Super Mario Maker: Not all tools available from the start, unlock over 9 days

Cbajd5 said:
Wait, I figued it out.

They're doing it so people can't make levels making fun of the September 11th terrorist attacks on the anniversary/launch day. Or at least any with Bullet Bills.

Unless people get early copies, but I imagine the combination between the two groups will be nonexistent.
Click to expand...

I'd love to call this a stupid joke, but...

Anyone else notice Nintendo is now exclusively referring to the release date as the 11th of September? Pretty smart move on their part honestly.
 
I wonder if they didn't add slopes because SMB 1 didn't have slopes. So, since you can instantly convert your level between the different mario game graphics, it make sense that slopes aren't in the game because it may break SMB 1 levels.
 
jholmes said:
I'd love to call this a stupid joke, but...

Anyone else notice Nintendo is now exclusively referring to the release date as the 11th of September? Pretty smart move on their part honestly.
Click to expand...
Well since saying the date like that is so unorthodox is automatically makes you think of why they are doing it and thus 9/11, so I'm not sure if it really matters. It is an awkward release date though.
davidbruy said:
I wonder if they didn't add slopes because SMB 1 didn't have slopes. So, since you can instantly convert your level between the different mario game graphics, it make sense that slopes aren't in the game because it may break SMB 1 levels.
Click to expand...
But they added elements that weren't in previous games, like Baby Bowser. Having no slopes is pretty odd, it just may be that it doesn't jive with how the creator operates (each section of the map is basically one square). I would like to see more complex functions in a later update for sure.
 
davidbruy said:
I wonder if they didn't add slopes because SMB 1 didn't have slopes. So, since you can instantly convert your level between the different mario game graphics, it make sense that slopes aren't in the game because it may break SMB 1 levels.
Click to expand...

I figure that's probably it, but honestly, they could have just added sliding to the game.
 
Forkball said:
Well since saying the date like that is so unorthodox is automatically makes you think of why they are doing it and thus 9/11, so I'm not sure if it really matters. It is an awkward release date though.

But they added elements that weren't in previous games, like Baby Bowser. Having no slopes is pretty odd, it just may be that it doesn't jive with how the creator operates (each section of the map is basically one square). I would like to see more complex functions in a later update for sure.
Click to expand...

Maybe during testing, slopes broke some elements of the game, so they had to take it out for now. Hopefully they'll fix the issues and brink it back with a future update.
 
It just makes no sense to me.

What about the guy who only played for 10 minutes on day 1? He still gets the new tools tomorrow. He hasn't learned shit. Nintendo should lock away all further updates for him until he can prove he has mastered the day 1 tools.

Seems like a weird stance to take just to defend this practice. In what perfect world do we live where people will sit down, observe the tools given to them, and strive to make the best and most balanced level they can with those tools and learn from those experiences and, now fortified with that Day 1 experience, prepare themselves for the exciting Day 2 where they will be able to make even cooler and awesomer levels and so forth and so forth.
It's a level editor. I wanna create wacky shit. Just give me all the goddamn tools. You're not grooming Mario Maker supersoldiers here.
 
I've been trying to pre download this for 3 days and I haven't been able to connect to the e shop once. Its always the same. Internet? Fine. Eshop? Nope.
 
I think the only way to look at it is...

Does this feature make people buy it?

Or

Does this feature make people not want to buy it?

It's pretty clear that no one is going to buy it because of this, but they might not buy it because of it.
 
I knew about no slopes but no vertical levels???


The vertical levels in SMB3 were my favorites! Is it that hard to have a flip the canvas button??
 
A Link to the Snitch said:
I figure that's probably it, but honestly, they could have just added sliding to the game.
Click to expand...

Well, the game seems to use NSMBU's engine and changes the graphics and Mario's abilities to suit the style. Sliding would just be another switch like wall jumping and ground pounding. If slopes and sliding were in the game it absolutely would have been turned off in SMB style.

Slopes in SMB would just be wrong, though. Likely that's part of the reason slopes aren't in the game. The way I would have liked them to have handled the problem is that when a level with a slope is converted to SMB style all slope tiles just become solid square tiles.

This:
o3PLiCt.png


would become this:
BOsheYP.png


I don't think this would be a problem, since that's essentially already what the game does in the airship theme of the game, albeit the slopes are upsidedown:
q79bOh3.jpg


Airship is the only theme that does this, so those tiles that contain slopes would have to become completely square in other themes.

Maybe they just couldn't figure out a good way to make a slope tool that's as simple as the rest of the tools, or they didn't want to have any tools that could not be used at all in one theme. It would give SMB even more of a disadvantage than it already has. They came up with the mystery mushroom thing to give SMB an equivalent to the leaf, feather, and propeller mushroom, but a slope tool... there's no simple equivalent replacement for that.
 
Bulbasaur said:
I knew about no slopes but no vertical levels???


The vertical levels in SMB3 were my favorites! Is it that hard to have a flip the canvas button??
Click to expand...

can't you connect each area of a level with a door or a pipe?

For example, World 3 - 4, when you start the level you go up as high as you can and to keep on going up, you need to use a vine, pipe, or door to enter the next area of the level. Repeat until you want to end the level.

It's probably not what you want but it's just an idea.
 
davidbruy said:
can't you connect each area of a level with a door or a pipe?

For example, World 3 - 4, when you start the level you go up as high as you can and to keep on going up, you need to use a vine, pipe, or door to enter the next area of the level. Repeat until you want to end the level.

It's probably not what you want but it's just an idea.
Click to expand...

That could work. I'll definitely give it a try!
 
There's no way slopes aren't in because of SMB1, it takes 10 mins to make slopes out of the SMB1 ground sprites. Not to mention, there are loads of things in the SMB1 style now that weren't in the original game, and the NSMBU engine that is used for this game obviously has slopes.

They probably left it out because they think people can only handle blocky ground and slopes are too complicated for us.
 
Azure Dream said:
It's 9 days from whenever you buy it and start playing, presuming you put in at least 5 minutes a day.
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MrBadger said:
New stuff is unlocked from you playing it. You'll have to wait 9 days no matter when you buy it.
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maxcriden said:
The content is all there day one. Whenever you buy the game, you will need to play for five minutes in the editor each day for nine days to unlock the next day's content.



No, you can't. Whenever you buy the game, you will need to play for five minutes in the editor each day for nine days to unlock the next day's content.



You will be able to create plenty of interesting levels with the initial toolset.
Click to expand...

Vital Tundra said:
Its based on YOUR play. Not a server.
Click to expand...

Kriken said:
It's not 9 days from September 11th, it's 9 days from a unique purchase
Click to expand...

herod said:
lol
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reading comprehension fail :(

god damn! i do not like that one bit
 
Ensures the community builds up enough over the 9 first days and the levels get more and more complex but not a total mess in the first few days.
 
This is a game that adds graphical features (rotation), elements, and properties (swimming Goombas) that didn't exist before. Saying Super Mario Bros didn't have slopes isn't really an excuse.

It's more likely they couldn't find an elegant way to easily handle slopes. It's the most commonly requested feature I've seen so hopefully Nintendo has noticed. If not, there's always Miiverse when the game is out to voice our wishes.
 
They left slopes out because they'd have to make a slide sprite for mario and all the other 80+ amiibos costumes for the smb style. /s
 
BGBW said:
This is a game that adds graphical features (rotation), elements, and properties (swimming Goombas) that didn't exist before. Saying Super Mario Bros didn't have slopes isn't really an excuse.

It's more likely they couldn't find an elegant way to easily handle slopes. It's the most commonly requested feature I've seen so hopefully Nintendo has noticed. If not, there's always Miiverse when the game is out to voice our wishes.
Click to expand...

I think that those elements that they added that SMB1 didn't have before are things that can be more easily overlooked, but slopes go against SMB1's visual identity in a much stronger way. I think it's a mix of both that and that a slope tool was difficult to make as simply as the rest of the tools. The game already makes upsidedown slopes in the airship theme so obviously it's not impossible.

I suppose another reason might be that slopes only really fit the plains and underground themes and they didn't want to create slope assets for theme where few people would use them and they'd look bad anyway.

Really, a slope tool can be as simple as the slopes generated in the airship theme. Just have a sloped terrain tool, and when you paint with it it generates slopes along the outer tiles automatically.

To use my earlier example in reverse, if you painted this with the sloped terrain tool:
BOsheYP.png


you'd get this:
o3PLiCt.png


So nix that. A slope tool would be very simple.

ffdgh said:
They left slopes out because they'd have to make a slide sprite for mario and all the other 80+ amiibos costumes for the smb style. /s
Click to expand...
They could just say that SMB1 Mario doesn't have the ability to slide and/or make slopes not exist in SMB1 style.
 
Slopes are for Super Mario Maker II, that'll also include Super Mario Bros 2 graphics and functions.

On topic: the way they deal with unlocking is a bit weird. I can understand why they don't want to give you all the tools at one, but they could've handled it better (ie, get extra tools after making your first level. Get a second bunch after creating a certain type of level. Another bunch after creating your tenth level etc - like most games do it).

It's a good way to ensure people will come back to your game several days in a row though.
 
I see no reason why slopes couldn't work in SMB 1. They wouldn't even have to draw sliding sprites -- the perfect ones already exist within Mario's climbing animation:

UbWDJ2M.png
 
Well its just what we already know but I said I would keep you in the loop.
Nintendo PR got back to me:

Thanks for your email. I understand your question, but this is done for a reason.

When you start building levels, you have a limited number of tools at your disposal. The number of tools you have available will be expanded over the course of a few days, as you create more in the game. So you get the chance to get the basics of level creation master. This is intentional, so players do not feel overwhelmed by the sheer number of tools in the game.

At present this is the only information I have. Should we have more information we will let you know.
Click to expand...

So just what we already knew but I'm keeping you in the loop.
 
The Dutch Slayer said:
Well its just what we already know but I said I would keep you in the loop.
Nintendo PR got back to me:



So just what we already knew but I'm keeping you in the loop.
Click to expand...
Oh yes. Don't want players to be overwhelmed by the unlimited posibilities of the arrow sign. That shit takes at least 7 days to mentally prepare for :P
 
Are we doing wishlists

Because

Frog Suit
Slopes
Turnips
Item that turns enemies into undead versions of themselves (aside from Dry Bones and Boo obviously)
Desert theme
Pokey
More interactions between items and enemies (fire flower could turn certain enemies into fire variants, enemies could be planted in turnips, Brick Blocks could be put onto Goombas to turn them into Pile-Driver Micro Goombas, etc.)
Vertical stages
Slopes
Rotating ground (a la New Super Mario Bros. Wii)
Hidden overlay like ramparter said
Chargin' Chuck
Shaking a Fire Flower turns it into an Ice Flower
 
Teknoman said:
Are we 100% on slopes not being in? I mean you can slide in every SMB game since 3.
Click to expand...

Yes. They would have to make a slope tool.

The more I think about it, the more I think they didn't put one in because slopes are very uncommon in Mario games. For example, SMB3 only has 16 total levels with slopes; all of which are either grass, desert, ice, or underground themed. I'm thinking the main reason is that Nintendo didn't want to make slope assets for all of SMB in addition to for themes that don't normally have slopes, mainly castle and ghost house. Yes both of those can technically have staircases, but staircases are only at a 45 degree angle.
 
My guess for the rationale for this is partially what they claimed (to avoid overwhelming new buyers and encourage creativity with the base tools), but mostly to incentivize people to play daily until they're hooked. It's like the mobile games that give you an increasing bonus for playing on consecutive days.
 
RagnarokX said:
I think that those elements that they added that SMB1 didn't have before are things that can be more easily overlooked, but slopes go against SMB1's visual identity in a much stronger way. I think it's a mix of both that and that a slope tool was difficult to make as simply as the rest of the tools. The game already makes upsidedown slopes in the airship theme so obviously it's not impossible.

I suppose another reason might be that slopes only really fit the plains and underground themes and they didn't want to create slope assets for theme where few people would use them and they'd look bad anyway.

Really, a slope tool can be as simple as the slopes generated in the airship theme. Just have a sloped terrain tool, and when you paint with it it generates slopes along the outer tiles automatically.

To use my earlier example in reverse, if you painted this with the sloped terrain tool:
http://i.imgur.com/BOsheYP.png

you'd get this:
http://i.imgur.com/o3PLiCt.png

So nix that. A slope tool would be very simple.

They could just say that SMB1 Mario doesn't have the ability to slide and/or make slopes not exist in SMB1 style.
Click to expand...
Ghost houses use stairs as slopes. Airships and castles tend to be more blocky but I don't think that would be too much of a factor.

While having a slope tool could work I wouldn't be surprised that having it as a separate tool was considered too messy i.e. they wanted people to be able to plonk down the ground in one easy go. Though making slopes the alt to ground (shaking them) would be one way to keep them together. The alternative would be more them to be like flowers and bushes, they auto generate when you make the stair formation with the ground texture, but you can use the eraser to remove them if you want to retain the block look. After all, in SMB, the stairs are often made with blocks not the ground, which often just stays the same height throughout the game ergo staying true to the SMB look wouldn't be that much of a problem.

Teknoman said:
Are we 100% on slopes not being in? I mean you can slide in every SMB game since 3.
Click to expand...
Technically no since no one has the final code, but it's an odd element to keep hidden.
 
BGBW said:
Ghost houses use stairs as slopes. Airships and castles tend to be more blocky but I don't think that would be too much of a factor.

While having a slope tool could work I wouldn't be surprised that having it as a separate tool was considered too messy i.e. they wanted people to be able to plonk down the ground in one easy go. Though making slopes the alt to ground (shaking them) would be one way to keep them together. The alternative would be more them to be like flowers and bushes, they auto generate when you make the stair formation with the ground texture, but you can use the eraser to remove them if you want to retain the block look. After all, in SMB, the stairs are often made with blocks not the ground, which often just stays the same height throughout the game ergo staying true to the SMB look wouldn't be that much of a problem.


Technically no since no one has the final code, but it's an odd element to keep hidden.
Click to expand...

I could see why it may be hidden. Like you said, it would be a complicated thing for a lot of people - I think we can all agree that it's not as simple as putting Kamek or a Chain Chomp into a level. I don't expect it'd be in, but if it was, I could see it locked away, either to be unlocked on like day 10 or something, or unlocked through play.
 
A Link to the Snitch said:
Are we doing wishlists

Because

Frog Suit
Slopes
Turnips
Item that turns enemies into undead versions of themselves (aside from Dry Bones and Boo obviously)
Desert theme
Pokey
More interactions between items and enemies (fire flower could turn certain enemies into fire variants, enemies could be planted in turnips, Brick Blocks could be put onto Goombas to turn them into Pile-Driver Micro Goombas, etc.)
Vertical stages
Slopes
Rotating ground (a la New Super Mario Bros. Wii)
Hidden overlay like ramparter said
Chargin' Chuck
Shaking a Fire Flower turns it into an Ice Flower
Click to expand...

The on/off switch for platform shenanigans.
Green fruit for low time levels with yoshi.
Edit: Oh and that red triangle block that lets you run up walls in SMW.
 
I really feel like this is the only Mario Maker game we're ever going to get, aside from a 3DS port or something like that. So there's probably a lot of ideas they're not putting into the game so they can sell other Mario games on those gimmicks being in there. Not to mention the NSMB art style is probably going away and they're going to use this as an opportunity to send it off before a new style comes in.
 
RowdyReverb said:
My guess for the rationale for this is partially what they claimed (to avoid overwhelming new buyers and encourage creativity with the base tools), but mostly to incentivize people to play daily until they're hooked. It's like the mobile games that give you an increasing bonus for playing on consecutive days.
Click to expand...

Nintendo need to understand that this is not a mobile game. But after Splatoon i'm not shocked anymore.

maniac-kun said:
How about an expert setting in the options to unlock everything from the start.
Click to expand...

in this way you'll not play for 9 consecutive day
 
oatmeal said:
I think the only way to look at it is...

Does this feature make people buy it?

Or

Does this feature make people not want to buy it?

It's pretty clear that no one is going to buy it because of this, but they might not buy it because of it.
Click to expand...
If it successfully increases the overall quality of the online levels, then it quite possibly could.

If it successfully leads people to become more well-rounded level designers and enjoying it more as a result, it quite possibly could.

Neither of these are guaranteed, of course. But they could both act as forces for making the game more popular over its run.

I really wish there was an Iwata Asks for this game, actually. I'm sure they'd touch on this and why they did it. (Maybe that was the last one he did…)
 
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