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Arrow Season 4 |OT| A Tale of Salt and Fire
- Thread starter ZeroX03
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PhoncipleBone
Banned
Code of Silence? They adapting Chuck Norris stuff now?
But anyways, now that Darhk and The Barrowman are joining forces, can they find a way to bring in Slade and Harrison Wells to complete the most powerful swag team of villains ever?
family_guy
Member
Hmm. Maybe it's Olliver's son that's in the grave.
gundamkyoukai
Member
PhoncipleBone
Banned
cereal_killerxx
Junior Member
I can't decide if this show is getting better or not. The last episode was incredible. This one was rather frustrating. How on earth could Oliver be that stupid?
I can think of five people Oliver cared for that 'died' by that point: Shado, Sara, Slade, Akio and Yao Fei. Maybe Slade doesn't count because he was an enemy when he was washed away.
Malcolm faked his death at the end of S1.
Oliver gave him the ring in return for helping him take down Ra's #1.
gundamkyoukai
Member
Also IMO the writers mess up .
It would have been better if oliver did not know malcolm knew about his son .
Would have made the ending even better and also made oliver look less stupid .
Cause he still not tell anyone in the group which makes him look even more dumb .
It would have been better if oliver did not know malcolm knew about his son .
Would have made the ending even better and also made oliver look less stupid .
Cause he still not tell anyone in the group which makes him look even more dumb .
As a character? Yeah, RF is the best. It was a great twist (although we knew something was up we didn't know the details), was an amazing character with great development, and the intersection with Barry was perfect.
However, as a villain he... killed Barry's mom and put his father in prison (who he later helped get out). Not saying those aren't bad things, of course they are. And when we see him again, he will probably continue to affect Barry, but he didn't destroy Barry the way Malcolm has done to Ollie.
Malcolm is the whole reason for the whole show and has killed, manipulated, and caused more pain to Team Arrow than nearly any villian in the media. Who created Deathstroke? Who caused the whole fight with Ras? Who is now teaming up with the main villain and willing to kill Ollie's son for revenge? Malcolm. He caused at least 3 seasons of trouble in Arrow.
Malcolm is basically a ripple effect of pain and death. I mean, until this last episode, after EVERYTHING he has done... he was Ra's Al Gul.
As a threat, Malcolm has shown to be the most dangerous out of all the villains. Not saying the most bad-ass/frightening (Zoom) or best developed (R-F), but he is by far the most manipulative and has won more than most villains in a superhero product.
Of course, it could be that I am biased as I remember when Malcolm was the biggest bad-ass in villains (then overshadowed by Deathstroke, then the Flash show, etc..). He gave me hope that there could be super villains that weren't well... Marvel movie villains (How is it Malcolm is cooler and more bad ass than freaking Ronan????).
OdysseusVA
Banned
I feel like this show has reached gutter tier. Not as terrible as S3, but just bad.
Thanks, Guggy.
Thanks, Guggy.
Still a fun character, but I do agree that he shines more as a villain (which it looks like they are finally getting into) than being someone who swings both ways.Well, to be fair, I at least find him more interesting than the Merlin in the comics (I know, different characters but still). In fact, I don't care for most of Green Arrow's villains, although I loved all the ones in Jeff Lemire's run. But nah, not comparing comic books.
Black Manta makes Malcolm look like a puppy.
gundamkyoukai
Member
Nah while this ep was not that good getting rid of the LOA for good is a plus .
Once they stick with it , the LOA had become a joke glad they gone.
I really liked this episode. There were a few problems like the power level discrepancies and the weak final fight. Yes Oliver should have killed Malcolm, but there's a consistency to his extreme hesitance to kill and take Thea's father away. Oliver underestimating villains is nothing new. Nyssa was on fire this episode, and it was hilarious when Malcolm tried to justify not giving her the league and she proved him completely wrong. Nyssa ruled, Felicity did the right thing and I didn't feel they tried to juggle too many plots. Lance got some smiley cameos!
Episode begs the question who the "he" that Oliver is going to kill even more, I think. Darhk and Merlyn are a terrifying combination.
No, Oliver is hands down the best non-magical fighter in the show, probably the Arrowverse. He gets jobbed for story reasons like Anarky so Thea can take the lead, but he's taken down Merlyn, Slade, Ra's and the god damn Reverse Flash. Nyssa is certainly up there with Sara as the strongest non-magical females, I'm not including Lazarus revivals as magic.
Episode begs the question who the "he" that Oliver is going to kill even more, I think. Darhk and Merlyn are a terrifying combination.
No, Oliver is hands down the best non-magical fighter in the show, probably the Arrowverse. He gets jobbed for story reasons like Anarky so Thea can take the lead, but he's taken down Merlyn, Slade, Ra's and the god damn Reverse Flash. Nyssa is certainly up there with Sara as the strongest non-magical females, I'm not including Lazarus revivals as magic.
gundamkyoukai
Member
Yep if not for magic he most likely would have taken down Darhk by now .
Darhk is fairly broken i wonder if people notice how broken he really is lol .
BewareTheBatsie
Member
Oliver didn't so much as beat RF on his own as much as slow him down with that technology Ray made which will probably never be brought up or used again despite the usefulness of it, and even then RF still managed to get a few hits on him without his speed and would have killed him easily with full-speed had Barry not then interfered.
I get that Oliver is one of the best fighters, but Nyssa fought Malcolm Merlyn last season when sent to capture him and beat him in battle easily enough when she was sent to capture him. Merlyn's only training was from the League, the same as Nyssa's who had even longer trainer, it makes no sense as to how he would somehow be able to knock her down after fifteen seconds of battle.
gundamkyoukai
Member
When Nyssa beat Merlyn he was not using a sword or a weapon he was accustomed using .
Don't forget in season 3 oliver had to level up by learning how to fight with a sword \ League way.
Also of course Oliver can't beat RF if he has his speed unless he tech the hell out .
OdysseusVA
Banned
Sure, but they're wasting time on a garbage character instead of developing Mr. Terrific. Laurel is capable of being decent, but again, wasting time on a garbage character. And Diggle... he's just there. Hell, he should be in the grave.
Power creep. I have no idea how Barry can believably beat Zoom, at least if they negate Darhk's Magic it'll be an even playing field for Oliver. Although apparently Darhk is a Ra's tier fighter too.
Yeah the Nyssa/Merlyn power discrepancy is odd.
But Ollie still beat the Reverse Flash. Nobody is more broken than guest star Oliver, he can go full Batman.
BewareTheBatsie
Member
He used a police baton. I don't think there is any specific level of training needed to properly use it, especially when the one using it is trained in the art of swordsmanship and odds are Malcolm knows his way around a staff. He didn't lose the fight just because he wasn't experienced with the weapon, he lost because logically speaking Nyssa was the better opponent.
Oliver being better than her works because he's had so many different teachers over the years, but Malcolm seems to have been trained by the same people as Nyssa was.
gundamkyoukai
Member
Man without Diggle there be no bromance and we can't have that i hope.
Plus we had diggle center ep just 2 weeks ago .
Also i don't really care about Mr. Terrific when he not going to be around for long .
A police baton is not a staff so even if he did train with staff that would be no help .
For eg a staff has much more reach and can even bend .
It's rather simple Malcolm is a better sword fighter than Nyssa even if they train under the same people .
Just like how oliver has now become better than everyone but with even less training .
You can't beat plot armor talent lol
To be fair on the villain front, at this point in time (in RF's life) he was becoming more and more..humane and a part of team Flash, due to the fact that he took over Wells' DNA/memory/etc. Future visitations from him will likely be far more sinister. That's what, imo, puts him over Merlyn for me.
TheGreatDirector
Banned
How did Malcom create Deathstroke?
Merlyn orchestrated to have the boat blown up, which lead to Ollie meeting Slade.
He indirectly created him.
BewareTheBatsie
Member
Staffs can be detached, like with Sara's, who was also trained by the League, implying that there is some level of training there with the weapon.
Plus Oliver has received training from numerous people, each with their own style, as opposed to the League's more elegant/formal way of battle.
But yeah, you're right. Malcolm's plot armor is off the walls with how ridiculous it is.
gundamkyoukai
Member
Yeah Zoom need a big nerf or Barry needs a big buff with the help of friends lol
Has the same problem as batamn also can be tech the hell out but don't bother .
This always fucking annoy me but i have learn to live with it .
PHOENIXZERO
Member
As I said months ago, it's totally going to be Oliver's baby's mama, Samantha in the grave. There's no way they're going to kill a kid but in an attack protecting the kid? Certainly. It's funny watching Oliver body Malcolm when he's had so many issues fighting people who shouldn't be in his league because they can't write him consistently while allowing less capable characters to shine. But oh well, good riddance to the League of Losers. If that story line is over then thank god for that. If Malcolm survives the season I'm going to be shocked and probably not come back for season five.
I fully expect Cicso being key in defeating Zoom.
I fully expect Cicso being key in defeating Zoom.
the_firewithin
Member
Why were they on the lowest roof possible?
Why did they need to bring all the brazier?
How long did it take to get them up there?
Those other buildings have some dedicated workers since every light was still on
Why did they need to bring all the brazier?
How long did it take to get them up there?
Those other buildings have some dedicated workers since every light was still on
BewareTheBatsie
Member
I'm just sitting here wondering how the fuck Felicity as well as her wheelchair got up there.
Dongs Macabre
aka Daedalos42
Elevator arrow
BewareTheBatsie
Member
They are the best
Glamorous.
nextgeneration
Member
LMAO! That was awesome!
Loved the episode, just went straight to the jugular on all fronts.
- League of Assassins disbanded makes sense, they didn't have any bite in them left anyway. But I hope we still see the girl that was with Nyssa. She looked important.
- Nyssa and Malcolm did a number on Oliver when it comes to one-liners "You're very handsome, not especially bright" and the constant remarks about their marriage.
- The Canary Scream is fun, it works against the league. It is good that they are disbanded, although I don't quite believe Nyssa if she says she gave up all that power.
- This makes it seem like Malcolm is the true bad guy after all. He'll be the one they kill in the finale. No problem with that.
- Donna laying down the truth. The Calculator story was nice, self-contained, didn't feature much drama. Felicity handled it perfectly.
- League of Assassins disbanded makes sense, they didn't have any bite in them left anyway. But I hope we still see the girl that was with Nyssa. She looked important.
- Nyssa and Malcolm did a number on Oliver when it comes to one-liners "You're very handsome, not especially bright" and the constant remarks about their marriage.
- The Canary Scream is fun, it works against the league. It is good that they are disbanded, although I don't quite believe Nyssa if she says she gave up all that power.
- This makes it seem like Malcolm is the true bad guy after all. He'll be the one they kill in the finale. No problem with that.
- Donna laying down the truth. The Calculator story was nice, self-contained, didn't feature much drama. Felicity handled it perfectly.
SargerusBR
I love Pokken!
You know, call me crazy but excluding the dumb Olicity bullshit i think S3 was far better than this season so far. I don't think i enjoyed a single episode besides the Flash crossover and the Constantine episode.
kylecoley182
Banned
i called it when we first met his son that he was going to be the grave
evil solrac v3.0
Member
which Nyssa are you talking about because the one from Death and the Maidens was a damn good character.
Oh, that is cool. Clearly time to actually read them if they are going to matter.
The Silver
Member
Ollie beat Merlin like he was a random mook, too OP, pls nerf in next patch
Coffee Dog
Banned
oh my fucking god, so this is going to lead to oliver and felicity breaking up over oliver lying about his son. Fuck off, arrow writers. Christ. If you need them to break up, do it for believable reasons, not having the now trusting, nice guy oliver suddenly break character and lie to his fucking girlfriend and have that break of characterization be the lynchpin of it.
There are ways to end relationships that don't involve our hero protagonist being fucking dicks for nonsensical reasons. Barry did this dumb ass shit, and now is Oliver. Ugh. I would have preferred Felicity dying over this horrible shit.
There are ways to end relationships that don't involve our hero protagonist being fucking dicks for nonsensical reasons. Barry did this dumb ass shit, and now is Oliver. Ugh. I would have preferred Felicity dying over this horrible shit.
PHOENIXZERO
Member
Oliver's kid solely existing to create Olicity drama was pretty much confirmed the moment they said he isn't what would be his comic counterpart and cemented it with the cross over nonsensical bullshit.
Can't wait to see who holds their own against Oliver when they shouldn't within the next couple episodes.
Can't wait to see who holds their own against Oliver when they shouldn't within the next couple episodes.
Er, what?
What more believable reason for a relationship to break up then loss of trust is there? That's very realistic.
Also the protagonist isn't be a dick for no reason. He was told he couldn't have a relationship with his son if he told anyone. Hence he didn't tell anyone because having that relationship is important (and Guggenheim agrees).
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