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[dragonbane]

And yet I am not entirely sure that the author of this site understands the difference between in engine and real time. So maybe he was told "in engine" and he translated it into "real time".?

Correct. Real time and in-engine makes zero sense. If it's real time it's automatically in-engine too. I think the author has no idea what he is talking about, especially since he just bumped into them. It's unfortunately not a definitive confirmation. We need a simple tweet from ND. I suspect he likely heard the words in-game and in-engine.

 

[Dangoesforth]

With the exception of Reach. Reach was an amazing prequel campaign.

this.

I really can't think of a prequel SP that was better than Reach's maybe a GoW/mgs psp title if you are into those.

 

[UrbanRats]

I think God of War 3 is definitely up there. Pure technically speaking however, Beyond is without question the best looking game on last gen consoles. If you played and completed it I don't see how you could argue otherwise. It looks like a current gen game at times. The IQ alone puts it above The Last of Us, which has so many jaggies.

I think art direction, especially on console, is a much more important aspect in how a game looks, beyond mere subjectivity, just how you juggle those resources can make the difference.

Beyond looks great in some details, abysmal in others.
Uncharted (Last of Us not as much, but still more than Beyond) is incredibly consistent, visually:

(Just a quick google search of a comparable setting between the two games, unfortunately the pics for both games are compressed to hell, feel free to post better examples)
Just to show the difference is art direction, which in my opinion, gives Uncharted its visual strength start to finish.
There is an attention to the use of color few other games have, to that extent.

Correct. Real time and in-engine makes zero sense. If it's real time it's automatically in-engine too. I think the author has no idea what he is talking about, especially since he just bumped into them. It's unfortunately not a definitive confirmation. We need a simple tweet from ND. I suspect he likely heard the words in-game and in-engine.

I don't think we need ND confirmation to know that footage is in-engine and not in-game.
It's a cutscene, why wouldn't they use the method they've always used? Plus, let's be honest, it just looked too good to be the exact detail you get while jumping and shooting around.

 

[Anos Voldigoad]

I'll suck that crow down without even cooking it if they hit 60fps with those graphics. With a smile on my goddamned face!

It just doesn't seem possible. O_O

^BELIEVE

 

[dragonbane]

I think art direction, especially on console, is a much more important aspect in how a game looks, beyond mere subjectivity, just how you juggle those resources can make the difference.

Beyond looks great in some details, abysmal in others.
Uncharted (Last of Us not as much, but still more than Beyond) is incredibly consistent, visually:

(Just a quick google search of a comparable setting between the two games, unfortunately the pics for both games are compressed to hell, feel free to post better examples)
Just to show the difference is art direction, which in my opinion, gives Uncharted its visual strength start to finish.
There is an attention to the use of color few other games have, to that extent.

That's fine. I should have specified I was more talking about technical specs such as AA, particles, lighting, effects and rendering techniques. Beyond uses a lot of next gen features in that regard. The pictures you posted are all indeed from the (IMO only) visually highly inconsistent chapter in the game and awful compression does the rest. I think the art direction in the majority of Beyond is pretty beautiful on top of impressive rendering. Here are some pictures I took across a wealth of chapters (click to enlarge):

Entire gallary: http://www.abload.de/gallery.php?key=oKK0eR8g

I don't think we need ND confirmation to know that footage is in-engine and not in-game.
It's a cutscene, why wouldn't they use the method they've always used? Plus, let's be honest, it just looked too good to be the exact detail you get while jumping and shooting around.

I don't either, but so many people still doubt/believe.

 

[UrbanRats]

Fantastic gallery Dragon, some of those shots and areas do, indeed, look insane.
Especially when they get to play with artificial light, as opposed to natural one, which falls flatter (which is where Uncharted shines the most, instead).

 

[foxbeldin]

I think there are people who are confused with the real time thing.

I believe it's real time, but it's also a cutscene, so it gives the devs a lot of room to optimise while they control the camera, the exact number of things shown on screen etc...

So yes, can be realtime, but no, it won't be that beautiful when you control drake.

Spoiler

it will still be fucking beautiful

 

[Trunchisholm]

I think there are people who are confused with the real time thing.

I believe it's real time, but it's also a cutscene, so it gives the devs a lot of room to optimise while they control the camera, the exact number of things shown on screen etc...

So yes, can be realtime, but no, it won't be that beautiful when you control drake.

Spoiler

it will still be fucking beautiful

No, it's not realtime. Realtime cutscenes don't have perfect IQ with zero aliasing. It's not a matter of optimisation or resource management. You need to downsample from an absurd resolution to get that IQ.

 

[Fancy Clown]

I think art direction, especially on console, is a much more important aspect in how a game looks, beyond mere subjectivity, just how you juggle those resources can make the difference.

Beyond looks great in some details, abysmal in others.
Uncharted (Last of Us not as much, but still more than Beyond) is incredibly consistent, visually:

(Just a quick google search of a comparable setting between the two games, unfortunately the pics for both games are compressed to hell, feel free to post better examples)
Just to show the difference is art direction, which in my opinion, gives Uncharted its visual strength start to finish.
There is an attention to the use of color few other games have, to that extent.

I agree wit all of this. The Art Direction (especially the use of color) puts ND games ahead, although I would disagree with you and argue that from an artistic standpoint The Last of Us is stronger than Uncharted 3. I feel like each area is more considered with its use of detail, architecture, and color palette.

Beyond looks good, but I really don't like the lightning. It has some good direct lights in the environment, but I'm not a fan of the soft filter and overall really flat lighting. It makes the game look pretty drab, especially when compared directly to Uncharted or The Last of Us.

 

[foxbeldin]

No, it's not realtime. Realtime cutscenes don't have perfect IQ with zero aliasing. It's not a matter of optimisation or resource management. You need to downsample from an absurd resolution to get that IQ.

This is said to be real time

It's amazing what devs can achieve when they don't have to deal with gameplay and player's input.

 

[Novan Leon]

Impressive. Still, I'm not exactly sure what people are expecting. There are absolutely no rendering artifacts of any kind in that footage, no aliasing, no z-fighting, no clipping issues, no SSAO artifacts... Compare this to the 1886 E3 2014 footage we saw, where starting at 1:30 you see all the aforementioned issues in a 5 second span, and that's at 1920x800 @ 30 fps.

There's no question that ND is preternaturally good at what they do, but it's probably wise to temper one's expectations at least until we see some actual gameplay footage.

GAF loves their fancy graphics but aren't tech-savvy enough to temper their expectations with a dose of realism. This creates a lot of unreasonable expecations among GAFers which ultimately leads to disappointment (ala Watch_Dogs).

Everyone should take these E3 tech demos/concept videos/early alpha footage with a grain of salt.

 

[dragonbane]

Fantastic gallery Dragon, some of those shots and areas do, indeed, look insane.
Especially when they get to play with artificial light, as opposed to natural one, which falls flatter (which is where Uncharted shines the most, instead).

I can agree with this. For natural lighting this was the stand-out moment in Beyond for me:

Bloody gorgeous IMO. Uncharted 3 and TLoU absolutely look fantastic though. I think I stopped playing for about 10 minutes during the Winter village section to take in the frozen lake and scenery.

 

[Thrakier]

Bloody gorgeous IMO. Uncharted 3 and TLoU absolutely look fantastic though. I think I stopped playing for about 10 minutes during the Winter village section to take in the frozen lake and scenery.

Funny, I stopped playing there because the framerate went from shit to complete shit. See, different priorities, how it works.

 

[dragonbane]

Funny, I stopped playing there because the framerate went from shit to complete shit. See, different priorities, how it works.

That's too bad considering Winter was the highlight. Summer was downright annoying in comparison and almost made me stop playing. Glad I continued though. Not one of my favourites, but I enjoyed the second half quite a bit. Framerate was indeed hit or miss pretty much all the time, which is unfortunate coming from Uncharted.

 

[Fancy Clown]

Funny, I stopped playing there because the framerate went from shit to complete shit. See, different priorities, how it works.

The frame rate only ever chugged for me at Tommy's society. Otherwise it was pretty much fine.

Nice comment on the art direction though!

 

[stryke]

See, different priorities, how it works.

Christ, he didn't even mention framerate and you felt the need to be patronizing.

 

[Thrakier]

That's too bad considering Winter was the highlight. Summer was downright annoying in comparison and almost made me stop playing. Glad I continued though. Not one of my favourites, but I enjoyed the second half quite a bit. Framerate was indeed hit or miss pretty much all the time, which is unfortunate coming from Uncharted.

I finished the game later on, no worries. I just found that, especially at Winter, the game was a chore to play and really no fun anymore. I couldn't immerse myself in it anymore so all that art direction etc. didn't really get through to me, because interaction comes always first. I'm happy that ND acknowledges that and seemingly is back on track with UC4. If they really hit a 90% stable 60FPS, I'll buy.

I'm just that they made this statement anyway, since TLOU was really a low point regarding graphics vs. performance. Since no one bothered (press, gamers) I feared it could kick start a new trend of 24FPS games.

 

[dragonbane]

The frame rate only ever chugged for me at Tommy's society. Otherwise it was pretty much fine.

Nice comment on the art direction though!

I'm not one of those people that really care about frame rate and nothing in TLoU really bothered me, but it does apparently have problems hitting 30 FPS a lot of the time. See some of DF videos:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zqsw2kkkeuM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_yX9UJV58XY

I finished the game later on, no worries. I just found that, especially at Winter, the game was a chore to play and really no fun anymore. I couldn't immerse myself in it anymore so all that art direction etc. didn't really get through to me, because interaction comes always first. I'm happy that ND acknowledges that and seemingly is back on track with UC4. If they really hit a 90% stable 60FPS, I'll buy.

Fair enough. If you can't look past the frame rate it obviously becomes less fun to play. Everyone can have different priorities.

This is said to be real time



It's amazing what devs can achieve when they don't have to deal with gameplay and player's input.

Sorcerer looks amazing, but I'm pretty sure that's supersampled (press shot). Direct feed still looks great though, but has minor rendering flaws as expected.

 

[Fancy Clown]

I'm not one of those people that really care about frame rate and nothing in TLoU really bothered me, but it does apparently have problems hitting 30 FPS a lot of the time. See some of DF videos:
.

Yeah, no it didn't have a great framerate but it didn't bother me too much unless it actually started noticeably chugging, which for me only really occurred in Tommy's town. Otherwise I found it to be completely playable.

I'm really excited for the remaster though to see how 60fps changes the experience.

 

[nelchaar]

I'll suck that crow down without even cooking it if they hit 60fps with those graphics. With a smile on my goddamned face!

It just doesn't seem possible. O_O

About that... http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2014-watch-uncharted-4-and-the-last-of-us-at-60-fps

 

[GIANKRATOS]

Old?

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1854335&postcount=265

No, it is definitely real-time, (as my post yesterday might hint) I had one of their devs explicitly confirm to me yesterday that it is running in real time, on a single PS4 and not pre-recorded.

Beginning with Uncharted 4, all Naughty Dog games will feature completely in engine, real time, 3D cutscenes (if they even stay cutscenes anymore), a huge performance departure from what they used to ship.

So I then asked Richard about it and whether he could spot any signs that the trailer was real time, which he did in his updated post:

Quote:
We've studied the video in a little more depth and have concluded that it's definitely running at native 1080p resolution (as opposed to being rendered at a very high resolution, then scaled down - a process known as super-sampling). Small clipping anomalies, a touch of specular aliasing on Nate's shirt as he sits up, along with some shadow aliasing on his forehead also suggest a real-time render. On the face of it, we're still looking at some pretty incredible anti-aliasing here for a real-time technique on a game running at 60fps, particularly when it comes to the perfect, artefact-free rendering of Nate's hair - but the combination of the low contrast setting, slow camera movement, motion blur and depth of field would work well generally in making aliasing much less of an issue.
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/di...f-us-at-60-fps

But wow, what an incredible achievement coming less than a year into the PS4's life.
And at 60fps no less.

 

[ChawlieTheFair]

Said it in the other thread but i'll say it again, first legit "WOW" moment I've had with graphics since the introduction of 360 and PS3.

I'm so happy I was wrong. Congrats ND, you have made real time CG.

 

[dgrdsv]

Uncharted 4 clearly uses the PS3 engine and you can stuill feel the older games' vibe (Naughty Dog clearly confirmed that they won't create any new engine for the PS4, it would take much more time)

Old engine cannot work on PS4. This engine has at the very least a new renderer (because using a D3D9 renderer on a D3D11.2 hardware is the stupidest thing ever) and likely a changed jobs system (because Jaguar isn't Cell in more way than you can think of). So while it may not be completely new it definitely not "PS3 engine". The "vibe" you're referring to is ND's artists being the same ND's artists. Engine has nothing to do with this.

 

[BulletTheory]

Old?

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1854335&postcount=265

WHAAAT!? So this is actually real time, unlike the cutscenes from uncharted/TLoU?

 

[shinobi602]

its hilarious how you guys keep falling for this CG bullshit. In engine simply means exactly that, Another way of skirting around saying pre rendered using the games engine.

should I go ahead and create the gfx downgrade disappointment thread now or later?

 

[Dr. Kitty Muffins]

They assembled a dream team of programmers & artists and this is the result. It is simply amazing what can be done with the hardware once the right hands get ahold of it.

 

[Canis lupus]

its hilarious how you guys keep falling for this CG bullshit. In engine simply means exactly that, Another way of skirting around saying pre rendered using the games engine.

should I go ahead and create the gfx downgrade disappointment thread now or later?

Yes please go ahead create the thread so everyone can laugh at you

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=835985

 

[DemurOnion]

He was serious? Hehehehehehehe come on now.

 

[FalsettoVibe]

We will see downgrades, but I think the game will look great regardless.

 

[Sharpeye]

Shinobi got banned again?

 

[LastNac]

LastNac's Gods have already been exiled.

Now is the time of Druckley, praise be to our framerate overlords.

 

[LastNac]

if what you're expecting is a man walking into bushes simulator, then perhaps you guys really won't be disappointed.

Enough of that cynicism.

 

[1.21Gigawatts]

I'll suck that crow down without even cooking it if they hit 60fps with those graphics. With a smile on my goddamned face!

It just doesn't seem possible. O_O

Well, if they can pull it off that would be huge statement for GPGPU and would put a lot of pressure on other developers to use it, too. Especially since new AMD GPUs like the R 290x are capable of the same amount of compute commands as the Ps4(64 compared to the XboxOnes 18 and 4 of the HD7850-7970)
If games like TheWitcher3 can look this good without using that stuff to the full extent, there is no reason why games on PC and Ps4 shouldn't look much, much better than that.
The gap between Ps4 and XboxOne would become a lot wider than it is now if developers would tap into the GPGPU potential.
But unless the Ps4 absolutely dominate in sales I don't see developers do that, so we'll probably only see it in 1st party titles and maybe stuff like DeepDown where Sony helps with the engine work.

 

[squidyj]

2X more polygon didn't sound a lot somehow considering it's a changing hardware generation. Then again, tlou character model already look really good poly count wise.

So hopefully they spent all the extra next gen power to the environment, make it really dense and lush jungle, like what driveclub done for their environment.

2x is enough. I want you to spot the polys on Joel. using 8x the polys wouldn't make sense. They'll get more out of spending that budget on the environment and possibly npcs.