Ollie Pooch
In a perfect world, we'd all be homersexual
We don't know if the game pad is turning people off, though - at the moment there's fuck all to play on it and its not cheap, so there's that.
Nintendo to meet UK retailers after unofficial Wii U price cuts fail
- Thread starter CrunchinJelly
- Start date
But its not revolutionary, that's the problem. And as I said before, I don't understand why people are excited about it at all. The gamepad pretty much provides what we have been experiencing on the DS/3DS systems for the last 10 years.
With that logic, why buy a PS4, you bought a PS3 in 2006?
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
Of course there others coming. Iwata said they are working on more collaborations with 3rd parties so dont be surprised when you see mushroom kingdom hearts.
I like the gamepad idea, if only for off tv play. I don't see how dropping it for a regular controller would help any. Thats not the problem at all. Motion controls might help, but really its that the system is underpowered, and so won't get much from thirty party devs. Nintendo will have to support the system on their own, but they do not have the resources to do so.
Exterminieren
Banned
This is the worst idea I've read on GAF. Holy crap.
Exclusivity is what makes Nintendo consoles work. Releasing titles on the competition before your own machine even launches is shooting it in the head before it even starts.
shinra-bansho
Member
Yeah, I'm perfectly open to them proving me utterly wrong; but it just seems so obvious:
For the traditional market: lacks third party support, isn't an upgrade from their current systems, more expensive than current systems, controller may be off-putting, brand image is still not aligned to key demographics.
The casual/expanded market: unappealing USP that doesn't seem novel, complicated/confusing USP, too expensive. May not need an upgrade. And that's assuming a lot of this market hasn't vacated the console space.
It's as if they never actually asked themselves...
"Who will actually buy this?"
...when they went about designing the product.
Perhaps they simply bought into the perception some people have of them as being more innovative than everybody else/ahead of the curve/trendsetting (EDIT: Oh, and "revolutionary" apparently) and thought they didn't actually need to take a read the market in their product development. Or they really think, as some of their fans do, that their software is better than everyone else's and a broad consumer base will buy it just to play their traditional franchises.
Bill Rizer
Member
I've learnt from recent 3DS XL threads that people aren't able to discern good picture quality from really bad (well i should have learnt in the past years especially in the 90s when my friends amazingly refused to buy rgb cables for their consoles because "it didn't look any different" from composite) but now, in 2013, I really wonder how people can enjoy play games with the absymal PQ they get on the WiiU gamepad screen, with dull contrast, washed out colors, compression artifacts; especially considering they have the option to play on an hdtv. I really don't see the excitment people has for this feature that I find nonsensical at the best.
But if this is what people want, well if I was Nintendo I would definitely take this as a relief: gamepad use becomes completely optional for all future games and mainly for offscreen play (or for optional functions such as inventory, maps, etc. which don't necessarily need the pad but that can be used for), who want the gamepad buys it apart from the console, which can then be sold at a lower price. Games will be better because more hardware power is set free, so it's win-win both for Nintendo and gamers.
I forgot: Actually, third parties off-screen play capable games *already* use the gamepad in an optional (unnecessary) way, in fact gamepad purpose has always been a confusing matter... I think Nintendo did a great mistake not providing a clear vision to both developers and gamers of what the gamepad purpose was, and that would have been done making a tighter design choice: OR the gamepad should have been a pure streaming device for this off-screen play idea, OR (better) it should have been exclusively an integrated tool for gameplay like we've seen in minor part until now.
But if this is what people want, well if I was Nintendo I would definitely take this as a relief: gamepad use becomes completely optional for all future games and mainly for offscreen play (or for optional functions such as inventory, maps, etc. which don't necessarily need the pad but that can be used for), who want the gamepad buys it apart from the console, which can then be sold at a lower price. Games will be better because more hardware power is set free, so it's win-win both for Nintendo and gamers.
I forgot: Actually, third parties off-screen play capable games *already* use the gamepad in an optional (unnecessary) way, in fact gamepad purpose has always been a confusing matter... I think Nintendo did a great mistake not providing a clear vision to both developers and gamers of what the gamepad purpose was, and that would have been done making a tighter design choice: OR the gamepad should have been a pure streaming device for this off-screen play idea, OR (better) it should have been exclusively an integrated tool for gameplay like we've seen in minor part until now.
AZ Greg
Member
During its worst selling month in the US, the PS3 still sold 25k more than the WiiU did in its worst month, the PS3 still had 3rd party support through the good and bad, visually it was on par with its direct competitors, and the high price was clearly one of the major things holding it back as opposed to just being a poorly conceived product.
King Mystery
Member
Nintendo needs to go back to their roots.
Scrap Wii U. Make a new 2D-centric game console. Play on nostalgia hardcore by making the console design reminisant of the Super Famicom. Release updated 2D HD titles of every game they released on NES and SNES, including forgotten gems like Star Tropics. Hammer out a stream of exclusive deals with third parties like Capcom, Sega, and Konami to release updated 2D HD versions of their NES/SNES library as well. Even though games will come in DVD-style cases, makes sure the packaging of the games is super premium; put the actual cases in colorful cardboard boxes like the ones old NES/SNES games came packaged in. Make sure every instruction book is at least 30 pages long with loads of nice artwork and game info printed on glossy pages. Every game comes with a poster and every RPG comes with a cloth map. Price the console at $149.
They'd reap mad profits. Am I right or am I wrong!?
Scrap Wii U. Make a new 2D-centric game console. Play on nostalgia hardcore by making the console design reminisant of the Super Famicom. Release updated 2D HD titles of every game they released on NES and SNES, including forgotten gems like Star Tropics. Hammer out a stream of exclusive deals with third parties like Capcom, Sega, and Konami to release updated 2D HD versions of their NES/SNES library as well. Even though games will come in DVD-style cases, makes sure the packaging of the games is super premium; put the actual cases in colorful cardboard boxes like the ones old NES/SNES games came packaged in. Make sure every instruction book is at least 30 pages long with loads of nice artwork and game info printed on glossy pages. Every game comes with a poster and every RPG comes with a cloth map. Price the console at $149.
They'd reap mad profits. Am I right or am I wrong!?
metalslimer
Member
Well yes but I didnt mean wiiu will turn around and become a 70 million seller. More like it becomes a nice secondary system that sells 25-35 million and a lot of Nintendo games. I dont see any viable way with the way wiiu is selling and its support to have a ps3 turnaround
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
LOL, no its comic view lolWhat is this, Comedy Central?
Not even close. You've obviously never played Mario Chase or any NintendoLand. You along with the developers have no imagination.
metalslimer
Member
Depends on your definition of that. At this point selling 100k a month in each major territoy would be a big turn around even if thats bad. But i do think nintendo has a shot at not heading the path of saturn/dreamcast/vita/etc. A little more than the gamecube in the end.
AZ Greg
Member
Depends on what your definition of turn around is. Get it back on track to what Nintendo was hoping for pre-launch? Not a chance. Guarantee it should at least sell as much as Gamecube? Sure.
Oh I've played NintendoLand. Sorry, but I didn't think it was all that great. It certainly didn't make me want to go back play it again and again. Wii Sports did however.
I haven't played a game on my Wii U since the first week of December. And I have 5 games for it, none held my interest for very long and I went back to my backlog. The only time I turn on my Wii U now is to video chat with my niece, I got her a Wii U for Christmas.
I don't know what you meant by the imagination crack, perhaps I'm supposed to imagine the Wii U games are good?
They were what the gamecube was all about.
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
More games and price cut. Cant price cut with no games. But to be fair I would wait till the other consoles to launch and see their performance to compare it to. If all consoles are doing bad do you say all consoles are selling terribly or is that the begining of the new standards of video game consoles? We'll see. PS4/720 are not out yet so people can talk about how great they will sell based off what they are saying with no real consequence.
metalslimer
Member
Wrong. I think i had more 3rd party than 1st party games for my GC. Sure the PS2 dwarfed it, but i had some of the best experiences that gen with my gc games. 3rd party games also ran better on GC. Had Sony not had their dominance and nintendoo not made a lunchbox with mini discs it could have done very well
I sort of wish that it was Microsoft or Sony that came up with the gamepad idea for their console. It's wasted on Nintendo with an out of date console, poor interface etc. The size of the battery is ridiculous. Having no Ethernet port and wifi in which the automatic settings don't work. I had to manual type in my wifi information to get it to connect. Our household PC, laptop, 360, IPad, mobile phones all connect automatically. Even the wifi adapter built into our TV worked with no problems.
When I was updating the Wii U for the first time, it would only download the update if the router was directly sitting on top of the Wii U. Any further away, an it would just give error messages.
When I was updating the Wii U for the first time, it would only download the update if the router was directly sitting on top of the Wii U. Any further away, an it would just give error messages.
Sho_Nuff82
Member
I'm pretty sure Gabe Newell said as much back in 2007/8. He eventually changed his mind, but yeah, people were not pleased.
It needs a revision. Multitouch. HD. Better battery. 3D?
If they wanted to design the entire console around it they shouldn't have cheaped out on it.
Mato
Member
The gamepad should be dropped, but the price not. Instead they should announce a revamped Wii U at E3, one that is significantly superior but matches the current price point. True next-gen, open world, non-linear, Zelda, Mario and Metroid, with superior Nintendo quality of art direction and attention to detail is what they must do.
You're insane, no way this could ever happen.
Mato
Member
I didn't say it will. Obviously it won't.
We haven't even seen those games for the wii u yet.
metalslimer
Member
Yes and completely fuck 3 million people. Im sure people would line up for days.
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
They would be even more fucked if they tried that, better specs for the gamepad wont do anything. Vita means life
You will see these games on Wii U dont worry
Mato
Member
Major games could have adjustable graphics ala PC to make it possible to run them on the older Wii U. Not saying that a revamped Wii U is feasible or going to happen.
Oh, I see you're here to try out your stand-up routine as well?
May I direct you to this post:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=51152355&postcount=1125
Having to play the poorer version of games you payed £300 to play would be a PR disaster for them.
Exterminieren
Banned
Wrong. What you describe is a niche, retro project, with very little resemblance to what is popular in any market.
Mato
Member
Not really, they could find a way to spin this, provided the newer machine was successful enough. They could offer a discount for those few unlucky adopters. It would be better to act swiftly and try to turn this ongoing failure around than just ride it out to the end.
Nintendo has already spent so much money on R&D and development of games that dropping the GamePad at this point is already far too late and would most likely cost them a fortune. It'd look far worse on them to give up than letting this thing roll Gamecube numbers. One can argue about whether or not the entire controller was a good idea but Nintendo's chosen their guns and now they're going to have to stick with them and do the best they can out of the situation.
Dropping the GamePad for their next console is definitely plausible, but dropping it now is asinine.
Dropping the GamePad for their next console is definitely plausible, but dropping it now is asinine.
TheDrowningMan
Member
Nintendo have problems; marketing needs to start in earnest, games need to be unveiled soon & a compelling price / content spot needs to be found, but some of the suggestions are just hilarious.
I think that, while more capable than the PS3 / 360, it would have been in their best interest to have opted for more of a spec boost, but opting for an identikit box with no distinguishing feature would have brought nothing but pain, leaving them with no chance of establishing a worthwhile niche. Wii U is in a lonely place at the moment, but they've a better chance at turning it around than if it was sitting as a $450 powerhouse; I don't think many people will drop their existing HD consoles quickly for the other two (it's been a marathon, a tortoise / hare generation) and they certainly wouldn't for a Nintendo console; the perception would be that it couldn't possibly compete, regardless of real-world performance,
I think that, while more capable than the PS3 / 360, it would have been in their best interest to have opted for more of a spec boost, but opting for an identikit box with no distinguishing feature would have brought nothing but pain, leaving them with no chance of establishing a worthwhile niche. Wii U is in a lonely place at the moment, but they've a better chance at turning it around than if it was sitting as a $450 powerhouse; I don't think many people will drop their existing HD consoles quickly for the other two (it's been a marathon, a tortoise / hare generation) and they certainly wouldn't for a Nintendo console; the perception would be that it couldn't possibly compete, regardless of real-world performance,
Mato
Member
It makes you wonder though, a cheap tablet is hardly a novelty and the software so far isn't really proving all that revolutionary.
Dave Meltzer
Banned
PS4 isn't living on a gimmick. Wii U is a last gen system except for the controller. But it turns out the controller isn't very good and no one cares, unlike Wii's controller.
Diablohead
Member
One reason why my friends don't own a wii is because they 1) already have a 360 or ps3, 2) own a touchscreen mobile or tablet of some kind and 3) already own a wii and not played it for a while from being burned out on it.
I am in all those 3 slots myself, I finally own a wii from last year and played it plenty over the last few, I own a 360 and already played it to death and I own a tablet and smartphone, I really have zero reason to buy a Wii U right now until we get games like F-zero, metroid, 3d mario, starfox and a few other games I would feel are worth buying.
Also doesn't really help that they are trying to go with the current gen power over a raise in performance, there is not much the Wii U can do my 360 can not.
I am in all those 3 slots myself, I finally own a wii from last year and played it plenty over the last few, I own a 360 and already played it to death and I own a tablet and smartphone, I really have zero reason to buy a Wii U right now until we get games like F-zero, metroid, 3d mario, starfox and a few other games I would feel are worth buying.
Also doesn't really help that they are trying to go with the current gen power over a raise in performance, there is not much the Wii U can do my 360 can not.
There really was no advantage at all to them launching so early, in fact it seems to have hurt them more than anything. Launching with a stronger lineup would have made more sense, but again it would still be forgotten in the midst of the next gen consoles. Nintendo's underpowered console plus unique feature set plan (or gimmick depending on how you see it) did not work out this time.
TwEE-N-Toast
Banned
You are totally right sir. I always felt the Wii U was too powerful if it pushed the price over $200 and that they should have tried to secure the low end of the market instead of attempting to chase Microsoft and Sony in what looks like a doomed path for everybody involved.
I absolutely agree. I would add also that even if we admit that marketing/etc. had some part in the system's failure, I tend to bristle at those concerns because they are often used as an excuse to avoid any further analysis.
By blaming the marketing, fans often engage in this implicit messaging: it isn't the product that is at fault. The product is great and that cannot be argued. Therefore, if the system isn't selling, something else must be wrong. People will argue the economy, pirates, and marketing -- anything except admit the system itself isn't appealing .
CoffeeJanitor
Member
Most people don't care. That's what's important.
If there is one good thing to come out of this Wii U disaster is that it stands as a warning to everyone in the game industry .
1 NEVER EVER PRIORITIZE THE CASUAL MARKET OVER YOUR MAIN FANBASE!!!while they will give you massive sales you can ( almost *)never keep them and they will eventualy jump to the next new thing and when that happens as a company you should be able to fall back on your hardcore fanbase but Nintendo by then had lost them too
and the system was declared death.
in fact i would argue that Wii U 's fate was already decided back in 2006
2 never assume that your console will sell well based on the success of its predecessor no matter how well it did as it will not be same.
i think nintendo still tought that the wii crowd would jump right back on the wiiu
instead of trying to gather their fanbase and go from there
we saw the same thing happen with the transition of PS2 150 MIL to PS3 70 + mill right now.
3
* Apple are the only ones i think who are currently avoiding that rule.
1 NEVER EVER PRIORITIZE THE CASUAL MARKET OVER YOUR MAIN FANBASE!!!while they will give you massive sales you can ( almost *)never keep them and they will eventualy jump to the next new thing and when that happens as a company you should be able to fall back on your hardcore fanbase but Nintendo by then had lost them too
and the system was declared death.
in fact i would argue that Wii U 's fate was already decided back in 2006
2 never assume that your console will sell well based on the success of its predecessor no matter how well it did as it will not be same.
i think nintendo still tought that the wii crowd would jump right back on the wiiu
instead of trying to gather their fanbase and go from there
we saw the same thing happen with the transition of PS2 150 MIL to PS3 70 + mill right now.
3
* Apple are the only ones i think who are currently avoiding that rule.
It looks to me like you're simply reading in to this what you want to read in to it. Most people seem to dislike Nintendo's casual focus from the Wii era and want to imagine they are being punished for their sins.
In reality, the Wii was an enormous success, while the PS3 was a massive failure, and if anything was learned last generation it should be that "hardcore" gamers no longer represent a profitable market segment. It's why there are so many new, major publishers and manufacturers focused on the casual sector (Zynga, Gameloft, Apple, Google, etc) while the "hardcore" market has primarily seen closures (THQ, Midway) and mergers (Eidos/SquareEnix).