Microsoft / Activision Deal Approval Watch |OT| (MS/ABK close)

Do you believe the deal will be approved?


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HeisenbergFX4

Gold Member
Why is it that XBOX guys can't remember, or willingly sidestep COD marketing under XBOX?
I am not sidestepping anything as I totally remember the PS3/360 COD days and a certain platform getting map packs 30 days early and such.

I am only bringing those things up because of the demands of Sony saying the Xbox hardware can't have an advantage not can Xbox give Gamepass players any type of benefits when Sony is doing they very thing they are arguing against
 
Why is it that XBOX guys can't remember, or willingly sidestep COD marketing under XBOX?

Is Microsoft now whining that exclusive content or platform perks are wrong and could affect their business? No, it’s Sony that’s doing it. Casting criticism about hypothetical practices they are actually engaging in themselves right now, with the same game no less.

It’s not hard to understand.
 

Topher

Identifies as young
I am not sidestepping anything as I totally remember the PS3/360 COD days and a certain platform getting map packs 30 days early and such.

I am only bringing those things up because of the demands of Sony saying the Xbox hardware can't have an advantage not can Xbox give Gamepass players any type of benefits when Sony is doing they very thing they are arguing against

Sony didn't make any "demands". They said players would leave PlayStation for Xbox as a result and these were the reasons why. Sony isn't in a position to make demands and the CMA isn't asking Sony for their demands.
 
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DeepEnigma

Gold Member
Sony didn't make any "demands". They said players would leave PlayStation for Xbox as a result and these were the reasons why. Sony isn't in a position to make demands and the CMA isn't asking Sony for their demands.
CoD is the Trojan Horse. MS knows it, Sony knows it, most know it.

MS is just as free to make those same deals in the 3rd party arena, as they have done so before. You buy up the jewel, then "cut the chord" just as the new gen launches with your horse... the addicts will follow their spice.
 

adamsapple

Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Keep fighting the good fight.

I'm not going back to check but fairly confident you argued with me previously even after the statement you linked to, that it wouldn't be on PlayStation as that would be stupid for Microsoft to do.

Microsoft can wish to have GP on as many devices it wants, it doesn't mean its gonna happen. Unless Sony allows it. I was just pointing out that the thing about MS wanting GP on as many platforms as they can is not new, they've been talking about it for year(s).


I think you’ll find it was Activision that accepted Sony’s money and not Sony holding them to ransom 😂

Sure you can say that. Sony paid Activision money and got certain perks for their platforms. Now Activision wants to take MS's money and Sony are raising a ruckus that it means MS will possibly get perks for their platforms.


Ok so they are worried about people switching over the exact thing Sony is doing presently in hopes to entice Xbox players to switch

Exactly. Raising a fuss over the same practice they're very actively doing right now is what so many are calling as a double standard.
 
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Sony didn't make any "demands". They said players would leave PlayStation for Xbox as a result and these were the reasons why. Sony isn't in a position to make demands and the CMA isn't asking Sony for their demands.
I could've sworn there was a thread here somewhere about Jim Ryan saying the deal MS offered on CoD was inadequate on many levels.
 

Topher

Identifies as young
Ok so they are worried about people switching over the exact thing Sony is doing presently in hopes to entice Xbox players to switch

Correct. Sony's lawyers are making their case. It is Microsoft's lawyer's job to point out the contradictions. It sounds outlandish as hell, but that's lawyers for you.

I could've sworn there was a thread here somewhere about Jim Ryan saying the deal MS offered on CoD was inadequate on many levels.

Those were not demands and they were statements provided to the press, not the CMA.
 

3liteDragon

Member
I don’t know about anybody else, but I hope this goes one way or the other ASAP because I’m bored to shit of reading about it.
Idk I’m entertained lol, I never thought we’d be discussing acquisitions like this on a daily basis. Sony & MS going at each other publicly makes it even better.
 

DeepEnigma

Gold Member
Ok so they are worried about people switching over the exact thing Sony is doing presently in hopes to entice Xbox players to switch
It's what they plan on doing after when the next systems launch is what I think the greater concern is with these statements. Once again, MS is free to do the same deals in the 3rd party arena, nobody will be when you take away the horse and a plethora of other 3rd party IPs that have been so for decades.
 

PaintTinJr

Member
I am not sidestepping anything as I totally remember the PS3/360 COD days and a certain platform getting map packs 30 days early and such.

I am only bringing those things up because of the demands of Sony saying the Xbox hardware can't have an advantage not can Xbox give Gamepass players any type of benefits when Sony is doing they very thing they are arguing against
But everyone is missing the point on this.

PlayStation are fine with the status quo - even in the 360 gen where it worked against them - because you get to market first with a popular product or you are set to sell PS1, PS2, PS4 level numbers and CoD perk deals are the rewards publishers make available.

Winning gets rewarded, as it is in everything all the way back to the dawn of time with us climbing out of primordial soup.

MSFT buying ACTIVI takes the trophy away forever, it isn't even like the Aussies burning the stumps to create the ashes, and then becoming an annual fixture born out of showboating a win - I'm not a Cricket follower in case anyone gets the wrong idea -the trophy is just gone, and will always be owned by the yearly loser - staying with the analogy - who will have a yearly winning parade.
 
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Darsxx82

Member
Sony didn't make any "demands". They said players would leave PlayStation for Xbox as a result and these were the reasons why. Sony isn't in a position to make demands and the CMA isn't asking Sony for their demands.
We can play a lot with the language, but in legal jargon what SONY is doing is definitely a demand to the CMA.

Sony is literally asking the CMA to deny the acquisition under the terms that MS and ACTV-Blz have agreed to. The Commission invites the interested parties to declare their interest and this declaration is part of the written declaration that SONY sends to the CMA.

When Sony exposes and develops examples, what it is doing is an appeal to the CMA that these do not take place.

The CMA, of course, as the competent body has the power to decide once the parties have been heard and has no reason to submit to Sony's demands. Which, and what is shocking and funny is how hypocritical they become when they "cry" for something they are doing.
 

quest

Not Banned from OT
It's what they plan on doing after when the next systems launch is what I think the greater concern is with these statements. Once again, MS is free to do the same deals in the 3rd party arena, nobody will be when you take away the horse and a plethora of other 3rd party IPs that have been so for decades.
Why im sure there will be 3 years of cross gen games again. So if Microsoft is making a ps5 version for 120 ps5 users they will be making a ps6 version. Microsoft has no reason to remove a multi player game with cross play. Most Playstation gamers will just find another game killing the value of COD. There's a reason Minecraft is still on Playstation and Nintendo platforms they don't want to give another company an opening to steal that market. Microsoft wants it on gamepass with perks for ultimate and family gamepass membership. It is yearly content with a big following.
 

The_Mike

I cry about SonyGaf from my chair in Redmond, WA
Due to all the drama surrounding this acquisition (fuss from Sony plus the fact that they acquired Bethesda right before this), I imagine it's gonna me mighty hard for MS to do this again
anytime soon....
Meanwhile when Sony has acquired Bungie, Firesprite, savage game studios, haven studios, and lasengle this year alone while this acquisition has been running.

And are doing future acquisitions while blocking Microsoft for doing the same thing.

The Grinch Smiling GIF by The Good Films
 
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DeepEnigma

Gold Member
Why im sure there will be 3 years of cross gen games again. So if Microsoft is making a ps5 version for 120 ps5 users they will be making a ps6 version. Microsoft has no reason to remove a multi player game with cross play. Most Playstation gamers will just find another game killing the value of COD. There's a reason Minecraft is still on Playstation and Nintendo platforms they don't want to give another company an opening to steal that market. Microsoft wants it on gamepass with perks for ultimate and family gamepass membership. It is yearly content with a big following.
The offer that they gave to Sony, was their original marketing contract they have to honor plus three years which was to expire around 2027-2028 (estimated by the online consensus). Just in time to harvest all those CoD addicts from your competition's platform when you launch next-gen exclusively.
 

DeepEnigma

Gold Member
Meanwhile when Sony has acquired Bungie, Firesprite, savage game studios, haven studios, and lasengle this year alone while this acquisition has been running.

And are doing future acquisitions while blocking Microsoft for doing the same thing.

The Grinch Smiling GIF by The Good Films
Sony would undergo the very same scrutiny and evaluations as MS is going through if they acquired two of the largest publishers in the world, one being the very largest.

MS did not have the same scrutiny and evaluation when they were acquiring smaller development studios.

The comparison is disingenuous.
 
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Topher

Identifies as young
We can play a lot with the language, but in legal jargon what SONY is doing is definitely a demand to the CMA.

Sony is literally asking the CMA to deny the acquisition under the terms that MS and ACTV-Blz have agreed to. The Commission invites the interested parties to declare their interest and this declaration is part of the written declaration that SONY sends to the CMA.

When Sony exposes and develops examples, what it is doing is an appeal to the CMA that these do not take place.

The CMA, of course, as the competent body has the power to decide once the parties have been heard and has no reason to submit to Sony's demands. Which, and what is shocking and funny is how hypocritical they become when they "cry" for something they are doing.

The only reason anyone is calling Sony's statements to the CMA as "demands" or "requirements" is because an Xbox twitter account referenced it that way. This is what they said amount to "Sony's requirements":

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Those are not a list of demands. Sony isn't in a negotiable position here. As you said CMA can simply ignore anything Sony says. So even if they were a list of demands, which they are simply not, they would be demands without any teeth. Calling them "requirements" or "demands" is simply Xbox console warrior rhetoric of the twitter variety. Nothing more.
 

8BiTw0LF

Consoomer
Meanwhile when Sony has acquired Bungie, Firesprite, savage game studios, haven studios, and lasengle this year alone while this acquisition has been running.

And are doing future acquisitions while blocking Microsoft for doing the same thing.

The Grinch Smiling GIF by The Good Films
I'm quite sure not even Bungie are in the same league as Actvision (alone, without Blizzard).

One franchise has been the top-seller every year for almost 20 years - Call of Duty.

10. Call Of Duty: World At War – 15.02 Million

9. Call Of Duty 4: Modern Warfare – 17.28 Million

8. Call Of Duty: WWII – 19.82 Million

7. Call Of Duty: Advanced Warfare – 21.76 Million

6. Call Of Duty: Modern Warfare 2 – 25.02 Million

5. Call Of Duty: Black Ops 3 – 26.72 Million

4. Call Of Duty: Ghosts – 28.98 Million

3. Call Of Duty: Black Ops II – 29.59 Million

2. Call Of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 – 30.71 Million

1. Call Of Duty: Black Ops – 30.72 Million



You can't really compare that to any acquisitions Sony has made - ever. You can compare it to the Bethesda deal though and that's maybe why many see this as a bad deal for gamers. Disney went on a shopping spree for 10 years and I'm not for any company to grow that big and have so many franchises in one house.

Who's next for Microsoft? EA? Ubisoft?

They sure make it sound like it's good for gamers that they buy all these developers.
 

KingT731

Member
Ok so they are worried about people switching over the exact thing Sony is doing presently in hopes to entice Xbox players to switch
Now i wouldn't say the exact same thing but this in combination with potentially getting the game "for free" is definitely enticing people to both not buy the game and sub to GP. That's a very strong combo.
 
Sony would undergo the very same scrutiny and evaluations as MS is going through if they acquired two of the largest publishers in the world, one being the very largest.

MS did not have the same scrutiny and evaluation when they were acquiring smaller development studios.

The comparison is disingenuous.

This.
 

quest

Not Banned from OT
The offer that they gave to Sony, was their original marketing contract they have to honor plus three years which was to expire around 2027-2028 (estimated by the online consensus). Just in time to harvest all those CoD addicts from your competition's platform when you launch next-gen exclusively.
No company is going to give forever agreements. I say 3 years is about right to look at the deal again. By then sony might have bought a big publisher so a fair swap of games in that next agreement. Sony has the money to buy a publisher if they can spend 3 plus billion on bungie.
 

GHG

Gold Member
So we're just going to ignore the fact that this was a statement to the octogenarians in the CMA who don't know shit about gaming?

This is misguided. They understand the industry as a whole much better than most would have anticipated:


It's a long one at 76 pages but I suggest everyone in this thread grabs a beverage of choice and actually reads it because there seem to be a lot of misconceptions about their current position.

A lot of it doesn't even center around Playstation. For example:

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FWIW it's worth considering this document became available after Microsoft's most recent response to the CMA in which they were laser focused on Sony including that accusation via a certain "industry commentator"('s) twitter.

Meanwhile, Google shutting down Stadia in recent weeks won't have done them any favours. Remember when Google and Amazon were supposed to be their "real" competition? Well one of them has already been forced to exit the race.
 
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Darsxx82

Member
The only reason anyone is calling Sony's statements to the CMA as "demands" or "requirements" is because an Xbox twitter account referenced it that way. This is what they said amount to "Sony's requirements":

Fe4PhHDaYAAXwFf


Those are not a list of demands. Sony isn't in a negotiable position here. As you said CMA can simply ignore anything Sony says. So even if they were a list of demands, which they are simply not, they would be demands without any teeth. Calling them "requirements" or "demands" is simply Xbox console warrior rhetoric of the twitter variety. Nothing more.
I repeat again, what Sony is doing from a legal point of view is literally and objectively a demand, petition or request to the CMA.
Sony is requesting the CMA directly to listen to his assessments and terminate the MS-ACT agreement in the terms agreed by both.
And yes, all the examples and exhibits from SONY as a whole can be taken as a list of what SONY does not want the CMA to approve.

Then, that the issue around the Actv-Blizar Acquisition is a gold mine for the console war and that each side uses the terms such as a throwing weapon is one thing, and what is objectively and legally a demand, petition o request or not is another.
Nathing more.
 

DeepEnigma

Gold Member
No company is going to give forever agreements. I say 3 years is about right to look at the deal again. By then sony might have bought a big publisher so a fair swap of games in that next agreement. Sony has the money to buy a publisher if they can spend 3 plus billion on bungie.
Tom Cruise What GIF
 

GHG

Gold Member
I repeat again, what Sony is doing from a legal point of view is literally and objectively a demand, petition or request to the CMA.
Sony is requesting the CMA directly to listen to his assessments and terminate the MS-ACT agreement in the terms agreed by both.
And yes, all the examples and exhibits from SONY as a whole can be taken as a list of what SONY does not want the CMA to approve.

Then, that the issue around the Actv-Blizar Acquisition is a gold mine for the console war and that each side uses the terms such as a throwing weapon is one thing, and what is objectively and legally a demand, petition o request or not is another.
Nathing more.

Read the document linked above. Sony aren't the only ones responding to the CMA for comment during their investigation, far from it.

People seeing this as simply "Microsoft vs Sony" are failing to see it for what it really is as far as the CMA are concerned.
 

oldergamer

Member
You realize that EA doesn't produce consoles, right?
You realize that isn't a factor when talking about what software is and isn't allowed on PlayStation (primarily because Sony were sued for blocking software before in Europe)

There is no rule that says because MS is a platform holder they can't release software on playstation. They already release minecraft and minecraft legends!
 

DeepEnigma

Gold Member
You realize that isn't a factor when talking about what software is and isn't allowed on PlayStation (primarily because Sony were sued for blocking software before in Europe)

There is no rule that says because MS is a platform holder they can't release software on playstation. They already release minecraft and minecraft legends!
Yes no law, but, there's royalty licensing. MS is free to release all their games right in the here and now on PlayStation... but they won't. Why do you think that is?
 

Darsxx82

Member
You can repeat it all you want. Doesn't make it objective or true. I'll leave it at that.
I have repeated it once only in view of the fact that you do not know how to understand what is legally and juridically a demand, petition or request to an Official Institution with competence and power to decide.

That you don't want to see it like that is another thing.

And yes, better leave it there.
 

DeepEnigma

Gold Member
also Sony history of making exclusive content and games that are made third party exclusive so Sonys word on this matter is as tainted as Microsofts
They both do this. Remember your post?
both companies Sony and Microsoft have a history of this so you can't blame one without the other
They (Sony) are not buying up entire publisher(s) (yet?), and if they were, they would go through the same process, with a lot on here that would flip flopping on the ground like a futbol player in the first 5 minutes of a tackle, I'm sure.

I have repeated it once only in view of the fact that you do not know how to understand what is legally and juridically a demand, petition or request to an Official Institution with competence and power to decide.

That you don't want to see it like that is another thing.

And yes, better leave it there.
Nobody was subpoenaed, the fuck you on about?
 
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phil_t98

#SonyToo
They both do this. Remember your post?

They (Sony) are not buying up entire publisher(s) (yet?), and if they were, they would go through the same process, with a lot on here flip flopping on the ground like a futbol player in the first 5 minutes of a tackle, I'm sure.


Nobody was subpoenaed, the fuck you on about?

yes they both do this I agree and I agreed earlier, my point is Sony complaining that if Microsoft acquire Activision they could make content exclusive to xbox with call of duty and at the same time they putting tweets out about exclusive content or free levelling up for preordering on PS. massively hypocritical of Sony there
 

DeepEnigma

Gold Member
yes they both do this I agree and I agreed earlier, my point is Sony complaining that if Microsoft acquire Activision they could make content exclusive to xbox with call of duty and at the same time they putting tweets out about exclusive content or free levelling up for preordering on PS. massively hypocritical of Sony there
Keep up the good fight. There was more to it that just that.
 

GHG

Gold Member
There are social media pundits and fanatics that make a living off this type of clickety rage. And the simpletons that cult along like good little lemmings to the land of confirmation bias.
retro games lemmings GIF

Well to be honest I can't blame them considering Microsoft's obsession with Sony throughout their communication regarding the approval process of this merger. There's no shame in anyone admitting that's all they thought it was about, we can only go off what the media have fed us thus far (which has mostly been scraps). Did anyone here talk about operating systems when discussing the potential impact of this deal? Because I've not seen it.

What's less than convenient though (for Microsoft) is the fact that this isn't just about Sony as far as the CMA are concerned, it's not even predominantly about them.

In the context of the CMA's full written phase 1 discussion, Microsoft's most recent response (the one that referenced the Tom Warren tweet) is somewhat of an own goal. This leads me to believe other regulators may have gone lightly on them thus far and allowed them to lead the or influence direction of the investigation(my opinion of course). If it were just about consoles and call of duty in particular there's no strong reason to block this from going through. But as far as the CMA are concerned this goes well beyond that scope.
 
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Darsxx82

Member
Read the document linked above. Sony aren't the only ones responding to the CMA for comment during their investigation, far from it.

People seeing this as simply "Microsoft vs Sony" are failing to see it for what it really is as far as the CMA are concerned.

Who has said that Sony is the only one who is expressing her demands or making requests???

What Sony is only the One of all of them totally against the approval of the acquisition. Definitely because it is the one that would make the worst stop and it is normal.

What is not normal is that a Commission for competition endorses all the requests, assessments and "concerns" of one of the parties (SONY) and ignores all the others, including users, workers and other publishers and market agents who support or do not oppose the MS-ACTV agreement. The work of the CMA is not to seek the interests of a single party, of course, and that is what is shocking about all of its writing. You want to see it or not.

From then on, I don't know what that has to do with what I was discussing with my partner so you could quote me and maybe you didn't understand... LOL.
 

DeepEnigma

Gold Member
Well to be honest I can't blame them considering Microsoft's obsession with Sony throughout their communication regarding the approval process of this merger. There's no shame in anyone admitting that's all they thought it was about, we can only go off what the media have fed us thus far (which has mostly been scraps). Did anyone here talk about operating systems when discussing the potential impact of this deal? Because I've not seen it.

What's less than convenient though (for Microsoft) is the fact that this isn't just about Sony as far as the CMA are concerned, it's not even predominantly about them.

In the context of the CMA's full written phase 1 discussion, Microsoft's most recent response (the one that referenced the Tom Warren tweet) is somewhat of an own goal. This leads me to believe other regulators may have gone lightly on them thus far and allowed them to lead the or influence direction of the investigation(my opinion of course). If it were just about consoles and call of duty in particular there's no strong reason to block this from going through. But as far as the CMA are concerned this goes well beyond that scope.
While true, they have access to the same document you shared, but decided to zero in on their rage inducing snippets (not showing the big picture of the documents) to drive their narratives and social media content.

Agreed with the rest.
 
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LOL, this thread seems to be all about people taking whatever they want to hear and focusing on that. For example, the Brazilian document vs the CMA document.
1 thing for sure is there is going to be some crow to be eaten whenever this is all said and done. Possibly myself included.

I still think it will go through with little to no concessions
 
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GHG

Gold Member
Who has said that Sony is the only one who is expressing her demands or making requests???

What Sony is only the One of all of them totally against the approval of the acquisition. Definitely because it is the one that would make the worst stop and it is normal.

What is not normal is that a Commission for competition endorses all the requests, assessments and "concerns" of one of the parties (SONY) and ignores all the others, including users, workers and other publishers and market agents who support or do not oppose the MS-ACTV agreement. The work of the CMA is not to seek the interests of a single party, of course, and that is what is shocking about all of its writing. You want to see it or not.

From then on, I don't know what that has to do with what I was discussing with my partner so you could quote me and maybe you didn't understand... LOL.

No request is being endorsed. What are you even talking about? Sony are also not the only party that have expressed concerns regarding the deal.

There's no way you could have read all 76 pages of what was linked above in the time it's taken you to respond, so please spare me.

While true, they have access to the same document you shared, but decided to zero in on their rage inducing snippets (not showing the big picture of the documents) to drive their narratives and social media content.

Agreed with the rest.

What's poignant to me is the fact that I'm yet to see a single media outlet do a deep dive of that document from the CMA. They are all focused on the excerpts that have been shared on twitter along with Microsoft's response prior to it releasing. Oh well.
 
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