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[Men_in_Boxes]

(Time stamped for your pleasure)


This won't be a popular topic because the zeitgeist is gone, but Colin Moriarty needed to be brought to justice. Lock him up, fellas...

 

[Guilty_AI]

You still havent lived down concord have you

 

[MiguelItUp]

The semantics really don't matter, the game was a large failure for various reasons, and nothing will change that.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

You still havent lived down concord have you

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

The semantics really don't matter, the game was a large failure for various reasons, and nothing will change that.

This isn't actually about Concord. It's about charlatan Youtubers who use anonymous sources to peddle clickbait. Colin Moriarty burned the remainder of his goodwill up.

 

[Guilty_AI]

This isn't actually about Concord. It's about charlatan Youtubers who use anonymous sources to peddle clickbait. Colin Moriarty burned the remainder of his goodwill up.

Its gone box man, like we all will be one day. You need to deal with the loss, remember the good times, all two weeks of them, and hold them close to your heart

 

[MiguelItUp]

This isn't actually about Concord. It's about charlatan Youtubers who use anonymous sources to peddle clickbait. Colin Moriarty burned the remainder of his goodwill up.

The unfortunate thing is that can be said about anything these days, not just YouTube. From "leaks" to "special info" it's more often BS than it is factual.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Its gone box man, like we all will be one day. You need to deal with the loss, remember the good times, all two weeks of them, and hold them close to your heart

 

[LectureMaster]

 

[lh032]

100 mil, 200 mil , 400 mil, no difference.

this game a waste of money.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Anyone working through the numbers like I did can connect the dots and see that Colin's claims were 100% BS, misinterpreted from a source that wasn't financially savvy regarding VC funding.

Glad to see a legitimate source back my thoughts up. Nice to be vindicated Men_in_Boxes

 

[zedinen]

How to spot the charlatans

 

[Raven117]

Who cares? Whatever it was, it was enough to tank a studio and potentially lead to a course correct from Sony.

 

[coachmcguirk91]

We have gone so long with no threads on Concord, sigh

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

The unfortunate thing is that can be said about anything these days, not just YouTube. From "leaks" to "special info" it's more often BS than it is factual.

True. That's why it's important for people to develop a BS detector.

Obviously the Concord story was "big news" but perhaps the bigger news was just how many people bought the story because it aligned with what they wanted to believe. A lot of people have to come to terms with a faulty BS detector now.

A great learning experience for many.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

How to spot the charlatans

Yup.

Playstation continued increasing operating income in a period when Concord flopped and they didn't have too many major releases, either.

Concord's supposed $400M failure (completely fabricated from misinterpretation of VC funding for multiple projects) wasn't even a blip on the radar. It was a non-event loss. Yet people claiming it's the biggest videogame failure of all time. It may be one of the most embarrassing failure of all time being pulled from the market immediately, but in terms of losses it's nowhere close.

 

[IAmRei]

no matter what budget, the game fails hard. we should carry on and move to somewhat better discussion rather than this legendary turd

 

[Hero_Select]

Yup.
It was a non-event loss. Yet people claiming it's the biggest videogame failure of all time. It may be one of the most embarrassing failure of all time being pulled from the market immediately, but in terms of losses it's nowhere close.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Who cares? Whatever it was, it was enough to tank a studio and potentially lead to a course correct from Sony.

It's a perfect specimen to study why fake news flourishes in all areas of life.

A population that wants to believe something, is easily lied to.

Then when the correction is made months later, people resist.

It's a machine that's built to roll one way.

People that want to be lied to don't like taking their medicine (truth). They want more lies.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Adam Boyes rightly says, what do you do after a Concord loss?

You keep swinging.

Why?

Because look at Helldivers 2. That game will continue to sell, they will make Helldivers 3 that likely generates hundreds of millions if not into the billions.

To strike it big, you have to crack some eggs. That doesn't mean you need to fund 12 GaaS titles, but the ones you do just need to be be green-lit with more scrutiny. Glad that Hermen Hulst is cleaning up Jim Ryan's mistakes.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

It's a perfect specimen to study why fake news flourishes in all areas of life.

A population that wants to believe something, is easily lied to.

Then when the correction is made months later, people resist.

It's a machine that's built to roll one way.

It's also disappointing given the person who revealed the numbers.

Colin "I'm not a journalist so I don't need to do any fact-checking due diligence" Moriarty looks really bad here. But he got a TON of clicks and attention and headlines from this, and the fact that his numbers were absolute nonsense isn't going to hurt his reputation because everyone has moved on.

He needs to do better, seriously. He could have at least presented the figures with some skepticism and worked through it, but he basically just doubled down on the source and said it was 100% solid.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Anyone working through the numbers like I did can connect the dots and see that Colin's claims were 100% BS, misinterpreted from a source that wasn't financially savvy regarding VC funding.

Glad to see a legitimate source back my thoughts up. Nice to be vindicated Men_in_Boxes

We were Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid on this one James Sawyer Ford . Only in this story, we made it to Mexico.

Brothers forever. A bond forged by Concord.

 

[March Climber]

Anyone working through the numbers like I did can connect the dots and see that Colin's claims were 100% BS, misinterpreted from a source that wasn't financially savvy regarding VC funding.

The amount of money never made sense. That level of budget is reserved for entrenched franchises like CoD and GTA.

People wanted to market it as true to make the game a beacon of what not to do.

Regardless people are now going to pivot and say it didn't matter. Which on a technicality they are right, it doesn't matter, this game made tons of bad news headlines last year, died, and people moved on.

 

[nemiroff]

 

[VolticArchangel]

 

[MiguelItUp]

True. That's why it's important for people to develop a BS detector.

Obviously the Concord story was "big news" but perhaps the bigger news was just how many people bought the story because it aligned with what they wanted to believe. A lot of people have to come to terms with a faulty BS detector now.

A great learning experience for many.

Of course, but I don't think the fine details really matter to the majority here. Regardless of who said what, what details were true, etc. The game was a failure, and that's factual.

 

[jcorb]

Has anyone actually disprove the 400m estimate? It's an obscene amount of money, but Colin seemed pretty confident in getting his source, and even cited that he thought the numbers were BS at first.

I get not everyone likes him for having a pretty divisive personality, but he's never struck me as a complete huckster. I'm sure there's more to the story than "Sony paid 400m to make this game", but I have a hard time it was COMPLETELY fabricated.

 

[Topher]

A bond forged by Concord.

 

[Buggy Loop]

It was not 400M, it was 399M. Now everything is fine.

No impact on Sony /s

 

[T4keD0wN]

Plot twist: it was 500mil

 

[plip.plop]

 

[diffusionx]

Why would I trust this guy?

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Why would I trust this guy?

Because he has intimate knowledge of the industry and was in a very high level position with Sony?

 

[diffusionx]

Because he has intimate knowledge of the industry and was in a very high level position with Sony?

Operative word here. He left Sony in 2016. He had nothing to do with Concord.

Do you know who else has intimate knowledge of the industry? Colin Moriarty.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Operative word here. He left Sony in 2016. He had nothing to do with Concord.

Do you know who else has intimate knowledge of the industry? Colin Moriarty.

He owns a videogame consulting firm. He is well aware of development costs.

Colin Moriarty isn't a journalist anymore. He runs a patreon for people to buy subs so they can listen to him talk. He even caveated the Concord information with "I'm not a journalist"

 

[bundylove]

Even if the number is lower its still a huge loss.

What a waste

 

[diffusionx]

He owns a videogame consulting firm. He is well aware of development costs.

Lol you don't know that. Being a consultant doesn't mean you all of the sudden know the development costs of every single game ever. Come on.

This is just he said he said, it's one rumor "suggesting" that another rumor was false.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Lol you don't know that. Being a consultant doesn't mean you all of the sudden know the development costs of every single game ever. Come on.

This is just he said he said, it's one rumor "suggesting" that another rumor was false.

Of course it's he said/she said.

I'll trust Adam over Colin. Adam has business sense and actual industry experience, Colin is just a grifting internet personality

 

[CLW]

 

[viveks86]

Has anyone actually disprove the 400m estimate? It's an obscene amount of money, but Colin seemed pretty confident in getting his source, and even cited that he thought the numbers were BS at first.

I get not everyone likes him for having a pretty divisive personality, but he's never struck me as a complete huckster. I'm sure there's more to the story than "Sony paid 400m to make this game", but I have a hard time it was COMPLETELY fabricated.

I doubt it was completely fabricated. But I have no doubt that it was completely misinterpreted.

There is going to be no way to prove it one way or the other at this point as even if Sony came forth and officially denied it and presented numbers, people are gonna believe what they want.

This doesn't change the fact that Concord was a colossal failure and a gross misjudgment of its potential and Playstation's future. But there is no logic to that number being already spent given the actual output. All we have is "because Colin said so". Ummm didn't he say something about Bloodborne as well that never came to be?

People just want to believe him and this rumor instead of taking the usual grain of salt because it makes the tragedy so much more grand. Wanting to watch a GaaS game go down like the Hindenburg may be invoking a bit of schadenfreude in all of us. I think we should check ourselves a bit on this one.

 

[Danjin44]

Let it go.

 

[adamsapple]

It definitely provided $400 million worth of laughs, that's for sure.

 

[kazuyamishima]

The game was a Turd, they had to basically remove it after 10-15 days.

The numbers were always sound like BS tho, but is best to let it go, it seems that financially, it didn't impact Sony too much.

In terms of their GaaS initiative it did some damage.

 

[diffusionx]

Of course it's he said/she said.

I'll trust Adam over Colin. Adam has business sense and actual industry experience, Colin is just a grifting internet personality

This is what he said "not all numbers you read online are real". That's it. There's nothing to trust because he doesn't say anything.

Obviously he is referring to the $400 million... But he doesn't say anything else, gives it no context, doesn't say he has sources, doesn't provide a more realistic number. There is no reason to believe what he is saying is based on any sort of fact or reality that would contradict Colin who at least said he had a source for his numbers. You and the idiot OP are really stretching here.

I doubt it was completely fabricated. But I have no doubt that it was completely misinterpreted.

There is going to be no way to prove it one way or the other at this point as even if Sony came forth and officially denied it and presented numbers, people are gonna believe what they want.

This doesn't change the fact that Concord was a colossal failure and a gross misjudgment of its potential and Playstation's future. But there is no logic to that number being already spent given the actual output. All we have is "because Colin said so". Ummm didn't he say something about Bloodborne as well that never came to be?

People just want to believe him and this rumor instead of taking the usual grain of salt because it makes the tragedy so much more grand. Wanting to watch a GaaS game go down like the Hindenburg may be invoking a bit of schadenfreude in all of us. I think we should check ourselves a bit on this one.

In the threads where the budgets were discussed it seems obvious that most people have no idea how much is spent to make videogames these days and think they cost $50 million.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

There is no reason to believe what he is saying is based on any sort of fact or reality that would contradict Colin

Yes there is, based on his understanding of budgetary costs for games. He's intimately aware of costs involved. Colin is not. He believed that a lot of the VC funding was allocated exclusively to Concord, when that wasn't the case. That leads to the over-exaggeration of $400M

 

[Skifi28]

I find it rather interesting as more of a social study than anything gaming related. You can say what you like about Concord itself, but the amount of collective hate it got, to a large extend organised by a certain group of YouTubers and internet personas was at propaganda levels. What's even more interesting is that the exact same thing is happening with AC Shadows right now. The game also has its fair share of issues and things that need critique, but again, the amount of pure hatred it receives on a daily basis is just insane and feels disproportionate to its problems. There's a group of people working 24/7 trying to spin every little piece of news Shadows receives into manufactured drama and I just can't figure out why. We even have our own resident GAF users that create daily drama threads out of literally nothing, trying to get as many people as possible to jump on the bandwagon. It's just so fascinating watching these witch hunts unfold In real time and one has to wonder what the endgame is.

 

[diffusionx]

Yes there is, based on his understanding of budgetary costs for games. He's intimately aware of costs involved. Colin is not. He believed that a lot of the VC funding was allocated exclusively to Concord, when that wasn't the case. That leads to the over-exaggeration of $400M

Colin's whole point is that Concord is a unique and special case that led to wildly ballooning dev costs. That's literally the whole point, go back and watch his video if you don't believe me. It doesn't matter what this guy knows about dev costs from other games.

Unless this guy provides knowledge to prove otherwise, he is NOT intimately aware of costs involved in Concord. He left Sony in 2016, worked for Iron Galaxy until 2024 and started his own company then. He has nothing to do with Concord.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

It's also disappointing given the person who revealed the numbers.

Colin "I'm not a journalist so I don't need to do any fact-checking due diligence" Moriarty looks really bad here. But he got a TON of clicks and attention and headlines from this, and the fact that his numbers were absolute nonsense isn't going to hurt his reputation because everyone has moved on.

He needs to do better, seriously. He could have at least presented the figures with some skepticism and worked through it, but he basically just doubled down on the source and said it was 100% solid.

I'm of the belief that certain professions attract certain personality types and then grow certain personality traits.

Colin doesn't have to hit shots like a basketball player or build bridges like an engineer. He doesn't get tested.

Accuracy isn't his barometer. Eyeballs are.

When that's how you make your money, you're naturally going to bend the rules harder than say...and electrician would.

So I can't waste my breath and say "Colin needs to do better" because that story did great for him. The people are the one's who need to do better. We (not you or me, we sniffed this out right away) need to a do a better job of not falling for charlatans because they sell us something we want to believe.

 

[KimDongHwan]

He mentions "our industry is overly tough on big companies that take risks". I don't think people are like making fun of Sony because they took a risk and failed, is that the risks they are taking is for games that their core audience really hates (GaaS -> Keep paying over month type of games). I bet the discourse would be completely different if lets say they took a big risk on a high budget JRPG that then failed, no one would be like "haha suckers stop taking risks". Anyways my point is lets not put in the same bag a game like Demon's Souls (high risk on PS3 - kickstarted a genre) to GaaS games, where they start designing the internal store and currency before they even have a gameplay element made.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Lol.

Concord lost $400M.

Defenders: But it didn't.

Ok, let's say Concord lost $200M, had no gamers, shut down a studio, shut down the game in less than 2 weeks, auto refunded gamers and deleted the game.

Defenders: Uhhhhh…. Duhhhhh…. But at least it didn't lose $400M!