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Better PS2 Trilogy: R&C or Jak?
- Thread starter ManaByte
- Start date
Do The Mario
Unconfirmed Member
C. Mario
Do The Mario
Unconfirmed Member
ManaByte said:
Yes he is, next mario for teh PS2!
JackFrost2012
Banned
The correct answer is Ratchet and Clank.
The incorrect answer is Jak.
The incorrect answer is Jak.
Rlan said:
It's worse. The entire game is worse (er... well, not entire game- but it's shorter and more linear. Controls and other things are tightened up- plus there's OL multi, and that really helps). The storytelling is pretty bad though. Angela doesn't even get mentioned in UYA and yet Insomniac tries to create a new love interest for Ratchet and it's really half-assed. Qwark is great though, and the enemies are my favorite of the trilogy.
DIrtyWeasel
Member
I couldn't stand Jak II. It's probably just me, but I found it to be a pathetic attempt to lure older audience.
I choose Ratchet & Clank.
I choose Ratchet & Clank.
bobbyconover
Member
R&C by an absolute landslide. It also tops the Crash, Spyro, and Sly Cooper series, in my opinion!
psycho_snake
I went to WAGs boutique and all I got was a sniff
Jak II ws the best platformer I had ever played since SM64. Ratchet and Clank is a very good game too, but at the end, jak II was better
Naked Snake
Member
I never played any game from either series... bad art.
I haven't played the last parts of both franchise yet, but with Jak2 and R&C2 I was under the impression, Naughty Dog tried too hard with their technology-pushing, while Insomniac tackled a better balance in the mix of tech and polish, even though the differences are marginal to me and did not kept me from enjoying both games.
J&D vs R&C:
Neither impressed me initially.
Bought J&D platinum, played to around 75%; most of the time it was good but not the best platforming fun I could have, punctuated with streaks of boredom when I had to search for some hidden power cell.
Played only the demo of R&C, found the two included levels to be amazingly gimmick and boring (fill water tank, empty water tank, fill water tank, do some other trivial stuff), never bought the full game.
Winner: Maximo!
Second choice: J&D, until I eventually play more of R&C and find out it improves a lot.
Jak II vs R&C2:
Loved Jak 2, offering high quality platforming and shooting and a couple interesting tools all seamlessy integrated, very good (and sometimes interactive) level design, complex missions, few but good bosses.
R&C2 was "only" good. Flat level design, little and unispired platforming, irrilevant melee combat, no complex missions. Maybe more but more simplistic bosses.
More gameplay styles but poorly integrated, like a collection of novel but poor minigames, aside the cool racing.
More gimick and boring sequences, which I loathed in the demo of the first game: fill water tank, freeze water tank, unfreeze water tank, empty water tank... x 10; playing it is about as fun as reading the description.
Where R&C2 outclassed Jak was on guns, powerups, addons variety.
I'm no fan of collecting toys and extras, so it didn't do too much for me. Played 8.5 hours on a rental and havent bought or finished it yet.
Jak II wins for me (but Maximo 2 is close up there!), still R&C2 is very good, thought not exactly my ideal game.
Jak III vs R&C3:
1.5 hours on R&C3, looks much better than the prequels.
Platforming seems more promising, more complex and fun battles. Dragged down considerably from the lack of challenge. Still, I might end really liking ths one.
Jak III: havent seen it yet.
Winner: undetermined.
Best series so far: MAXIMO!
Neither impressed me initially.
Bought J&D platinum, played to around 75%; most of the time it was good but not the best platforming fun I could have, punctuated with streaks of boredom when I had to search for some hidden power cell.
Played only the demo of R&C, found the two included levels to be amazingly gimmick and boring (fill water tank, empty water tank, fill water tank, do some other trivial stuff), never bought the full game.
Winner: Maximo!
Second choice: J&D, until I eventually play more of R&C and find out it improves a lot.
Jak II vs R&C2:
Loved Jak 2, offering high quality platforming and shooting and a couple interesting tools all seamlessy integrated, very good (and sometimes interactive) level design, complex missions, few but good bosses.
R&C2 was "only" good. Flat level design, little and unispired platforming, irrilevant melee combat, no complex missions. Maybe more but more simplistic bosses.
More gameplay styles but poorly integrated, like a collection of novel but poor minigames, aside the cool racing.
More gimick and boring sequences, which I loathed in the demo of the first game: fill water tank, freeze water tank, unfreeze water tank, empty water tank... x 10; playing it is about as fun as reading the description.
Where R&C2 outclassed Jak was on guns, powerups, addons variety.
I'm no fan of collecting toys and extras, so it didn't do too much for me. Played 8.5 hours on a rental and havent bought or finished it yet.
Jak II wins for me (but Maximo 2 is close up there!), still R&C2 is very good, thought not exactly my ideal game.
Jak III vs R&C3:
1.5 hours on R&C3, looks much better than the prequels.
Platforming seems more promising, more complex and fun battles. Dragged down considerably from the lack of challenge. Still, I might end really liking ths one.
Jak III: havent seen it yet.
Winner: undetermined.
Best series so far: MAXIMO!
Wellington
BAAAALLLINNN'
First, let me just say thanks for holding down the fort Anihawk, the check is in the mail.
This topic is pretty much what my damned house is like. I'm a huge R&C fan, my brother is a huge Jak fan. The guy bought Jak 3 last night and played it over Halo 2, while I just looked on in disgust. All joking aside heh, I will say that Naughty Dog has an incredible handle on the PS2 and it's capabilities. Jak 3 is far and away the best looking game on the PS2 (so far released).
I loved the first Jak. Probably more so than the first Ratchet game. I love the style of the game, loved the setting, loved the variety, loved the... collecting. Ratchet & Clank felt more like it was having an identity crisis the whole way through. The level designs were absolutely brilliant, but the enemies and action were mixed. The second games though... I hated Jak 2. It was such a bitter disappointment, and such a drastic departure from something that I thought worked so well. It'd be like Mario Kart suddenly playing like Ridge Racer. The sprawling city scape and the back and forth fetch quests killed it for me. No, I didn't think it was too hard, just too boring. R&C2 on the other hand developed the identity of the R&C series, mixed in a ton of additional gameplay, and had those open areas where the player could choose how much they wanted to play. Combine that with the new level system for Ratchet and his weapons and you can see why it was a winner.
R&C3 improves on it, but I don't want to get into detail just yet, not until I finish at least. Haven't played Jak 3, but it looks better than 2 from what I have seen.
This topic is pretty much what my damned house is like. I'm a huge R&C fan, my brother is a huge Jak fan. The guy bought Jak 3 last night and played it over Halo 2, while I just looked on in disgust. All joking aside heh, I will say that Naughty Dog has an incredible handle on the PS2 and it's capabilities. Jak 3 is far and away the best looking game on the PS2 (so far released).
I loved the first Jak. Probably more so than the first Ratchet game. I love the style of the game, loved the setting, loved the variety, loved the... collecting. Ratchet & Clank felt more like it was having an identity crisis the whole way through. The level designs were absolutely brilliant, but the enemies and action were mixed. The second games though... I hated Jak 2. It was such a bitter disappointment, and such a drastic departure from something that I thought worked so well. It'd be like Mario Kart suddenly playing like Ridge Racer. The sprawling city scape and the back and forth fetch quests killed it for me. No, I didn't think it was too hard, just too boring. R&C2 on the other hand developed the identity of the R&C series, mixed in a ton of additional gameplay, and had those open areas where the player could choose how much they wanted to play. Combine that with the new level system for Ratchet and his weapons and you can see why it was a winner.
R&C3 improves on it, but I don't want to get into detail just yet, not until I finish at least. Haven't played Jak 3, but it looks better than 2 from what I have seen.
SpoonyBard
Banned
Metal Arms does the "platform game with guns" thing much better than either of them. The first Jak & Daxter was pretty good though. Jak2 was better than R&C1 and 2, even with the crappy hub city.
I havnt played Jak 3 yet but if its just as good as Jak 2 then is say the Jak series is better, Even though R&C2 is like the best PS2 game ever, R&C 3 is too much of a dissapointment even though its still a pretty good game. Aside from the multiplayer, Insomniac really fuxxored the game up and it definatly feels "rushed". I love the plasma whip and Dr. Nefarious is an awesome villian, but they dropped the ball in too many other areas.
Naked Snake
Member
Ar_ said:
I believe this news.
Wholeheartedly disagree with the "rushed", "fuxxored the game up" and "dropped the ball" comments. I know what things your complaining about based on your comments in the UYA impressions thread, but they don't qualify for such strong disregard to be heaped upon the game.
kaching said:
If they would have just taken what they had in Going Commando and added the new weapons, multiplayer, and the capture and control type missions with rangers it would have been the advancement in the series I was looking for. Its not, and for that reason its a dissapointment. Its still a good game, there are some really likable parts, but in the end its missing many things.
They threw out the flying missions. Why? They wrent that bad and they added another layer to the game. Why? Instead of improving them they threw it out and with it a part of the game. There was potential there. Alot of it. They dropped the ball.
The clank missions are terrible. They are downgraded 100% from Going Commando. They go ahead and create Agent Clank, and then they dont even really use it like they could have. There are onlye like 2 Clank levels. Instead of improving them they got downgraded. They took out the cool robot control aspect instead of improving it. You can still get the little guys, but its only like 3 of them and its only twice. Why even bother? Nope, we get the stupid bananna gun and the monkey. The strong robot, bridge robot, or anything else they could have taken the time to think up are gone, and make the Clank levels that much more uninteresting.
We get 1 level where we play as giant clank. Stupid. There was alot of potential to turn them into something but they totally blew it over and just threw in 1 little boss fight as to not get rid of it completely.
Weapon mods are gone, they are integrated into the leveling up process. A lame way to take out the customability of them. They could have added alot to the weapon mod system, but they took it out.
Okay. So what do we have here? Instead of improving on multiple aspect of Going Commando they removed them completely for UYA. The game is shorter and its a bit easier. All evidence points to a rushed product. Or they threw together the quickest single player they could think of without it being a total shitstorm and only really gave a shit about the multiplayer(which is very well done).
They dropped the ball on the series. Where is the improvement? R&C2 was leaps and bounds above in R&C1. They arnt even in the same league. UYA could barely classify as a level and weapon expansion pack to Going Commando.
Ninja Scooter
Member
ManaByte said:
not really. R&C=kicks ass. Jak=suck
> They threw out the flying missions. Why?
But there are flying missions in the game...just with a different type of craft.
> The clank missions are terrible. They are downgraded 100% from Going Commando.
I don't really think the Clank missions in GC were really an upgrade. More involved, yes, but not really improving the formula. The monkey is no better or worse than the specialized robots they had in GC. Same idea, different special task.
> They go ahead and create Agent Clank, and then they dont even really use it like they could have. There are onlye like 2 Clank levels. Instead of improving them they got downgraded.
> We get 1 level where we play as giant clank. Stupid.
Agent Clank serves its purpose as a plot device and as a bit of humor. And Clank's use in general has been as a supporting character. I don't think Insomniac ever intended for his role to continue to grow to be as equal as that of Ratchet as a standalone character.
> They could have added alot to the weapon mod system, but they took it out.
I won't argue that this one is a bit of a loss.
> Instead of improving on multiple aspect of Going Commando they removed them completely for UYA.
And added others. It's not like they simply regressed from GC. They built on some of its stronger elements, added new elements and generally streamlined\trimmed in a number of areas.
> All evidence points to a rushed product. Or they threw together the quickest single player they could think of without it being a total shitstorm and only really gave a shit about the multiplayer(which is very well done).
I'm sorry but I just don't get this feel from the SP game. The UYA storyline and characterizations are the best they've done for the series so far and are better integrated into the entire game, offering more ambient storytelling than the earlier games which relied more heavily on simply establishing story in cutscenes. Level design is as good as either of the earlier games, just generally broken up into smaller chunks. Many of the levels feature more creative themes than either of the previous games and offer notable improvements in visual effects. The SP generally offers a variety of elements that simply aren't offered in the MP and haven't been offered in the series previously - weapons, powerups, minigames, etc. I can't see how doing any of that is conducive to rushing out a "quicky" SP mode, in favor of putting the majority of effort into the MP.
But there are flying missions in the game...just with a different type of craft.
> The clank missions are terrible. They are downgraded 100% from Going Commando.
I don't really think the Clank missions in GC were really an upgrade. More involved, yes, but not really improving the formula. The monkey is no better or worse than the specialized robots they had in GC. Same idea, different special task.
> They go ahead and create Agent Clank, and then they dont even really use it like they could have. There are onlye like 2 Clank levels. Instead of improving them they got downgraded.
> We get 1 level where we play as giant clank. Stupid.
Agent Clank serves its purpose as a plot device and as a bit of humor. And Clank's use in general has been as a supporting character. I don't think Insomniac ever intended for his role to continue to grow to be as equal as that of Ratchet as a standalone character.
> They could have added alot to the weapon mod system, but they took it out.
I won't argue that this one is a bit of a loss.
> Instead of improving on multiple aspect of Going Commando they removed them completely for UYA.
And added others. It's not like they simply regressed from GC. They built on some of its stronger elements, added new elements and generally streamlined\trimmed in a number of areas.
> All evidence points to a rushed product. Or they threw together the quickest single player they could think of without it being a total shitstorm and only really gave a shit about the multiplayer(which is very well done).
I'm sorry but I just don't get this feel from the SP game. The UYA storyline and characterizations are the best they've done for the series so far and are better integrated into the entire game, offering more ambient storytelling than the earlier games which relied more heavily on simply establishing story in cutscenes. Level design is as good as either of the earlier games, just generally broken up into smaller chunks. Many of the levels feature more creative themes than either of the previous games and offer notable improvements in visual effects. The SP generally offers a variety of elements that simply aren't offered in the MP and haven't been offered in the series previously - weapons, powerups, minigames, etc. I can't see how doing any of that is conducive to rushing out a "quicky" SP mode, in favor of putting the majority of effort into the MP.
BatiGOOOOOOL
Member
R&C by a landslide.
BigGreenMat
Member
Well I think that you have to respect Jak and Daxter a bit more because Ratchet and Clank is basically a game built around what Jak and Daxter builds. Naughty Dog develops all of the technology and then Insomniac simply puts Ratchet and Clank on top of it. A lot of the credit Ratchet and Clank might get falls on the foundations that Jak and Daxter and Naughty Dog put down.