Balducci30
Member
Balance? Just go somewhere else and level up/respec/get a better weapon if you can’t beat someone
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fart town usa
Member
No. Some enemies are just meant to be avoided until you can actually handle them. It's hard to brute force your way through certain sections.
Or just do co-op, makes a lot of bosses/dungeons much easier.
Or just do co-op, makes a lot of bosses/dungeons much easier.
Raven117
Member
Not every boss has a bunch of summons in front of it.
The bosses are just uneven. Some feel like the a-team designed them others feel like the b-team.
Fights can be hard, but they have to be fair. I’ve probably said “this is bull shit” more times in this game than any other souls game. Some just haven’t been fair as the game logic isn’t being applied to the boss as it is to the player.
Compare to something like monster hunter. Those bosses can run out of stamina. Don’t input read, don’t track, commit to huge hits. I can’t stand when you read perfectly well that the big hit is coming, you position way in advance, and the boss pivots on a 360 degree axis to then one hit kill you. Like, rage inducing. That’s not good design. That’s just garbage.
Not all bosses do this though. It’s just uneven. As I was saying
The bosses are just uneven. Some feel like the a-team designed them others feel like the b-team.
Fights can be hard, but they have to be fair. I’ve probably said “this is bull shit” more times in this game than any other souls game. Some just haven’t been fair as the game logic isn’t being applied to the boss as it is to the player.
Compare to something like monster hunter. Those bosses can run out of stamina. Don’t input read, don’t track, commit to huge hits. I can’t stand when you read perfectly well that the big hit is coming, you position way in advance, and the boss pivots on a 360 degree axis to then one hit kill you. Like, rage inducing. That’s not good design. That’s just garbage.
Not all bosses do this though. It’s just uneven. As I was saying
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ChoosableOne
ChoosableAll
Since the difficulty levels of the regions different, you can progress very easily or sometimes very difficult according to the order you discover. I started using my lower spec weapons as a solution and my enjoyment increased.
But OP talks about something else which I partially agree. Balance is off, yeah, but bosses were always stronger than normal enemies along the path and required you to memorize their moves. If I have to pick a souls game that has balance issues, it would be DS 3, not this one.
But OP talks about something else which I partially agree. Balance is off, yeah, but bosses were always stronger than normal enemies along the path and required you to memorize their moves. If I have to pick a souls game that has balance issues, it would be DS 3, not this one.
Bumblebeetuna
Member
I agree about the souls rewards being out of whack. I have farmed these poisonous guys in a northern part of the map with my astrologer and got him to level 80, each one of them you kill gives you almost 1400 souls and they are easy.
But now I am going through the magic academy and facing these mages who have insane ranged attacks that come super fast. They are annoying as fuck and they give like 300 souls when they die
Zeroing
Banned
Isn’t that the normal thing? We get help from other people, we advance level up, get stronger then we help others?
NinjaBoiX
Member
iorek21
Member
Yes, bosses are the major flaw of Elden Ring. Most of the main quest bosses are actually Sekiro bosses, not Dark Souls bosses, that's the main issue; there's no stamina, limitations, little to no windows of opportunity etc.
Elden Ring bosses were designed for the use of summons, you can see it is almost all major fights. Yes, you can solo every single boss, but summoning is the new optimal way.
Elden Ring bosses were designed for the use of summons, you can see it is almost all major fights. Yes, you can solo every single boss, but summoning is the new optimal way.
As mentioned before, the screams of 'git gud' is nonsense on this game and irrelevant to what's even being discussed. I've played 120 plus hours and beat tons of bosses, so 'getting good' has nothing to do with this conversation.
The boss fights are more obnoxious than fun and it's being dismissed by nonsensical cries of 'git gud'. Getting good isn't going to make bosses stop jumping in the air and 360 degree rotating in midair and hitting your character. Neither is having bosses read your inputs and throwing daggers or some item at you the moment you try to heal. Neither is bosses having infinite stamina and 8 hit combos that can often take the majority of your life with one hit. Neither is giving bosses ultra long reach to where they all have attacks that can hit you halfway across the screen. Neither is it going to stop the delayed attacks that make finding a rhythm nearly impossible go away. Strategic positioning is almost worthless now and boss fights pretty much devolve into rolling around and hittomg with blood loss, parrying nonstop or blast spells from 20 miles away. Strength builds are pretty much bunny hopping over and over with the jump attack. Shields are pretty much worthless. Strategic positioning is worthless. Either spam a dodge move or hope you can stun bosses over and over with jumping attacks. That's cheese. Cheese or be overly leveled to where boss fights are a breeze. Not fun either.
The boss fights are more obnoxious than fun and it's being dismissed by nonsensical cries of 'git gud'. Getting good isn't going to make bosses stop jumping in the air and 360 degree rotating in midair and hitting your character. Neither is having bosses read your inputs and throwing daggers or some item at you the moment you try to heal. Neither is bosses having infinite stamina and 8 hit combos that can often take the majority of your life with one hit. Neither is giving bosses ultra long reach to where they all have attacks that can hit you halfway across the screen. Neither is it going to stop the delayed attacks that make finding a rhythm nearly impossible go away. Strategic positioning is almost worthless now and boss fights pretty much devolve into rolling around and hittomg with blood loss, parrying nonstop or blast spells from 20 miles away. Strength builds are pretty much bunny hopping over and over with the jump attack. Shields are pretty much worthless. Strategic positioning is worthless. Either spam a dodge move or hope you can stun bosses over and over with jumping attacks. That's cheese. Cheese or be overly leveled to where boss fights are a breeze. Not fun either.
balls of snow
Member
If it wasnt apparent when you have to fight any duo bosses than I dont know what From needs to do to say that Ashes are part of the Elden Ring. Soulsborne type bosses died with Dark Souls 3. Consider:
1) With Sekiro, the way I beat Isshin was not to deplete his health bar but to bust his guard for the execution. Did it 3 times with his health was about half full the entire fight. Could I have done it the traditional soulsborne way, sure but it was way harder. This is the same throughout the main bosses in Sekiro.
2) With ER, the first 100 hours of the game is telling you that these bosses while slower moving have the capacity to cheat (infinite stamina), read inputs, combo heavy, cancel combo you name it. They teach you this so while you can solo it, Ashes can trully be a gamechanger to take back the advantage. Late game bosses change it up by giving such a small window to attack that while you can do it the soulsborne way and no summon, its clear that they are balanced specifically for Ashes help.
NinjaBoiX
Member
Yeah, thanks for all the replies guys.
I’m losing so much patience with this game, I was having an absolute blast for the first 20-25 hours, but at just over 40 hours in now (and probably 5-10 hours from finishing it if I wanted to) I’m just not sure I can be bothered with it anymore.
It’s not really fun like it was, it just feels like work. And I don’t even think I’m at the worst of it yet!
GOTY it ain’t for me, and I certainly don’t think it’s the best Souls game.
Dark Souls > Bloodborne > Dark Souls 3 > Elden Ring > Demon’s Souls > Dark Souls 2
I’m losing so much patience with this game, I was having an absolute blast for the first 20-25 hours, but at just over 40 hours in now (and probably 5-10 hours from finishing it if I wanted to) I’m just not sure I can be bothered with it anymore.
It’s not really fun like it was, it just feels like work. And I don’t even think I’m at the worst of it yet!
GOTY it ain’t for me, and I certainly don’t think it’s the best Souls game.
Dark Souls > Bloodborne > Dark Souls 3 > Elden Ring > Demon’s Souls > Dark Souls 2
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Guilty_AI
Member
I have a 90 hour strength build and none of what you said is correct.
I also don't understand this complaint people have of enemies sometimes attacking you when you try to heal. They're not "input reading" because there's a visible delay between you trying to heal and they starting an attack. And to avoid that what you have to do is not heal right when you're having a staring contest with the boss a few feet away, do it when you know they can't start an attack right away.
Guilty_AI
Member
Dude, i'll tell you this, if you're gonna finish this game in under 50 hours its no wonder you're having a hard time.
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rofif
Can’t Git Gud
Why Dark Souls 2 hate
SatansReverence
Hipster Princess
Nah, it's just time you accepted that you're shit at elden ring.
You can play thousands of hours of souls games and never git gud. You're a prime example of that.
If they didn't track you, they would be incredibly easy to exploit. These attacks are also highly telegraphed and very easy to avoid.
Stop healing at bad times then. The bosses punish you just the same way that you punish them. You should be waiting for a combo or power attack that can't hit you and heal while literally standing inside their asshole but instead you try to create distance then do an obvious heal while the boss has nothing to do but punish you.
I can swing 100times more than a boss can. Their "infinite stamina" is not even remotely a problem. Bosses are also several hundred times more likely to get staggered and punished than I am.
Again, highly telegraphed, easily dodged and blocked.
This is probably the single valid complaint in your entire whinefest of a post. There are attacks that extend to full wind up and stay for several seconds before swinging, even one or 2 that have a fake out swing.
Absolute bullshit once again. Positioning is, as with other souls games, incredibly vital. Example, Malikeths AOE attack that is supposedly impossible to dodge or block. Try dodging through it and get behind him. It only hits infront of the boss and has a long recovery time that the player can punish. OMG, POSITIONING!
And are you really having a cry about rolling? It's been the bread and butter of souls games since their inception hence their i-frames.
Parry spamming is just going to get you dead and spells have always been the easy mode the bads have been clamouring for since the beginning.
Sounds like you need to learn that rolling R1s are good, as are guard counters. Also that bosses all have attacks that leave them vulnerable for extended periods which are great for staggering them
Pure horseshit. The fact that you even think this is telling of how bad you are.
You already said that and I've already addressed it.
"spam a dodge"
Jesus 'git fucking gud' christ.
TIME
YOUR
DODGES
The game is designed to punish you for dodge spamming like a dumbshit.
There is no hope, there is pattern recognition and punish windows.
Beat the draconic tree sentinal the other night, way underleveled with a far from meta straight sword, no casting bullshit.
Git
Fuckin
Gud
kyoji
Member
I agree with you toad but none of this stuff applies to malenia, lol
Except i'm 'gud' enough to beat these bosses, so that whole git gud talk is nonsense from From software fanboys who think they can do no wrong. What more do I need to get 'gud' at when I'm beating these bosses? The problem is fighting these bosses is not fun, but apparently that is just too hard to understand.
Dark Souls is my favorite game of all time, but I understand now how obnoxious From software fanboys are who think the company makes utter perfect gems that couldn't use improvements.
009EspadaSageJay
Member
Elden has the same problems that the Souls games in general have this terrible problem that is never addressed because any sort of critique gets hand waved by the community. The Hitbox problem has been a problem since DS1 DE didnt have as much of a problem because the game in general is slow your slow the enimies are slow
and the bosses for the most part are slow every game past that has gotten faster and faster but has left the player character at antique speeds. Go google some bosses from the varies games and look at the hitbox range some of them have it is beyond disgusting somewhat bloodborne and Sekiro fixed the player movement speed but
the hitboxes in those games are leagues better then elden ring. The way enemies are balanced in elden ring is also terrible heres a video that shows one of the many problems with this game
Bosses and enemies now have multiple moves and combos that 360 track and can do 1000+ dmg on hit so if your getting one shotted alot its because of that. In general the souls series has terrible balancing people complain about OP stuff in all of the games and how insert this should be nerfed but most of the times the enemies and bosses have stuff that will always have an advantage over you.
and the bosses for the most part are slow every game past that has gotten faster and faster but has left the player character at antique speeds. Go google some bosses from the varies games and look at the hitbox range some of them have it is beyond disgusting somewhat bloodborne and Sekiro fixed the player movement speed but
the hitboxes in those games are leagues better then elden ring. The way enemies are balanced in elden ring is also terrible heres a video that shows one of the many problems with this game
Bosses and enemies now have multiple moves and combos that 360 track and can do 1000+ dmg on hit so if your getting one shotted alot its because of that. In general the souls series has terrible balancing people complain about OP stuff in all of the games and how insert this should be nerfed but most of the times the enemies and bosses have stuff that will always have an advantage over you.
Punished Miku
Human Rights Subscription Service
I dont understand the lack of self awareness. Surely you must realize you sound completely insufferable
. Is this game and your story of accomplishment literally all you have to feel good about yourself? I'm not understanding what psychologically motivates someone to speak to others like you do about a video game.
SatansReverence
Hipster Princess
And?
You aren't "having fun" because you're playing like shit because you're bad.
Eventually potatoing your way through a boss =/= make you good.
GermanZepp
Member
Pve Balance not so much. But some enemies and bosses are awfull to fight in a tradicional meele souls way. The bosses are plenty but encounters are less refined, Sometimes you enter places waaay out for your level and you need to go leveling up.
SatansReverence
Hipster Princess
I dont understand the lack of self awareness. Surely you must realize you sound completely insufferable
It's called not giving a fuck about the feelings of bad players.
Not even remotely, and I don't even consider myself a particularly good souls player.
Threads like this are the embodiment of the dunning-kruger effect
The real question is, why do bad players have to blame absolutely everything on the game instead of than their own lack of ability
Except rolling hasn't been a staple of Dark Souls games unless you CHOSE to play that kind of build because you could ACTUALLY circle around enemies and have them miss you because they didn't auto-track. You could actually make enemies miss by carefully stepping outside of their range because they didn't automatically spin around to aim at your character.
Heavy armor and shields were actually useful in Dark Souls because bosses didn't immediately blow through your stamina with 3 hits of a 7 hit combo.
I know to heal when I'm 20 foot away. I'm not sure why it's so difficult to understand that me having to compensate for this cheap AI is NOT FUN. I can beat the bosses, but it's not fun.
Auto tracking, input reading, etc. makes fighting the bosses NOT FUN because you have to fight them in a certain way that feels less strategic and more cheesy and one dimensional
I'm not having fun because the boss fights suck. Apparently understanding an opinion outside your own is too difficult
Raven117
Member
This. Freakin this.
Punished Miku
Human Rights Subscription Service
No point. I got banned from the OT and then banned for a week for very mildly criticizing people exactly like you.
You genuinely sound like the stupidest person in the thread and I dont think you grasped a single point that K kevm3 3 was saying. You should go back to the OT since no criticism of the game is allowed in there.
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rofif
Can’t Git Gud
I agree with some of you points but christ... you are an ASS.
Cmon man let it go. K kevm3 got some good points. Sounds like you are disputing it all just to dispute it.
The game is not perfect. I don't want to write the whole essay but I dislike repeated bosses, random difficulty, infinite super huge aoe attcks, delays, repeated bosses and so on. I thik all 3 souls games had better flow and balance.
That said - of course I like the game and finished it.
BadBurger
Many “Whelps”! Handle It!
It's called not giving a fuck about the feelings of bad players.
Not even remotely, and I don't even consider myself a particularly good souls player.
Threads like this are the embodiment of the dunning-kruger effect
The real question is, why do bad players have to blame absolutely everything on the game instead of than their own lack of ability
You are way too emotionally invested in a video game, also maybe try to remember that there's a human being on the other end that conversation.
Edit: NM, misread the question. No, one can level the ashes (summons), but not the ashes of war
Check this out:
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Apeopleman
Member
My biggest issue against bosses is the mobility they have vs the mobility you have. When Placidusax warps at the other end of the arena after you work so hard just to run up to him, and when Milenia uses her brutal water fowl move and you cant dodge it because of low mobility options, it feels like something’s missing. Both these boss fights were nonsense and I say that as someone who’s played quite a few Fromsoft games to completion
the boss fights when you have access to your horse are much better due to increased mobility IMO
Imru’ al-Qays
Member
Are people seriously whining about needing to ROLL in a Souls game now?
The issue isnt rolling, the issue is that the bosses and enemies can
A) Input read a roll
B) Animation cancel to punish a roll
Combine those with AOE attacks and it just becomes annoying to fight
Apeopleman
Member
Agreed. Faith incanations suck compared to sorceries like Comet azure. Faith incants need a hugggeee buff. They also need hyper armor. I say this as someone who started off with prophet and stuck with faith the whole game
No because the camera sucks. Horse fighting in games is a no no to me. Although I am partial to Twilight princess. Loved the horse there. They never gave you anything difficult though.
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balls of snow
Member
You shouldnt have to devote half! of your endgame level recommendation on vigor to just have a chance of not getting one shoted combo by a boss. Point here being, lategame bosses are not balance for soloing.
Recommended Level by Location | Elden Ring Wiki
Elden Ring Leveling Progression: Recommended Level for Matchmaking and taking on enemies easily!
eldenring.wiki.fextralife.com
But thats not input reading. /s Sidenote, I love fighting godskin apostle singular now, at close range he never does the black fireball and second phase stretching never hits you if you stay in his grill.
V4skunk
Banned
You can pump health way higher than 50. I think a soft cap comes in at 80 or 90 points.
Imru’ al-Qays
Member
Endgame bosses are balanced for 60 vigor. If you do not have 60 vigor go respec to get yourself 60 vigor. There is no other stat that is more important than vigor. Leveling the HP stat is ALWAYS the first step you take if you find yourself getting killed in a Souls game.
Yoda
Member
Didn't check if anyone else answered:
There's a lady next to the fireplace in the roundtable. Ping pong between talking to her and the blacksmith + reloading the area, eventually she'll offer it as a service (upgrading ases) similar to how the blacksmith offers upgrades for your weapons.
March Climber
Member
Guys, I think we've finished the first playthrough wrong. We just have to pump all points into vigor. Don't grow your mana bar or stamina bar. Melee players, don't put any points into STR or DEX to equip or try out better weapons. Just make do with that starting club you were given. Mages and Pyromancer mains, just use your starting spells only. What's that? Late game bosses are doing high damage combos? It's clear, you need even more vigor in your life. Go explore to earn xp. What's that? But you've already explored the other areas? Go grind. Still a problem? Then that means you're the problem, get gud. You got gud? Why are you still complaining then? It's not the game. The game is flawless, you're wrong and you just don't like souls games. Are you a journalist?
...How are we supposed to have any type of actual constructive discussion about this game if we aren't allowed to point out it's flaws and criticisms without it being treated like we are bad at the game or we offended fans or we attacked the game? This will most likely be my game of the year of 2022, but I'm simply not sipping on the kool-aid as hard as everyone else is here.
...How are we supposed to have any type of actual constructive discussion about this game if we aren't allowed to point out it's flaws and criticisms without it being treated like we are bad at the game or we offended fans or we attacked the game? This will most likely be my game of the year of 2022, but I'm simply not sipping on the kool-aid as hard as everyone else is here.
Imru’ al-Qays
Member
At the end of the game you'll be level ~150. You start with at least 10 points already in vigor. Putting 50 additional points into vigor leaves you with 100 points to distribute however the fuck you want.
If the game is too hard for you, you need to get vigor to the fucking softcap before you start investing in other stats (beyond the minima required to wield your chosen weapons). This is straightforward common sense and it really confirms for me that there's nothing seriously wrong with Elden Ring's endgame difficulty, it's just the usual whiners who show up whenever there's a Souls game.
mansoor1980
Member
March Climber
Member
I got called a whiner. Cool. I just hope the director of these games doesn't get too big of an ego with such enabling from fans.
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Imru’ al-Qays
I used to be like you man. I've made your same statements before for Dark Souls 3. I guess I just started to see the cracks when Sekiro came out. You haven't reached that point yet and that's cool. Who knows maybe you never will.Nah, just slightly annoyed. I'm just glad there are a few people here not still stuck in the honeymoon period and can spot flaws when they see them.emotional post.............
but i agree
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Imru’ al-Qays
Member
The games have absolutely been getting harder since DS1/Bloodborne. There's nothing wrong with that. Elden Ring is harder than DS2/3 but easier than Sekiro, I'd say. And maybe it is too hard! But a lot of what I'm seeing in this thread isn't Elden Ring being too hard, it's people refusing to rectify their own incompetence by leveling vigor and using weapons and tactics that are adapted to their playstyle.
DarthPutin
Member
I know that later game has OP super hard bosses that made some Souls vets not happy, but for the early game bosses I sort of... feel like it's opposite? How am I supposed to know that I got over-levelled for a boss, if I keep getting killed by three rats in a small room? )) It has real W3 energy for me, where you kill higher vampire on first try because he's lower level and then get knocked out by three thugs using bare fists. Very immersive!
I suspect a lot depends on playstyle/build. I'd much rather fight any of the huge things in game, because as a battle mage I can ride around or roll around and spam magic at them with occasional special, meanwhile small things get me in close quarters where I am reminded that I still suck at even basic control of the character movement.
Anyway, if From got the balance perfectly, they wouldn't be nerfing some things and upping others, maybe fine-tune a tiny bit. They are clearly still experimenting and only fans think they can do no wrong.
I suspect a lot depends on playstyle/build. I'd much rather fight any of the huge things in game, because as a battle mage I can ride around or roll around and spam magic at them with occasional special, meanwhile small things get me in close quarters where I am reminded that I still suck at even basic control of the character movement.
Anyway, if From got the balance perfectly, they wouldn't be nerfing some things and upping others, maybe fine-tune a tiny bit. They are clearly still experimenting and only fans think they can do no wrong.
V4skunk
Banned
Lol don't watch iron pineapples no dmg pacifist run or the various no hit full runs and sl1 runs on YT.
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March Climber
Member
Already have. Their runs helped me learn boss patterns. You should check out this guy too he's pretty good.
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