Yep...Shaq was in his prime all those years.
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2012 NBA Playoffs |OT3| If he dies, he dies *wink*
- Thread starter reilo
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Yep...Shaq was in his prime all those years.
You're talking to someone who likes Bledsoe more than Tom Brady.
What about that Kareem dude?
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
One and a finals trip
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
Tom... sigh..
Black Mamba
Member
It really isn't there. Most LA fans I've ever come across love Shaq.
Without Shaq, Kobe dies like Mac.
Some of these dudes posting now said that Pau was a better player than Shaq
Maybe in person. But here?
Some of these dudes posting now said that Pau was a better player than Shaq
They've blown confetti for every home game win this season. Apparently they've spent over $200k this year on confetti alone.
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
Kobe would have left LA if there was no Shaq
Black Mamba
Member
even you don't believe this.
Who posted Pau > Shaq? Not Lakers Shaq. No fucking way someone posted that without being in jest.
impossible to ever know this.
...that doesn't rhyme.
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
Kobe would have left LA and never looked back if he was carried to the promise 3 times by Shaq
better?
friskykillface
Banned
"get those Bulls jerseys ready" or whatever Kobe said to those guys in that videp of him in a parking lot, anyone remember that haha
Avery out for the season huh
smhAvory out for the season huh
Is this confirmed? Fuck.
Avery is out?
I'd love to dig up those posts again though. It came right around the same time as "passing out of the double team!" and "Lakers are done in 2-3 years barring a significant roster change"
not joking at all
I'd love to dig up those posts again though. It came right around the same time as "passing out of the double team!" and "Lakers are done in 2-3 years barring a significant roster change"
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
It really isn't.. he lobbied to be traded until they pulled a flimflam and got Pau
Blackace you really think the Lakers don't build a championship team around Kobe in 2000 when he hits 21 years old and is balling on ALL NBA Team levels? They did from 2008 on, why wouldn't they then?
Also, by your circular stupid logic, and most everyone else's, Magic (who won no rings without Kareem, and would have never come here in the first place without Kareem) can't be considered a better Laker than Kobe because the same Shaq/Kobe argument you all have been making for the past 2 pages applies...
except Kobe got 2 rings without Shaq
Also, by your circular stupid logic, and most everyone else's, Magic (who won no rings without Kareem, and would have never come here in the first place without Kareem) can't be considered a better Laker than Kobe because the same Shaq/Kobe argument you all have been making for the past 2 pages applies...
except Kobe got 2 rings without Shaq
Avery is out?
Yeah, looks like he is being shut down.
He only got THREE votes for the All Defensive team? Stupid league.
The Team that Shaq Built.
Avery is out?
not joking at all
I'd love to dig up those posts again though. It came right around the same time as "passing out of the double team!" and "Lakers are done in 2-3 years barring a significant roster change"
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=22390630&postcount=18642
Biased because of my name but yup.
There is a reason Shaq got all 3 of those finals MVPs, and one of the finals mvps kobe has was 100% pau's if it wasn't for the media.
Black Mamba
Member
Avery is out?
not joking at all
I'd love to dig up those posts again though. It came right around the same time as "passing out of the double team!" and "Lakers are done in 2-3 years barring a significant roster change"
I don't see the current crop of posters here posting anything this crazy (except maybe Konex).
I guess there will always be crazies, but I assure you the overwhelming majority of Laker fans do not believe that nonsense.
That LS comment is not saying Pau is as good as Shaq. Guess his point went over Kad's head. big shock!
With the hindsight of having won 3 titles already. And without Shaq, it's an entirely different team. What if they were contenders by then? Like I said, this is an impossible thing to figure out. So stop.
That comment is just one part of a 5 pages of salt between Imperial Conquest, Forcetawolf, Clovis, and some other members of Laker-age.
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
Yes Kobe did get two rings without Shaq.. did anyone say he didn't? nope they didn't.. thanks for that useless bolding..
and my stupid logic says that Shaq is a Laker great that should be thanked and viewed as highly as Kobe Magic Kareem and West..
And how would Magic have NEVER come to the Lakers? I mean I guess if they won more games the year before he was drafted he would have never come to LA.. but yeah I have no idea what you are talking about..
What I said is based on kobe's actions in the past he wouldn't have stayed on a boarderline playoff team and would have jumped ship to team that had a chance to win a chip if Shaq never came to LA..
So you agree with him? Pau had as much an impact as Shaq?
1) It's absurd to think that the Lakers organization wouldn't surround Kobe with competitive talent for the first 12 years of his career even if Shaq wasn't here...you can't possibly believe that
2) Kobe took the 5th best power forward at the time (KG, Duncan, Dirk, Amare were all better) to the Finals in 2008 and won two chips right after that. There are a number of different ways the Lakers could have built around Kobe from 2000-2008 that would bring about at least one or two chips...BUT EVEN IF THEY DIDN'T
3) All of the Shaq arguments used against Kobe you guys are making apply to Magic and Kareem and also to West / Wilt. West and Magic likely NEVER WIN without Kareem or Wilt so to consider Magic better than Kobe...JUST BASED OFF THAT, when Kobe actually won without Shaq...shows the flaw in the logic presented...and quite frankly what I've been saying...
People's arguments against Kobe are never consistent with their arguments against other players in similar situations. I.E. you're just being inconsistent, irrational, trolls whenever Kobe's place is brought up
We've got 16 chips, we don't only care about who wins more chips. For Most Celtic Fans Larry Legend and Bill Russell are right there, and many place Larry Legend above Bill, and if they don't they place him above Cousy or Havlicek despite having less chips.
You want us to value a guy who played here for 7 years as much as 3 guys who played here for 12+ and were great, along with the franchise for a decade? Not going to happen. Again, Kareem is a better player than Magic, but he's not more valuable for Laker fans...if you still don't understand why that is then you're just flat out missing the point.
2) Kobe took the 5th best power forward at the time (KG, Duncan, Dirk, Amare were all better) to the Finals in 2008 and won two chips right after that. There are a number of different ways the Lakers could have built around Kobe from 2000-2008 that would bring about at least one or two chips...BUT EVEN IF THEY DIDN'T
3) All of the Shaq arguments used against Kobe you guys are making apply to Magic and Kareem and also to West / Wilt. West and Magic likely NEVER WIN without Kareem or Wilt so to consider Magic better than Kobe...JUST BASED OFF THAT, when Kobe actually won without Shaq...shows the flaw in the logic presented...and quite frankly what I've been saying...
People's arguments against Kobe are never consistent with their arguments against other players in similar situations. I.E. you're just being inconsistent, irrational, trolls whenever Kobe's place is brought up
We've got 16 chips, we don't only care about who wins more chips. For Most Celtic Fans Larry Legend and Bill Russell are right there, and many place Larry Legend above Bill, and if they don't they place him above Cousy or Havlicek despite having less chips.
You want us to value a guy who played here for 7 years as much as 3 guys who played here for 12+ and were great, along with the franchise for a decade? Not going to happen. Again, Kareem is a better player than Magic, but he's not more valuable for Laker fans...if you still don't understand why that is then you're just flat out missing the point.
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
lol it pretty clearly states that Pau is just as vital to the Lakers as Shaq was...
Also that is one post in many..
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
The Lakers drafted Magic with a pick from the Jazz in the Gail Goodrich trade. Without Goodrich, the Wilt/West Lakers never win a title, Kareem never comes to the Lakers because of this, the New Orleans Jazz don't trade Magic to the Lakers, Shaq never wants to come to LA, Kobe doesn't try to force his way to LA. It all makes perfect sense, Goodrich is the most important person in Lakers history other than Mikan and the superior Minnesota Lakers.
Black Mamba
Member
No,I don't. But I understand his point and see that he said Pau wasn't as good as Shaq, which is what the conversation is about right now.
Black Mamba
Member
"Some of these dudes posting now said that Pau was a better player than Shaq"
"as vital as" does not mean "better player than."
Maybe it happened, but that wasn't evidence of it.
There are dozens of pages of complete garbage that are all about Pau being a better person, player, teammate, etc.
Intangibles!
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
That's because nobody else claimed that Magic a better Laker than Kareem other than some Laker fans.. And selling Shaq short is as inconsistent as it gets..
Sure the Lakers would have gotten some players but would any of them have been better than Shaq? No.. On almost any team in the NBA Shaq would have posted those numbers because he was truly a one man show for a few years..
West played in a different era, where teams had more talent per team than now.. So he gets a bit of a pass for not winning until he linked up with Wilt.. Wilt does have 2 chips because big men are far more vaulable than wings not named Michael Jordan...
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
Comparing Pau to Shaq and not having the words Soft served ice cream, puppies or Wiz Khalifa is plain wrong..
oh shit lol
Black Mamba
Member
Fair enough, but it's still not evidence of what Dy claimed.
Maybe. But according to you it was done by the 2 most "off the wall" laker fans from what you said on that page.
Although I have a hard time believing someone would claim he was actually a better player at their primes. I'd love to see that.
Herpes Reasons
Banned
a world where darkside and red blaster will finally join laker nation.
What are you on? Magic is the ONLY answer as to who the best Laker of all time is when compared to Kareem. It's about as debateable as "Is Michael Jordan the best player of all time". Kareem was NEVER in the conversation...he spent half his Lakers career past his prime and bald and before Magic came aboard, he wasn't winning anything (not to to be blamed, but also not to be credited)
Not the years they were winning! How is Kobe being an All Star Starter, and All NBA Team Selection on both sides, as well as 22-28 ppg make Shaq a "one man show"...Sure Kobe doesn't get someone as good as Shaq, but with the money Shaq was getting, he would have 2 or 3 other great players he could contend with if the team was built right.
We're not selling Shaq short. He brought us 3 chips, and his Laker team underachieved for 3 years prior to those 3 chips, then he burned bridges, left, and threw everyone in the organization under the bus.
As for Kobe's "trade me" situation, he was clearly all about "Trade me if you're not willing to build a team around me"...not much different from "Fire Coach Westhead or trade me" that Magic did...I have no problem with Magic or Kobe using that tactic to push management to make the right choice to improve our team, and both did that, and then held up their end of the bargain and won chips when management did so.
Its not like you're the only person denying it. Everyone who was around at the time says it went down and that it was completely shameful.
Its like when Chars said that Crawford > Wade. Except it was a whole gang of people who said that Pau was better for LA than Shaq was.
Also, you're about to be a pony.
WesternHeretic
Member
Kobe isn't the best Laker but he is definitely top 5.
deleted i think
clovis should make a new one... the right way *shakes cane*
Magic
Kareem
Wilt
Shaq
Ceballos
...? Don't see it.
Black Mamba
Member
eh, given how people have trouble interpreting things, that won't convince me. But even if you did, you shouldn't assume that repesents most fans of any kind.
You're a cruel, cruel man. I'd have never pony'd you. You will rue the day you pony me. RUE IT I SAY.
Why does Vag keep mentioning that Kareem was bald? WTF
Remember how close they came to getting KG?
Imagine if the team had two maniacs instead of one
You understand his point is dumb as shit.
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