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After Destiny, do you trust the games media more?

Frankly, games media aren't the problem here. Hype exists because there is a public willing to swallow without questions almost anything.

Destiny has been a repeat of the same, sad and disgusting parade of witless fanboyism months before actual release we have seen with Titanfall. 'Gamers' get what they deserve.
 

kd-z

Member
I'm routinely disappointed anytime somebody ever suggests that cynicism is the answer after being let down by something.

The gaming world, or at least my enjoyment of this hobby I love, would be so incredibly diminished if it weren't for hype. Will every single hyped game turn out exactly as expected? Of course not. But big deal. We all get it wrong sometimes and it merely proves to me that we *cannot* predict everything and we *cannot* tell exactly how good a game will be just by watching some videos or whatever, and I consider that a good thing. A certain amount of unpredictability makes life interesting.

I also think its unfair to put all the blame on the media for the hype of a game. They actually do feed very much off of what the consumers are talking and hyped about. I do not believe in 'manufactured hype', but rather believe that media hype is often a reflection of consumer hype. It is a business and probably cant be trusted 100%, but if you're really going to blame them for *you* being excited about Destiny and it failing to live up to those expectations, I suspect you are simply deflecting responsibility.
Well said. I don't understand the "I think every game will suck and I'm always positively surprised!" attitude. A lot of games won't live up to the mystical Hype, but being excited for their release, soaking up info, speculating and so on is often half the fun of a big, new release.

Dragon Age II was a huge disappointment for me after the first 10 or so hours, but at least I had a lot of fun waiting for it before release.
 

Everis

Banned
In the days when practically every game has an alpha/beta, early access or a demo (and for the ones that don't, you could always watch a twitch stream which is pure, unedited gameplay for the most part) why would you trust anybody's opinion but your own?
 
I don't get why people feel deceived, I could maybe understand that after the Alpha, but the Beta made it pretty clear just what type of game this was going to be. Nearly anyone could play the Beta, if the beta wasn't your cup of tea then you should have waited to see what changed.

Regardless what the gaming press and some vocal people on boards have to say there are many people that are enjoying the game. The game doesn't have to score in the 90's to be enjoyed by many people. If anything I hope Destiny illuminates to many people that review scores are not as important as they once thought, and they rely on them less. Maybe get them thinking about a title like Wolfenstein The New Order or Infamous Second Son which are at or below 80 on Metacritic at the moment.
 
I didn't have the feeling it was the games media hyping the game. It was Activision and especially Sony PR and also a lot of hype from gamers themselves.
 

Paper Lion

Neo Member
Watch Dogs was hyped up to be the best game ever. It wasn't.
Titanfall was hyped up to be the best game ever. It wasn't.
Destiny was hyped up to be the best game ever. It wasn't.


Hmm, it's almost like there's some kind of pattern here. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
 

Anticol

Banned
Why should I trust media more if they were hyping the game even after the Beta. Only a few of them show concerns when they played the beta or even before that, I trust them but the rest I trust even less now.
 
If this is a watershed moment and all reviews start actually using the 1-10 scale correctly from now on, then sure, mission accomplished, and gaming press opinions become useful again.

What this actually is however, is gaming press getting unreasonably picky about one hyped title in a vacuum, and they'll go right back to routinely giving HaloChartedWarfare 10s.

Same thing happened with Batman Origins last year; it didn't deserve to get shat on like it did when everything it did wrong (being an iterative sequel improving on its predescessor) gets a free pass every year from a myriad of other titles that iterate even less.

I wasn't even that impressed by Destiny in the alpha, but fuck, it is clearly a better game than many of the titles that also pull that 7/10 from those self same media outlets.
 
Sometimes, I feel like it's easy to generalise statements like 'games media' and forget they're human beings just like us.

I don't trust 'games media' in blanket. I trust people. I trust the respective individuals on GAF. I look at every initial engagement with a fundamental trust that people are being honest more often than they are liars.

There are times when I feel that journalist say things they shouldn't, vocalize terrible opinions, write nonsensical stuff, do things without due diligence, approached a subject matter without context, and many other unlikable things. But you know what? People are flawed. They're human beings. I don't like games journalist that write off 'animu' stuff without even willing to spend some time with it, but you know what? That's their opinion and stance towards it, just as many folks in GAF have that same stance. And while I think less of them because they have a pre-determined bias on artistic portrayal of any medium, I can acknowledge that. Just as I have flaws and if people look down on me for those things, then fine.

I'll use IGN as an example. Put it this way, on a fundamental level, I trust folks like Greg Miller, Brian Altano, Marty Silva, Ryan McCaffrey, etc. I don't have the energy or effort to believe that they would spend a large part of their lives being liars, and purposely say terrible things.

I trust that they're being as honest as they are about their opinion on things. Maybe some of those things are stupid, or worse, downright ignorant, but that's their flaw as people, and I accept that. Like, I think Ryan's Titanfall hyperbole is lame, and his tweet about Destiny is meh, but you know what? He's hyperbolic, easily excited and it shows. Maybe he's a bit less critical than he can be, but that's who he is. I can easily put the same label on Greg Miller for inFamous/Uncharted franchise, he's a known fan of said titles, and if he says hyperbolic statements about how awesome it'll be, it's just him being him.

With that being said, even if I trust them, I do think that there's a lot of room for improvement. My issue with the Order PAX preview was one. I don't mind one bit that Marty Silva has a negative opinion on the game, but he has given no indication in his written preview that it was the same build from E3, and the way he wrote his preview at times felt misleading because he made it sound like you actually travelled across town, when it was just 'across the street.' People won't always notice that it's a different editor's opinion, and sometimes that can come across as an updated news, when it's really opinion no.3 from IGN.

Or TLG cancellation fiasco. I'm sorry, but when you're refuted by Scott Rohde, who is literally just one rank below Shu Yoshida in the WWS hierachy of power, you don't get to act like your one source has any validity whatsover, unless your source was Shu Yoshida himself. The fact that it took so long to acknowledge the error, in light of the person refuting the news, was a misstep by IGN, imo.

With that being said, I trust a lot of folk in the games media, especially those who put their faces out as public figures and are strong opinion people on stuff. But just because I trust them ( at a functional level ), doesn't mean that I think their opinion are worth shit. Some of them have occasionally displayed ignorance, contempt of their audience, downright disgusting write-ups, and many other stuff, but I trust that they were honest about their stance on those terrible things, and that only makes them anywhere from 'nice people whose opinion isn't worth my time' to terrible human being who has no respect from me' in my eyes.

But not liars.
 

Beefy

Member
Never get hyped over a game I haven't played. I may like what I see from trailers etc, but until I have played the game I never get too excited. Games media, Sony, MS and game devs will always hype up games. Why wouldn't Bungie and Sony give crazy PR to a game they are supporting/ making? It is a business after all. End of the day we all have different opinions so we should judge the media, critics etc as gospel. That being said I like Destiny for what it is, but then I didn't buy into the crazy hype.
 

Gustav

Banned
I actually believe that the low scores are short sighted and will be seen as a mistake a year or so down the line.
 

Quazar

Member
Why should I trust media more if they were hyping the game even after the Beta. Only a few of them show concerns when they played the beta or even before that, I trust them but the rest I trust even less now.

True. You have to wonder how many reviewers are bitter about having to wait to review games as well
 

RooMHM

Member
Destiny was a title that was hyped beyond belief and had a massive marketing campaign behind it, yet quite a few game review sites were critical of the game's failings and scored it accordingly. Do you trust them more now as a result?
I trust that, as a 75-70 average the game must be around 40 in my book.
 
Not more, not less. But I don't read IGN, GT, Eurogamer, Polygon etc. reviews so for the readers of these publications it may have changed something, I don't know.

I only read The Escapist and Edge but I have no reason to follow the advice of some people (even if I appreciate a lot their work) blindly. I trust them in the way that I think they're putting effort for providing quality content and not to be biased by everything around them (which is not easy imo). So, regarding both nothing changed for me.

Jim's Destiny's review seems fair and I have a lot of points of agreement with him on the gaming industry and games in general so no reason for me not to at least listen to what he has to say.

Now I don't know if Destiny gets the treatments a lot of other big games should've had and maybe the game's scores have been unintentionally lowered because of this but if it's not at least a sign that hype and marketing campaign should and can be ignored by games media then I don't know what you need.

Games journalism is ok, it's just that people opinion's differ you may have to choose a publication depending on your tastes. Also who is stupid enough to buy something just because it gets a good score on the Internet ?!?
hype and marketing are different since it's you and only you who can decide to get on board
 

hoos30

Member
Did any collective hype Destiny more than thousands of users on NeoGAF? Am I not supposed to trust this site now?
 

Cavalier

Banned
I trust them less now. Even 6/10 is too much for Destiny.

hehehehehe_duck.gif
 

Scrawnton

Member
I actually believe that the low scores are short sighted and will be seen as a mistake a year or so down the line.

I agree with tbis. After hitting the level cap and doing heroics I see this game for what it really is, an end game loot grinding fest. I love it. I feel like reviewers only focused on the story, which was short and not that great.
 

Replicant

Member
Never believed them, never relied on them before. Why should I start now?

I'm perfectly capable on making a decision whether or not I want Destiny.

Fuck gaming media. I WILL NEVER FORGIVE them after the Xbone shenanigans and their support for DRM.
 
No, but it's a start. If the trend of actually reviewing and scoring games like this continues then sure, but I'm not convinced it will.

Normally reviewers get games early when hype is huge and they're some of the first people to play the game at all. That stuff is probably hard to look past and we end up with inflated scores.

Also Destiny is like the (insert name of huge multi-championship winning team or player here) of video games. It has more to live up to and higher expectations than most other games. So when it fails everything about those failures are magnified. If you're one to root for the underdog you might be more harsh on this particular game than normal, just because Destiny was supposed to be huge. It's Activision. It's Bungie. This was supposed to be the new Halo for christ's sake.

So yeah, I hope Destiny is only the first huge game that isn't automatically given an 8-10 by every big site but my hopes aren't too high. I'll wait for the next CoD and Assassins Creed and such to decide if I trust them any more than before.
 

BibiMaghoo

Member
If people buy a game based on "trusting" a media company on the internet, with a review written by a person they do not know, and are paid to write, then perhaps I would suggest they re-evaluate their outlook on this method.

Opinions and all, but no reviewer in the world is going to perfectly mesh with your likes and dislikes, in anything. They can be used to backup a position you may already have, but don't let them make that position for you. That will only end in disappointment.
 

Head.spawn

Junior Member
Hype or not, Destiny got a lot of basics wrong with their game. The short coming IMO have nothing to really do with being too hyped, particularly because I didn't have huge expectations for it.

Basics though:
-broken or non-existent social features.
-interesting story? Skippable cutscenes in a game where you play certain things over and over is a must.
-memorable characters, even ho-hum would've sufficed.
-why would you plant story or lore elements into a website, but not into the game? It's not 2004 anymore, websites aren't impressive and if you want to push supplementals, just release a book.
-Have they played Borderlands, PSO, Diablo it anything similar? There isn't enough character differentiation, not enough meaningful customization and oddly for a game based solely on squad co-op... why the hell is the only real thing you can do as a team mate/ally is revive them? That is mind boggling. How is communication even relevant? Just fucking shoot wherever, who cares? don't go too far off and revive me. The end.
-The world is a barren wasteland of anything to interact with besides random random-spawn enemies huddled together for warmth?
-One major location per planet, just screams DLC INCOMING!! WE SWEAR WE DIDN'T CUT CONTENT TO SELL IT TO YOU LATER!

It just feels like someone was there pushing awful ideas, wasn't addressing the short comings and nobody questioned it out spoke up. Destiny didn't need to be the best game in the world, just competent.

The gunplay is literally the only saving grace, Bungie still knows their shit in that regard. It's not enough to keep me on board though. It is enough to have me interested but absolutely hesitant in a sequel. As it stands the game is ready to pass up with no regrets (I've owned every Bungie game except Oni).

Reviewers did a good job accurately potraying the game and I think the scores are completely on point. Maybe they weren't caught up in a dorito/dew haze and they could think a bit more clearly. If anything it has pointed nd to a few reviewers that I can possibly look to that share a similar critical eye, whereas before I never read game reviews: but polygon, the escapist, gamespot, giant bomb,
 

Xenon

Member
No, I am not going to blame the enthusiast press for getting excited about a new IP from one of the top developers in gaming. People need to remember that previews are PR pieces and there is nothing wrong with that. The developer shows some clips from the game, details on how it will play, and sets the expectation of what the product will be like. The person writing the article will then add their opinions. But the expectation is set by the developer. I am not going to take the press to task for giving devs the benefit of a doubt.

I think Bungie is to blame for failing to meet people's expectations here. The fact that the game had no story is pretty shocking considering the ťrailers they released. I was under the impression that the game was story heavy. Even then, if they delivered on game and loot people would have forgiven them for that. But it looks like it fell short there as well.

I'd also like to add that gamers seemed to be hyping this up more than the gaming media and I wonder if people are throwing that onto the bonfire as well. In the end as long as you temper your expectations and excitement you'll never feel betrayed by someone else's opinion.
 

SDCowboy

Member
No, I am not going to blame the enthusiast press for getting excited about a new IP from one of the top developers in gaming. People need to remember that previews are PR pieces and there is nothing wrong with that. The developer shows some clips from the game, details on how it will play, and sets the expectation of what the product will be like. The person writing the article will then add their opinions. But the expectation is set by the developer. I am not going to take the press to task for giving devs the benefit of a doubt.

I think Bungie is to blame for failing to meet people's expectations here. The fact that the game had no story is pretty shocking considering the ťrailers they released. I was under the impression that the game was story heavy. Even then, if they delivered on game and loot people would have forgiven them for that. But it looks like it fell short there as well.

I'd also like to add that gamers seemed to be hyping this up more than the gaming media and I wonder if people are throwing that onto the bonfire as well. In the end as long as you temper your expectations and excitement you'll never feel betrayed by someone else's opinion.

Exactly. At its core, I think Destiny tries to be a Diablo-style loot game and a pseudo-mmo, and I feel it fails miserably on both counts. Beyond that, one can take any aspect of the game, and it's just a super shallow husk of what could have been. Destiny has a fantastic foundation to build on, but in it's current form, the game just lacks any kind of real depth, anywhere, in my opinion.
 

Coolade

Member
why? its a great game and they scored it low because they didn't get to review it early. i understand why they had to do that and even agree with their logic, but it doesn't make me trust them more than before.

I played the alpha and the beta, and purchased the full game and I wouldn't give it anything higher than a 5/10. The game is awfully sparse, repetitive missions, unbalanced MP. I for one will still give it a fair shake, and hope the DLC packs rectify some of the content issues, but don't think it got a low review score because they didn't get an early copy. It got a low review score because that's what it deserves. It's not to say you can't have a great time playing it with friends. I enjoyed the Beta immensely. Then I played Diablo 3 and saw how interesting a co op campaign could be. By comparison, the game feels shallow. Hopefully over time it's fixed but it did make me trust certain reviewers more.
 

Timmay

Banned
Nope, I don't trust them any more or less. I didn't need their reviews to tell me the game wasn't great (it's barely good). The beta was the first sign I had that there was a problem. Distributing quests with blinking lights? Get out. Horrible PVP? From Bungie? Wouldn't have guessed that, but there it is. They got my money though, but only because I'm a sucker for a pretty white console.
 
I actually don't need to trust critics. I rarely use reviews as a determining factor to buy something. There are so many other sources to learn about the game: Videos, streaming, message boards, etc. Sitting around and wondering what Arthur Gies thinks I should buy, never happens.
 
Personally, this changed nothing, since it was never about trust for me (although there's been some really shady stuff). Did Destiny have a 75 metascore? I'm ok with it. Did Destiny have a 90+ metascore? I'm okay with it too. Scores are absolutely meaningless, if I'm interested in the game.

I'll be definitely buying Destiny when I get around to buying a PS4, because I enjoyed what I played of the beta and I'm interested in the game, flawed game or not.
 

Ecto311

Member
This game is advertised as "ONLINE NEEDED" and ( I am fuckin dumb sometimes ) can't this game open and close parts as needed by bungie? In the beta they opened the moon for a bit so what is stopping them from opening up new shit slowly in the game? They do that kind of thing in a ton of PC games so why not here? I get that it was hyped and kinda fell flat on that but who says all we have now is all we are getting? I know there are expansions coming but even without those can't more/different areas open or enemies be found?

That is what I am hoping for since I got another xbox one and this game 2 times outta pocket for this fuckin game.
 

Flayer

Member
Destiny is an excellent game. There are so many games way worse than Destiny that have got much higher scores across the games media that it makes me wonder why they are scoring Destiny comparatively lower. It is a weird one because Destiny is an above average game with a ton of potential and great multi (so 6 or 7 out of 10 is fair) so I can't say I massively disagree with the review scores it just feels wrong when other actually terrible games score 8s and 9s across the board.
 

Two Words

Member
GAF isn't a single entity
Neither is the gaming media.


I hate to tell you this but Destiny had nothing to do with the media directly. All these hype? was generated entirely by the players themselves. The reason why players blame the media in most cases is because it is easy to pawn off responsible to someone else than accept it. Finally, you should not trust the game media because most of the times, they don't know more than us about a game until a few days before release due to early reviews.

As someone who wasn't hyped at all, I can say that the media had no role in hyping other players because I experience the same thing most people here would in terms of the media and I wasn't hyped. I have been around long enough to realize unless the game is a story based game I want to complete before spoiling it to myself, there is no point in pre-purchasing. (Another game that reeks of manufactured hype? A certain indie game).

tl;dr
Stop blaming the media for something that is entirely a player's fault. Take responsibility and accept you got hyped over nothing.
OP is saying the media did a good job of not giving it high review scores.
 

Mr Moose

Member
I never trust their hype, I knew what I was getting with Destiny (and thought it would have a small story, which was what I feared, and my fears were correct *cries*).

I didn't get hyped for Watch_Dogs, the best thing about that was the stuff that came with it when I purchased it (Hat, face mask, USB card thing and hoody, the box it came in was nice too).

I'm enjoying Destiny, although everythingwasDLC.jpg... Which is crappy, but I got the game for £35 with a £20-something free headset from Tesco, so can't complain.
 

Two Words

Member
Does anybody think Bungie thinks Destiny is as good of a game as they were acting it was in all of their videos? If you watch their vidocs, you get this idea of what Destiny means to them and how much was put into the game. They make a big deal about certain elements like the social nature of the Tower, but that doesn't matter in the game at all as it is implemented. They made the story appear to be this grand journey, but nothing about it makes sense. The classes are incredibly shallow and indistinguishable outside of their Super.I have a hard time believing they believe Destiny is anything but a hyped money-maker.
 

OccamsLightsaber

Regularly boosts GAF member count to cry about 'right wing gaf' - Voter #3923781
I don't think we should be shitting on New IPs, it's what we want. We should give constructive criticism so that they could make the next iteration better.

We shouldn't deter publishers from investing in new, different games. We should judge games by their own merits and not by other games in its genre. Assassin's Creed's first game wasn't great, but it was something that could improved upon.

I have no doubt the sequels to those games would be better than their first iteration. Not every developer could hit a homerun with ever new game they make.
 
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