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[sonto340]

So, I guess, sadly, I did understand the story. I was hoping I missed something and it wasn't as basic as you described. Is there a reason why Eli is so filled with hatred other other than me rescuing... or queuing up the future games?

Isn't it explained that he's upset with his father. Presumably for abandoning him, or for venom not acknowledging anything to do with him as a father figure.
It could also just be Big Boss's 'superior battle genes' make him in a state of constant rage. Who knows. Probably because Kojima thought it would be cool to have child liquid be the last boss.

 

[SolVanderlyn]

So, I guess, sadly, I did understand the story. I was hoping I missed something and it wasn't as basic as you described. Is there a reason why Eli is so filled with hatred other other than me rescuing... or queuing up the future games?

By this point Eli already thinks he's an inferior clone of BB.

Makes you wonder why Eli knew about LET but David was totally kept in the dark. Flash forward years later and grown up Eli knows about Solid Snake but Liquid Snake is a total enigma. Hmm...

 

[Coffee Dog]

Bwahhhaa. Dont mean to offend you but looks like you are a new comer to MGS series.

I've played all the main MGS games. I'm glad that MGSV is so story light. Kojima's been an ass writer for several games now.

 

[Stallion Dan]

shit here I was farming side ops so I could have better gear for S-ranking stuff

Can S rank most missions easily using starter gear. Only a couple really benefit from researched items.

Fulton upgrades are most important I'd say. Really help on vehicle related missions. Aside from that level 1 of the sneaking suit, but even this is not needed.

 

[brianmcdoogle]

By this point Eli already thinks he's an inferior clone of BB.

Makes you wonder why Eli knew about LET but David was totally kept in the dark. Flash forward years later and grown up Eli knows about Solid Snake but Liquid Snake is a total enigma. Hmm...

Nanomachines? Parasites? Fans excusing Kojima's antics much longer than I can?

 

[sonto340]

By this point Eli already thinks he's an inferior clone of BB.

Makes you wonder why Eli knew about LET but David was totally kept in the dark. Flash forward years later and grown up Eli knows about Solid Snake but Liquid Snake is a total enigma. Hmm...

This insert I wanted to know. Fuckin HUGE missed opportunity in fleshing out Eli. Who was he before the white mamba. Why does he know Big Boss is his father? What the fuck did he do with A METAL GEAR MORE ADVANCED THAN REX OR RAY BETWEEN 1984 AND 2005.
lol full circle.

 

[Shouta]

This insert I wanted to know. Fuckin HUGE missed opportunity in fleshing out Eli. Who was he before the white mamba. Why does he know Big Boss is his father? What the fuck did he do with A METAL GEAR MORE ADVANCED THAN REX OR RAY BETWEEN 1984 AND 2005.
lol full circle.

Did you watch the Mission 51 stuff?

 

[yuraya]

Wasn't it Big Boss that triggered Mantis? Big Boss woke up first, once they were aware of the threat they woke up Venom in response.

Do we even know exactly when BB awoke tho? I don't think they mentioned it. But for me it felt like when you first awoke and the doc tells you have been in a coma for 9 years. When your heart started beating fast and they needed to restrain you. I thought that was what set off Mantis and the plane crash. It may have not been anger at all that first triggered Mantis. Just that unique circumstance that venom was what did it to Mantis. And those days in between while you lay in the hospital bed is how long it took for Mantis to be transported to another location and then return with Volgin. Volgin being at the hospital definitely makes the most sense since BB was there as well.

 

[Palpable]

Eli is filled with hate towards Big Boss because he feels he doesn't have an identity of his own. He knows he is a clown & he feels he is garbage since he believes he was the 'leftovers' from Solid Snake. Liquid always thought he was the inferior clone.

Seriously, does no one remember MGS1?

Do we even know exactly when BB awoke tho? I don't think they mentioned it. But for me it felt like when you first awoke and the doc tells you have been in a coma for 9 years. When your heart started beating fast and they needed to restrain you. I thought that was what set off Mantis and the plane crash. It may have not been anger at all that first triggered Mantis. Just that unique circumstance that venom was what did it to Mantis. And those days in between while you lay in the hospital bed is how long it took for Mantis to be transported to another location and then return with Volgin. Volgin being at the hospital definitely makes the most sense since BB was there as well.

Volgin was in a research lab just outside of Moscow. Nowhere near BB & Venom.

 

[CambriaRising]

This insert I wanted to know. Fuckin HUGE missed opportunity in fleshing out Eli. Who was he before the white mamba. Why does he know Big Boss is his father? What the fuck did he do with A METAL GEAR MORE ADVANCED THAN REX OR RAY BETWEEN 1984 AND 2005.
lol full circle.

Watch the cut mission 51 stuff.

St84 isn't more advanced than Rex or Ray. It doesn't even work without a psychic kid controlling it.

 

[hamchan]

By this point Eli already thinks he's an inferior clone of BB.

Makes you wonder why Eli knew about LET but David was totally kept in the dark. Flash forward years later and grown up Eli knows about Solid Snake but Liquid Snake is a total enigma. Hmm...

It's because the British are nicer people than Americans and told Liquid Snake the truth when he was young.

 

[SolVanderlyn]

Watch the cut mission 51 stuff.

St84 isn't more advanced than Rex or Ray. It doesn't even work without a psychic kid controlling it.

Is it right to assume that Skull Face's entire plan hinged on selling an essentially broken/incomplete/basically useless Metal Gear? That part of the plot is still shady to me.

This insert I wanted to know. Fuckin HUGE missed opportunity in fleshing out Eli. Who was he before the white mamba. Why does he know Big Boss is his father? What the fuck did he do with A METAL GEAR MORE ADVANCED THAN REX OR RAY BETWEEN 1984 AND 2005.
lol full circle.

I agree, although that last point was resolved in mission 51. How the hell did he end up in Africa? Why does he know what he does? Oh well. It was still cool to see Liquid again for the first time since MGS1.

 

[sonto340]

Did you watch the Mission 51 stuff?

Watch the cut mission 51 stuff.

St84 isn't more advanced than Rex or Ray. It doesn't even work without a psychic kid controlling it.

Not yet. I'm planning on finishing up Quiets stuff when i get off work later today and then looking it up to really finish the game.
The problem is your average consumer has no idea about that. They just know that a fucking child ran off with Sahelanthropus, and then that's the last we hear of him.

 

[brianmcdoogle]

Is it right to assume that Skull Face's entire plan hinged on selling an essentially broken/incomplete/basically useless Metal Gear? That part of the plot is still shady to me.

Skull Face's plan rested on Master Miller mastering the hamburger.

 

[yuraya]

Volgin was in a research lab just outside of Moscow. Nowhere near BB & Venom.

I know. I meant him showing up at hospital makes sense since his anger is toward BB and why he killed all the XOF soldiers who were in his way. At that point it was just Mantis and Volgin. Later Skull face took control of them.

 

[CambriaRising]

Is it right to assume that Skull Face's entire plan hinged on selling an essentially broken/incomplete/basically useless Metal Gear? That part of the plot is still shady to me.

My understanding was that ST84 was motivation to get people to buy his failsafe nukes that didn't actually work if anyone tried to fire them.

 

[Palpable]

I know. I meant him showing up at hospital makes sense since his anger is toward BB and why he killed all the XOF soldiers who were in his way. At that point it was just Mantis and Volgin. Later Skull face took control of them.

Ah, my bad.

Doesn't make sense that the real BB doesn't feel the lust for revenge & thus isn't being saught out by Volgin. I thought it was the real BB waking up which triggered Mantis / Volgin antics.

 

[Nintendoga]

Another thing I'm confused about is Venom's existence. Or more so why Big Boss is okay with having a phantom. He said it's so he could build his own nation, but why couldn't he do that normally? Because people would be after him? In that case why not let Venom Snake die in the hospital so everyone would think BB is dead. "Because the world needs an icon like Big Boss to be alive." But the problem with that is the world has already thought BB has been dead for over 9 years. In fact letting XOF kill Venom would've been beneficial to BB so nobody would get on his back.

This twist just keeps adding in more complicated questions and that's part of the reason why I don't like it.

 

[Jintor]

So, I guess, sadly, I did understand the story. I was hoping I missed something and it wasn't as basic as you described. Is there a reason why Eli is so filled with hatred other other than me rescuing... or queuing up the future games?

You can figure it out based on MGS1, but basically, when Les Enfantes Terrible is shut down, he's already figured out that he's a clone and moreover that he's the 'shit clone' (probably because he's 12 and doesn't understand genetics I guess). Add that to basically being a prepubescent soldier trained in battle from day one and you've got a fountain of rage that overcomes Skullface AND Volgin apparently.

*shrug*

Just watched the animatic, thought it was cool.

The other thing is that it's really weird that Mission 46 just... turns up. It's not led into in anyway, it just... appears out of nowhere after you toss Huey off the raft.

Also, people are saying the Mirror Punching scene takes place in 95 or at the beginning of Metal Gear, besides Operation Intrude and the MSX Loading noise is there a solid indication of that? The mirror clearly shows the Diamond Dogs logo behind him on the door.

 

[Kathian]

My biggest problem is Keifers frankly bored performance. You don't care about Venom Snake. The animations do most of the job (even with Keifer he feels like a silent character) but the voice acting is just phoned in and he doesn't care about the role whatsoever.

I think that's why Quiet as his mate works. Its a mostly silent relationship.

 

[yuraya]

Ah, my bad.

Doesn't make sense that the real BB doesn't feel the lust for revenge & thus isn't being saught out by Volgin. I thought it was the real BB waking up which triggered Mantis / Volgin antics.

It seemed like BB was fully awake when you first started moving. He moved fairly well and he could shoot. Plus he was in cahoots with Ocelot for the getaway plan. It seemed like they planned it all weeks before TPP starts. For all we know BB could have awoken months before you. Maybe even years. The main mission for Big Boss in this game was to get you out of that hospital alive. Because Venom is basically BB's free ticket to a new life. The way I see it is BB shows up at the hospital for his mission (lol) wearing fake bandages and tricks you into believing you are seeing hallucinations. He successfully completes his mission. The prologue is like a double mission hehe

 

[brianmcdoogle]

You can figure it out based on MGS1, but basically, when Les Enfantes Terrible is shut down, he's already figured out that he's a clone and moreover that he's the 'shit clone' (probably because he's 12 and doesn't understand genetics I guess). Add that to basically being a prepubescent soldier trained in battle from day one and you've got a fountain of rage that overcomes Skullface AND Volgin apparently.

*shrug*

Just watched the animatic, thought it was cool.

The other thing is that it's really weird that Mission 46 just... turns up. It's not led into in anyway, it just... appears out of nowhere after you toss Huey off the raft.

Also, people are saying the Mirror Punching scene takes place in 95 or at the beginning of Metal Gear, besides Operation Intrude and the MSX Loading noise is there a solid indication of that? The mirror clearly shows the Diamond Dogs logo behind him on the door.

I really think the keyword in your post is...

*shrug*

which is this game narrative-wise. I can't argue against anyone hating the gameplay, but the story and the story progression will forever remain a goddamn mess.

Oh, hey, listening to the tapes... Zero doesn't sound at all like Zero! YAY!






I wish all of you the best/worst of luck in finishing this garbage story with boring/bland characters.

Semper fidelis!

 

[ZeroX03]

The thunderbolt's steed meets the lightning.

 

[SolVanderlyn]

Also, people are saying the Mirror Punching scene takes place in 95 or at the beginning of Metal Gear, besides Operation Intrude and the MSX Loading noise is there a solid indication of that? The mirror clearly shows the Diamond Dogs logo behind him on the door.

It opens with text saying "Outer Heaven", and there's no way he'd have a tape with the name of a '95 operation in any year but 95. The DD logos are a bit off putting, but they could be homage to the unit he built up.

 

[Jintor]

Seriously though, in a game full of magical superpowers Psycho Mantis really stands out as just being kinda like this weird plot device character that people only really accept out of nostalgia. He powers all the villains and is invincible because ??? and also has zero character of his own until MGS1

It opens with text saying "Outer Heaven", and there's no way he'd have a tape with the name of a '95 operation in any year but 95. The DD logos are a bit off putting, but they could be an homage to the unit he built up.

totally forgot about that

god if the game had ended with Metal Gear in the Fox engine (or even just the bossfight with solid snake somehow) i would have lost my shit

 

[EmCeeGramr]

The whole "I need a phantom" thing is also confusing because, like... BB was perfectly aware at the end of Peace Walker that the world would be after him and he's fine with that.

Then he wakes up from a coma, learns that the militaries of the world still idolize him and that Zero tried to help him, even going so far as creating a double... and he's like, "okay, we need this guy to stand in for me."

The only person who goes after Big Boss in the game is Skull Face (and sorta Eli), and Venom Snake hypnotized to be like Big Boss takes them on just fine while building up a massive army. Why did the real Big Boss need to hide again?


Hell, considering that a major part of Outer Heaven is that nobody knew Big Boss was in charge so he doesn't tip off The Patriots... why have it head up by a double of Big Boss who specifically uses Big Boss's reputation to recruit mercenaries?


gah.

 

[hamchan]

It seemed like BB was fully awake when you first started moving. He moved fairly well and he could shoot. Plus he was in cahoots with Ocelot for the getaway plan. It seemed like they planned it all weeks before TPP starts. For all we know BB could have awoken months before you. Maybe even years. The main mission for Big Boss in this game was to get you out of that hospital alive. Because Venom is basically BB's free ticket to a new life. The way I see it is BB shows up at the hospital for his mission (lol) wearing fake bandages and tricks you into believing you are seeing hallucinations. He successfully completes his mission. The prologue is like a double mission hehe

Mission 46 really should have been from BB's perspective and included all this. I can only assume it's another victim of development not finishing on time.

 

[Jintor]

i was also getting kinda ticked off at the amount of times people were saying PHANTOM in every goddamn cassette by the end of the game, but i guess that's par for the course in any videogame/movie/whatever

 

[Reebot]

Can we also talk about what a wasted plot point Volgin was? What terrible use of a great villain.

 

[SkylineRKR]

Mission 46 really should have been from BB's perspective and included all this. I can only assume it's another victim of development not finishing on time.

46 is the worst medias res sort of scene I have seen. Its exactly the same, same POV, same tutorials (that they're in confirms a hackjob). With some added cutscenes at the start and end. I was surprised the face editor was left out this time.

Normally, you'd give the conrols to Ishmael. Or add extra details throughout.

 

[ponpo]

Can we also talk about what a wasted plot point Volgin was? What terrible use of a great villain.

Maybe it's because characters tend to appear in more than one MG game, but I always considered Volgin to be forgettable despite impact on big boss.

Also OTP

 

[Jintor]

Can we also talk about what a wasted plot point Volgin was? What terrible use of a great villain.

even worse there was literally nothing surprising about it. dudes figured it out before we even knew MGSV was a thing and there was no twist on it besides "oh he didn't die when he got exploded by the shagohod and also he's a dude on fire?"

 

[Doctor_Thomas]

The mirror scene is definitely '95, which means Venom doesn't learn the truth until the end of MG1 because all that gun fire isn't normal... but with no lead in or explanation, it's just there and things like that plague the game. A victim of being pushed out the door without being able to make what they had work. There's gaps in the narrative everywhere either because of time or because of editsm. Mission 51 is just another victim of that.

 

[The Silver]

With Venom not learning the truth until Solid Snake is right outside his door I can understand his smirk reaction.

All this damn he thought he was the real thing and was working towards his dream and right in the middle of things going NUCLEAR this tape tells all him all this bullshit. It's the kind of thing you can't help but laugh at, one of those insane morbid laughs knowing how badly you got fucked over and its too late.


Well that's how I'm going to take it, that cut dialogue was cut so shut up, it never happened.

 

[Jintor]

Also why does he listen to the tape then, did he get a fedex package or something?

 

[snake_eater_raiden]

MGS5 Plot that should have been. Sorry for the English.

Afghanistan - Chapter 1

1. No body double, we are playing as Big Boss. Big Boss awakes from his coma and Ocelot rescues him and brings him to DD, a offshore unit that is funded by Cipher and under check by Kaz, so that Zero can manipulate Big Boss. DD is nothing but the war arm of Cipher but BB does not know about this.
3. Big Boss, Ocelot and Miller keep on building Motherbase but BB is unaware that Kaz is a Cipher spy.
4. Kaz wants revenge but only against Skullface. Since Skullface defected and destroyed MB in GZ, Kaz suffers massive revenue loss. Remember he is in it for business. Zero tells Kaz to manipulate BB and gain revenge and remove his nemesis: Skull Face
5. They finally get hold of Skullface and gets him killed not before Skullface leaves a cassette tape for Big Boss which reveals the truth about Kaz and Cipher. He reveals that Kaz is only in it for business purpose. Big Boss also defeats the new Metal Gear and gets hold of it.
6. However after learning the truth about Kaz, Big Boss is angry and reacts but almost the whole of DD turns against Big Boss. Big Boss kills each one of them and Kaz escapes. DD is disbanded and Cipher's plans are unfolded.

Africa - Chapter 2

1. Big Boss now takes whatever he can from the old Motherbase, including the new Metal Gear and loyal soldiers and begins to form OH in Africa. Ocelot makes sure that this information is not leaked to Cipher.
2. Ocelot makes sure that Cipher is unaware about BB'a location. Cipher in retaliation uses Solidus to spread the legend of BB. Lies and deceit spread about Big Boss.
2. Fultoning out Soldiers, and gaining resources, Big Boss keeps on building OH. He extracts Huey who is doing research for Cipher for a new Metal Gear which does not work out. Gray Fox, Naomi and Sniper Wolf and several other original members are extracted/saved as well and Big Boss starts forming his own war machine.
3. Ocelot then informs him about Liquid Snake in Africa. Big Boss extracts him. Liquid learns about his father but hates him. This leads to a retaliation and Liquid along with child soldiers forms Kingdom of Flies and runs away with the new Metal Gear. However Big Boss defeats him and leaves him to starve. Somehow Liquid manages to escape and reaches UK. BB once again manages to extract the Metal Gear and with the help of Huey, repairs and enhances it and names it as TX55.
4. Big Boss now completely forms OH with Cipher having no knowledge about it. But at the right time, Big Boss returns to US, makes amends with Zero and Kaz.

Chapter 3: OH

1. Fast Fwd 1995.
2. Big Boss finally meets Solid Snake. Trains him along with Kaz.
3. However, due to a proxy network of the Patriots, Cipher comes to know that a certain mercenary unit is retaliating in Africa. Outer Heaven.
4. Big Boss gets wind of this information and purposely sends Gray Fox, his best soldier and lieutenant. Gray Fox and Big Boss purposely create a drama where the former will get captured.
5. Big Boss reports back to Cipher and insists the mission wont work since they now have Gray Fox, one of their best soldiers captured and they cant afford to lose any more good men.
6. However, Cipher insists through a proxy that BB needs to send Solid Snake.
7. With no option left, he does as Cipher commands, however he makes it harder for SS to infiltrate by purposely setting traps.
8. Much to his surprise, SS gets through, defeats all the bosses. On his journey, SS collects cassette tapes which makes him aware about what actually is going on. In the end he receives a cassette tape Number 46 title "From The Man Who Sold The World" where a recording is present between Gray Fox and BB, which reveals that BB is the leader of OH.
9. Big Boss gets hold of this and has no option but to reveal himself in OH. Boss Battle ensues with Metal Gear. Snake "kills" Big Boss.
10. Game ends.

 

[The Silver]

Also why does he listen to the tape then, did he get a fedex package or something?

it had a postage that said do not open unless you're really fucked.

 

[hamchan]

Also why does he listen to the tape then, did he get a fedex package or something?

He just wanted to listen to some Bowie man.

 

[crazyrabbits]

Maybe it's because characters tend to appear in more than one MG game, but I always considered Volgin to be forgettable despite impact on big boss.

Also OTP

where

how do we get this mod

 

[ponpo]

where

how do we get this mod

Soon.
Probably.

 

[Frillen]

Wait, I thought it was obvious that Ichmael was BB since they had the same voice. Is that seriously the "big" twist of the game!? If so I figured it out pretty much from the get go.

 

[Broken Joystick]

I loved the (sort of) foreshadowing to Liquid in MGS1 with Eli in this game

V: He has his own team, the kids.
1: He has his own team, Foxhound.

V: Wants Big Boss (Chapter 51)
1: Wants Big Boss' remains.

V: Steals and rides a Metal Gear.
1: Steals and rides a Metal Gear.

V: Ocelot seems to be pretty nice to him.
1: Ocelot is working for him.

 

[crazyrabbits]

Soon.
Probably.

THIS IS WHAT I ALWAYS WANTED!

Spoiler

But if he does Quiet's idle animations... uh...

Time for Snake/Ocelot buddy shenanigans in the jungles of Africa!

Also, more unused Kiefer dialogue. Did you know he was intended to have voiced interactions with Paz? And his dialogue is so good! Dat Chico reference!

 

[Rhapsody]

Remember that one trailer that showed 2 Eli's, thinking Solid Snake would somehow be involved in this?

Then it just turns out to be Psycho Mantis... lol

 

[Wanda/Wander]

Soon.
Probably.

Please tell me this is just a quiet re skin

 

[Jintor]

V: Ocelot seems to be pretty nice to him.
1: Ocelot is working for him.

ya know in every tape ocelot's like "Miller let me torture him" and Miller's like "Yo dude, I may be an angry armless legless ball of rage but I ain't torturing kids" and ocelot's like "come on just a little torture, just a bit"

I'm really fucking annoyed I don't get Quiet after concluding her storyline, I wanted to go back and dick around on some early missions with OP sniper support.

 

[ponpo]

Please tell me this is just a quiet re skin

Yeah just a model swap.

 

[Ruff]

Soon.
Probably.

Oh god Ocelot is going to be in my face and bending over in front of me on the helicopter isn't he.


Hrng.

 

[ponpo]

Oh god Ocelot is going to be in my face and bending over in front of me on the helicopter isn't he.


Hrng.

Call me when it's

Spoiler

D Walker

instead.

 

[Tribes of Trusty]

Yeah a lot of stuff makes more sense in retrospect. Eli's genetic tests not matching (or being similar to, whatever) V's. Why the phrase "V has come to".

The negative genetic test was just another BIG hint yeah.

Wait, I thought it was obvious that Ichmael was BB since they had the same voice. Is that seriously the "big" twist of the game!? If so I figured it out pretty much from the get go.

I think a lot of people figured it out. But in my case, I didn't want to believe it until I was forced to acknowledge it, as evidenced in the OT :

About the chopper easter egg I hope it is just Kojima fucking with my head and not foreshadowing for some kind of cliché twist

With Venom not learning the truth until Solid Snake is right outside his door I can understand his smirk reaction.

All this damn he thought he was the real thing and was working towards his dream and right in the middle of things going NUCLEAR this tape tells all him all this bullshit. It's the kind of thing you can't help but laugh at, one of those insane morbid laughs knowing how badly you got fucked over and its too late.


Well that's how I'm going to take it, that cut dialogue was cut so shut up, it never happened.

I like that interpretation.