Foxtastical
Member
Portable Ops always gets shit because of what Kojima said, but Portable Ops is the last time that Metal Gear really felt like Metal Gear to me. To each their own, but I really liked Portable Ops.
SPOILER: Spoiler Metal Gear Solid V (TPS) Spoiler Thread (Contains Spoilers, Thanos).
- Thread starter Love Deterrence
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Essentially, the game was supposed to show how Big Boss turned into the villain he was in MG1 and MG2, ostensibly through his acts as the head of TPP's Mother Base. It doesn't, even if it calls his morals into question in other ways, and its pretty convoluted what we have gotten instead.
I can definitely understand why people would dislike it, even if I do like the idea.
I liked PO, too. I was surprised to find out Kojima didn't make it.
Just a small correction, from the leaked dialogue, it seems like it wasn't exactly his doing, by the time he woke up, it was already done, he just decided to accept and play along. Sure, you can argue that this makes him a bad person as well, but to me it's clear how this somewhat lessens his fault in the whole deal, it was already done before he could even do anything about it.
robotoboy20
Banned
His dad strikes me as a sociopath... in fact all of DD/Militaires Sans Frontières seem to be made up of manipulative self driven sociopaths. Hal doesn't try to kill his step-daughter out of jealousy... and he also doesn't let his love interests die... generally they die outside of his control... Huey is a monster however, even helping create weapons of mass destruction for leaders he believes in.
I guess that's true... to some extent. However his friends and colleagues also helped. Kaz is a piece of crap... Ocelot has always been an asshole... and BB really isn't any better.
Spainkiller
the man who sold the world
I don't think anyone has pointed this out yet, but: the twist actually makes sense from a gameplay perspective and has been staring the player in the face from the get-go.
See, you don't even have to do the missions as Venom Snake; you can play most missions with every Mother Base soldier available. Just pick a different character on the loadout screen and voila, you're good to go.
(The reason you might want to do this? Because every soldier has different stats and might work out better in certain missions. For instance, a soldier with a high Medic stat will see medicinal plants from a greater distance, etc.)
But what does this imply? Exactly: that every soldier has the potential to be a Big Boss. You could theoretically beat the game as Random Bald Russian #235, code name Freaky Buffalo, because the avatar doesn't matter. Your actions as a player matter.
It's a perfect twist that ties into what we do as gamers so incredibly well.
See, you don't even have to do the missions as Venom Snake; you can play most missions with every Mother Base soldier available. Just pick a different character on the loadout screen and voila, you're good to go.
(The reason you might want to do this? Because every soldier has different stats and might work out better in certain missions. For instance, a soldier with a high Medic stat will see medicinal plants from a greater distance, etc.)
But what does this imply? Exactly: that every soldier has the potential to be a Big Boss. You could theoretically beat the game as Random Bald Russian #235, code name Freaky Buffalo, because the avatar doesn't matter. Your actions as a player matter.
It's a perfect twist that ties into what we do as gamers so incredibly well.
Whoa, I like this.
BTW, I asked a few pages back, but does the game have in-game volume controls for music and such? GZ doesn't and it annoys me, but I'm hoping TPP will.
Dick Justice
Banned
Judging from what I've heard about TPP, that hardly seems to be the case. Though his design in Peace Walker was a hilariously lazy duplication of Otacon.
Once again, this would be totally cool if the cop-outs surrounding it weren't so incredibly stupid. There's a point to be made but it's lost under nonsense.
Foxtastical
Member
And others might think it's not nonsense. To each their own.
Objectively it's pretty bad. The only way it's not is if you don't particularly care for consistency and don't mind outrageous explanations that don't have any logical place in the story.
That's actually a very cool feature, didn't know that was possible. I assume you'll always have Sutherland's voice though, right? Or are there generic noises for male soldier and female soldier? Can you play as Ocelot?
I still think the twist is dumb and what you're saying now is nonsense, but it's quite a cool feature.
Foxtastical
Member
Shits not objective, sorry. Your response to a piece of entertainment media is anything but.
Again, I'm not really feeling what we're hearing either. But I'm reserving judgment and seeing how my interpretation pans out.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
She's in the mission where you need to rescue Huey.
Can you justify all of this game's explanations logically and consistently?
I don't care who I play as, I just wanted to see how Big Boss made his transformation. Him having a double, being a sham, etc, while interesting, is not really what I wanted to see. I just wanted to see how he would just reach that point whether we controlled him, were an observer, or whatever.
TheCthultist
Member
Welcome to the Metal Gear series... From MG1 there's been tons of things that either can't be explained logically or require a huge suspension of disbelief. Retcon a have been made left and right on different pieces of the lore. And nothing about them take away from the overall quality of the work. So I don't see why this is any different.
Yeah, he was never set up as "you are Big Boss." He was his own character with his own personality, ideals, motivations, etc. Not like Raiden, who was as green as the trees and didn't have much of his own defining characteristics until late in the game. Then all of a sudden those are virtually erased for the sake of an unnecessary repeat of a message we got over a decade ago, only handled much worse at the expense of just about everything else.
The quality of this work (story) isn't very good, so they do take away from it. There's been a few individual examples in past games, but this one takes the cake. I'm glad the series is dead now.
TheCthultist
Member
Damn that got dark fast. While I'm not going to pretend you don't have some good points, I'm going to reserve my judgement for when I actually finish the game. I find it hard to believe this is really going to be as bad as people are making it out to be, but that may just be because I more or less subscribe to the same school of thought that Spainkiller has on it. The idea that any soldier can be Big Boss given the right circumstances just comes across as a very Metal Gear theme.
How do you know how it was handled? When we have multiple people who played and experienced it telling us that it's handled well, why are you so intent on burying it in the fucking ground before you ever get to see it for yourself?
TheCthultist
Member
It's probably because he's disappointed about how it's turned out vs what he had expected the end result to be. Nothing wrong with that, you see it all the time in spoiler threads. You have to come into these things expecting a good volume of salt to be thrown around. Anytime something someone has waited a long time for doesn't match what they had hoped for, there's going to be some bitterness.
Wow. I worried this wouldn't have good boss fights, but it looks like that is unfounded.
Just unfortunate that the guy playing is probably the worst MGS player I've ever seen ;-)
TheCthultist
Member
How the fuck did DSP get a copy?!
I guess you're right.
A part of me has a hard time understanding it though. It almost feels like some are ignoring the history of this series in order to justify their hate of the mgs5 twist
TheCthultist
Member
Oh some of that has definitely also been going on. Give it a week. the game's not even out yet and there's already this much drama surrounding it. After people have had a few days to play it, stuff will start clearing up... probably...
TheSpoiler
Member
I came back to this thread and now people are trying to use terms like "objectively" wrong?
Bruh.
Bruh.
TheCthultist
Member
Again, you're probably right
I appreciate the optimism
Stupidly high amounts of optimism are the only thing keeping me sane til launch
Back to the spoilers at hand, has anyone else been able to confirm that Super Spoiler from the first page? I really, reeeeeeeeaaally want that to be true.
TheCthultist
Member
The game appears to have a Metal Gear-esque ending twist, and as such people are losing their shit.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
Is it me or is that stream super laggy?
I caught that, but I'd like to read about what that twist is.
PandaAttack
Banned
Metal Quiet! How many skins does she have?
You play as the Medic from Ground Zeroes who assumes he is actually Big Boss for the majority of the game.
Oh, isn't that what like everyone guessed from the get go? Why are folks freaking out then? Also, was this done to him on purpose? Where is the actual Big Boss during all this and what does he think about it?
AwayFromInfinityx
Member
Just a heads up for my fellow Gaf brothers that live in new york
JanL video games are selling the game right now.
JanL video games are selling the game right now.
Apparently Zero did it after GZ while Medic and BB were both in a coma to protect the real BB after they woke up. BB finds out about it and goes along with it, is in hiding from then until eventually Zanzibar. Outer Heaven BB is Medic (Venom Snake).
mgs2master2
Banned
im so confused. what part is he at? hes fighting MB troops
I know what I'm playing tonight
what?
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