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Black Lives Matter shuts down a Bernie Sanders rally

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The O'Malley protestors weren't screaming that the audience were white supremacists. And once they were finished, they handed back the microphone so he could actually respond.

Bernie couldn't handle them either. That's on him. That's a weakness. A fixable one, but in the general election, that's a killer.
 

samn

Member
Bernie couldn't handle them either. That's on him. That's a weakness. A fixable one, but in the general election, that's a killer.

I really don't know what you are saying here. I'm pointing out that the O'Malley hecklers let O'Malley speak, they physically handed back the microphones after making their (far more eloquent) point and then left the stage, whereas the ones in this instance did not let Sanders speak, and did not leave the stage once they had made their point, therefore it is unfair to use the former case to say that Sanders handled this worse.

There was no way Sanders was getting back to that microphone to 'respond with compassion' without those, frankly racist, activists being removed from the stage.
 
And yes, you still respond to those people with compassion. I mean, we see where the "Don't you know who I am? I'm not responding to this." approach has gotten Bernie.

But hey, he's free to keep doing it.

What alternate universe are you living in? Is it nice there?
Exactly.

It's like Bernie's supporters want to dismiss O'Malley because of his history, but that doesn't change the fact that BLM went in on him every bit as much as they Bernie at Netroots, but O'Malley got them off his back with a quickness and didn't have to kill his campaign to o it.

Why Bernie can't do this is apparently a mystery. It's like Bernie's own supporters view him as weak.

What does O'Malley's history have to do with anything? Are you still fighting with figments of your imagination? No one has been bringing up his history as a reason why Bernie can't respond.
 

FiggyCal

Banned
Exactly.

It's like Bernie's supporters want to dismiss O'Malley because of his history, but that doesn't change the fact that BLM went in on him every bit as much as they Bernie at Netroots, but O'Malley got them off his back with a quickness and didn't have to kill his campaign to o it.

Why Bernie can't do this is apparently a mystery. It's like Bernie's own supporters view him as weak.

Weren't you the one that said Bernie needed more security so this wouldn't happen again? Not every bit of protest is reasonable or makes sense.

Other people have pointed out to you that Bernie has responded to BLM. He's mentioned Sandra Bland multiple times and has come out with policy ideas like O'Malley did. Whether or not people choose to follow up on that is not really the problem here. But even then that misses the point. I think there's a line between asking politicians to pander to you and holding politicians accountable.
 

royalan

Member
What alternate universe are you living in? Is it nice there?


What does O'Malley's history have to do with anything? Are you still fighting with figments of your imagination? No one has been bringing up his history as a reason why Bernie can't respond.

Absolutely nothing, and that's the point. Why was it so easy for O'Malley to do what he had to do to get BLM off his back, but apparently impossible for Sanders?
 

samn

Member
Absolutely nothing, and that's the point. Why was it so easy for O'Malley to do what he had to do to get BLM off his back, but apparently impossible for Sanders?

Because the activists gave the microphone back to O'Malley.

Watch both videos.
 

-COOLIO-

The Everyman
Absolutely nothing, and that's the point. Why was it so easy for O'Malley to do what he had to do to get BLM off his back, but apparently impossible for Sanders?
O'mally being handed the mic back and sanders not being handed the mic back sounds like a crucial distinction if true.
 

royalan

Member
Weren't you the one that said Bernie needed more security so this wouldn't happen again? Not every bit of protest is reasonable or makes sense.

I said that Bernie either needs to get better at engaging the movement in the moment (because what he's doing now isn't making him look good at all), or beef up security so that this doesn't keep happening to him. Both of which are fine options.

Because the activists gave the microphone back to O'Malley.

Watch both videos.

You and I aren't on the same page. I'm talking about Netroots, where this all started.
 
I said that Bernie either needs to get better at engaging the movement in the moment, or beef up security so that this doesn't keep happening to him. Both of which are fine options.

You did watch the video, right? It was five or six minutes of them arguing with the event organizer who wasn't Sanders or Sanders campaign and speaking to the audience / a moment of silence, then by the time they wanted to "hold Bernie accountable" he had to leave and go to his actual event.
 
Absolutely nothing, and that's the point. Why was it so easy for O'Malley to do what he had to do to get BLM off his back, but apparently impossible for Sanders?
You say, "Bernie should have let them finish." and it's immediately (and repeatedly, tiresomely) pointed out to you he did just that. Then you say, "Bernie should have responded with compassion!" and it's, again (and again) noted that he never had the opportunity. He wasn't allowed an opportunity to reply.

"Well, if he can't get a mic back from some protesters he's clearly too weak to be President." seems to be the new line. And at this point I'm honestly sitting here like:

anigif_enhanced-29975-1391010143-2.gif
 

UrokeJoe

Member
From watching both videos posted and reading through this thread the whole thing seems like a no win situation. It certainly didn't benefit Bernie and I don't see how it benefitted BLM.
 

HK-47

Oh, bitch bitch bitch.
From watching both videos posted and reading through this thread the whole thing seems like a no win situation. It certainly didn't benefit Bernie and I don't see how it benefitted BLM.

Things benefitting no one or benefitting the rich seem to be the standard outcomes in American politics.
 

Mesousa

Banned
From watching both videos posted and reading through this thread the whole thing seems like a no win situation. It certainly didn't benefit Bernie and I don't see how it benefitted BLM.

We're talking about them this morning. That has to be a win for Black Lives Matter.
 

FiggyCal

Banned
I said that Bernie either needs to get better at engaging the movement in the moment, or beef up security so that this doesn't keep happening to him. Both of which are fine options.

But the problem is that getting more security to make him look good is not the issue. It's an unreasonable protest against a candidate who isn't really the biggest threat to black people. Legitimately, it's the republicans -- any of them. But practically, it's Hillary Clinton.A protest like this, that hurts the more progressive candidate only moves the democratic party to the right.

Someone else posted how Obama would have made some witty comments to win them over. But no; he would have just escorted them out like he usually does. And it makes sense to do that because protests aren't supposed to be convenient. What doesn't make sense, is protesting this particular candidate.
 

royalan

Member
You say, "Bernie should have let them finish." and it's immediately (and repeatedly, tiresomely) pointed out to you he did just that. Then you say, "Bernie should have responded with compassion!" and it's, again (and again) noted that he never had the opportunity. He wasn't allowed an opportunity to reply.

anigif_enhanced-29975-1391010143-2.gif

I'm sorry, but I'm not of the same mindset that Bernie HAD to leave in that moment. Bernie's not an idiot; he knows what incidents like this can do to his campaign. If Bernie had made the decision to take an extra 2 minutes to address them somehow I don't think event organizers would have snatched him off the stage for going over time, and I don't think his arena full of supporters would have left from him being a few minutes late.

I don't buy that Bernie was a slave to his circumstances here. He could have exercised more control than he did. He made the choice not to, which is his prerogative.
 

FiggyCal

Banned
We're talking about them this morning. That has to be a win for Black Lives Matter.

I imagine many white liberals don't care too much for being called white supremacists.

I'm sorry, but I'm not of the same mindset that Bernie HAD to leave in that moment. Bernie's not an idiot; he knows what incidents like this can do to his campaign. If Bernie had made the decision to take an extra 2 minutes to address them somehow I don't think event organizers would have snatched him off the stage for going over time, and I don't think his arena full of supporters would have left from him being a few minutes late.

I don't buy that Bernie was a slave to his circumstances here. He could have exercised more control than he did. He made the choice not to, which is his prerogative.

He apparently stayed for like 20 minutes or something. From what I read (albeit from a far right rag, Breitbart). He even apparently observed the 4 and a half minutes for Mike Brown and then spent the next 15 or so minutes talking to supporters. It's unclear to me if any of that info is accurate though. So if someone could clarify, that'd be nice. It definitely did sound like he could have adressed them if he really wanted, but at the same time, it's clear that they were not looking for a discussion.
 

ApharmdX

Banned
I don't "get" these protests. They are shitty and serve to alienate the people we need to reach. In order to truly change the culture with regards to police violence against blacks, we need to have as much of the mainstream (read: white people) on board as possible. This isn't doing it, at all.

Furthermore, as a progressive and not just as a black American, harming Sanders hurts our liberal cause. We need Bernie to do well to bring Hillary left. She is far too centrist in her past record.

Bernie needs black voters
Black voters don't need Bernie
Govern yourselves accordingly

Pretty much (for the primaries). However, for the general election, it's pretty much the opposite. Hillary will get the black vote by default. We aren't voting for Trump, Walker, or Bush, that's for sure. So African-Americans have become a surprisingly-weak Democratic voting block. We're definitely behind Latinos. If BLM is going to have any real influence, it'll need to be in the primary elections. The way they're going about this so far isn't going to accomplish that.
 

DrForester

Kills Photobucket
I'm sorry, but I'm not of the same mindset that Bernie HAD to leave in that moment. Bernie's not an idiot; he knows what incidents like this can do to his campaign. If Bernie had made the decision to take an extra 2 minutes to address them somehow I don't think event organizers would have snatched him off the stage for going over time, and I don't think his arena full of supporters would have left from him being a few minutes late.

I don't buy that Bernie was a slave to his circumstances here. He could have exercised more control than he did. He made the choice not to, which is his prerogative.

Leaving was the best choice. This protest was about being attention whores, not to being any meaningful attention to the issue, and there was zero interest in letting Bernie speak on the matter. They just wanted attention and to make the news.

Ideally, his people would have had security in place and stopped these idiots from ruining his rally. But he didn't. His best option was to leave.
 
And don't kid yourself: Bernie Sanders doesn't have to worry about being shot while driving/walking/being white. The random black voter who desperately needs someone in office who can address this shit does, though. Even if we don't "need" him specifically we do need someone damn near just like him.

No, the dependence on elected officials to protect them and solve their problems is a major part of why blacks still find themselves in an oppressed position today. Politicians only codify issues of social justice after the people have resolved the situation themselves. It's only through movements that black lives will actually matter to those in power. Once that is accomplished, then and only then will it necessary to elect politicians that will enshrine those gains into law.
 

lednerg

Member
If you want to see Bernie Sanders addressing leaders of the black community, then here's a video from July at the Southern Christian Leadership Conference: Bernie Sanders Speech to SCLC [YouTube]

Here's a short list of his Civil Rights acheivements. (Things he's done, not just lip service.)

Here's his voting record on a whole slew of issues, many of which pertain to minorities.

Bernie has a problem with optics, mostly among people who don't know who he is - and it's understandable if you don't know who he is. But the problem is with optics, not substance. You've got these random activists who hogged the mic and wouldn't let him speak. They created an impossible situation for him. Some are saying he should've done "something", but I feel there's nothing he could have done to satisfy them. They have their minds made up. And it's weird because he's already done plenty over the past 50 years, and has been outspoken on systemic racism and the steps we should take to address it. His platform is closest to what BLM's is on their website among all the candidates. He's even mentioned them in speeches. It's bizarre. Did RFK have Civil Rights activists storming the stage during his speeches? Because that's sort of what this is like.
 
If you want to see Bernie Sanders addressing leaders of the black community, then here's a video from July at the Southern Christian Leadership Conference: Bernie Sanders Speech to SCLC [YouTube]

Here's a short list of his Civil Rights acheivements. (Things he's done, not just lip service.)

Here's his voting record on a whole slew of issues, many of which pertain to minorities.

Bernie has a problem with optics, mostly among people who don't know who he is - and it's understandable if you don't know who he is. But the problem is with optics, not substance. You've got these random activists who hogged the mic and wouldn't let him speak. They created an impossible situation for him. Some are saying he should've done "something", but I feel there's nothing he could have done to satisfy them. They had their minds made up. And it's weird because he's already done plenty over the past 50 years, and has been outspoken on systemic racism and the steps we should take to address it. His platform is closest to what BLM's is on their website among all the candidates. He's even mentioned them in speeches. It's bizarre. Did RFK have Civil Rights activists storming the stage during his speeches? Because that's sort of what this is like.

They also tweeted out a page earlier today consolidating some of his views / ideas on racial injustice, in case anyone isn't familiar with his platform.
 
Hillary having better security is a cop out. Show up, challenge her, and get arrested in the process if you're bout it. It's more important that they challenge that corporate shill Hillary.

Hillary is barely having events, it's not really comparable. She's not really "campaigning" whereas Sanders, O'Malley, and the republican candidates are on the ground talking to folks.

I don't fault Sanders for leaving the stage, either at Netroots or in Seattle. No point in rewarding this type of emotional, childish behavior. That being said I do fault Sanders for allegedly cancelling meetings with BLM chapters. If that's true (I haven't seen a link posted here) then that's the bigger problem. Agitators who can't hold a conversation shouldn't be appeased, especially when they're staging something. But if you can't sit down with mature folks who act like adults then there's a problem.
 
This Will Keep Happening Until Bernie Sanders Learns

This Will Keep Happening Until Bernie Sanders Learns
Before the first time protesters with the banner of #BlackLivesMatter interrupted a Bernie Sanders speech, I had written repeatedly that things like this were likely to happen. When it happened in Phoenix at the Netroots Nation conference, I wrote here that Bernie needs to train his troops. But neither the candidate nor too many of his supporters have used any of this as a learning moment, and yet they act all surprised that it happened again today.

Listen up, white progressives and repeat after me: Nobody can win the Democratic nomination for president without significant black and latino support. It is a mathematical impossibility. I know the math. I've studied it. Close readers over the years know how well I know it. Your guy cannot - will not - win until he changes the way both he and his supporters react when a speech is interrupted.

A guy I follow on Twitter put it this way: Remember when Barack Obama had to prove himself to white people? Uh huh? In fact, he even had to prove himself to black voters, who until he won in Iowa supported Hillary Clinton in the polls, and half the Congressional Black Caucus still wouldn't support him. Later he had to prove himself to Hispanics, gay folks, and lots of other kinds of folks. That's the only winning coalition for any Democrat to win the White House. Every candidate has to prove him or herself with all of these demographics, or no White House.

This campaign is not about you getting your "Bernie fan boy experience" uninterrupted at a campaign rally. And you don't get to shout down protesters who want your candidate to lead more with their priorities. You don't get to yell, as one Sanders supporter did in Seattle today, "Tase them!" You don't get to say "Bernie marched with Martin Luther King" or "he has done more for your people than those hecklers ever did."

And you absolutely don't get to do it when just months ago you cheered the LGBT heckler at Obama's White House event, when you cheered every time the white ladies of Code Pink did it, when you whined and complained about Obama for six years not giving you your "hope and change" cookies as you define them.

You know why you don't get that cookie? Because nonwhite Americans saw your dreadful behavior toward Obama all these years. That's a big reason why. Now you need their support, you gotta court it just like Obama once courted you.

Instead too many of you are on Twitter right now whitesplaining and lecturing and talking down to black folks and people of all hues who happen to see this through the lens of the same team. Oh, yeah, that's a real bright idea for winning this campaign. Let's go on Twitter and troll the black people about how they don't understand Bernie.

Bernie handled it badly again today. He left the stage and went shaking hands among the white people in the crowd. He told a reporter that the protesters "don't want to listen to anything." Just like in Phoenix, he ran.

Contrast that with how Martin O'Malley handled the Black Lives Matter protest in Phoenix. He shut up, sat down, listened, listened a lot more, went throughout the conference all damn day seeking to listen to people of color who would talk with him. And since then he has put out the most progressive and detailed policy proposals on controlling police violence, prison and criminal justice reform and related matters. You don't see people protesting at his rallies. They probably will soon enough, but he'll know how to respond, unlike your guy.

And sure, Hillary Clinton doesn't have public rallies. She gives out tickets to her events. Nobody can get near her. But that doesn't mean Black Lives Matter has a double standard. That moment of reckoning with Clinton will come, too, during the course of this campaign. She, in particular, needs to answer for things she's done over the years just like Bernie has to answer for voting against immigration reform and for the 1994 crime bill. That's what candidates have to do in a democracy. It's a lot harder work than calling big rallies and giving long speeches to adoring fans.

Welcome to the NFL, candidates. Wear a cup.

But your guy has been tone deaf from the get-go with this, so the same story repeated itself a second time in Seattle today, and will keep repeating itself until Sanders either gets it right or withers out of the contest. All the white people in America cannot make the man president. You need others on the team to do that.

The reason your guy is having such a hard time is that many of you have alienated black, brown, yellow and red people all these years. Those of you who were in New York's Occupy Wall Street ran the black and hispanic organizers out of there, calling them sell outs for the Democratic party, insisting that you could have "no leaders" to people who build leadership among young people, and through your overall desire to just be in a white college educated ghetto while you tell yourselves you're "not racist." So now Bernie is getting the payback for white progressive disrespect of people of color, including of Barack Obama.

That's all that is going on here. Train each other and your candidate to do it better or he's going to be toast long before the first caucus or primary.

There's still a chance to get it right. Your guy is being offered an opportunity. But if he keeps making the same mistake over and over gain, stick a fork in him.
 

What the heck is TSU? Why isn't this linked to the actual article?

To respond that article, it's still wrong. What is the alternative? Blacks don't vote? We know the truth, they don't need the black vote. Blacks aren't stupid enough to vote for one of the right wing crazies over a democrat even if they are relatively apathetic to their cause. I think it doesn't help when people keep painting this as a one sided argument. Blacks would have to be crazy to cut off their nose to spite their face. They need EACH OTHER, this isn't a one way street. The politicians need them to care and they have to care too since they are both necessary to get this changed.
 
Bernie won't learn and Democrats become Republican lite because the Bernies get smoked out by those who ostensibly agree with him.

And nobody will have a sane choice left because it's a two party system.
 

This article is a logical disaster.


You know why you don't get that cookie? Because nonwhite Americans saw your dreadful behavior toward Obama all these years. That's a big reason why. Now you need their support, you gotta court it just like Obama once courted you.

Who is he referring to here? White liberals...at what point have they displayed "dreadful" behavior towards Obama as president?

And in terms of courtship, are we talking about the personal responsibility courtship of whites that these activists hate so much?
 

royalan

Member
Hillary is barely having events, it's not really comparable. She's not really "campaigning" whereas Sanders, O'Malley, and the republican candidates are on the ground talking to folks.

I don't fault Sanders for leaving the stage, either at Netroots or in Seattle. No point in rewarding this type of emotional, childish behavior. That being said I do fault Sanders for allegedly cancelling meetings with BLM chapters. If that's true (I haven't seen a link posted here) then that's the bigger problem. Agitators who can't hold a conversation shouldn't be appeased, especially when they're staging something. But if you can't sit down with mature folks who act like adults then there's a problem.

It's true.

If you listen to the TWiB! podcast, Elon James White, who was present at Netroots and was one of the black bloggers/activists/writers invited to have a sit-down with Bernie after his speech, details how he was told by Bernie's people that the meeting was still on only for him to show up, wait a few minutes, and then be told that Bernie wasn't actually coming.

I imagine something similar happened here.
 
Which would have been fine, if Bernie hadn't responded badly, which has been like a million times in this thread.

And that link has been posted at least twice in this thread. Also, it was made after what happened Seattle.

It was compiled after Seattle, but these are all things that he's campaigned on and talked about in many speeches at the SCLC and others.
 
Yep, and here's the address to the National Urban League.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vD9z3mM7o4

Still not good enough I guess.

To be honest, nothing will be good enough. Bernie is just the most accessible candidate. Think not of this as them going after him (but in reality they are) but after candidates in general. These protestors are not getting near the big guys so their way of challenging the election and holding politicians accountable is by holding Bernie accountable. This wouldn't even be a thing if he had good security personal at his events.

How can you say that? This was compile after the Seattle event.

Then we can assume he's fulfilled BLM requests? They'll back down off him? Are you content in saying he's doing well now and the protests should focus elsewhere until he slips up?
 
Of course, but good for Sanders on doing something to make his stances on the issues clear. It's obviously something he needed to do.

And he responded so why are you still so against him? You wanted him to respond and he has. You've been arguing nonstop that he hasn't done anything and has been dismissive and uncaring to the issues. So which is it?
 
Of course, but good for Sanders on doing something to make his stances on the issues clear. It's obviously something he needed to do.

Probably, since there seems to be a lot of doubt and miscommunication floating around. I wish more people would signal boost his solutions rather than complain about the protesters interrupting his speech - his new hire said it best:

"It's not just about, I fought for civil rights and I protested and I sat at the lunch counters," Symone Sanders said, parroting a line the senator regularly uses on the stump. "That is important and that is great, but that was 50 years ago. And he has a lot more to stand on than what he did 50 years ago."
 

royalan

Member
And he responded so why are you still so against him? You wanted him to respond and he has. You've been arguing nonstop that he hasn't done anything and has been dismissive and uncaring to the issues. So which is it?

Did you even read my post? I just said your boy Sanders did something good.

Did I attack him afterward?
 

linsivvi

Member
What? Seattle event was a day ago. The video I linked was on July 31st, to the National Urban league. He made promises, he made policy suggestions.

It wasn't after the Seattle event.

He even specifically said Black Lives Matter.

WTF?
 
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