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Bungie Creative Studios is joining PlayStation to build the foundation for a creative team that can support all PlayStation live service games
- Thread starter ArtHands
- Start date
BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
Destiny 2 is an old and busted shitshow. I liked it for a while and played it a lot. Going back to it is an indecipherable mess of currencies and storylines that go nowhere. If you like it, cool. Bungie used to be a top tier dev that released amazing campaigns and multiplayer, now they seem content to turn the crank on destiny 2 forever to a dwindling playerbase.
Yea, they are doing so well that they keep missing their projections.
James Sawyer Ford
Member
The latest release of Destiny 2 is well loved by critics/fans
A team can miss projections and still have a successful track record and still have very high sales
digdug2
Member
It truly is. To me, it mirrors Activision Blizzard's decision to make many of their studios only support COD.
Jibran#one
Member
From halo 3 probably the goat of multiplayer games to a support studio.
Wildride bungee has been on from Microsoft's lap to Activision's bitch and finally into a sonys support studio
Wildride bungee has been on from Microsoft's lap to Activision's bitch and finally into a sonys support studio
BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
Yes, massive layoffs and missed projections are signs of a healthy business.
Even if they were doing well (they’re not), I would still say they fell off from where they were. Just like Blizzard. Diablo Immortal was popular and Overwatch is chugging along, but they fell off dramatically from where they used to be.
James Sawyer Ford
Member
Massive layoffs are a universal thing across the industry for the most part.
Like a lot of studios, they overhired during Covid thinking the new demand in gaming was permanent
Bad assumptions, but it doesn’t mean they can’t be successful after right-sizing
BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
Sure Jan.
Sony’s Bungie Faces Reckoning After Mass Layoff
The creator of Halo and Destiny laid off more than 200 people this week including several top executives
www.bloomberg.com
clarky
Gold Member
I already said in the thread about Destiny, its best days are behind it but there is no denying it was a top top game for 10 years. If the final shape would have led into D3 then they wouldnt find themselves in this situation.
If they Wrapped up D2 right now then they would be just like any other studio, working on the next game.
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James Sawyer Ford
Member
Sure Jan.
Sony’s Bungie Faces Reckoning After Mass Layoff
The creator of Halo and Destiny laid off more than 200 people this week including several top executives
Sure Jan…?
What are you disagreeing about? Activision also laid off a ton of people.
Bungie hired hundreds during Covid, which was a mistake because lockdown demand wasn’t sustainable
Are you suggesting Bungie can’t be successful with a reduced headcount?
clarky
Gold Member
Thats not what this is, are you unable to read?
BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
What I’m saying is they are objectively not doing well. And even if Destiny 2 was still hugely popular, they are still not what they used to be in terms of their output. Their best days are behind them. Could they turn it around? I guess. So could Blizzard and Bioware. I wouldn’t bet on it. Would you even be defending them if Sony hadn’t bought them? No, ya wouldn’t.
clarky
Gold Member
Doing a lot better then most studios that have not released anything for the last 4-5 years for sure.
Mibu no ookami
Banned
How though? It's not at all like that.
I don't think their issue was covid demand but rather delays in getting product out. The bigger your studio is the more expensive delays are. They delayed Final Shape and Marathon back to back. This was made worse by Lightfall underperforming.
Isn't that what they are though? They have a game coming out next year.
James Sawyer Ford
Member
They’re not doing well relative to expectations of 2020 Covid demand
Their best days were just a few years ago during the pandemic. Expectations are set accordingly
I am “defending them” as a solvent business after right sizing, I’m not “defending them” as a studio without problems or issues. Is CoD dead because Activision had massive layoffs?
What had changed in terms of their output? Their latest release is widely beloved and fans say it is peak destiny
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clarky
Gold Member
That was my point. Sure Destiny 2's best days look it be behind it but they are working on Marathon there next game, just like any other studio.
I don't see the problem.
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digdug2
Member
It may not be like that at all, but it's still weird seeing in a supporting role.
Mibu no ookami
Banned
It's weird seeing people who work in marketing continue to work in marketing?
Loomy
Banned
Let's not pretend that Bungie is all of a sudden an incompetent studio. Leadership screwed them over, but it's still a talented group.
Final Shape DLC was very good. Destiny 2 is still one of the most played AAA Live Service out there. They know this market. It would be dumb of Sony to not leverage that knowledge and experience if they're still planning on going down this road.
Final Shape DLC was very good. Destiny 2 is still one of the most played AAA Live Service out there. They know this market. It would be dumb of Sony to not leverage that knowledge and experience if they're still planning on going down this road.
clarky
Gold Member
Agreed, but D2 looks to be in big trouble just now with a 5k CCU on Steam at this moment in time. They should have led into D3 with TFS, a big missed opportunity imo.
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ChorizoPicozo
Member
can't wait for Concord 2.0
chokotoureiki
Member
I think SIE pursuing GaaS is an incredibly smart move. There's capital loss which many ppl are way too heavily focused on (Concord) and then there's opportunity cost, where you also lose money if you don't pursue certain paths that are obviously reaping huge rewards. GTA5 alone made over $8 billion from GaaS. Destiny 2 on Steam alone is one of its biggest platinum earners (not accounting for consoles). Genshin Impact makes billions per year. Of course Sonys gonna want some of that moola.
Mibu no ookami
Banned
Context is always key.
First is the middle of the day/early for key western audiences. Destiny isn't nearly as big in asia. The 24 hour peak is 43K players, substantially more.
More importantly though the latest season started October 8th and the numbers always wane in the weeks after the start of a new season. It's also quite a long time since Final Shape launched.
Mibu no ookami
Banned
Many people think of their own interest rather than Sony's obvious business interest.
There are those that are mad Sony is focusing any attention on PC ports and GaaS, even if the vast majority of that has come from new studios rather than focusing solely on single player games.
There are others on PC and Xbox who simply hate Sony and see Concord as a chance to dunk on them.
clarky
Gold Member
Oh for sure. Im a lapsed player myself. Ive just never seen it that low especially on reset.
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digdug2
Member
It's also important to note that Destiny 2 launched over 7 years ago. It has been supported incredibly well by Bungie and 43K concurrent daily players is no slouch. Is this number just for Steam? Or does it include PS/XB players too?
clarky
Gold Member
Just steam. Its never seen numbers this low though. l dont think, ive not been following it religiously for a while now.
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Games of Today
Member
She's the one who probably told ND to cancel Factions.
finalflame
Banned
Makes sense, they've proven they cannot be trusted when left to their own devices.
HerjansEagleFeeder
Member
Finally, more resources put into GaaS. I was worried Sony doesn't spend enough on that venture.
Angry_Megalodon
Member
Sony doesn't have the capacity to make GaaS anywhere close to GTA or Genshin Impact. Not even second-tier ones.
Rockstar headcount is +2000 and Mihoyo +5000, besides many years of polishing their craft.
It took three generations for Sony to excel in single-player games, they built a dominant brand around that. Now they are deviating from that in the blind conviction that they can cut corners where others took many years. It's the kind of short-sighted strategy that sank XBOX.
clarky
Gold Member
Sorry this is nonsense. They built a brand around good hardware and polished mostly excellent games. Single player, multiplayer and a lot of the time both together.
They have been excellent at what they do since PS1
Where exactly are they cutting corners?
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Angry_Megalodon
Member
Sony's flagship titles have a recognizable trademark. This was established by the end of the PS3 era and reinforced last gen. That's their competitive advantage, the same as Nintendo is the strongest in family games. Brand perception matters.
Sony noticed GaaS big money and believed they would achieve it overnight. Not long ago their strategy was to make 12 GaaS so a few would pan out and make up for the others' losses. At least they canceled some, realizing that's a dumb strategy.
chokotoureiki
Member
Neither does any other company including Nintendo. Oh wait....they're way too busy twiddling their thumbs as other lucrative opportunities soar over their heads and before they know it....they're huffing and puffing trying to catch the next plane bc they're way behind the times, just like they did with HD and online, which btw sucks ass.
They don't need to. They just need to build another set of evergreen revenue streams from any potentially successful GaaS games to continue funding their AAA blockbusters and/or new IPs. Evergreen as in reccuring. Lots of companies are making crazy bank on GaaS. F2P accounted for over 78% of gaming revenue in 2020. New PS5 owners spend on average 25% more time playing F2P compared to 4% on PS4. That's huge.
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clarky
Gold Member
They currently have Gran Turismo 7, Helldivers 2, MLB The Show and Destiny 2 all successes in one form or another and one bust in Concord.
Marathon & Fair games are in the not too distant future. If Marathon is as big as Destiny was then they will have a monster on their hands.
Strategy seems to be doing ok to me. If these games keep the tills ringing with other studios make the single player/ narrative games that we all like the then whats the issue ?
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chokotoureiki
Member
No cuz they want Sony to follow the Nintendo way....that is churning out rehash after rehash or whoring out IPs. Why be Tesla when you can be General Motors.
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clarky
Gold Member
Don't agree with the Nintendo part but I catch your drift.
Most on this board seem to just see red when they see GAAS. If the underlying game is great then who gives a shit. I don't see any one moaning about Helldivers 2 for example.
Looking forward to the Crow served when Bungie smash it out of the park with Marathon.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Shouldn't have had all those non-binary (see: retarded) knitting clubs on work time like it's extended college
James Sawyer Ford
Member
Sony’s GaaS strategy is fine, people don’t seem to understand there will be massive successes or failures and now it settles down a bit you’ll have Bungie/SIE curating a proven portfolio of GaaS titles that diversifies the lineup and provides more regular cash flow
Sony could have told insomniac and ND to make the games instead and that would take away from SP experiences, but they didn’t.
chokotoureiki
Member
People often underestimate that Bungie has had a history of turning uncertain ideas into
. Who would've thought that a console FPS would be a smashing success, an arena that is dominated by the PC space? Or a shooter RPG like Destiny would be a knockout seller that's lasted longer than most WoW clones? That said, I'm quite optimistic that Bungie will make their magic.
chokotoureiki
Member
Yeah basically, the key here is positive recurring cash flow, something that a GaaS title, when done right, can yield a massive payoff. Sony is incredibly wise for taking this hot as fire opportunity, esp in the wake of rising budget costs and changing markets.
clarky
Gold Member
Did i miss the part where they are becoming a support studio?+3bill down the drain for this, a support studio, excellent management right there
I'm not into live service, but there is a market for it especially with the success of helldiver 2. If they want live service or MP games, they should have made it with existing franchise titles like Resistance, Killzone, Socom, and Twisted metal, not that twisted agenda infested concord.
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Physiognomonics
Member
More games directed by commitees. This is akin to communism and usualy doesnt lead to good results. Their only successes so far were games done by passionate teams with their own vision!
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