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SPOILER: Spoiler Metal Gear Solid V (TPS) Spoiler Thread (Contains Spoilers, Thanos).
- Thread starter Love Deterrence
- Start date
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Stallion Dan
Member
Anyone beat the Quiet fight on Extreme? One hit and you're dead, no reflex mode, the moment you pop your head out she fires, and crawling around slowly doesn't hide you from her like it does regular snipers.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
Supply drops bro.
Stallion Dan
Member
Drop them on her?
crazyrabbits
Banned
This is why I think the game was cut or changed drastically in development. A lot of the revelations just don't add up with what we discover over the course of the game.
Ishmael (in his hospital garb) doesn't seem to have much fighting ability, decent shooting skills and no facial hair from what we can see in stills of him. Yet, he is supposedly BB and is sporting a full shaggy head of hair, beard and mustache under those thin bandages.
I have a feeling that the whole "Venom is fake BB" twist was added in over the last few months (along with the clipped narrative) as a result of the shenanigans from Konami, plus an unclear goal of what the game was supposed to be. There's enough cut/unclear content (the Skullface hallucinations, the African child soldier scenes, the shot of him screaming in the napalmed village, Mission 51) to suggest that things were originally going to be different.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
Christ how does this thread have so many views
It truly amazes me how far people will go to blame Konami.
Shit company it maybe, but forcing a release due to deadlines is readonable and Kojima failed to tell a coherent/satisfying story is on him.
Charlouie Jonesman
Banned
I know the screen with the co-writer for MGS1-3 gets thrown around a lot, however, Kojima *did* write Snatcher & Policenauts by himself, so he did have good days. Policenauts is probably the most straight-forward out of all his games.
As far as I know, the several co-writers that the series had over the years, were mostly responsible for optional codec conversations. That's what Kojima said in interviews years back, during the MGS2 and 3 era, he wrote all the main cutscene dialogue, but a lot of the codec dialogue was handled by different writers.
So it's probably just a case of Kojima going full-on crazy over the years.
Coffee Dog
Banned
Yeah, as much as I want to say it's the cowriters, the various interviews kojima has had over the years talking about the story and the themes shows that there was a lot of of the original trilogy that came from him and was intentional.
His writing just got a lot more inconsistent in recent years and is flat out bad a lot more often than it used to be. It's a shame.
crazyrabbits
Banned
I have no problem with a company enforcing the bottom line. That being said, everything I've read so far over the last few days indicates something happened. Whether it was on either party, it affected the content in the game in a significant way, I believe.
That whole spiel before release about how we would go to revisit Camp Omega and do something that "had never been done in video games before" has turned out to be vaporware, or at the very least something that isn't on the disc at all. We know there was a massive chunk of story chopped out when it was 30% complete, answering one of the biggest story hooks in the game (where did the Sahelanthropus go?). There are other elements seen in the trailer (like the whole "Skullface vision") that seemed to be setting up story points that never appeared. Hell, there's the fact that main story content mostly drops off a cliff in Chapter 2, in favor of remixed missions.
Then there's all the content that just doesn't add up. The lanky, skinny Ishmael is seemingly shot during the ambulance escape, but when we cut back to it later, he's perfectly fine and grows a lot of muscle mass when Ocelot gives him the motorbike. The final scene at the mirror is so vague and confusing as to be non-descriptive. Is it directly after the events of the game or directly before MG1? If it's the latter and he's listening to a tape about Operation Intrude, why hasn't he aged? Or is wearing his apparel from MG1? Why is he using a tape recorder and MSX when CDs were around? If it's set right after the events of the game, how/why would Operation Intrude been planned that far in advance? And why is Kiefer Sutherland's performance so half-assed (like, "Harrison Ford in 'Blade Runner' reshoots" half-assed) when it's so much better over the course of the game?
Now people are holding out hope that there's going to be some sort of patch released in a week that ties into 9/11 and missing story material. I doubt that's going to happen.
As much as I'd like to blame all of this on Kojima's typical trolling, there's just too much of it to chalk it up to manipulative editing. Something happened that changed the scope of the game.
Black Pewter
Member
Find cover, and tap L2 to quickly pop out to make her shoot.
Shoot back when she pulls back the bolt of her rifle.
Snake goes to visit Hideo Kojima at his office: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6jm2IHFqyY
i dont know about that, MGS story started getting inconsistent(to not say something worse), after fukushima left, and i dont believe for a second that he was only, or mainly doing codec stuff, especially when you consider he was involved in MGS1-3 writing, and also wrote Ghost Babel by himself and thats a game thats as Metal Gear as they come
Uh, its over? Thats it? What the hell?
Seriously, im a huge metal gear fan... While i was fighting the final boss, I was like "This is a great midway point"
So many unanswered questions....
Edit: Fuck, how do i get the real ending? Are you serious.
edit2: THERES A CHAPTER 2 ARE YOU FUCKING JOKING
Seriously, im a huge metal gear fan... While i was fighting the final boss, I was like "This is a great midway point"
So many unanswered questions....
Edit: Fuck, how do i get the real ending? Are you serious.
edit2: THERES A CHAPTER 2 ARE YOU FUCKING JOKING
Bam Bam Baklava
Member
Policenauts, Snatcher, and MGS were extremely well written stories with clear focus and well thought out situations/characters.
After that it was just nanomachines, bizarre bullshit, retcons, and blatant movie ripoffs.
After that it was just nanomachines, bizarre bullshit, retcons, and blatant movie ripoffs.
If I kill quiet on the rerun will she be dead in the actual game?
Coffee Dog
Banned
As much as I'm shitting on it, the game is basically what I expected, it really is a lot like peace walker with a crazy budget. Its just too bad it was a monkey's paw deal and the story had to be sacrificed to the powers that be in order for me to get a really entertaining big boss warlord simulator.
Charlouie Jonesman
Banned
Not that I disagree with the rest of your post, but Kojima's movie rip-offs were never quite as blatant again, as they were in Snatcher & Policenauts.
We need to save this post for future reference. What you just said is exactly what seems to have happened.
Metroidvania
People called Romanes they go the house?
Come to think of it....
Does anyone know if we actually get to go back to camp omega in TPP?
I haven't seen any real mention of going back there anywhere, though I haven't been looking super hard.
edit: Missed it being mentioned above as a 'probably not'. That's a shame, though another possible indicator that there was budget/time constraints somewhere along the line.
Does anyone know if we actually get to go back to camp omega in TPP?
I haven't seen any real mention of going back there anywhere, though I haven't been looking super hard.
edit: Missed it being mentioned above as a 'probably not'. That's a shame, though another possible indicator that there was budget/time constraints somewhere along the line.
crazyrabbits
Banned
There is nothing whatsoever about it in the guide. This is despite said guide going out of its way to list the GZ recruits that transfer over and other save bonuses.
Whatever it was, it changed or was removed at least before the guide was released. I can't help but feel that it's cut content. Hopefully modders start cracking into the files and seeing what's there. That's my hope.
XANDER CAGE
Member
No way. The twist was predicted way back when GZ first came out, and I think maybe even before that. Part of what's so bad about the twist, aside from it adding nothing to the narrative, is just how blatant and obvious it is.
-Kiefer clearly voiced Ishmael in the 2012 reveal
-Boss being shown smoking fake cigars
-The medic sharing BB's face model in GZ if you poked through the files (granted, not sure if that's actually because of the twist plans or not)
-The robot arm
-The whole Moby Dick Studios/Joakim Mogren stunt
-The split V/exclamation mark logo that shows two lines converging into one point (two lines converging into one point - two men forming one legend; I know this sounds like rambling at this point but consider the next point as well)
-The "Metal Gear Solid V" logo being hidden within the phantom pain logo in the reveal trailer
Concealed identities and doubles were always part of the narrative. It's even part of the graphic design. So much dialogue in the game hammers you over the head with the reveal. Nearly every major character has some kind of ham fisted HMM IS THAT REALLY YOU BOSS NO IT CAN'T BE line.
The twist was always there and it was always going to be stupid. Everything we're missing is stuff unrelated to that particular ruse, which is pretty clearly something that's been planned since the beginning.
entremet
Member
It honestly didn't get bad until 4. MGS2 foretold tons of stuff regarding the Internet. Play it again. It's brilliant.
KOMANI
KOMANI
You know, the "Solid" series is much like Star Wars. The first three are awesome, but the last three... Uh... Not so good. It's as if MGS1-3 had a message and a theme, and some pretty good writing... To MGS4, PW, MGSv, which had real modern, fun game mechanics... But a story that disappointed you.
crazyrabbits
Banned
I agree that the twist was stupid and not needed, but I also think that the rationale for who he was did change at some point.
The Medic's face wasn't Big Boss, but I do believe that they intended for him to be Ishmael or someone like Gray Fox. Even the strategy guide seems to be leading readers to think Ishmael is the Medic.
Also, Venom does smoke a real cigar at one point in the game, Apparently, he even has crates full of real ones.
I mean, we know the post-GZ hospital cutscene was there from the get-go (announcement trailer), but I still think the identity of Ishmael was changed so Kojima could have one final mega-twist just to fuck with fans, even if the narrative didn't support it. Maybe Kojima thought the mysterious person being some nobody wasn't epic enough.
This isn't like the original Knights of the Old Republic, where the entire game is written with the Revan twist in mind. This is a last-minute curveball that comes out of nowhere and is barely supported by anything in the narrative. The more you think about it, the less sense it makes. I have a feeling that an earlier incarnation of the game was going to be a bit more simple, with us seeing exactly how Venom's demons overtake them. Instead, we have this revelation that is going to be the focus of discussion going forward, even though it's so stupid.
And don't even get me started on the Xanatos gambit BB/Ocelot pull to establish Venom in the first place, lol.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
If you haven't done so already, yes.
KOMANI
KOMANI
Eh... I don't think so.. What I'm starting to think naught have happened us... Remember that leak from reddit user MGbigFan? Most of his information pans out, some of it doesn't... Maybe the leak forced, whomever, to change the game a bit.. Or maybe it's just one uncooked bird. Such a shame 'cause it's a fun game. Real good, intense intro...
This illustrates, more than anything, that the success of MGS should be shared with Fukushima, and the localization of Jeremy Blaustein and Agnes KaKu (sic).
The twist did strike me as probably not being part of the game two/three years ago.
If the twist was always that the narrative is oddly ignorant of it. We have Huey's suspicions, the AI pod's statement and Eli's blood test, but that's really it.
I also feel like Ground Zeroes would have put the medic in a balaclava if they knew they were going down this route.
It all feels a bit too contrived, like they weren't doing themselves any favours in doing the twist. The twist feels like it was made to fit around a narrative, rather than the narrative being made to support the twist. Clumsy things like Ocelot whisking Snake away from the ambulance, conversing with him, then heading back to pick up the medic just seem weird if the twist was always planned. Some of the scenes Kojima chose to show in trailers also seem like an obvious, huge mistake if he wanted to keep the twist a secret; it would be the equivalent of him showing Raiden crawling through vents in an MGS2 trailer.
If the twist was always that the narrative is oddly ignorant of it. We have Huey's suspicions, the AI pod's statement and Eli's blood test, but that's really it.
I also feel like Ground Zeroes would have put the medic in a balaclava if they knew they were going down this route.
It all feels a bit too contrived, like they weren't doing themselves any favours in doing the twist. The twist feels like it was made to fit around a narrative, rather than the narrative being made to support the twist. Clumsy things like Ocelot whisking Snake away from the ambulance, conversing with him, then heading back to pick up the medic just seem weird if the twist was always planned. Some of the scenes Kojima chose to show in trailers also seem like an obvious, huge mistake if he wanted to keep the twist a secret; it would be the equivalent of him showing Raiden crawling through vents in an MGS2 trailer.
XANDER CAGE
Member
It's entirely supported by the narrative though. Maybe too well. Again, nearly every major character expresses something about how Big Boss doesn't really seem right. The Boss AI from Peace Walker doesn't recognize him. Ocelot has to come up with an on the spot excuse as to why BB suddenly can't speak Russian. BB and Eli's DNA doesn't match up. Also, the cigar thing - it's not that Fake Snake shouldn't smoke real cigars, it's that Big Boss wouldn't smoke fake ones per dialogue from Peace Walker (granted, I'm sure Kojima plays fast and loose to forget details like this). The entire hospital scene plays out exactly as it did in the reveal trailer - again, with Kiefer Sutherland, not doing any kind of different voice, playing Ishmael (complete with the line "you're talking to yourself").
I agree with you that the twist is dumb as hell, but I'm pretty sure it was always going to be. Kojima has written tons of stupid things throughout his career and this won't be his last. I'm sure the narrative did have to be patched together somewhat after budget and deadline constraints, but all the work you're suggesting was done after the fact to make the Venom twist happen (new script, new VO recording, new cutscene mocap) would have been more work to do under pressure, not less.
I'm pretty certain this was always going to be the fate of Not Boss.
crazyrabbits
Banned
Hardly any of BigMGSFan's information panned out because he was bullshiting. He was running around making multiple accounts to agree with himself, and was going on long tangents about how you could find a young Sniper Wolf and Frank Jaeger in Africa. While I believe that he may have heard information on the prologue from someone who was at the bootcamp, all of his information after it was fake and he ended up apologizing on GameFAQs.
Besides, that "leak" was only three weeks ago. They would have had to make a decision to change it months ago, because it had to have been finalized and ready for distribution by a set date.
Like I said, I believe that something significant happened in development, similarly to how Mass Effect 3 changed gears drastically in the scripting/early production stage when Drew Karpyshyn left and they started rewriting large chunks of the plot.
Maybe I'm wrong. Who knows.
Bam Bam Baklava
Member
I watched MGS2 cutscenes recently and it made me want to vomit. That game was a massive disappointment.
funkystudent
Member
I personally think the twist was always the idea since the reveal. Venom was always going to be a unknown guy plucked from MSF and not some known figure in the universe. Now that would have been real dumb.
Maybe how it was executed over the course of the game changed though. Its really poorly executed and feels like a twist for the sake of a twist at the end.
The game really needed a last act after the reveal that actually took more advantage of it somehow now that the player was in on it. Or Venom Snake just needed better closure.
Like.. I dunno... maybe being confronted with the truth forced him to snap in some way and the whole Outer Heaven thing was started with the spark of him going crazy like a insane King who got power hungry and went all out with the global domination thing in a attempt to prove he was Big Boss to himself.
Still dont understand what would eventually cause Big Boss to do what he does with Zanzibarland though. That is the real messed up part of the story now.
On the plus side I guess maybe it explains why Gray Fox joins up with BB in MG2 after being a prisoner of the phantom in MG1? Maybe?
Maybe how it was executed over the course of the game changed though. Its really poorly executed and feels like a twist for the sake of a twist at the end.
The game really needed a last act after the reveal that actually took more advantage of it somehow now that the player was in on it. Or Venom Snake just needed better closure.
Like.. I dunno... maybe being confronted with the truth forced him to snap in some way and the whole Outer Heaven thing was started with the spark of him going crazy like a insane King who got power hungry and went all out with the global domination thing in a attempt to prove he was Big Boss to himself.
Still dont understand what would eventually cause Big Boss to do what he does with Zanzibarland though. That is the real messed up part of the story now.
On the plus side I guess maybe it explains why Gray Fox joins up with BB in MG2 after being a prisoner of the phantom in MG1? Maybe?
I think plenty of people want to know what the story is without investing 40 hours in playing the game.
And even out of the people who are planning on playing MGSV, there are others who assume the story will be gobbledygook anyhow, so they just want a primer before diving in.
I'm still largely on the fence about trying MGSV just because of the length and the base-building stuff sounds tedious, plus I am so in the dark about the Big Boss/Peacewalker timeline I know any twist is going to have zero effect on me anyway (though it sounds like this one lands with a thud even for people that are into the Metal Gear mythology).
Death Metalist
Member
MAJOR SPECIFIC SPOILERS DON'T READ ALL YOU NEW PEOPLES IN THIS THREAD WHO DIDN'T FINISH THE GAME. SKIP THIS ENTIRE POST.
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Completed the game yesterday and after sleeping on the ending, in my mind I loved it but in my heart I didn't. What I wanted to see was the game ending with SS as David Hayter infiltrating Outer Heaven. I didn't know how to react when I first saw the ending, sure I had a fishy feeling about what's going on around me from the start but I didn't expect it to end up as me being a body double for BB. The more I thought about it though, the more I liked it in the sense that it doesn't matter if Venom was the medic or whoever, that wasn't the point. The whole point is that we the players, are a part of BB and BB is a part of us. Without us, he wouldn't be where he is and vice versa, it's because of us we kept his legend alive because of our interest/love for the character throughout those 28 years and an ending like that couldn't work unless it's 1) video games and 2) It's a series with a massive history. The medic was just an extension of the player of loving/wanting to be BB so bad, that's why he believed he was him among the other mumbo jumbo shit that Ocelot usually does. I have a feeling that ever since Kojima knew his fate with Konami he wanted to end it on a much more broader note rather than an ending that leads up to MG1 immediately. However, BB's phantom works as his own character too within the context of MGS5 besides the meta stuff. I mean, the smirk he gives off in the end leads me to believe that BB actually sent him the truth bomb tape much later? it felt to me at that point BB is in a good place to reveal to the phantom that he's not the real BB and thus after listening, phantom punches the mirror in anger and sets out to make Outer Heaven. Atleast, that's what I got out of the entire ending, liked the breakdown of the years as well. I hope more people understand the meta message, although I'm not sure most people would because half of them in the final trailer thread thought Kojima spoiled that Skullface is BB, lmao.
Could it have been executed better? sure but I think what we got is far more interesting and ambitious to me than a beginning of MG1 as an ending for example. It'll be interesting to discuss about it and see the reactions lol. If it wasn't for that scene before the end one, I would have not liked the ending as much. But man, seeing BB in that leather jacket,with the sunset smoking a cigar then riding off to make zanzibarland...perfect. The scene after it was fantastic as well because it's one of the few times I felt that Keifer delivered his lines perfectly about the whole "You're BB", got a kick out of BB becoming me as well(passport). It also made me think how did I not notice Venom not smoking a real cigar during the entire game but an electrical one which is again another subtle hint of him/us believing to be the legend. I think if people replay the game, they will notice many subtle hints throughout which should be fun, I'm sure there are other neat hidden things as well that we haven't even found yet. Should be an interesting next few months(it would be disappointing if there wasn't). The whole game just is so good in making you feel like BB. In the end it kind of felt like Kojima saying thank you & goodbye to us.
Now how does this fit with the whole canon? I didn't drop into that rabbit hole yet but at this point I don't really care all that much ever since MGS4 ended because that was the ending for me. BB/SS both met up, a bunch of shit was explained, BB died and SS has a few months to live. Perfect. Didn't need anything more than that. All the other games I got was just the cherry on top. I think what disappointed me is that we never got that becoming fully evil by the time the game finishes, sure Venom does some disturbing shit with Miller but it isn't to the extent of "YUP HE IS DAMN EVIL SHIT!" I'll say this much though that it made me interested in playing the MSX games(Yeah, I never did) which is a good thing. I'm just glad we got a game sublime in its gameplay and its option to approach any situation from many different ways and a story that's much more interesting than PW and a fuck tons of other games, doesn't reach the highs of the first 4 though. I always loved the insane shit about MGS and how it mixes politics, military issues within the insanity while also having many different themes throughout the series about love, pain, sadness, loss, family, mentors.etc
Aside from the ending, I really enjoyed how Kojima used language in a way that made me think about it much more than just a means of communication as a guy from the middle east, it hit me that the first thing you have to do to get accepted into collages here is doing an English test to determine how good your English is and if you need more classes or not on English. Since it's Kojima he went a step further to twist it with a horror-esque aspect to it that totally reminded me of The Thing. LOVED IT. Parasites are the new nanomachines!!!1 Fantastic score as well by Ludvig Forssell with Harry Gregson-Williams as music producer.
My personal ranking of the series in terms of story.
MGS4 > MGS3(subsistance) > MGS1 > MGS2 > MGS5 > PW.
Technically story wise, MGS3 is the better one by far but MGS4 to me was a cathartic experience at the time, will not forget the first time I experienced it. Played it for 20 hours straight with bathroom breaks and food of course, and I'm glad at the time nothing was spoiled for me.
Gameplay wise though it would be
MGS5 > MGS4 > MGS3(subsistance) > MGS2 > PW > MGS1.
Now onto my favorite missions/tapes and the things I found memorable.
Main Missions
Prologue, Phantom Limbs, A Hero's Way, Where Do The Bees Sleep, Occupation forces, Back Up Back Down, Cloaked in silence, Hellbound, Blood runs deep, On the trail, The war economy, Voices, Retake the platform, The white mamba, Code talker, Metallic Archaea, Skull face, Sahelanthropus, A Quiet Exit, Truth.
Side Ops
Make Contact with Emmerich, Eli's Challenge, Extract the AI Pod, Secure the remains of the Man on Fire & Wandering MB soldiers. Don't know if there will be anything more varied than those but usually it's mostly securing or destroying and extracting shit which I don't have a problem with because the gameplay is damn good.
Most memorable tapes for me are anything that has to do with the story as well as lore. Aside from that, The Hamburgers of Kazuhira Miller is legendary. Best thing ever which leads me to my other point, CODE TALKER. I really loved him as character, only him and Huey I felt were always consistent and on point with their voice acting. Most memorable moments in the game to me are:
In the end, I think it's an amazing game. Gameplay wise and not story wise. Story wise it's alright/good and very engaging(with or without the twist)but I think the overall message is what makes it great to me personally. Only bad thing about it is having to replay older missions on a harder difficulty to progress with the story. The person's expectations is what's going to ruin this game for said person. Like every MGS game, Kojima loves fucking with people's expectations for better or worse. What a ride as always. Shame we may never get the insanity we usually get with MGS, if we ever even get an MGS game at the level of Kojima's MGS games. Looking forward to his future projects.
I'm Team A so we failed hard lol, unless there is a super duper secret ending.
VenomEdit: Shame about the cut content though, hopefully we see it someday.
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Completed the game yesterday and after sleeping on the ending, in my mind I loved it but in my heart I didn't. What I wanted to see was the game ending with SS as David Hayter infiltrating Outer Heaven. I didn't know how to react when I first saw the ending, sure I had a fishy feeling about what's going on around me from the start but I didn't expect it to end up as me being a body double for BB. The more I thought about it though, the more I liked it in the sense that it doesn't matter if Venom was the medic or whoever, that wasn't the point. The whole point is that we the players, are a part of BB and BB is a part of us. Without us, he wouldn't be where he is and vice versa, it's because of us we kept his legend alive because of our interest/love for the character throughout those 28 years and an ending like that couldn't work unless it's 1) video games and 2) It's a series with a massive history. The medic was just an extension of the player of loving/wanting to be BB so bad, that's why he believed he was him among the other mumbo jumbo shit that Ocelot usually does. I have a feeling that ever since Kojima knew his fate with Konami he wanted to end it on a much more broader note rather than an ending that leads up to MG1 immediately. However, BB's phantom works as his own character too within the context of MGS5 besides the meta stuff. I mean, the smirk he gives off in the end leads me to believe that BB actually sent him the truth bomb tape much later? it felt to me at that point BB is in a good place to reveal to the phantom that he's not the real BB and thus after listening, phantom punches the mirror in anger and sets out to make Outer Heaven. Atleast, that's what I got out of the entire ending, liked the breakdown of the years as well. I hope more people understand the meta message, although I'm not sure most people would because half of them in the final trailer thread thought Kojima spoiled that Skullface is BB, lmao.
Could it have been executed better? sure but I think what we got is far more interesting and ambitious to me than a beginning of MG1 as an ending for example. It'll be interesting to discuss about it and see the reactions lol. If it wasn't for that scene before the end one, I would have not liked the ending as much. But man, seeing BB in that leather jacket,with the sunset smoking a cigar then riding off to make zanzibarland...perfect. The scene after it was fantastic as well because it's one of the few times I felt that Keifer delivered his lines perfectly about the whole "You're BB", got a kick out of BB becoming me as well(passport). It also made me think how did I not notice Venom not smoking a real cigar during the entire game but an electrical one which is again another subtle hint of him/us believing to be the legend. I think if people replay the game, they will notice many subtle hints throughout which should be fun, I'm sure there are other neat hidden things as well that we haven't even found yet. Should be an interesting next few months(it would be disappointing if there wasn't). The whole game just is so good in making you feel like BB. In the end it kind of felt like Kojima saying thank you & goodbye to us.
Now how does this fit with the whole canon? I didn't drop into that rabbit hole yet but at this point I don't really care all that much ever since MGS4 ended because that was the ending for me. BB/SS both met up, a bunch of shit was explained, BB died and SS has a few months to live. Perfect. Didn't need anything more than that. All the other games I got was just the cherry on top. I think what disappointed me is that we never got that becoming fully evil by the time the game finishes, sure Venom does some disturbing shit with Miller but it isn't to the extent of "YUP HE IS DAMN EVIL SHIT!" I'll say this much though that it made me interested in playing the MSX games(Yeah, I never did) which is a good thing. I'm just glad we got a game sublime in its gameplay and its option to approach any situation from many different ways and a story that's much more interesting than PW and a fuck tons of other games, doesn't reach the highs of the first 4 though. I always loved the insane shit about MGS and how it mixes politics, military issues within the insanity while also having many different themes throughout the series about love, pain, sadness, loss, family, mentors.etc
Aside from the ending, I really enjoyed how Kojima used language in a way that made me think about it much more than just a means of communication as a guy from the middle east, it hit me that the first thing you have to do to get accepted into collages here is doing an English test to determine how good your English is and if you need more classes or not on English. Since it's Kojima he went a step further to twist it with a horror-esque aspect to it that totally reminded me of The Thing. LOVED IT. Parasites are the new nanomachines!!!1 Fantastic score as well by Ludvig Forssell with Harry Gregson-Williams as music producer.
My personal ranking of the series in terms of story.
MGS4 > MGS3(subsistance) > MGS1 > MGS2 > MGS5 > PW.
Technically story wise, MGS3 is the better one by far but MGS4 to me was a cathartic experience at the time, will not forget the first time I experienced it. Played it for 20 hours straight with bathroom breaks and food of course, and I'm glad at the time nothing was spoiled for me.
Gameplay wise though it would be
MGS5 > MGS4 > MGS3(subsistance) > MGS2 > PW > MGS1.
Now onto my favorite missions/tapes and the things I found memorable.
Main Missions
Prologue, Phantom Limbs, A Hero's Way, Where Do The Bees Sleep, Occupation forces, Back Up Back Down, Cloaked in silence, Hellbound, Blood runs deep, On the trail, The war economy, Voices, Retake the platform, The white mamba, Code talker, Metallic Archaea, Skull face, Sahelanthropus, A Quiet Exit, Truth.
Side Ops
Make Contact with Emmerich, Eli's Challenge, Extract the AI Pod, Secure the remains of the Man on Fire & Wandering MB soldiers. Don't know if there will be anything more varied than those but usually it's mostly securing or destroying and extracting shit which I don't have a problem with because the gameplay is damn good.
Most memorable tapes for me are anything that has to do with the story as well as lore. Aside from that, The Hamburgers of Kazuhira Miller is legendary. Best thing ever which leads me to my other point, CODE TALKER. I really loved him as character, only him and Huey I felt were always consistent and on point with their voice acting. Most memorable moments in the game to me are:
- The entire opening
- Rescuing Kaz and bringing him back to MB(I know, I'm already a demon.).
- Puppy DD when you visit MB for the first time.
- Skullface appearing out of no where with a giant hand in episode 6.
- MISSION 11 SUPRISE MOTHAFUCKA(and the scene after getting her with the jet as well as MB)
- Seeing Sahelanthropus for the first time and knowing where Huey is held
- Huey interrogation
- Meeting the child soldiers for the first time and the conclusion of that
- THE DEVIL'S HOUSE YOOOO
- Meeting ELI for the first time
- Quiet identifying the person who's infected which we don't know at that time
- Meeting Code Talker for the first time
- The entire drive with SkullFace and Venom ending with a WOOOOAAHHHHHH-AAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH! so good.
- Sahelanthropus going mobile because of Mantis
- SkullFace's Demise(Huey yelling REVEEENNNGEE!! made me laugh) apart from the brutality of that scene
- Quiet speaking for the first time with Code Talker
- "I won't scatter your sorrow to the heartless sea. I won't see you end as ashes, you're all diamonds" and then makes diamonds out of the ashes which is visible on your arm when you wear the DD suit(If I'm not mistaken)
- Man on Fire and BB struggle in the middle of the base in that side ops mission, WHAT IS REAL?!
- Eli escaping with the Metal Gear
- Medical bay scene WUT?! (I don't know if there are other hidden things in MB. Didn't get the rain cutscene with Quiet, that would have been memorable as well.)
- The Truth Ending
In the end, I think it's an amazing game. Gameplay wise and not story wise. Story wise it's alright/good and very engaging(with or without the twist)but I think the overall message is what makes it great to me personally. Only bad thing about it is having to replay older missions on a harder difficulty to progress with the story. The person's expectations is what's going to ruin this game for said person. Like every MGS game, Kojima loves fucking with people's expectations for better or worse. What a ride as always. Shame we may never get the insanity we usually get with MGS, if we ever even get an MGS game at the level of Kojima's MGS games. Looking forward to his future projects.
I'm Team A so we failed hard lol, unless there is a super duper secret ending.
VenomEdit: Shame about the cut content though, hopefully we see it someday.
snake_eater_raiden
Member
I am Team A as well and given that TPP is basically with the cut outs and all, It's not far stretch to think that Solid Snake was in the game. I have a feeling that a story DLC is incoming. Remember, Kojima is still with Konami till December.
People start to realize how bad all of this is. I'm happy to not be alone. 
As the game itself, I just started. Feels damn good but maps looks.. empty and lifeless? I still prefer the more focused MGS3 maps with fruits and rabbits, medical herbs and mushrooms, snakes on the trees.. fishes.. oh well.
LMAO !
As the game itself, I just started. Feels damn good but maps looks.. empty and lifeless? I still prefer the more focused MGS3 maps with fruits and rabbits, medical herbs and mushrooms, snakes on the trees.. fishes.. oh well.
LMAO !
That is Big Boss's face. When you remove the scars and beard, that is Big Boss's face. The Big Boss switcheroo was always the plan, but maybe the execution was going to be different originally.
It's not hard to figure out why the story is weak. It's a prequel, so we know any world ending event that is threatened by Skull Face doesn't pan out. It needed to be a character story, which it isn't really. It could still be a character story with the fake Big Boss, but the real one had to be more involved than a single tape recording.
It's why I don't understand people being upset about the cut content. Seeing Eli and VS's last encounter wouldn't have saved anything. It was just going to be more winks and more nods towards what we know is coming. It's just be retelling what we already know except now 80 billion characters we recognise are there because of course they are.
Death Metalist
Member
I agree. That's why MGS4 was always the end for me, well it is lol. The other games are just cherry on top.
Death Metalist
Member
50. With more than a few being old missions on higher difficulties.
Wrestlemania
Banned
The only thing the press could be accused of maybe being hyperbolic about is the gameplay, they certainly haven't been glowing of the story which is what most of the complaints in here have been about. Gameplay wise I think they've been completely justified in their praise.
Quite right, the core gameplay is superb. But there's multiple design issues that hamper the gameplay experience. Some of which are especially apparent when you enter the endgame.
Doctor_Thomas
Member
Although, the harder missions aren't necessary to get the actual ending and some of the side ops are of equal importance (I personally think one of the side ops is more important than anything else in the game).
Wrestlemania
Banned
Death Metalist
Member
User phoenix296 said that you could play side ops instead of the replayable missions on hard to unlock the next story mission. That is much better honestly.
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