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Alpha Protocol |OT| Bourne, Avellone, Denton, and the Agency's Sagacious Secrets

I finally beat AP after having a save on my PC for a year now. Romanced all the ladies. I was honestly let down at how little of Sis I saw, I thought she was cool character and I was going to have a Kiss of the Dragon moment in which I have to save her from G22 which she clearly insinuates with her locket.

Damn you Obsidian for cutting that!
 

masterkajo

Member
Just finished the game (got it cheap from steam sale). It isn't the best game of its type out there but I really liked the converstions and the choices that influnced the game.
I just looked at the AP wiki and to my surpise there are characters I never met in the game even though I did all that was available. So, big thumps up for the choices&consequences!
However, the game has weaknesses: combat, stuff to do inbetween missions (besides e-mails, black market and choose a new beard(!) what else is there to do?) and most importantly, consistency from a story standpoint -> half the time I didn't know what was going on exaclty (even though I read all the dossiers and mission briefings) and a lot of actions and events were not really mentioned or explained.

Also, after finishing it I am still not quite sure who the bad and who the good guys were and what it was all about. Still, I sneaked in embassies, executed some people, roundhousekicked others and most importantly got to sleep with a lot of women. Would buy AP2 if it ever got made!
 

Dries

Member
So I wanna play a MGS/Splinter Cell type of build, but I heard the bosses are terrible when going for stealth. How can I avoid this problem?
 
Dries said:
So I wanna play a MGS/Splinter Cell type of build, but I heard the bosses are terrible when going for stealth. How can I avoid this problem?

if you are doing a stealth build, just make sure to distribute some points to 1 gun at least and you shouldn't have many problems, I ran thru the game with a stealth, pistol, hacking build and didn't get stuck anywhere
 

Card Boy

Banned
Dries said:
So I wanna play a MGS/Splinter Cell type of build, but I heard the bosses are terrible when going for stealth. How can I avoid this problem?

Pistol, Master Chain shot, armour bullets, 6 shots to the head = bosses instant die.
 

XiaNaphryz

LATIN, MATRIPEDICABUS, DO YOU SPEAK IT
TheVisualizer said:
pretty much, add to that the skill that allows you to line up your shots from behind cover and it's a cakewalk
Also note that while aiming behind cover, you can still get unmissable crit shots.

Also, if you go with this build it's not a bad idea either to go up the technical tree to at least pick up Brilliance for more broken awesomeness.
 

Durante

Member
MechaX said:
But God Damn, I feel like this game wants me to play it like a chest-high wall cover shooter than anything actually stealth-related.
I played the entire game exclusively with stealth and never got that impression. Sure, I had to do a small number of reloads, but overall the difficulty didn't feel very different from something like MGS or Splinter Cell.
 

Card Boy

Banned
I just clocked this after picking it up from the Steam sale. Why the heck does this have a 72meta? This game is easily worth a 9 out of 10.

Feels good playing it at 60FPS, 16xAF, AA and maxed out. Sure it has bugs and Mina could of being hotter, but man this game is SO GOOD! Took me 20hours to clock, loved it.

I know it tanked in sales, but this game needs a sequel.
 

iavi

Member
Gez said:
I know it tanked in sales, but this game needs a sequel.

Might as well get ready to sing a hymn, cause it's never getting a sequel. That's already been said. It's sad too, but that's what launching against ME2 will do to you.
 

MaddenNFL64

Member
Miri said:
Might as well get ready to sing a hymn, cause it's never getting a sequel. That's already been said. It's sad too, but that's what launching against ME2 will do to you.

I thought it came out 2 months after?
 

iavi

Member
MaddenNFL64 said:
I thought it came out 2 months after?

Actually 6 months, lol. I was way off there. Still, it feels as if it couldn't help but be compared to it at every turn. It did the game a huge disservice, cause it really is a great one.
 

Dries

Member
So yeah, I'm loving this game. Why aren't there any other spy games on the next gen consoles (besides Splinter Cell) I can't think of any? :eek:
 
God dman this disco guy. He just hurts so much and I have so few resources going in..


Side note: most awesome action game I've played since Metal Gear Solid.
 

Grayman

Member
DownLikeBCPowder said:
God dman this disco guy. He just hurts so much and I have so few resources going in..


Side note: most awesome action game I've played since Metal Gear Solid.
Have you gone to Hong Kong and Met
Mr. Heck?
he can sell you an intel package that makes the boss fight easier.
 
Grayman said:
Have you gone to Hong Kong and Met
Mr. Heck?
he can sell you an intel package that makes the boss fight easier.

I had, but had no idea they would offer cross benefits, nor what those really offered outside of a map or securituy downgrade. Game has a lot of depth (sort of ) to it and I'm still learning it all.
Man I hate to do this whole level again.
 

Grayman

Member
DownLikeBCPowder said:
I had, but had no idea they would offer cross benefits, nor what those really offered outside of a map or securituy downgrade. Game has a lot of depth (sort of ) to it and I'm still learning it all.
Man I hate to do this whole level again.
Ok you can also always go to another area to try and level up some before the boss fight if you have other levels left.
 
Grayman said:
Ok you can also always go to another area to try and level up some before the boss fight if you have other levels left.
Well iof the spiked does him in that's no prob it's just going through thew hole level again is irritating because enemies hurt quite badly.
 

zkylon

zkylewd
DownLikeBCPowder said:
I had, but had no idea they would offer cross benefits, nor what those really offered outside of a map or securituy downgrade. Game has a lot of depth (sort of ) to it and I'm still learning it all.
Man I hate to do this whole level again.
Unfortunately, you might have to. The boss fights in AP are infuriatingly unfair if you come unprepared.
 
zkylon said:
Unfortunately, you might have to. The boss fights in AP are infuriatingly unfair if you come unprepared.
Already working on it., I don't mind half that much because this game is just crazy awesome?

Got it sweet game.
 

Erudite

Member
So what's the trick to getting AA in this game without the dialogue options disappearing?

Tried nVidia Inspector and RadeonPro (thoguht I might give it a shot just to see what would happen, despite running a 460), neither worked. Am I just not setting them properly, or is there another program ya'll would recommend?
 

Stallion Free

Cock Encumbered
Traced-Velocity said:
So what's the trick to getting AA in this game without the dialogue options disappearing?

Tried nVidia Inspector and RadeonPro (thoguht I might give it a shot just to see what would happen, despite running a 460), neither worked. Am I just not setting them properly, or is there another program ya'll would recommend?
In Nvidia Inspector, use the AA compatibility: 0x00000041.
 

Erudite

Member
It worked, but I have the missing dialogue issue like I did when I tried to set it from the Nvidia Control Panel. Are my settings wrong?

0BUPz.jpg
 

Stallion Free

Cock Encumbered
Oh my bad, I just checked my settings and realized I gave you the wrong comp, try 0x00000045.

Everything else looks good, though you may want to force anisotropic filtering if the option isn't in the game.
 

Erudite

Member
Thanks for taking the time to help out Stallion, however still the same problem occurring: The AA works, but the dialogue options disappear
uE8zw.jpg
 

Erudite

Member
Stallion Free said:
The latest drivers must have fucked it up, I had it working perfectly with that compatibility and now I have the same problem as you.
Shitty. Ahh well, guess I'll just have to deal with it, thanks for trying
 

soultron

Banned
Picked this up for $20 today. I'm blown away by how good it is. Reviews made it sound much worse than it plays out. My build (stealth + CQC focus) does seem to take the pain out of the dodgy targeting system though.

The conversation trees and intel bonuses are probably my favourite part about this game. As someone who read every codex entry in ME1, I love reading to get tangible in-game benefits.

The length of the game has also surprised me so far. I spent probably 10 hours doing Rome missions. I got stuck at a certain boss encounter, so I've moved onto Moscow for now. I'm enjoying some of the benefits in Moscow that are actually results of the choices I made elsewhere -- that's awesome.

Too bad it tanked and won't ever see a sequel. With more polish in certain areas, Alpha Protocol could've been an absolutely incredible game. Still, right now, I'm going to place it right beside ME1, even though AP is relatively terrible in the area of mechanics, graphics, and so on. I think I like the dialogue options even more in this game since it's less about making moral choices and moreso about making decisions that suit a particular situation or goal.
 
I accidentally played this game all day long and was about to come and make a LTTP love-in thread. I never expected to adore this game as much as I do.

I can definitely see where a lot of the complaints with the game come from, the shooting in particular. I spec'd myself out for Stealth and Pistols, and I've been duckwalking through every level shooting from cover and doing the RDR Dead Eye thing whenever I screw up and that works pretty well, but I'd hate to try and play the game as a straight up shooter given the way the guns handled in the firing range near the beginning. I appreciate that there's the option, but it's not something I'd ever mess with.

It's the conversation system and the story that get me, though. It's amazing how much the real time decisions can add, and the writing and the way the conversations are mapped out is superb. Talking to someone like Scarlett, who will change her demeanour completely from line to line, is a joy because you have to stay on your toes and actually listen to what she's saying. I was thinking about how lifeless all of L.A. Noire's interactions were, where every conversation is split into finite questions that have only one correct answer that is rarely clear to anyone but the gameplay designer; I really don't think there's a better conversation system out there than Alpha Protocol's. And I love getting the drop on someone by checking out their entries beforehand.

I went to Taipei right after Saudi Arabia and I think I'm just about finished there. The game would probably have benefited from a little more variance within missions, like not dropping you into a staged firefight if you're a stealthy character that hasn't triggered one alarm in the entire hotel, but given the branching paths that are already there it might be too much to ask for. I'm playing the PC version and so far it's pretty gorgeous and glitch-free, it seems like the lack of polish in the console versions is a lot of the reason the game didn't do so well.
 
I've been playing this for the past few days and I'm surprised by how well it plays. It's definitely clunky in spots and the AI can be quite dumb but, overall, playing as a pure stealth character is actually pretty great. Things fall apart a little in boss fight shoot outs though. Those situations seem to highlight all the gameplay issues.

The voice acting is a mixed bag but the dialog is well written and I'm liking how the story is playing out. Also, I find myself not questioning the decisions I'm making throughout the game. Usually, with this type of game, if something doesn't play out just right, I end up reloading an earlier save and replaying that section. I'm not sure why, but with Alpha Protocol, I never feel the need to do that.

So far I've played about 10-11 hours. I finished up the Moscow section and I think I'm nearing the end of the Taipei mission.
 

soultron

Banned
Felix Lighter said:
I've been playing this for the past few days and I'm surprised by how well it plays. It's definitely clunky in spots and the AI can be quite dumb but, overall, playing as a pure stealth character is actually pretty great. Things fall apart a little in boss fight shoot outs though. Those situations seem to highlight all the gameplay issues.

The voice acting is a mixed bag but the dialog is well written and I'm liking how the story is playing out. Also, I find myself not questioning the decisions I'm making throughout the game. Usually, with this type of game, if something doesn't play out just right, I end up reloading an earlier save and replaying that section. I'm not sure why, but with Alpha Protocol, I never feel the need to do that.

So far I've played about 10-11 hours. I finished up the Moscow section and I think I'm nearing the end of the Taipei mission.
I feel the exact same way, to a tee.

I rarely like to replay games, but I started up right after the credits wrapped. The Veteran character option is awesome thus far... even in the opening minutes it's been quite a different characterization of Thorton. I'm going to be an asshole this time around and see how people treat me when I'm mercilessly efficient about completing the mission.
 

soultron

Banned
Buttonbasher said:
Finished it tonight, and loved it. Will replay it soon. Would have bought a sequel in a heartbeat.
It's sad to think that a sequel could've really layered on the polish needed to get the AI and combat up to snuff.
 
soultron said:
It's sad to think that a sequel could've really layered on the polish needed to get the AI and combat up to snuff.

I'm just about at the endgame, and aside form a couple of balancing issues, AP is brilliant.

It saddens me that reviewers shit on it and we wont see a sequel, yet, gave ME1 a pass.

AP deserves a sequel :.(
 
Have been playing alpha protocol this two last days, and continuing today. The game has surprised me. I didnt know that the dialog trees and conspiracy story would be so awesome.
The game has some bugs that already have fucked my game (because I was not saving before each mission), and the shooting mechanics are horrible, worse of all when you are against bosses (the fucking russian boss mission of defending the guy is horrible) but the good parts are so good that you continue playing.

Its really a rough diamond. I pray that someday they change their view and decide to make a sequel having all the great aspects of the game, and reworking all that doesnt work.

I always comment jokingly that I can always make my face in the games that let you make your character, maybe because its so easy to do it. I was sad you couldn't make your own Mike Thorton like Mass Effect at the start of the game (and that he looked like ass), but then I arrived to the locker and blam! Changed the hair (i dont kow why but my hair appears in all make your character videogames), changed eyes color, put some light facial hair, put some glasses and BLAM! There I have it, a guy that resembles me :lol
 

butsomuch

Member
New Chris Avellone interview
WO: Personally, what are your feelings on how it was received? Anything you would have done differently?

MCA: The game wasn't received well on release, and as a developer, that's never something you want when you've spent a good number of years and hours on a title. Once the price dropped, though, people seemed mostly fine with it - well, at least on Twitter. Without the Twitter feeds and user reviews, I would have thought no one enjoyed it at all, but enough folks did for me to feel good about that. As expected, all the feedback we got was being incorporated into sequel plans, although it turned out SEGA didn't want to pursue it.

In terms of internal changes we could have done, hindsight's 20-20. A lot of the changes we realized had to be done were included in the 2nd round of Alpha Protocol's development cycle (the overhaul occurred about halfway through development, and carried on until the end of the game). We broke up the story to allow for more game mechanic inclusion and reputation mechanics, allowed for more optional progression per mission and within the narrative, made sure the stealth and pacifist paths were a viable path, and overhauled the AI and inventory management.

I never liked the cinematic feel of the game, but that was the request and one of the pillars, so we did that. I would rather all the animation budget have been spent on combat, stealth, or other game mechanics rather than cinematic conversations, and I felt anything we did would be a negative comparison to current RPG titles from studios who already had a lot more experience and pipelines for delivering that cinematic experience - our animators and designers did a great job, but we definitely didn't have the same resources and budget as other developers.

Also, I'd have dropped one romance, at least. I hate them normally, and having 4 in one game, all of which I had to write, was a pain in the ass. I lobbied for killing the Scarlet romance (spoiler, though probably not a shock if you've played past the first mission) and successfully got a 5th romance kicked from the game, but the others remained like a taint. Still, it's part of the spy fantasy and it was part of the mandate, so it was time to roll up the sleeves and get to the romancin'. I confess that I enjoyed writing the "hate" sides of the romances better, between Madison losing her temper, Mina's final judgment, and... well, I always liked SIE, no matter which direction.

One aspect that we did want to include for AP2 was a system proposed by our Systems Designer, Matt MacLean - I've heard it called "honeycomb" mission structure, but that makes me think of cereal, so I'll just describe it instead (note that I'm quoting my answer in Vince Weller's Iron Tower interview below):

--------------------------------------------------------------
Honeycomb Mission Structure: It applies to a mission design where the player is given an overarching objective (to put it in Fallout New Vegas terms: "force the New California Republic to sign the treaty with the Jacobstown super mutants") and then given about 5-6 "satellite quests" orbiting the main quest, all of which can affect the set-up or success of the central mission. The player can choose which of those 5-6 missions he wants to undertake, and they all react to each other and cause a reaction in the central objective as well.

We did this to an extent in AP (optional missions, missions affecting other missions for each hub), but a lot more we could have done with this system, and all other things being equal, it's my goal that it be a focus for at least one of our titles in the future, as it's a really interesting idea.

The disadvantage is it can get extremely complex if done improperly (special casing events), the advantage is that it's a better means of giving the player reactivity without a linear quest progression... and more importantly, it gives the player choices in how they want to complete the objective. They wouldn't need to do all 5-6 missions at all, and they could accomplish these satellite missions in any order they wanted. A speech character may simply target 3 missions that cater to diplomacy (say, sowing gossip or convincing soldiers or officers that the main capital is going to be attacked), and suddenly the garrison gets a high-level order to move its troops to the capital to defend the monarch.
--------------------------------------------------------------

Lastly, in terms of what we would have done differently, one thing that definitely impacted the reception was out of our control (release date) - first off, people expected more from the delay when there was never any plans to do anything more with the title during the delay. In addition, being released after Mass Effect 2 with clearly superior cinematic sequences nor after Splinter Cell which specializes in some of the best stealth mechanics to date didn't help, either. To explain the publisher reasoning, however, I do know that there was a drive to push the "buzz" of the project so players were aware of it, and it was felt that eight months would give that lead time enough for people to be aware that Alpha Protocol existed. That said, even with this lead time, the PR efforts still came on late, so I don't know how much that helped in the end, except pushing the game at least eight months out from a more favorable release time, at least in terms of features. If it had been released much earlier (and it's rare to say this), I think the reviews would have come from a different perspective... as it stood, it defeated expectations on a number of levels in the marketplace.

There are things I think we did do well in Alpha Protocol, and I'm proud of them. There's a lot of branching, there's a lot of consequences to your choices, you can outwit the bad guy just by being clever and doing your homework, you can persuade almost all your adversaries that you'd make a better boss, the fact we didn't use speech or dialogue skills in conversations as an "insta-win" button, the character had no moral barometer, but everyone's perception of him was different was good, and I liked the fact that having negative reputation gave bonuses, so if you felt like being a jackass, the game recognized you were in a role-playing game and playing a role and didn't cut you off from content to punish you, it gave you different content and abilities. I like that I could pick and choose the personality of the weapons, Matt MacLean wrote great emails, and I did like the fact that there was a pacifistic path... and having the voice actor who did Winnie the Pooh be one of our major adversaries was a nice, bizarre little touch.
 
There are things I think we did do well in Alpha Protocol, and I'm proud of them. There's a lot of branching, there's a lot of consequences to your choices, you can outwit the bad guy just by being clever and doing your homework, you can persuade almost all your adversaries that you'd make a better boss, the fact we didn't use speech or dialogue skills in conversations as an "insta-win" button, the character had no moral barometer, but everyone's perception of him was different was good, and I liked the fact that having negative reputation gave bonuses, so if you felt like being a jackass, the game recognized you were in a role-playing game and playing a role and didn't cut you off from content to punish you, it gave you different content and abilities
Hey, these are the things I really liked about it! Also the bolded is a straight bitchslap to Mass Effect.
 

Grayman

Member
mmm honeycomb design.

Even though there will not be a sequel I am hoping that Obsidian will do a game using APs dialog as the basis. A modern setting would be great too. AP tells a complete story and would be stretching to continue on anyways, although we would get more Heck.
 
That's an interesting read, because the thing I took away from Alpha Protocol was, man, if only they didn't have all that gameplay. The conversation system and the e-mails and data collection were my favourite things about it, the thing that set Alpha Protocol apart from other RPGs, and I really don't think another pass over the mediocre dude-shooting parts would have helped much.

This game really clicked with me, I enjoyed it far more than I thought I ever would, and it's because it's so different to everything else on the market. I like Mass Effect a lot but the highpoints of those games are always when they break from their patterns and do something unexpected, like Thane's cop procedural episode floating in a sea of samey shooting missions, and Alpha Protocol was all about that. When I got to Rome I think I did four or five missions where I didn't even draw my gun and I loved that. It's the pitched gun battles where the game falls down, not because the controls are bad but because they just don't need to be there. You can shoot a hoard of dudes in almost every game ever made, you don't need to do it in a really interesting espionage game of intrigue and mystery.

It's a completely unreasonable to ask a small developer like Obsidian to make even more branching options than they already did, but I feel like it would really have benefited the game. When the game allows you to spec yourself all the way towards Stealth and Pistols you're just going to have no fun when a big fight breaks out, but when you're spec'd for Stealth and you've been sneaking your way through a whole mission that fight shouldn't have to break out in the first place. That one hotel mission in Taipei is a prime example: you set off a random alarm by deleting some of Stephen Heck's data off a laptop and then have to fight off endlessly respawning dudes in the hotel lobby. That didn't need to happen. In some situations it could be as simple as not putting the guards into Alert mode before you get there depending on your performance in the mission so far.

Obviously it'd be harder when it comes to bossfights, but I'm sure it could have been done. I know why they didn't: because that kind of game would only appeal to someone like me who'd rather talk his way through a whole game and never fire a single shot, but I can dream can't I?

As it stands Alpha Protocol is a game I adore with a few sections I really have no interest in playing that I'll just have to suffer through on repeat playthroughs. It probably wouldn't hurt too much to skip some of the higher Stealth and Pistol abilities and just pump up my Assault Rifle skills for when the rubber hits the road, though.
 

Labadal

Member
matrix-cat said:
That's an interesting read, because the thing I took away from Alpha Protocol was, man, if only they didn't have all that gameplay. The conversation system and the e-mails and data collection were my favourite things about it, the thing that set Alpha Protocol apart from other RPGs, and I really don't think another pass over the mediocre dude-shooting parts would have helped much.

This game really clicked with me, I enjoyed it far more than I thought I ever would, and it's because it's so different to everything else on the market. I like Mass Effect a lot but the highpoints of those games are always when they break from their patterns and do something unexpected, like Thane's cop procedural episode floating in a sea of samey shooting missions, and Alpha Protocol was all about that. When I got to Rome I think I did four or five missions where I didn't even draw my gun and I loved that. It's the pitched gun battles where the game falls down, not because the controls are bad but because they just don't need to be there. You can shoot a hoard of dudes in almost every game ever made, you don't need to do it in a really interesting espionage game of intrigue and mystery.

It's a completely unreasonable to ask a small developer like Obsidian to make even more branching options than they already did, but I feel like it would really have benefited the game. When the game allows you to spec yourself all the way towards Stealth and Pistols you're just going to have no fun when a big fight breaks out, but when you're spec'd for Stealth and you've been sneaking your way through a whole mission that fight shouldn't have to break out in the first place. That one hotel mission in Taipei is a prime example: you set off a random alarm by deleting some of Stephen Heck's data off a laptop and then have to fight off endlessly respawning dudes in the hotel lobby. That didn't need to happen. In some situations it could be as simple as not putting the guards into Alert mode before you get there depending on your performance in the mission so far.

Obviously it'd be harder when it comes to bossfights, but I'm sure it could have been done. I know why they didn't: because that kind of game would only appeal to someone like me who'd rather talk his way through a whole game and never fire a single shot, but I can dream can't I?

As it stands Alpha Protocol is a game I adore with a few sections I really have no interest in playing that I'll just have to suffer through on repeat playthroughs. It probably wouldn't hurt too much to skip some of the higher Stealth and Pistol abilities and just pump up my Assault Rifle skills for when the rubber hits the road, though.

What is great is that handlers react not only to dialogue responses, but they also react on how you complete some missions.
 

Khal_B

Member
Started playing this recently and though the mechanics are proving to be a hurdle, I'm liking it enough that I've stuck with it so far.

I really like the way the dialogue flows, makes conversations feel more natural. I really wish the controls weren't so clunky though.
 
Shake Appeal said:
Hey, these are the things I really liked about it! Also the bolded is a straight bitchslap to Mass Effect.

Hahaha at comparing ME to AP.

AP is a much better RPG than ME. I really don't consider ME as an RPG.
AP has real consequences to your every decision, that's brilliant and sorely missing from all RPG's today. My actions in AP had real story consequences and affected the outcome.

Once I understood that AP is an RPG first and a third person shooter last I had awesome fun with the game.

Its one of the best new IP's of this gen and one of the best WRPG's ever.
I'm truly saddened that there won't be a continuance of the franchise.
 
Labadal said:
What is great is that handlers react not only to dialogue responses, but they also react on how you complete some missions.
My failure with the Gelato guy in Rome haunted me all the way through to the final mission :p
 

Kevtones

Member
Finally started playing this past weekend... I really like this game.

- Mechanically it feels last-gen at times but I'm fine with that.
- The environments are varied and the pacing is great.
- Graphics communicate what they need to so whatever.
- Camera is too close to Thornton.
- Dialogue is okay but the trees are great and it flows really well.
- I feel the changes I'm making.
- The RPG elements are felt in the action.



After 8 hours AP > ME and it only stands to get better.



Also, I just did the Gelato mission (maybe I've played 5 hours?) and I answered 2 questions and left without a hitch..?
 
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