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[Aaron-Lagann]

do you think everyone in japan draws 'anime'

Konami refused to use these types of covers for MGS4-

because "Anime doesn't sell in America."

So yes, everything drawn in Japan is anime to an American audience. Sweeping generalization? Yes. But still works just as well for identifying something.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

Are you really telling me that what I posted was an outlier of similarly styled "anime" games?

Because unfortunately, it is all too common. We can go down that road and I can provide numerous examples if you'd like. Ni No Kuni is simply fantastic in terms of art style and tone though and would absolutely love if more games of similar ilk followed in its footsteps.

It doesn't matter if it's an outlier or not, what matters is that there are a significant amount of anime games that do NOT have imagery like that. I could also post a bunch of embarrassing examples of "western styled" games. Does that mean they shouldn't be taken seriously?

 

[fvng]

Konami refused to use these types of covers for MGS4-

because "Anime doesn't sell in America."

So yes, everything drawn in Japan is anime to an American audience. Sweeping generalization? Yes. But still works just as well for identifying something.

I don't think many gamers would identify that art style as anime. At least not the cheesy anime art style that anime has become synonymous with

 

[Aaron-Lagann]

I don't think many gamers would identify that art style as anime. At least not the cheesy anime art style that anime has become synonymous with

Most people wouldn't, but the fact that enough do to have it impact the marketing of a game says a lot about the perception of anime here. I think it's pointless to keep arguing that just because something is from Japan that it isn't necessarily anime, when at the end of the day we know what they're talking about anyway.

 

[SenorArdilla]

Konami refused to use these types of covers for MGS4-

because "Anime doesn't sell in America."

So yes, everything drawn in Japan is anime to an American audience. Sweeping generalization? Yes. But still works just as well for identifying something.

Which is odd considering the American cartoon industry's habit of outsourcing cartoon work to South Korea.

 

[block tower]

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[FluxWaveZ]

EDIT: for clarification i will use this wiki definition as to what I'm referring to when i say "anime", or games based on a Japanese art-syle. I realize Ni No Kuni is not based on an existing manga or show, I'm using anime to encompass games such as Ni No Kuni which are done in the vein of the anime style. So my question applies to games based on anime shows, manga or the style of Japanese anime.

Oh, and by this definition, this isn't anime.

 

[Silky]

I'm having a hard time deciding anymore parameters besides the link in the OP. the discussion is really meant to center around the question "Is Ni No Kuni evidence that more original and deeper anime games have a market on consoles?" Ni No Kuni was more of an example than a definition of "anime".

What the hell is deep and original about Ni no Kuni, again?

 

[chickdigger802]

good games should be taken seriously. if they have tits and ass or lolis or w/e to sell to a niche audience, so be it.

i just wish discussions for said games would focus more on the gameplay systems than waifu wars... but i guess that's a problem with all games really.

 

[Mauricio_Magus]

What the hell is deep and original about Ni no Kuni, again?

It's funny cause I can stand most JRPGs(I can even finish Tales games!), but I could in no way finish Ni No Kuni, it was way too boring.

 

[Vire]

Dragon's Crown and Studio Ghibli's style are just as outlier as each other.
I can't even think of any other series that look like Dragon's Crown.

That wasn't the point I was making... What I was trying to explain to you is that it isn't an outlier in terms of being some of the worst offenders of outrageously demeaning and downright offensive treatment of women in their games and certainly isn't furthering their cause for being more "respectable" or to be taken seriously.

Does this mean that this is completely and inherently exclusive to "anime" styled games and that Western games are innocent in all of this? No of course not.

 

[block tower]

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[Silky]

good games should be taken seriously. if they have tits and ass or lolis or w/e to sell to a niche audience, so be it.

i just wish discussions for said games would focus more on the gameplay systems than waifu wars... but i guess that's a problem with all games really.

If people cared about the gameplay in these types of games, Neptunia wouldn't be popular

a lot compared to the more popular anime style games on consoles like DBZ, Mobile Suit Gundam etc.

You're comparing new, original work to aged anime/manga and a toy/manga property that goes through a different revision almost yearly.

...So. I played Ni no Kuni. I liked it. I think it deserves it's sales. Is it deep and original? Nooooooooooooooooooope.

 

[MetroidPrimeRib]

That wasn't the point I was making... What I was trying to explain to you is that it isn't an outlier in terms of being some of the worst offenders of outrageously demeaning and downright offensive treatment of women in their games and certainly isn't furthering their cause for being more "respectable" or to be taken seriously.

Does this mean that this is completely and inherently exclusive to "anime" styled games and that Western games are innocent in all of this? No of course not.

Oh shit did I walk into another sexism thread on accident

 

[outunderthestars]

good games should be taken seriously. if they have tits and ass or lolis or w/e to sell to a niche audience, so be it.

i just wish discussions for said games would focus more on the gameplay systems than waifu wars... but i guess that's a problem with all games really.

Agreed. I clicked on the Ys thread and the last page was mostly people arguing about different female characters and waifus. It is really off putting and a bit gross.

 

[Deap92x]

Anime games are just focus to an specific type of consumer and we all know how small is that market.

 

[Vire]

Oh shit did I walk into another sexism thread on accident

According to the OP: Anime styled games aren't taken very seriously, why do you think this is the case? Honest question?

Let's not be naive here.

 

[Mauricio_Magus]

Agreed. I clicked on the Ys thread and the last page was mostly people arguing about different female characters and waifus. It is really off putting and a bit gross.

Oh my lord, it was a joke about how the main character doesn't even care about girls and how we can still talk about waifus just because it's funny, it's amusing to see you took it seriously. (I don't blame you, you have no way of knowing this)

Ys is awesome, it's one of those series that should be taken seriously as it focuses on the game-play and not that waifu stuff I'm going to guess you dislike(at least till Ys Seven).

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

That wasn't the point I was making... What I was trying to explain to you is that it isn't an outlier in terms of being some of the worst offenders of outrageously demeaning and downright offensive treatment of women in their games and certainly isn't furthering their cause for being more "respectable" or to be taken seriously.

Does this mean that this is completely and inherently exclusive to "anime" styled games and that Western games are innocent in all of this? No of course not.

You used the Dragon's Crown image to respond to the OP's shaky premise, implying that you think it's equivalent to "anime" games

Take the L

 

[Vire]

You used the Dragon's Crown image to respond to the OP's shaky premise, implying that you think it's equivalent to "anime" games

Take the L

Do you mind posting anything more constructive than continual one off drive by trolling posts?

Because if you aren't, I'm not going to bother responding to you.

 

[MetroidPrimeRib]

According to the OP: Anime styled games aren't taken very seriously, why do you think this is the case? Honest question?

Let's not be naive here.

Probably because most only appeal to a niche market? Dungeon crawlers like Ys and Visual Novels/Whodunnits like 999, Danganronpa aren't exactly in high demand in the West, add that to the fact most exist on handhelds now..
I highly doubt it's because people think they are sexist. Games like Mortal Kombat do pretty well despite the fact such assertions could be made.

 

[JayEH]

Anime is for jerks.

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

Do you mind posting anything more constructive than continual one off drive by trolling posts?

Because if you aren't, I'm not going to bother responding to you.

I'm sure you imagine yourself as being constructive, but you're just demonstrating how ignorant you are about two forms of entertainment. Your perceptions of games and anime don't define either.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

Do you mind posting anything more constructive than continual one off drive by trolling posts?

Because if you aren't, I'm not going to bother responding to you.

Can I ask you what the last "anime" game you played was?

 

[Aaron-Lagann]

Anime is for jerks.

 

[HolyBaikal]

Hmm, well, I do think that some people are too closed minded towards anime.

 

[joe2187]

Some Visual cues should help.

This is Anime

This is not Anime

 

[Soriku]

The OP is confusing.

Ninokuni is a "deep" anime game?

What happened to JRPGs?

Since when were these games not taken seriously?

 

[Vire]

Can I ask you what the last "anime" game you played was?

Ni No Kuni, admittedly I have not beaten it yet, but that has little to do with it being "anime" and more to do with the tedious slog of grinding.

Love the art style though.

 

[outunderthestars]

Oh my lord, it was a joke about how the main character doesn't even care about girls and how we can still talk about waifus just because it's funny, it's amusing to see you took it seriously. (I don't blame you, you have no way of knowing this)

Ys is awesome, it's one of those series that should be taken seriously as it focuses on the game-play and not that waifu stuff I'm going to guess you dislike(at least till Ys Seven).

It is just a bit alienating and makes me a bit uncomfortable as a parent of a young teen girl. I played Ys games back in the Turbo Graphx 16 era, and was interested in putting ttogether a run through the series. That conversation was enough to make me wonder about that plan to be perfectly honest.

That said, I'm still going to do so, as I love old school Japanese action RPGs, but I wonder if part of the issue is that small parts of the games are overly promoted/fawned over by their fans. Waifu wars and what not are really not my cup of tea, and seem to be a barrier to a portion of the gaming audience.

Seriously though, thanks for giving me more context.

 

[block tower]

.

 

[ohlawd]

People are just tsundere for anime.

"I-i-it's not like I s-s-secretly watch anime or something. D-don't get the wrong idea, OK!? I was just passing by, that's all!"

 

[fvng]

Hmm, well, I do think that some people are too closed minded towards anime.

It's okay to not like the art style, it either meshes with you or it doesn't

 

[kick51]

What constitutes an anime game?

air dashes, glyphs everywhere, meters everywhere, numbers that are too high

 

[FluxWaveZ]

People are just tsundere for anime.

"I-i-it's not like I s-s-secretly watch anime or something. D-don't get the wrong idea, OK!? I was just passing by, that's all!"

My Little Video Game Can't Be This Anime

 

[BakedYams]

What the hell is an anime game? Not to bash on OP but a game just has different aesthetics/visuals than others. Games are taken seriously, whether they are drawn very similar to adaptions in Japan. There are a lot of stigmas due to "fanservice" sadly but look at a lot of indie games (none come to mind sadly, too late for me) on Steam that are oriented around manga style drawings. They surprisingly do well, or Steam is filled with a bunch of anime lovers.

People are just tsundere for anime.

"I-i-it's not like I s-s-secretly watch anime or something. D-don't get the wrong idea, OK!? I was just passing by, that's all!"

My man. You know your tsundere very well. By the way, where is your avatar from?

 

[_hekk05]

People are just tsundere for anime.

"I-i-it's not like I s-s-secretly watch anime or something. D-don't get the wrong idea, OK!? I was just passing by, that's all!"

I recognise that avatar.


On topic, the west just can't handle anime. Social connotations and all that. No wonder you guys don't get any localisations. I'm off to play me some PSO2 lol

 

[Mauricio_Magus]

It is just a bit alienating and makes me a bit uncomfortable as a parent of a young teen girl. I played Ys games back in the Turbo Graphx 16 era, and was interested in putting ttogether a run through the series. That conversation was enough to make me wonder about that plan to be perfectly honest.

That said, I'm still going to do so, as I love old school Japanese action RPGs, but I wonder if part of the issue is that small parts of the games are overly promoted/fawned over by their fans. Waifu wars and what not are really not my cup of tea, and seem to be a barrier to a portion of the gaming audience.

Seriously though, thanks for giving me more context.

Check out the games that are available on Steam, they are everything except "waifu games", you won't regret it.

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

that was the point of this thread. should games like those which are based on anime shows/toys be made into more thought out games. like a Mobile Suit Gundam game that tries a different gameplay or genre style other than hack and slash. did the sales of a game like Ni No Kuni show that a more deep and complex Mobile Suit Gundam game could sell?

More complex licensed games could sell, but they're usually not treated that way by publishers in Japan. The Naruto games are a good example of better licensed games, partially because Cyber Connect 2 really likes Naruto and puts a lot of effort in. Also, Namco Bandai knows the games will sell, so they're more willing to put money into them. Both developer skill and publisher willingness to shell out affect final quality.

Unfortunately, a lot of licensed games aren't handled as well and it shows, especially compared against sequels or new IPs, where publishers are more concerned about reaching set quality levels.

As far as how all this plays out in the west, there's a somewhat disturbing wave of jingoism in gaming born partly out of western developers actually being good now, combined with the decline of formerly venerable Japanese developers. On top of that, there's the increase of overt Japanophilia that generates a backlash aimed at Japan in general.

 

[Boomstick (Coffee Crazy)]

I feel like if game's draw is that it is Anime, then its not a surprise its not taken seriously, regardless of its quality.

It can have many qualities of one (W101 comes to mind), but the moment it becomes the defining factor, you kind of lose all interest with a lot of people.

I personally dislike the one or two anime that my friends have forced me to watch, so generally speaking, I try to avoid games that try to emulate it as much as possible. Unfortunately, I am kind of in the majority when it comes to the "general audience", although I'm definitely a minority in the "gamer" niche.

 

[chickdigger802]

Agreed. I clicked on the Ys thread and the last page was mostly people arguing about different female characters and waifus. It is really off putting and a bit gross.

Sometimes it's the opposite. Ffx still has one of the better stories out of japan ( the script... well) while everyone talks about the awful end game stuff all the time instead. I don't get it.

 

[G-Fex]

Hmm, well, I do think that some people are too closed minded towards anime.

or that people can't accept that some people don't like it

 

[Eusis]

Hmm, well, I do think that some people are too closed minded towards anime.

I kind of feel like I have a love/hate relationship with it sometimes. There's a lot of anime junk that puts me off, but there's some great stuff out there and I generally like the basic style, even from said junk that puts me off otherwise.

or that people can't accept that some people don't like it

Some people have ridiculously thin skin though. Granted everyone has their irrational hangups, but sometimes it feels like they'll disregard something entirely for dumb, superficial reasons. It's probably why we have cases like Gunvolt editting out the midriff and the braid (though I think that one's a genuine mistake.)

 

[DVCY201]

You mean like the Naruto's and the Bleach's and the One Piece's? Uhhh...no?

It'd be cool if we could see more games based on anime, as long as they're not poor.

 

[Vire]

that was the point of this thread. should games like those which are based on anime shows/toys be made into more thought out games. like a Mobile Suit Gundam game that tries a different gameplay or genre style other than hack and slash. did the sales of a game like Ni No Kuni show that a more deep and complex Mobile Suit Gundam game could sell?

They have little incentive to, these games have small budgets and do exceptionally well for what they set out to accomplish with a certain audience.

So why set out to make this $100 million dollar blockbuster that has an arguably alienating art style and is incredibly high risk, when you are making bo-ku profit off some shitty Dynasty Warrios clone?

 

[outunderthestars]

that was the point of this thread. should games like those which are based on anime shows/toys be made into more thought out games. like a Mobile Suit Gundam game that tries a different gameplay or genre style other than hack and slash. did the sales of a game like Ni No Kuni show that a more deep and complex Mobile Suit Gundam game could sell?

I think it hard to compare the success that Ni No Kuni gained by partnering with one of the most beloved animation studios in the world to that of a Gundam series. I feel like Gundam will always be niche, and trying too hard to move away from that could alienate their core audience.

Art styles will always be divisive though. One only has to look at the Celda and Overstrike meltdowns to be reminded of this. There will be people who certain styles of art and characters and immediately writenoff those games. We all have styles that we enjoy, and those that we don't. I really hate the bulky space marine kind of thing, but I am also uncomfortable with the more sexually suggestive younger looking anime styles as well.

I'm not sure if that means that I believe those games should be taken less seriously than others as this hobby is so incredibly subjective.

 

[joe2187]

You mean like the Naruto's and the Bleach's and the One Piece's? Uhhh...no?

It'd be cool if we could see more games based on anime, as long as they're not poor.

Trigger + PlatinumGames

MAKE IT HAPPEN, I WILL KILL/MAIM/SUCK UNSPEAKABLE THINGS TO MAKE IT HAPPEN.

 

[block tower]

.

 

[outunderthestars]

Check out the games that are available on Steam, they are everything except "waifu games", you won't regret it.

Deal.

 

[DVCY201]

Trigger + PlatinumGames

MAKE IT HAPPEN, I WILL KILL/MAIM/SUCK UNSPEAKABLE THINGS TO MAKE IT HAPPEN.

A Platinum Game based on Trigger's works

......

DON'T LOSE YOUR WAYYY!