1.) You may have missed the beginning of the conversation from yesterday but everything I've been talking about is from the "initial perspective." All encounters become trivial once the strats are optimized and we're optimally geared. I don't care about challenge, just talking about the thought put into the design itself.
Supplicants are not a pure trash wave, they interact with mechanics in ways that were initially compelling. Sadly they weren't scaled well (spawn timers and locations, pathing movement and speed) so people figured out how to trivialize them by activating both plates. They're easily the weakest part of an otherwise brilliant encounter but at least the design is there. Golgi add waves have no design at all: thralls + cursed from bottom cave --> Adepts and acolytes from side doors and back caves then bottom cave. They're funneled into narrow corridors in a cramped boss room, that's it.
2.) I was just clarifying. There's more happening in the summoned fanatic waves than a pure ammo dump so it wasn't clear. "Running out of ammo when most enemies have dropped ammo in a green death pool that requires cleansing in their spawn location except they blow up if you get close" is interesting.
Once again it wasn't scaled well (or made lactose intolerant) so the interesting part falls away. I'm not arguing these are great designs, in fact they're some of the weakest parts of VoG. But some good flickers exist and they have enough freedom that players can make them more interesting. I realize I'm being nitpicky, but small details go a long way for me when comparing VoG and KF.
