Support NeoGAF

[Whataborman]

It comes off as a cash grab.

And no matter how many times these documentaries try, they can't make these victims look like anything else but stupid as hell. I mean, as dumb as a box of rocks.

The 2nd one on Starz is absolutely a cash grab, but I don't think "The Vow" on HBO is. This season centered around the "victims" and evidently next season is going to examine everything from Raniere's point of view.

You're absolutely right about the victims looking stupid.

 

[oagboghi2]

The 2nd one on Starz is absolutely a cash grab, but I don't think "The Vow" on HBO is. This season centered around the "victims" and evidently next season is going to examine everything from Raniere's point of view.

You're absolutely right about the victims looking stupid.

oh definitely the Vow is 10x better documentary. I just think they were a few moments when they tried to make Keith Raniuere look worse than he really is. This really stood out to me during the episode about the men's support group, and when they would have Bonnie recount her midnight walks with Keith

 

[TrainedRage]

I feel like Nexium could have been potentially really good and beneficial if it weren’t for the side grift of having concubines.

Keith seemed truly gifted at speaking to people and telling them what they needed to hear.

 

[Whataborman]

I just think they were a few moments when they tried to make Keith Raniuere look worse than he really is.

Agreed.

The guy may be a scumbag but in the documentary, he just comes off as a weird multi-level marketing dude who is into polyamory.

Now, some of the followers on the other hand seemed batshit crazy. Plus, they really didn't go into detail about what happened to DOS members, other than the branding.

I feel like Nexium could have been potentially really good and beneficial if it weren’t for the side grift of having concubines.

Maybe I was expecting more about the human/sex trafficking side of things but after watching "The Vow" most of the DOS stuff seemed consensual, particularly with the higher-ups like Allison Mack and the India girl. I don't think it's against the law to have concubines if the concubines are cool with it.

NXIVM just seemed like a huge MLM-scheme and a way for the higher-ups to avoid paying taxes.

 

[TrainedRage]

Agreed.

The guy may be a scumbag but in the documentary, he just comes off as a weird multi-level marketing dude who is into polyamory.

Now, some of the followers on the other hand seemed batshit crazy. Plus, they really didn't go into detail about what happened to DOS members, other than the branding.




Maybe I was expecting more about the human/sex trafficking side of things but after watching "The Vow" most of the DOS stuff seemed consensual, particularly with the higher-ups like Allison Mack and the India girl. I don't think it's against the law to have concubines if the concubines are cool with it.

NXIVM just seemed like a huge MLM-scheme and a way for the higher-ups to avoid paying taxes.

I agree but it’s about the power structure and him essentially being a figure of power and he for sure abused that power. But yeah it seemed consensual, who really knows. But he was with an underaged girl and that shit is gross.

 

[Whataborman]

But he was with an underaged girl and that shit is gross.

Agreed. I don't think they really went into that in The Vow, did they?

 

[TrainedRage]

Agreed. I don't think they really went into that in The Vow, did they?

Nope that was before the ‘cult’ I’m not too sure about the details though. Honestly I really have an interest in cults. I find them so interesting.

 

[Whataborman]

Honestly I really have an interest in cults. I find them so interesting.

Last Podcast on the Left has done some really deep dives into Jim Jones/Peoples Temple, Children of God, Ohm Shinrikyo, and Scientology which are really worth listening to.

 

[The Hamburglar]

I’m currently watching smallville and everytime she comes on the screen I say out loud ‘sex cult’.

 

[Hatemachine]

Been watching this. My main takeaway is that HBO tries really hard to make these women far more sympathetic than they should be. They're fucking morons and they did this shit consensually for the most part. You're not a victim here, just an idiot. Are women even responsible for their actions?

 

[Zog]

Are women even responsible for their actions?

Not if there is a man around to blame.

 

[Romulus]

Been watching this. My main takeaway is that HBO tries really hard to make these women far more sympathetic than they should be. They're fucking morons and they did this shit consensually for the most part. You're not a victim here, just an idiot. Are women even responsible for their actions?

Probably connected to someone on HBO and they're trying to lessen the blame through their influence.

 

[West Texas CEO]

My first thought when I read the headline was that someone was blowing the story of a kinky sex club all out of proportion. But no, that sounds like a creepy cult.

As an aside, putting people on a 500 calorie a day diet doesn't just make them thin. It's a well known brainwashing technique.

I read about her being in the cult a few years ago, including the branding part. People are into some weird shit. The actress who played Cally on Battlestar Galactica is also in it.

 

[Ferdinandthecowfish]

Been watching this. My main takeaway is that HBO tries really hard to make these women far more sympathetic than they should be. They're fucking morons and they did this shit consensually for the most part. You're not a victim here, just an idiot. Are women even responsible for their actions?

The show tries to make most of the people sympathetic when in reality they are all a bunch of morons.

Watching the show, I never got the feeling that anyone, even the women, was being forced to do anything, not even the branding. It seemed like anyone could walk away at anytime because some people did. Maybe they would face civil legal ramifications for doing that, but a company suing former employees to protect their IPs isn't anything new.

Keith Raniere probably deserves to be in jail for tax evasion or financial crimes but I'm not sure about anything else. Same with Allison Mack.

 

[AJUMP23]

The show tries to make most of the people sympathetic when in reality they are all a bunch of morons.

Watching the show, I never got the feeling that anyone, even the women, was being forced to do anything, not even the branding. It seemed like anyone could walk away at anytime because some people did. Maybe they would face civil legal ramifications for doing that, but a company suing former employees to protect their IPs isn't anything new.

Keith Raniere probably deserves to be in jail for tax evasion or financial crimes but I'm not sure about anything else. Same with Allison Mack.

There was certainly extorting and blackmailing going on. Some of it willingly, but when you say "I want my stuff back" and they don't do it, then it is full on blackmail.

 

[Guileless]

She (was) fine.

 

[AJUMP23]

At least Kristin Kruek got out of the cult.

 

[Evil Calvin]

At least Kristin Kruek got out of the cult.

Or....did she?............

 

[AJUMP23]

Or....did she?............

She did, she got Mack in, and then after a while she left. I think her Smallville costars have talked about it a little.

 

[Torrent of Pork]

I'm at the the point where I just assume everybody in Hollywood is a sexual deviant until they prove otherwise.

 

[poppabk]

The show tries to make most of the people sympathetic when in reality they are all a bunch of morons.

Watching the show, I never got the feeling that anyone, even the women, was being forced to do anything, not even the branding. It seemed like anyone could walk away at anytime because some people did. Maybe they would face civil legal ramifications for doing that, but a company suing former employees to protect their IPs isn't anything new.

Keith Raniere probably deserves to be in jail for tax evasion or financial crimes but I'm not sure about anything else. Same with Allison Mack.

They had people divuldge their deepest secrets and fears including documentation under the guise of 'therapy' and then blackmailed them into further brainwashing over the course of several years and then to sexual acts and finally too branding.
I do wish I could meet a Kieth Raniere type because I am pretty sure I wouldn't fall for their crap, but you never know.
They'd probably get me with the batman theme.

 

[Ferdinandthecowfish]

They had people divuldge their deepest secrets and fears including documentation under the guise of 'therapy'

The thing is, no one forced them to do this. They could have walked away at any time, especially at that point.

 

[Aggelos]

wow thats really fucked up. I never thought she was such a person.

Never judge a book by its cover... as they'd say...


"If convicted of all charges, Mack and Raniere faced imprisonment for a minimum of 15 years. In March 2019, it was revealed in court that Mack and the other defendants in the case were in active plea negotiations as Raniere appeared in court to plead not guilty to child pornography charges related to the case. On April 8, 2019, Mack pleaded guilty to racketeering conspiracy and racketeering charges, and was scheduled for sentencing in September 2019.
On October 27, 2020, Raniere was sentenced to 120 years in prison."

Allison Mack - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Madflavor]

The thing I find the most eerie about this, is that you wouldn't know it just by looking at her. She just had this harmless look to her, like a quirky girl next door type. Then you find out she was a leader of some cult of sex traffickers.

Reminds me of Ted Bundy in a way. Harmless, handsome and charming looking dude, but absolute monster inside.

 

[Futaleufu]

I'm at the the point where I just assume everybody in Hollywood is a sexual deviant until they prove otherwise.

Harvey Weinstein was just a scapegoat but the putrefaction runs deep.

 

[TDiddyLive]

I do wish I could meet a Kieth Raniere type because I am pretty sure I wouldn't fall for their crap, but you never know.
They'd probably get me with the batman theme.