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Buggy Loop
Member
I feel completely terrible after just hitting the refund button and putting it aside for either gamepass in 5 days or after a deal later in the year
I’ll somehow have to find something to play today in a huge backlog of games. I don’t know how to go forward.
Maybe I should be inspired by you and defend a game to the end with no bottom levels how far down I go to protect a company that I have no shares or affiliations with. Maybe I could have put the effort to be like you James
and that was a 85 meta obsidian game, cant even imagine how bad this one actually is, they basically went downhill since the day avellone left
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adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Rawbutt Jellybean
Member
So politically charged gaming journalists will overrate a game because it has purple but won't overrate a game with a lesbian relationship, roided up woman, and trans kid.
LectureMaster
Gold Member
I believe so, it's just getting very rare those days. The example will still be Dragon Age, Origin this time, and to some extent Inquisition as well. The writer is an openly advocating gay but I absolutely loved his writing! I think the baseline is that to create a likeable (even memorable) queer character, you need to write it as a normal person, not some gen z cringy show for "modern audience".
As for point number 2, once I again I say let's wait to see the steam score, Veilguard is sitting at 69%, which IMO it is probably indeed 7/10 game. While SH2 sits at a crazy 95%, so it is worth a solid 87/100 score. The vast majority are not changing rules based games they like or not. Let's see how Avowed fair.
James Sawyer Ford
Member
I feel completely terrible after just hitting the refund button and putting it aside for either gamepass in 5 days or after a deal later in the year
I’ll somehow have to find something to play today in a huge backlog of games. I don’t know how to go forward.
Maybe I should be inspired by you and defend a game to the end with no bottom levels how far down I go to protect a company that I have no shares or affiliations with. Maybe I could have put the effort to be like you James
Damn, reviews cut that deep it seems.
fart town usa
Member
Not saying the game sucks, but those reviews read like AA games that score 6 and below, games that people recommend you avoid.
For the most part, AAA are treated with kids gloves.
For the most part, AAA are treated with kids gloves.
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LectureMaster
Gold Member
LectureMaster
Gold Member
semiconscious
Member
it'd appear that the normalization of mediocrity is becoming yet another abominable feature of the 21st century...
James Sawyer Ford
Member
Just vote with your wallet and the truth will find a way out
Humdinger
Gold Member
Average Metacritic score is in the low 70s, about 72 (as of 2014, anyhow), so Avowed is scoring above average, relative to all games. However, "all games" includes a bunch of low-budget, half-baked indie throwaways that drag the average down. If you took those out and just looked at games with relatively high budget, long development cycle, relatively high profile, coming from a major studio and publisher - then I'm guessing the average would be higher. I say "guessing" because I don't have any data to back that up. But I think it's reasonable to suppose that if you took all the low-budget, throwaway stuff out of the mix, the average would rise.
All of that is to say that, whether the game is scoring "mid" or not depends on your comparison. If you're comparing to all games everywhere, then yes, the game is scoring about 8 points above average. If, though, you compare it to other games of this type (similar budget, profile, studio size, publisher funding), it's probably scoring just about average or "mid."
Now, whether Metacritic scores actually mean anything, that's a different conversation... I don't think they mean much. I always get more out of reading or watching reviews than looking at scores.
All of that is to say that, whether the game is scoring "mid" or not depends on your comparison. If you're comparing to all games everywhere, then yes, the game is scoring about 8 points above average. If, though, you compare it to other games of this type (similar budget, profile, studio size, publisher funding), it's probably scoring just about average or "mid."
Now, whether Metacritic scores actually mean anything, that's a different conversation... I don't think they mean much. I always get more out of reading or watching reviews than looking at scores.
Kacho
Gold Member
We'll get one as soon as CCUs can been seen. Looks like no one has donated a copy to SteamDB yet, so until someone does we have to wait for the early access period to be over.
Buggy Loop
Member
A few reviewers I trust told me impressions that are opposite of preview impressions from 3 months ago and I ain't spending $138 CAD on it to play early.
Still seems like a good game. Even MrMatty explains for 5 mins that its a good game, just not a GOATSIDIAN. Which is mainly what is disappointing. I'll probably play it later
Unlike you though who would rate a Hermen Hulst fart directly in the mouth a 10/10 best fucking experience, I want more again.
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its really not that complicated, its basically the worst rated obsidian game, and they already have some turds like outer worlds at their belt, you can go from there.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Bet time for @Kachos favorite gif.
If it winds up like NV, that's gonna be fuckin' incredible.
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rofif
Can’t Git Gud
This pos gets 8/10 and really good game forspoken gets destroyed for nothing.
This dei shit should’ve taken the hit. Especially that it’s just mid. Not good games that try some unique stuff
Edit: people who laugh at this post are xbots and fake gamers who wouldn’t know a good game if it was handed to them. I can’t believe some of you still believe the awful forspoken smear campaign and prefer this soulless Microsoft dei crap. That’s just dad
This dei shit should’ve taken the hit. Especially that it’s just mid. Not good games that try some unique stuff
Edit: people who laugh at this post are xbots and fake gamers who wouldn’t know a good game if it was handed to them. I can’t believe some of you still believe the awful forspoken smear campaign and prefer this soulless Microsoft dei crap. That’s just dad
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bender
What time is it?
If it winds up like NV, that's gonna be fuckin' incredible.
LectureMaster
Gold Member
I think they have the key already. It's probably taking time to get stuff together.We'll get one as soon as CCUs can been seen. Looks like no one has donated a copy to SteamDB yet, so until someone does we have to wait for the early access period to be over.
I am smashing that F5 now lmao.
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James Sawyer Ford
Member
Buggy Loop
Member
MrMatty
remember you asked me about slop?
Yea MrMatty? Or many others.
But still more interesting than Spider-man 2 will ever be to me. It doesn't have the open world slop of Horizon & Spider-man at least. Some peoples apparently LOVE that clearly but I would not even play it if given for free.
ChorizoPicozo
Member
is this gane going to top Indian Jones site CCU numbers? i don't see any hype at all
March Climber
Member
It was about a world where everything became too corporate, thus everyone you met across the galaxy was spouting different advertisements to products at you while telling you important information and sacrificing lives just to make sure that an in-game product sells to the masses.
It was cute and funny at first, but became aggravating after 10 hours of it, and the game was even longer than that. It's the example of a game that hits you over the head repeatedly about a specific message, which is how corporatism is bad and a shitty future if it happens. Due to that I've recommended High on Life over that game since they came out around the same time.
And this has been a problem plaguing everything, woke or not. Younger writers on average are just working off of vibes and surface level ideas. They don't have people in the writing room asking questions like 'who is this character beyond this one trait' or 'why does this device function this way'. You know, the script doctors and loremasters.
This has been my biggest issue with some certain recent Chinese games too, but they have been getting away with it because people are easily swayed by T&A. The First Descendant's plot is horrible gibberish mixed with Chat GPT. It is a fun game to play, but it's story is entirely skippable and it's story characters aren't memorable at all aside from their designs.
On average (key word as there are some outliers) this has been an issue with Chinese games that Japanese games don't seem to suffer from, because they tend to approach with characters-first or concepts/story first. Whereas Chinese games on average seem to function off of vibes, great animation, and good gameplay. Their games will give you a feeling of 'this almost reminds you of ______, but different' and then the plot, lore, writing, and especially character writing, are treated like an afterthought that is patched and made decently okay, far too late. It's why even if you remove any and all woke aspects from a plot, a shitty writer is still a shitty writer, and they shouldn't be given a pass simply because they pandered better than the other guy.
James Sawyer Ford
Member
You couldn’t pay me to play slop like avowed with its wooden NPCs, terrible dialogue/writing, and clunky combat.
But MrMatty really, really likes it!
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MacReady13
Member
Yeah but if 2 million people "play" it on the Microsoft rental service, then you really can't vote with your wallet. Sales don't seem to matter to Microsoft and the Xbots.
James Sawyer Ford
Member
It does matter, MS will give Obsidian a pass when Avowed and Outer Worlds 2 bombs, but they are going to be a Fallout factory next.
If they ruin Fallout, the studio will get shuttered
LectureMaster
Gold Member
My man, you are conflating all non-Japan games together as Chinese games. First Descendant is from Korean, and I think being a GaaS online looter shooter, we can probably go easy on her.
There is only one high budget Chinese game out there and that is Wukong, which has amazingly retold the Journey to the West story IMO.
Korean games can also have decent writing and stories, for instance Stellar Blade and Lies of P.
And I can almost assure you that Phtantom Blade Zero's story is gonna be great.
Buggy Loop
Member
The difference between me and you is that I tried Spider-man & Horizon Zero dawn
And want nothing from the sequels
You have 0, zero hours in Avowed and here you are with strong opinions. What a fucking clown you are. But Neogaf knows that already.
I switched my Avowed premium @ $138 CAD to either gamepass in 5 days or the standard version or even further down. But one thing is certain. I'll try Avowed 100%, while Spider-man 2 & Horizon forbidden west, even if you James, sent me a copy as a gift, it would not even be installed.
James Sawyer Ford
Member
And you’ve tried Avowed?
I know enough watching the reviews that it’s complete junk and will sell like it to boot
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Kacho
Gold Member
I doubt Obsidian survives if Outer Worlds 2 flops.
Buggy Loop
Member
And what else would we expect from our local clown
We ALL know your position James. 100% of Neogaf knows. You're so predictable that there's only one thing more predictable in life and that its the sun will rise tomorrow.
I'll try Avowed, still deciding on gamepass or standard version for next week
If I'm not satisfied I can leave a harsh review just like I did with Starfield.
Are you even able to critique a single game from your plastic box James? Is such a thing even possible?
I know enough watching the reviews (from people that actually play a lot of rpg and crpg, and didn't start playing BG with BG3 because it has acted scenes, since reading is oh so boring) and those guys think the rpg part is pretty solid and in line with what PoE accomplished.But, by all means tell us again how the game is shit because you read/saw some reviews.
Also it seems we got to a point (a pretty idiotic one) in gaming where in a rpg game is more important the facial animations, acting etc. rather than the character upgrade trees, classes, weapons.
I actually did upgrade the gamepass version and started to play, its fun here and there. Combat has been ok(Started as a warrior)and just arrived at a "big" city. The Npc:s is boring, and yes they just stand there mostly. It has this floaty feel and the scaling just feels weird when running around on for example some rooftops in the city. It does feel fastpaced, and one can find some fun in it for sure. But yeah, i cant see my self finish this one without beeliningt the mainstory quests, if even then. Maybe not ta brightest of me to try this one in the middle of KCD2, there are so many lvl between thoose two games when it comes to quality and greatness its not even fun.
Kacho
Gold Member
fart town usa
Member
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
March Climber
Member
Apologies then, you're right I mixed up The First Descendant's studio with another studio. However, my point still stands. Genshin impact (which IS from China) used to have the same issue when it first came out, and now games inspired from it are also suffering from the writing same issue. Most recently a game I played, Infinity Nikki, also has this same issue.
I want to make something clear though, I do not think that these are bad-playing video games.
I just think that on a writing-level, quite a few of them on average are very poorly written and get a ton of passes here simply because they check the right boxes and sometimes have a cool factor. And again due to that, I think people are getting things confused with what is meant by a good story. Phantom Blade Zero has great character designs and encounter designs so far from what we've seen, but those don't make a good story alone. Listen to what those characters are actually saying and what lore we are being given. Read what the motivations are for the hero character. So far it feels disconnected and not engaging.
If Capcom had made PBZ this would not be the case. Their character would have an iconic design that would be remembered years from now from the first or second trailer, you'd be introduced to their character, their motivations, the reason for the story being what it is, etc. That is my main issue and what isn't being discussed more. I just want people to use the same critical microscope for all games instead of just select ones they don't like.
CLW
Member
Wait my 40/5080 equivalent card is only going to give me 1660/4060 crap performance?
Angry_Megalodon
Member
Adding to the previous poster correction, I would mention Nikke and Infinity Nikki (Korean and Chinese respectively) as examples of excellent writing, both in worldbuilding and story presentation. There are others.
By the way, character design is also storytelling. Some characters catch attention by their mere presence, from physique to clothing or attitude. When you see Vergil in DMC3 in just one minute you think "whoa, that guy is cool", despite being the villain you like him immediately. Games like Genshin or Wuthering Waves may have bad dialogues, but the way they introduce characters are often on point. People don't pull for them only because they have boobs, come on.
Western faux writers not only can't write for their lives, they have also forgotten what cool means.
Said this, the main problem with video game writers is that most of them aren't writers. Writing is a craft that takes hundreds of hours to hone, it's not just sitting at your desk and shitting out the first thing that crosses your mind. Since these people lack ideas for good writing, they insert their beliefs and even their personas in the stories, resulting in a pile of trash.
The same applies to game design. The lack of innovation in gameplay or quest design is because they are bad creators who just build on the foundations laid by the true pros.
Mister Wolf
Member
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
LectureMaster
Gold Member
LMAO, I did not know my man is actually playing so many mobile gacha games! I expect better.
Joke aside, let me tell you some facts about Chinese gaming industry. Those online gacha games (Genshin, ZZZ, or Wuthering Waves, etc), the devs have very specialized writing teams, aimed to please their major audience in China, which is most pre-college students. So all those games' stories pretty much a template tailored for those teenagers.
As opposed to gacha games, Chinese single-player devs are really valuing their stories and often go above and beyond with expectations of their writers. I guess a major barrier is that many if not all of those games are using ancient Chinese background/lores, and the sheer difficulty of localization distances the western audience. You'll definitely see a different in PBZ compared to say Genshin, in terms of maturity of story.