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[elektrixx]

I'm stayin' 60, but that's quite a difference.

 

[dragonfart28]

Not worth the drop to 30.

 

[Zakalwe]

I'm stayin' 60, but that's quite a difference.

Only if you stand still and take a good look.

Running around you're probably not going to notice it very much.

Regardless, it isn't worth 30 fps.

 

[PrimaNocta]

"Its easy to talk about, its easy to sum it up when you just talk about shadows. We sittin' in here, I'm supposed to be the franchise player, and we in here talkin' about shadows. I mean listen, we talkin bout shadows. Not a game, not a game, not a game. We talkin bout shadows. Not a game, not a, not a, not the game that I go out there and die for, and play every game like its my last. Not the game. We talkin' bout shadows, man. I mean how silly is that? We talkin' bout shadows. I know I'm supposed to be there, I know I'm supposed to lead by example. I know that, and I'm not shovin' it aside, you know, like it don't mean anything. I know its important, I do. I honestly do. But we talkin' bout shadows, man. What are we talkin' bout? Shadows? We talkin' bout shadows man. We talk... We talkin' bout shadows. We talkin' bout shadows. We ain't talkin' bout the game, we talkin' bout shadows, man. When you come into the arena, and you see me play, you see me play, don't you? You see me give everything I got, right? But we talkin' bout shadows right now. We talkin' bout shadows. (crowd laughs) Man look, I hear you, its funny to me too. I mean, its strange, its strange to me too. But we talkin' bout shadows man. We not even talkin' bout the game, the actual game, when it matters. We talkin' bout shadows!"

 

[nelsonroyale]

How is this not a name for an abs-exercising device yet.

Quick, patent it! hahah

 

[darkwing]

30 or 60? Looks really good!

you can look at the shadows, it's easy to tell if it's 30 or 60

shadows 4 lyf

 

[amar212]

Only if you stand still and take a good look.

Running around you're probably not going to notice it very much.

Regardless, it isn't worth 30 fps.

This post is 100% accurate.

 

[-MD-]

It would make more sense to say that about a gamer who sacrifices playability for a little bump in shadow resolution, also.

I think it was sarcasm.

 

[ron_bato]

Really strange. If that is the case, then the older shots do seem like one off bugs. I don't know what to think at this point. In either case, I'm playing the 60 fps version

EDIT: Kept staring at it and finally found areas where the lower resolution shows. Man, this stuff is going to be incredibly rare to notice unless you are looking for it. lol

It's at 60, I've been waiting for the prompt to get patch 1.01 but I have yet to get it. I would have been all over photo mode if I had 1.01 but still yet to receive a prompt for the patch.

At any case, you'll definitely notice the blocky shadows at times, but it's because everything else is super clean. I don't mind it though, the 60 fps gameplay is butter. Plus, the texture work and character models are insanely detailed and crisp. I don't want to sound like somebody gushing over the game (my av speaks for itself lol), but I'm very damn pleased with the outcome of the game.

Some more images for you all to dissect. I'll be playing some more later and posting some more pictures for those who want to see them.

http://i4.minus.com/iZnKRpXwd214o.jpg
http://i5.minus.com/iFDhpKXBQIbxg.jpg

PS The blocky shadows do exist, and you'll run into them for sure, but the above shows that it's not always bad.

 

[darkwing]

it's the better to see the game in motion, I don't think you are going to really notice the difference in shadows, maybe just turn the 30fps lock if you are in photomode , even then you have to zoom in

 

[gundamkyoukai]

ron bato your pics look so good making the wait even harder.

 

[ron_bato]

ron bato your pics look so good making the wait even harder.

Sorry! I don't want to be that guy, just want to show everyone what the game is like. I just want to say coming from someone who paid full retail and bought the season pass for the ps3 version, this remastered version is definitely worth every single peso. But hey, that's also coming from someone who has an Ellie av with a delsin beanie, hence why I want to let the pictures speak for themselves.

Can't wait for everyone to try the game out, I wish I didn't have to work tomorrow lol.

 

[Cthulhu_Steev]

"Its easy to talk about, its easy to sum it up when you just talk about shadows. We sittin' in here, I'm supposed to be the franchise player, and we in here talkin' about shadows. I mean listen, we talkin bout shadows. Not a game, not a game, not a game. We talkin bout shadows. Not a game, not a, not a, not the game that I go out there and die for, and play every game like its my last. Not the game. We talkin' bout shadows, man. I mean how silly is that? We talkin' bout shadows. I know I'm supposed to be there, I know I'm supposed to lead by example. I know that, and I'm not shovin' it aside, you know, like it don't mean anything. I know its important, I do. I honestly do. But we talkin' bout shadows, man. What are we talkin' bout? Shadows? We talkin' bout shadows man. We talk... We talkin' bout shadows. We talkin' bout shadows. We ain't talkin' bout the game, we talkin' bout shadows, man. When you come into the arena, and you see me play, you see me play, don't you? You see me give everything I got, right? But we talkin' bout shadows right now. We talkin' bout shadows. (crowd laughs) Man look, I hear you, its funny to me too. I mean, its strange, its strange to me too. But we talkin' bout shadows man. We not even talkin' bout the game, the actual game, when it matters. We talkin' bout shadows!"

'Get the hell out of my galaxy!'
\

 

[Freewheelin']

Hey guys so I was directed here by someone in the TLOU: OT and I have a question:

Can anyone with review copies confirm that the cutscene commentary has subtitles please? I am deaf and like commentaries on Blu-Rays when they have subs. Valve is a good example too

Thanks.

 

[ron_bato]

Sorry, I forgot I had these, but I took these ones for shadowGAF specifically. I can also take some pictures of the blocky shadows using different light sources, but there's a lot already that shows good examples of what you can expect. I can post them nonetheless just to make sure that I give examples for both sides. Just wanted to show again, that it's not always as bad as the examples given.

 

[IAmRandom31]

#team30

And no gameplay is sacrificed. That shit is hilarious.

 

[GavinUK86]

It looks like Tess has pigtails in the shadow, lol.

 

[Jhn]

Is there literally no AO at all in this? The hand-on-couch looks really bad without the contact shadow.

 

[bidguy]

Sorry, I forgot I had these, but I took these ones for shadowGAF specifically. I can also take some pictures of the blocky shadows using different light sources, but there's a lot already that shows good examples of what you can expect. I can post them nonetheless just to make sure that I give examples for both sides. Just wanted to show again, that it's not always as bad as the examples given.

is this the ps3 version ?

 

[CyberPunked]

Is there literally no AO at all in this? The hand-on-couch looks really bad without the contact shadow.

How much AO was in the original?

 

[Xav]

Why is this thread over 30 pages long?

Seriously guys?

 

[Hoo-doo]

is this the ps3 version ?

Just trolling now, huh?

 

[mrklaw]

No, not really. Those "shine over substance" people are what made consoles pretty much unplayable to me. It's a shame that ND decided to include a 30FPS mode in the first place. It's a thing of the past (actually, not really, because in the past games were 60FPS) and it needs to go NOW. It's an abdomination of console generations which were underpowered for the expectations people had for the graphics.

So it isn't good enough that you finally get a game at 60fps that you constantly go on about? You need to go further and remove any choice from people that might want to play at 30fps?

 

[GavinUK86]

is this the ps3 version ?

Yes, yes that is the PS3 version. /sigh

 

[pswii60]

I'm stayin' 60, but that's quite a difference.

60 FPS is an even bigger difference. And one which also has a direct positive impact on the feel of the game too. You're making the right decision going 60, only a fool would opt for half the framerate in this case, or someone with a shitty LCD TV with motion blur.

 

[Sid]

From the console screenshots thread:

Looks awesome.

 

[mrklaw]

This thread is a little embarrassing, so many pages on something so insignificant. I think the shadow resolution is not worth the framerate drop, really, but this is not a game where 60FPS is mandatory either way.

Everyone wins?

No, you have it wrong. 'Everyone wins' is one of those socialist phrases. Really it means 'nobody loses' - and we can't have that. For our choice to be properly justified, someone has to lose.

 

[Seanspeed]

Is there literally no AO at all in this? The hand-on-couch looks really bad without the contact shadow.

The screens do look quite flat.

is this the ps3 version ?

JPEG compression is playing a role here.

 

[Joey Ravn]

To each their own, but I'm finding completely mindboggling that some people are willing to half the framerate just to get better shadows. Of all the games I play, 95% of them I play them on PC... and I still wouldn't sacrifice so much performance for eye candy.

But, hey. To each their own.

 

[mrklaw]

TLOU used precomputed AO for static stuff - there'd be no reason for that to be absent. And the thing that "IS" obviously different - like the circled parts in the GIF are artifacts of different shadow-bias (both versions render the same-amount of shadow detail, but it's offset in PS4 version - in a way that creates artifacts in that particular screenshot).

What stands out to me more is the very-sharp shadows on PS4 - original version went with a heavily filtered/soft shadow look, blending with their approach to indirect shadows/AO from dynamic objects.
I've yet to see any footage of PS4 version demonstrating what indirect shadows look like (assuming they're still there) and that was one of the defining areas of what made TLOU stand out IMO.


See my post above - it's not cutbacks, it's basically a single value that has been tweaked differently on PS4.

Thanks for the clarification. I agree about the sharp shadows on PS4 vs the much softer ones on PS3

 

[Jhn]

How much AO was in the original?

I actually have no idea. Regardless, it's a weird oversight not to use it in the remaster. Even a really cheap ssao method would make this look much better.

 

[Cave Johnson]

It's rather funny since meant it the other way but since some of us know Thrakier we knew what he was trying to say .



A port of a game from a different system on a old engine does not tell us anything about the new system really .
That is like saying the GOW HD collection is going tell us how GOW 3 going to look on PS3 .

If you're talking about the developer capabilities than yes. The collection is a SOLID port. Making a last-gen game not run at a locked framerate only undermines the system, the developer or both. One can also argue that the GOW HD collection could've gone the way of the Silent Hill collection and the statement would still be correct.

 

[nOoblet16]

Is there literally no AO at all in this? The hand-on-couch looks really bad without the contact shadow.

TLOU characters cast indirect shadows instead having screen space AO implementation (which are always just approximations). Also the contact shadow should be minimal/not visible in cases like that picture where there's a lot of light, most AO implementations ignore this and will give you thick contact shadows even when there's bright light.

A port of a game from a different system on a old engine does not tell us anything about the new system really .
That is like saying the GOW HD collection is going tell us how GOW 3 going to look on PS3 .

No, because
1) GOW HD was not done by Santa Monica
2) The engine ND will use this gen is the same engine that was used in TLOU/Uncharted 1,2,3. Unlike GOW3's engine which was largely rewritten considering the massive changes in rendering techniques that came about with the 7th gen.

 

[Seanspeed]

To each their own, but I'm finding completely mindboggling that some people are willing to half the framerate just to get better shadows. Of all the games I play, 95% of them I play them on PC... and I still wouldn't sacrifice so much performance for eye candy.

But, hey. To each their own.

A dev came on here and straight up said that 30fps was included because it was easy to add the option. It isn't meant to be a trade-off situation. They just included better shadows because it was also apparently something pretty simple to do real quick. But they say the definitive way to play is 60fps, and they're dead on about that. 30fps is for people who have been brainwashed into thinking that 30fps is more 'cinematic' than 60fps and Naughty Dog figured its just easier to placate these people rather than hear them whine, I'm guessing. Not for those who prefer IQ over performance.

 

[Sylver]

Now we need a 60FPS30FPS-PS3 comparison gif in the OP.

 

[IAmRandom31]

To each their own, but I'm finding completely mindboggling that some people are willing to half the framerate just to get better shadows. Of all the games I play, 95% of them I play them on PC... and I still wouldn't sacrifice so much performance for eye candy.

But, hey. To each their own.

I'm the opposite. I will push my PC as hard as possible until I reach a solid 30fps while making the game look as good as it possibly can on my rig.

I've never once ran into a game where 60fps actually made me play noticeably better then 30. Be it racing or whatever. Well scratch that, a fighting game needs those extra frames, but few other games do.

As long as the game doesnt go from 30 to 35 to 30 to 40 to 30 to 35 and just hops all over the place, and just keeps a steady framerate, it is all gravy.

 

[Cthulhu_Steev]

Why is this thread over 30 pages long?

Seriously guys?

It's 60 pages if you're a true gamer.

 

[jett]

edit: eh i'm not really sure

 

[Dr. Black Jack]

Why is this thread over 30 pages long?

Seriously guys?

TLOU + a reason to bitch is too much to resist, apparently.

 

[AKyemeni]

Hey guys so I was directed here by someone in the TLOU: OT and I have a question:

Can anyone with review copies confirm that the cutscene commentary has subtitles please? I am deaf and like commentaries on Blu-Rays when they have subs. Valve is a good example too

Thanks.

Yes, the commentaries hAve subtitles.

 

[Jhn]

TLOU characters cast indirect shadows instead having screen space AO implementation (which are always just approximations). Also the contact shadow should be minimal/not visible in cases like that picture where there's a lot of light, most AO implementations ignore this and will give you thick contact shadows even when there's bright light.

Well, that does look like a very nice GI solution, but I'd still prefer a subtle, very short range ssao implementation in place for complementing their indirect shadows with contact shadows. The hand on the couch really should produce at least a subtle contact shadow, and it feels very detached and synthetic for not doing so. Yes, most games go overboard with it, but not having it at all just looks bad to me.

 

[Xun]

Not a huge jump over the PS3 version, but I never expected much better.

Also it could be the GIF, but the texture filtering looks ever so slightly better in the 30 fps version as well.

 

[tiny raptor]

I think it was sarcasm.

It was him botching his words/meaning.

 

[velociraptor]

Circled or not, there are obvious cutbacks being made in this version. Lighting improvements have been touted again and again by this company. Now we're seeing many lighting effects from the last gen version are completely missing (such as wrinkles on clothing when moving and many shadows in the environment). Yes, we're pissed about this rush job and don't want to support this half done port. I wonder what else they left out.

Wow.

 

[darkkain]

You won't see differences in shadows during masive gameplay 60 fps for sure for me Great work ND.

 

[Fafalada]

How much AO was in the original?

Original has the best indirect-shadows of any game in last generation by far. That said - there was still overdarkening like in pretty much any game that uses any sort of dynamic AO in last 8 years, but that's a separate topic.

Well, that does look like a very nice GI solution, but I'd still prefer a subtle, very short range ssao implementation in place for complementing their indirect shadows with contact shadows.

There were areas in TLOU on PS3 where it looked like they were doing something like that (mostly because I saw what looked like camera dependant artifacts). Most importantly - like that GIF showcases the scenes didn't look like it ever missed contact-shadows, so this could be a case of isolated screenshot showing things in a bad light - or even PS4 version actually doing something different than original(there's already evidence of shadowmap bias being different, leading people to complain about missing shadows, as well as different filtering on shadows themselves). Anyone capture actual PS4 gameplay in motion that would showcase the shadowing?

 

[Freewheelin']

Yes, the commentaries hAve subtitles.

That's great thanks!

 

[DSN2K]

makes sense really, anyone who plays PC games knows when you want to improve frame rate your first decision is shadow quality. Its a big killer in performance.

 

[TronLight]

No, because
1) GOW HD was not done by Santa Monica
2) The engine ND will use this gen is the same engine that was used in TLOU/Uncharted 1,2,3. Unlike GOW3's engine which was largely rewritten considering the massive changes in rendering techniques that came about with the 7th gen.

And you think that their engine won't be significantly rewritten too?

 

[n0tail]

Holy Moly! That's a HUGE difference in shadow quality between 30 and 60 FPS. Now I am torn between which to pick. Considering how big the difference is I might actually go for 30 FPS for the story and then change to 60 for multiplayer.