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14 year old girl has baby in toilet and then kills it

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Laughing Banana

Weeping Pickle
14 years old pregnant... and then giving birth... and then kills the baby...

That's very, very fucked up.

Oh, and I hate to be the PC-guy here, but anyone should stop referring to the newborn baby as "it"... Unless a newborn baby is considered not a human being after all?

Regardless, the overall story is very fucked up.
 

Future

Member
14 years old is old enough to know good from bad, and to know that killing is just plain wrong.
I'd understand if she was afraid for her life he she had had the baby. But killing it just because she didn't want her relation with her mother to change is just wrong when you're 14.
Still I'll never know what goes through someone head when you have an unwanted pregnancy.


Then again I'd put the blame almost all on the parents because they are at fault for bad parenting all over the place, voluntary blindness and stupidity.

When you are 14 you are pretty much an idiot. As heinous as this is, I can see a 14 year old panicking, and without guidance doing something like this. Parents should get charged with neglect or something
 

GaimeGuy

Volunteer Deputy Campaign Director, Obama for America '16
I don't think she did, thus the result. She obviously couldn't see telling her family, or adoption, or even abortion as viable options, and getting rid of the baby was probably the only option she thought she had left.

She probably strangled the kid because she knew her mother was home. How is she supposed to get the kid to the police/fire dept /hospital without the parents finding out?

She wanted to get rid of the baby but without her parents finding out about it. So she can't get an abortion, and she can't drop it off somewhere. (Plus the crying would likely give her away, she realized). She was scared, afraid, confused, with nowhere to turn to.

Society failed this girl, and her kid.
 
The girl needs psychological help.
She's only 14. Lots of shit happen when you're that age, and the added burden of pregnancy and the shitty dynamics of that household were also probably key factors to this situation. To stick a pair of scissors near your genitals, you had to be in such a dysfunctional state of mind. Any sane, rational person would never entertain such an idea unless they were driven by desperation. Trying her as an adult and putting her away for life won't accomplish anything constructive.
 
Woman jailed for taking drugs to abort birth within 1 week of expected delivery

Sarah Catt, 35, and a married mother of two, believed the child was the result of a seven-year affair and had kept her pregnancy secret from her "highly supportive" husband.

The idea that access to sex-ed and abortions would be a panacea to all sexual ills is hilarious. People do evil things, they always will do.

A 14 year old girl recently stabbed and killed a 15 yr old boy and I highly doubt GAF would come out to blame society for that one.
 
it would have been better if the baby died when it was a lesser-developed fetus with a lesser-developed nervous system.

lots of displaced compassion in this thread. it's hard to murder a baby, but way worse to be a murdered baby.

society has to figure a way to reversibly sterilize kids at birth. when you're ready to have kid, you go get the procedure to reverse it.
 
Some girls can be quite heartless, couldn't she put the baby up for adoption?

She could have left the child on a social services' doorstep no questions asked.

Instead she'll likely rot in jail because she'll be tried as an adult and has already admitted her guilt.
 

stupei

Member
Woman jailed for taking drugs to abort birth within 1 week of expected delivery



The idea that access to sex-ed and abortions would be a panacea to all sexual ills is hilarious. People do evil things, they always will do.

A 14 year old girl recently stabbed and killed a 15 yr old boy and I highly doubt GAF would come out to blame society for that one.

Did anyone say that sex-ed and abortions would solve every problem related to sex everywhere?

If so I must have missed it, but it is impossible to argue that it would not have helped in this instance. If the girl's mother had acknowledged and accepted the pregnancy, the baby would not be dead. This is a fact. The entire reason the 14-year-old murdered her baby was to keep her mother from finding out, so if her mother had already acknowledged the pregnancy then the baby would not have been killed. This is the reality of the situation. It's pretty straight forward and simple.

A 14-year-old who cannot drive herself to get an abortion -- and likely can't get one without parental consent -- and likewise cannot drive herself to the hospital in secret to drop off her baby sees herself as having limited options. If she truly felt she could not tell her mother, that what she had done was horrible and shameful and had to be kept a secret, then what do you think her options were? If she felt that what she had done was so awful, so unforgivable that she preferred to shove scissors inside of her body rather than face her mother, are you seriously arguing that this is the same thing as an adult making a conscious choice to cover up an extra-marital affair through an illegal abortion?

She could have left the child on a social services' doorstep no questions asked.

Instead she'll likely rot in jail because she'll be tried as an adult and has already admitted her guilt.

Again: how? People are seriously acting like a 14 year old can hide a baby in their backpack on the way to school and just drop it off somewhere.

That solution works for 16 year olds with cars. It really does! If she was old enough to drive, it would immediately be a different situation. But she isn't. I'm not sure what circumstances you're imagining where she transports herself to social services without the aide of any one of those adults in her life who seemingly didn't give enough of a shit to intervene.

it would have been better if the baby died when it was a lesser-developed fetus with a lesser-developed nervous system.

lots of displaced compassion in this thread. it's hard to murder a baby, but way worse to be a murdered baby.

society has to figure a way to reversibly sterilize kids at birth. when you're ready to have kid, you go get the procedure to reverse it.

Actually, I was horrified when I read the article and quite repulsed by her description of events.

But I'm also capable of enough empathy to think about how desperate a child -- because yes, in addition to being a child-murderer she is also a child herself -- would have to feel to do the things she did.

If she was a heartless, cold-blooded killer she would have done a better job hiding the body. But she wasn't. She was a desperate dumb kid.

It's possible to feel both disgust and empathy at the same time.

This is why I'm ok with teenage girls getting the morning after pill w/o parental consent. I had a heated discussion on fb about how it can take away parental rights. I would prefer the loss of parental rights than seeing something like this.


This.
 

andthebeatgoeson

Junior Member
This is why I'm ok with teenage girls getting the morning after pill w/o parental consent. I had a heated discussion on fb about how it can take away parental rights. I would prefer the loss of parental rights than seeing something like this.
 
This is the perfect example of people jumping to conclusions and grabbing their pitchforks too early. There's a reason why 14 year olds are generally not completely held accountable for their actions, they're still not completely emotionally and mentally developed.

Either way whether she should be tried as an adult or a child is up to the judge, calling for the 14 year old to be tried as an adult when you know really very little about her state of mind is ridiculous and unfair. I'm really glad some of you have no influence over the justice system.
 

mxgt

Banned
This is the perfect example of people jumping to conclusions and grabbing their pitchforks too early. There's a reason why 14 year olds are generally not completely held accountable for their actions, they're still not completely emotionally and mentally developed.

Either way whether she should be tried as an adult or a child is up to the judge, calling for the 14 year old to be tried as an adult when you know really very little about her state of mind is ridiculous and unfair. I'm really glad some of you have no influence over the justice system.

Jumping to conclusions?

She strangled her newborn baby. She's not 5 years old, 14 is perfectly old enough to know what the fuck you're doing.
 

jimi_dini

Member
The teen did not know what to do with the child, Judd said.

I disagree, she did know. Killing the baby in cold blood. That's what she did.

btw. Holy fuck. This makes me sad. A 14 year old should know that it's possible to give a baby away for adoption.
 

Zutroy

Member
The girl should get a lot of phycological help and get away from her family for a bit, but I don't think she should go to jail for this.

Her mother on the other hand should get charged with something like neglect.
 
Clearly the people around her failed her. But she certainly knew better than to strangle the kid. She knows what adoption is and she knows what killing is.

She must have had some strange relationship with her parents . . . perhaps she was terrified of them?


But how do you deal with this? No sense throwing her in jail forever. But you can't just let her off.

She will needs many, many years of therapy, and I'd definitely feel safer knowing she had an ankle monitor for at least a decade.

This whole story is just such a sad mess, and it makes you wonder what drove her to such an extreme action.
I'm blaming attitudes towards single parents here, as well as attitudes towards younger people having sex ("My daughter isn't a slut and don't need no protection") and abortion.

She didn't want to be a single and young parent, and she also didn't want to have an abortion. I guess the reason she didn't try to abandon it was that she was afraid it'd be traced back to her somehow. And putting it up for adoption might involve her parents and people around her, which she probably didn't want either.

Imho, this could have all been easily resolved if there wasn't such a stigma around abortions in the United States, and if it was common practice for very young people to get them with everyone around them accepting them for it.
 

TheSeks

Blinded by the luminous glory that is David Bowie's physical manifestation.
um, this is pretty common. One of the reasons fire and police stations in California and many other states have the law where a mother can leave a newborn for adoption without any repercussions.

Yep. And I also blame kids being kids before they're ready for it. Kids simply should not be having sex without knowing the consequences and letting their parents know they're active.
 

fanboi

Banned
Jail time?
Absolutely not.

Alot of therapy?
Absolutely.

Jail time will do nothing good in this case, none whatsoever.

Some sort of guardian/councellor for the family and provation is needed.
 

NEO0MJ

Member
Insane. It's amazing how people can act when in a state of panic. Oh, and I believe that both are at fault. Mother was delusional and the kid should have at least tried getting help from another adult.
 

Marco1

Member
There is obviously an issue with the relationship between the mother and daughter here. The fact that she could not go to her mother and explain she is pregnant proves there is more of an issue.
I would call the mother in to doubt here also.
 

bengraven

Member
Charge her as an adult. She had likely been planning it all along and the cold blooded-ness of the case means she is perfectly willing to kill even her own children...not the type I want on the streets.

Plus, if you're old enough to fuck you can be treated as an adult.
 

effzee

Member
All my friends are either married or about to get married. And those married are having babies. I fucking love babies. Some of the best times I have now are hanging out with my friends and their new borns.

This is so sickening on so many levels. I just can't deal with this kind of shit. Just depressing.
 

Rebel Leader

THE POWER OF BUTTERSCOTCH BOTTOMS
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WHAT THE FUCK!
 

Vyroxis

Banned
Society, common sense, and a moral compass all failed this child horribly in this situation. Tis a sad, effed up story.
 

Marco1

Member
All my friends are either married or about to get married. And those married are having babies. I fucking love babies. Some of the best times I have now are hanging out with my friends and their new borns.

This is so sickening on so many levels. I just can't deal with this kind of shit. Just depressing.

You're a good human-being, the measure of a person is how comfortable they are around babies.
I will never understand how anyone can harm something so defenseless.
 
Even in the states where abortion is legal, you can't do it without your parents consent?

It depends:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minors_and_abortion

In the United States, most states typically require one of two types of parental involvement– consent or notification, or both. 35 states required some type of parental involvement in a minor's decision to have an abortion– 22 states require one or both parents to consent to the procedure, 11 require one or both parents be notified and 2 require both consent and notification before an elective abortion can occur.

It sounds to me like this sort of legislation would only encourage baby murders.
 
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