Mark Rein: "I'd be shocked if Wii U doesn't do well." UE3 better than Zelda Demo.
- Thread starter BY2K
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And the bolded part its pretty much it. Like i have been saying countless times it's not if UE4 will be runing in the WiiU, that's just a matter of if "its financially sound for Epic" because they are even considering mobiles and flash platforms. The important thing is, if a full featured UE4 will be running on the WiiU and it looks like it won't.
But that's a hard pill to swallow to some group and i just don't fucking know why
big question is:
after bleeding money for a lot of years will microsoft and sony make Epic wishes come true and pump up the hw or will they prefer save some money because nintendo clearly showed them that as long as you have 3rd party support you don't need a bleeding edge tech to have good sales?
and i'd like to point out that even kinect is showing that, because trust me, that's not selling because of it's graphics.
plus if two console have lower specs while the third one (let's say Microsoft) is bleeding edge the game devs will make multiplatform games ignoring whatever advantage they could get from the better hw (see PS3)
360 didn't bleed money the way people want you to believe. It was smartly designed hardware, with good CPU and great custom GPU that kept it afloat through the gen. PS3 on the other hand was bleeding money, but not because GPU, but because architecture that required expenisve CPU and very pricey memory. It also had blu ray, which cost 300$.
Hobbestetrician
Member
One way makes sense. The other? Not so much.
Refreshment.01
Member
This is a reasonable argument. However the scenario you paint is the least likely from my point of view. Chances are the 2 other platforms smoke WiiU hardware wise yet again, HOWEVER Nintendo won't be in a Wii vs PS360 disadvantage and that could play in their favor.
Point remains, if a full fledged UE4 lands on consoles chances are it will not be on WiiU but in the other platforms. Rein is kind of sectorizing the WiiU in the UE3 league. That's how it looks like now.
meanwhile in the sony boardroom:
Executive 1 "we cannot lose money again this gen, we have to sell hw for a profit this time, we need money"
Executive 2 "wait, we didn't lose that many because of the GPU, it was because of the CPU!"
Executive 1 "oh, you are right, let's add those other gb of ram and that GPU then, we can still lose money for those"
it doesn't really matter why the lost money, the point is that sony is unlikely to want to bleed money once again, also because vita is not doing well either... i don't really think they can afford it.
and if two out of 3 won't have the bleeding edge tech, that will be common standard for multiplatform game development.
Meh.
Consoles are good for playing exclusives and for interesting and different ways to play software.
My PC will be for everything else.
I wouldn't be too sad if UE4 wasn't compatible with ANY of the next gen consoles. It'd be nice, but I don't expect bleeding edge from any of the big three.
Consoles are good for playing exclusives and for interesting and different ways to play software.
My PC will be for everything else.
I wouldn't be too sad if UE4 wasn't compatible with ANY of the next gen consoles. It'd be nice, but I don't expect bleeding edge from any of the big three.
DCharlie
And even i am moderately surprised
There's an interesting situation here with Nintendo where they can end up going either way.
If the Wii U is the correct spec then they could well be the baseline machine for the next gen - something that didn't happen with the Wii because there was quite a large gap between the three machines.
If correctly positioned then you may well see a host of 3rd parties use Wii U as a base.
However, if it's drastically underpowered and third party efforts remain portovers/simultaneous releases of X360/PS3 games without looking -significantly- better then you could end up with it sending the wrong signal.
Wii U is a fascinating machine even without confirmed specs. I do also expect some MAJOR launch window announcements game wise. I've go spider tingles about Japan for a start.
No, it's not how it looks, it's how YOU are seeing it. There's a difference.
i do get your point, but still we know that currently no console match Epic wishes (Mark Rein is pratically begging for Microsoft to pump up the hw) and while microsoft can decide to do it i'm not too sure if sony can or will want to afford it.
tkscz
Member
I'm going to try and summarize this thread. Ok here goes.
"WHAT!? HE SAID UE3 AND NOT UE4!? WIIU CAN'T RUN IT!"
Did I do well?
In all seriousness though, it seems like people are just jumping the gun for no other reason than to jump the gun. Makes me wonder if they brought up UE4 running on it, how'd they react.
"WHAT!? HE SAID UE3 AND NOT UE4!? WIIU CAN'T RUN IT!"
Did I do well?
In all seriousness though, it seems like people are just jumping the gun for no other reason than to jump the gun. Makes me wonder if they brought up UE4 running on it, how'd they react.
Rush2thestart
Member
Rein is all about promoting his engine. I cant imagine him thinking the Wii U will be a success without UE4.
Sony won't bleed money. They are ditching Cell and there is no 300$ worth of blu ray in it. Vita is technically amazing, and is surely not bleeding money. PS3 was anomaly which won't be repeated. 360 proved you can make technologically very advanced console that doesn't bleed money, and Sony showed that they get it now with Vita.
OrangeGrayBlue
Member
I will be so happy the day that gamers finally stop caring about console wars. It makes threads like these unbearable to read.
AceBandage
Banned
The Vita is still being sold at a loss...
I take it he completely dodged the question. Because that's exactly what Rein did. Any other interpretation is jumping to conclusions.
Refreshment.01
Member
Yea, watch out for 2 ton safes falling of the sky, it'll be a pity if one smashes you like in those bugs bunny documentaries.Good to hear Epic sounding so positive on Wii U. Must be the extra bumps Nintendo put in to make sure it would run UE4. Nintendo's success is now a part of UE4's success (at least until the other consoles come out and run UE4, too), so it follows that he'd be up on it.
That's why i clearly said "IF a full featured UE4 lands on consoles" in my last post.
I don't know how anyone is making the connection between the Wii U and UE4 based on what he said. Or even what level hardware the Wii U is using to be able to run or not run UE4. Basically, we know next to nothing about the Wii U specs, so saying either way is nothing but speculation and conjecture.
I don't think its ~300$ dollars loss though.
Vita it's technically amazing indeed, but you should take a look at Media Create threads...
here's the current trend of Vita sales:
and software sales are not good either...
and we do know that Sony is losing money on every vita sold...
and btw according to last NPD vita is not doing great in US neither...
Is vita a great handheld? sure!
is it a financial success? if things don't change is much closer to become a train wrack.
They are still loosing money on every Vita sold. It looks like nothing, but 5$ x 500 000 unit sold, that's already 2 500 000$ lost.
What if Crytek came out and said "We are going to blow the door with next gen CE4". And than next day says "CE3 on next gen consoles will look great". How would you interpret it?
pieatorium
Member
so is the 3ds no?
CrunchyFrog
Member
Pardon me if "common sense" or gut feeling doesn't stand up to any kind of objective scrutiny. Perhaps you could direct me to these specific lines and the spaces between which you are reading? I just find it perplexing that some people seem to have this smug feeling
in "proving" something that they can only conclude from wild speculation and what little rumors, as if they get some perverse pleasure from your pre-established worldview being right, in particular that Nintendo's next console will be "underpowered."Does Vita not selling have anything to do with how much money they lose on one unit? I don't think so... They could price it 100$ and if it doesn't sell its a failure. If system is not expensive yet its very technically advanced, I think they would look for other reasons of it not selling well.Vita it's technically amazing indeed, but you should take a look at Media Create threads...
here's the current trend of Vita sales:
and software sales are not good either...
and we do know that Sony is losing money on every vita sold...
and btw according to last NPD vita is not doing great in US neither...
Is vita a great handheld? sure!
is it a financial success? if things don't change is much closer to become a train wrack.
Vita it's technically amazing indeed, but you should take a look at Media Create threads...
here's the current trend of Vita sales:
and software sales are not good either...
and we do know that Sony is losing money on every vita sold...
and btw according to last NPD vita is not doing great in US neither...
Is vita a great handheld? sure!
is it a financial success? if things don't change is much closer to become a train wrack.
At what price point and profitable hardware combination do you think the Vita would be a stunning success at?
Exactly. He's not going to be promoting a system that can only run the "last-gen" engine. Not enough blood from that stone. He's going to be up on a system that can promote their new engine for a new revenue stream. Good news all around.
sure, but while sony and microsoft were losing money nintendo has a lot of coins in their warchest, plus they make money out of sw, and they are selling a lot of sw, something that right now vita is not doing!
AceBandage
Banned
So...You people are arguing that Sony and MS won't go high tech because it bleeds money, but on the other side you argue that Nintendo is constantly updating Wii U to run UE4? UE4 that runs on yet to be released flagship Nvidia card? Would Nintendo than sell it on loss? With controller like that and GPU that would pack some serious power?
Exactly. He's not going to be promoting a system that can only run the "last-gen" engine. Not enough blood from that stone. He's going to be up on a system that can promote their new engine for a new revenue stream. Good news all around.
He just did exactly that for the Vita, iPad, and Flash.
Nothing to interpret except maybe they won't kill off CE3 when CE4 hits. CE3 will still look good on the next batch of consoles. I'm not sure what else anyone could get from that without adding in their own thoughts about what was being said. And even that is open to so much interpretation, it's not worth getting into without more information.
Though, in the case of Epic and UE3/UE4, they have pretty much said that both will co-exist. If you need a low cost solution, then UE3 is there. If you want the best of the best, then you have UE4. That doesn't say anything about hardware power.
AceBandage
Banned
That card won't be used in any of the next gen systems.
And it doesn't matter.
Consoles are not PCs and UE4 will be far more scalable.
The circle of life.
i'm not an analyst, but i don't think that a price drop so soon would be a good idea, because it would consolidate a trend (because of the 3DS) and consumer would expect the same from the PS4, forcing sony to go even cheeper on the hw to not lose money on that one...
what it needs its just compelling sw for the Japanese market, and if they want to push sales maybe they could do more bundles, but that's about it.
we are not saying that nintendo will do it, we are just saying that nintendo could afford it, something sony can't (microsoft sure can, the question is: is ballmer ok with it?)
and anyhow the hw we are guessing for Wii U is not bleeding edge, is normal, so it wouldn't necessarily force them to sell the system at a loss
CrunchyFrog
Member
One other thing people aren't taking into account. The Zelda tech demo was a TECH DEMO, on unfinished hardware, made in a short time span by Nintendo's developers who have little experience in HD asset creation, while UE3 is a heavily matured middleware engine with a wealth of dev houses and assets with which to showcase it's ever updating features. I'd also like to point out that Zelda tech demos have become a mainstay for Nintendo platforms, and in each and every instance the actual Zelda iteration (and many other first/third party titles) have matched and mostly exceeded them wholesale. It is with this "common sense" that i find the idea of Nintendo's next gen console to be so woefully lacking behind SOny's and Microsoft's next gen offerings as it was this gen absolutely laughable. Not to mention that again, we've seen absolutely nothing on the competitor's consoles anyway. I;m not sure why I wrote out such a long post anyway which can be summarized by saying this is all speculation and bullshit until objectively proven otherwise.
Get out of here with that reasonable and thoughtful post nonsense...
And so we came to the point where you will be able to run UE4,not only Samaritan, on system that is not sold at loss. An engine aimed for strictly next gen games that currently runs on the graphics card yet to be released. The graphics card thats 2x the price of Wii U...You see why people doubt it?
les papillons sexuels
Banned
i thought the gamecube zelda demo was better then TP in terms of lighting and most other aspects (except texturing). been a while since I've seen it though.
AceBandage
Banned
You really think UE4 will only be able to run on super high end cards?
Really?
When has that ever been the case for engines?
Gamecube Zelda demo looks quite bad in technical comparison.
Epic does not make engines for the good sake of the industry, make engines to sell them.
if two consoles are "low" on tech, you can be sure that UE4 will be re-engineered to run on those specs.
No one is going to buy epic a license for an engine that runs just on 1 hw, if not the hw maker and it's first and second party.
Refreshment.01
Member
But Darkchild, you are being reasonable and Crunchyfrog doesn't dig that, unless you hit him straight to the face with a bag of bricks and some cold hard factsPardon me if "common sense" or gut feeling doesn't stand up to any kind of objective scrutiny. Perhaps you could direct me to these specific lines and the spaces between which you are reading? I just find it perplexing that some people seem to have this smug feeling
Wii U unable to run Epic games confirmed.
I could run Crysis 1 on 6600gt card so to answer to your question is no. That was never the case. However, Crysis 1 on 6600 gt and 580gtx is not a same game, neither is the engine.
Which is why I think they're pushing for hardware makers to pump it up so they don't have to do a lot of back end things to get it to run on various hardware. They'll win or lose on some points and make adjustments accordingly.
AceBandage
Banned
So.. the game had multiple engines...?