disappeared
Banned
I'm glad she's getting the help she needs. Prisons, after all, exist to incarcerate but also facilitate the rehabilitation of prisoners, so I think something like this is a positive.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
California Funds First Prisoner Sex-Reassignment Surgery and Move to Women's Prison
- Thread starter Horse Armour
- Start date
- Status
Why are people so concerned with a single medical procedure being performed? For a forum that likes to be perceived as very progressive, the sheer amount of negative responses any topic regarding convicts coming from people is surprising. If prisons are supposed to rehabilitate criminals, how does denying them treatment achieve that? The same bloodthirsty right-wing rhetoric used to describe immigrants and refugees now being thrown around here at people essentially at the mercy of the state, especially one as liberal as California.
Societies should be evaluated by the way they treat the least among them, and that includes convicts. If this is the way we, of all places, behave towards them, then we clearly still have a long way to go.
Societies should be evaluated by the way they treat the least among them, and that includes convicts. If this is the way we, of all places, behave towards them, then we clearly still have a long way to go.
It doesn't matter if one considers a right in this case because either way, the state agrees to take on the responsibility for the wellbeing of a prisoner once they get incarcerated. In fact, one could easily make the argument that not providing this surgery would be a violation of her existing rights under the 8th Amendment.
Coffee Dog
Banned
The prisoner received healthcare to prevent them from being depressed. When depression is managed, it helps them be more cooperative and staylor alive.
That is the tax payer's job. To care for the prisoners.
Is prison in America not about re-socialisation?
Get the person back to make him/her a good member of the society again?
because I think this operation would also help in that process.
It sounds like a lot of people here want to take every human right away from that prisoner..
Get the person back to make him/her a good member of the society again?
honest question I know nothing except from shows like orange is the new black >.> I'm from Germany
It sounds like a lot of people here want to take every human right away from that prisoner..
excelsiorlef
Member
Lol you're all for LGB (T seems to be optional here) rights until you have to factor in literal pennies per person...
chillybright
Banned
Or is SRS universally covered by healthcare in Cali. One poster mentioned that Medicali does cover it.
Theoretically prison is about rehabilitation but in reality our prison system does not do that, at all.
I think people still don't care whether Medicali covers it or not. If we go to another state where medicaid doesn't cover it, is it then ok for the penal system to not perform this surgery?
Reptars Revenge
Member
Cant afford a sex change? Commit fraud, get caught, get thrown in prison and its freeeeee.
You know, I haven't heard the term sex change since rat race
I'm sure there is alot of things prisoners would like us to pay for to help them not be depressed.
Or just get on the state medicaid program and apply legally without committing any crimes at all.
Ninja Scooter
Member
On what planet does this statement make any lick of sense to you? Did you even read it before you hit "submit reply"?
How About No
Member
You know I never realize how outdated and derogatory "sex change" sounded until now
Wulfric
Member
Forgot the T huh? The taxpayer's job is literally to help support roads, schools, and *gasp* prisons. Get real guy.
Coffee Dog
Banned
In theory, yes. In practice, America has made it extremely difficult for reintegration to occur smoothly.
I understand it's difficult for you to not be super aggro when someone is advocating something harmful towards trans people, but don't tell him what he does or doesn't stand for. Maybe this is a nuance he hasn't thought of before, and is simply fumbling through ignorance.
Reptars Revenge
Member
My apologies...Sex Reassignment
Ninja Scooter
Member
Oh man you are really on to something here...oh wait
http://abcnews.go.com/Health/Wellness/nc-man-allegedly-robs-bank-health-care-jail/story?id=13887040
The response to this should not be "Fuck that we should stop offering medical treatment to prisoners!" It should be an indictment on how fucked up the state of medical care is in this country, not an indictment on the prison system...at least it would be to anybody with an ounce of reason.
Coffee Dog
Banned
We pay for those too.
Prisons don't like it when inmates kill themselves. They work to prevent it. This is part of that.
Why the fuck would I need to know you to call you transphobic? You called the prisoner "he" several times and now you're talking about "sexual preferences". Your words already tell me that you are indeed transphobic.
If you're going to refuse healthcare to prisoners, yeah, you might as well execute them on the spot.
Well, the blood thirsty part seems to be accurate.
CitizenCope
Member
So my theoretical neighbor who hasn't even gotten a speeding ticket can't get the surgery he/she needs but this person can? When we all get universal healthcare I'll change my stance. Just doesn't sit well with me, I hope you can understand.
Overall? Not really. A significant number of prisons in the U.S. are run by corporations who aim to maximize occupants and reoffending rates for their executives' profits. These companies, in turn, are in bed with conservative politicians, who use racially-targeted legislation, as well as other policies that target drug users and other "undesireables", to effectively institute modern-day slavery.
So you would prefer that instead of some people getting health care, no one gets it. Gotcha.
Principate
Saint Titanfall
TBF it's not that someone managed to figure this out it's that such actions are actively incentivised. Which as your correct statements is an indictment of the medical care of your country
Unfortunately it will take a long time until American society will get there. America is built on individualism, a "fuck you, got mine" attitude, and a belief in pulling yourself up by your bootstraps. All of this is so engrained that it will take a long time before anything changes.
entremet
Member
I think a better approach would be to understand how they reached their positions then giving out backhanded compliments.
These threads are always a struggle cause no one is listening.
Reptars Revenge
Member
you do know that fraud can be a felony with a sentence of more than a year in jail? do you also know that north carolina is north carolina?
Coffee Dog
Banned
This prisoner isn't the one that stops your theoretical neighbor. Don't make the prisoner suffer just for trying to be happy when the healthcare system is perpetrating this.
Ninja Scooter
Member
There are normal, every day citizens who can't afford cancer treatments, diabetes treatments, who can't afford mental health care, and that is fucked up, but does that mean we should not offer it to prisoners? You have such a backwards view on this.
What the fuck are you talking about?
Reptars Revenge
Member
What was the point of the article you sent? hah dude calm down
D
Deleted member 10571
Unconfirmed Member
No, I can't. Your strawman neighbor doesn't get his imaginary surgery, because apparently your healthcare program is shitty. That's why a person in prison, who can't even have an actual life to speak of, should be declined basic human rights and help.
No, I'm sorry, I still can't understand.
Wulfric
Member
Sorry man, this issue is close to my heart, and it's frustrating to watch people blame the prisoner for "wasting" money on treatment and not the ludicrous healthcare system for the fact that surgery is out of reach for many on the outside.
I'm gonna step away for a bit. Peace.
excelsiorlef
Member
We've had people refer to the surgery as non essential, optional, cosmetic...
There is no koombaya moment here.
Ninja Scooter
Member
the point was that people have been doing what you described already. For someone to be that desperate is simply sad, and the furor over it should be directed at the right people: The ones that have turned healthcare into a for-profit business in America, not at the people that are suffering because of it.
metalslimer
Member
Yep and then hide behind fucking tax dollars as if that really matters.
Not mutually exclusive issues. We should be fighting for everyone to get healthcare. The problem isn't that someone in prison can get healthcare, it's more that people in general often can't get or afford healthcare they need. It sure isn't fair but that doesn't mean we should deny healthcare to someone that is deemed less deserving for whatever reason. It highlights the larger problems of our healthcare system.
entremet
Member
I don't think that's the issue.
I think the real issue is how people view the incarcerated, especially violent offenders.
Even in death penalty threads people are fine with locking people for life on solitary, a fate worse than death.
We have a bigger issue on how the incarcerated are viewed, which colors this issue.
I doubt any of these posters are against the surgery itself. They just don't believe the incarcerated deserve it.
I violently disagree. But if we're gonna solve this the first thing is to address that problem.
Monocle
Member
No, actually you don't lose fundamental human rights when you commit a serious crime. Your freedom is curtailed but you don't magically become some fucking animal that can be abused at the state's pleasure.
Sorry but that post came after a couple pages of people either ignoring posts trying to educate or outright arguing them from ignorance. It's the same as a lot of trump supporters, or anti-blm people, they either know and don't care or actively don't want to know.
I tried posting multiple educating posts, I don't have time to talk in circles to those who remain ignorant on purpose.
That's the one flaw in the "find out why" argument, which isn't really about wanting to be educated and more "don't call me nasty names, my delicate sensibilities can't handle human rights for others".
I for one am done, they wanted a culture war it's time they got what they asked for, I plan to fight not understand.
How About No
Member
"Well not with MY taxes! I hope the system fights them tooth and nail in court for YEARS!"
Reptars Revenge
Member
See, I agree with you. I do feel bad for these people. I think its not the worst idea to go to prison for a year on a small felony and get some healthcare for free.
If you're going to go after him for word choice you should probably switch your "transphobic" to ignorant or better still, uneducated. Accusing people of ill intent rather than educating them on a new, evolving and highly misunderstood legal, medical and psychological frontier and societal shift seems counterproductive. That person is now defensive rather than curious or receptive.
More flies with honey.
OnionPowder
Member
no opinion on the surgery or whatever, but for the bolded. She's in prison for life without a chance for parole. There was never an intention for rehabilitation.
excelsiorlef
Member
Ninja Scooter
Member
I think it's an incredibly stupid and short sighted idea, but I also have sympathy for people that feel that is there only option, but it doesn't make me mad or worse, somehow envious of them.
disappeared
Banned
100%
I don't get the victim-blaming that's going on.
I was moreso talking about facilitating the care she needs so that she doesn't suffer from more depression like so many of the transgender community does.
Like shining a light into a nest of cockroaches and watching them skitter out.
CitizenCope
Member
Agreed but I'm seeing this as they are deemed MORE deserving.
entremet
Member
I saw. But do you think the poster would say the same thing for a law abiding civilian?
People hate criminals unfortunately. It's a societal brainwashing that is deep.
To them, bread and water for food would be ok.
IsntChrisL
Member
Well I can't say I'm glad the murderer gets what she wants on my dime. It's ass-backwards that this is a right for prisoners but not citizens.
- Status