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Can SEGA make a comeback?

thorns

Banned
I have a feeling they will make a comeback (they have nowhere to go but up, honestly) and it will come mostly from their western arm. Sega of america and sega of europe have been purchasing studios and signing publishing deals. I have a feeling we will hear a lot from them come E3.

They're publishing stuff from Monolith and Silicon Knights for next-gen and have also recently purchased The Creative Assembly. I'm sure they have a few more publishing deals that haven't been revealed yet..
 
Maybe. But if they ever want to become a top publisher again, they'll have to release something other than quirky Japanese games. You can't live off of Sonic games alone.
 
Solid said:
As a publisher, yes. As a developer, no.
I disagree, just one look at PSU tells me that Sega can revive themselves whenever they can be arsed doing so, as PSU appears to be a return of quality Sega gaming.
 
Not without putting out quality games. More games with the quality found in gems like Orta, JSR, PSO and less shit like Gungrave, Headhunter and Billy Hatcher
 
I think they'll do better as a publishing force because they've hired marketing type people to head their major divisions. Their also really committed to getting involved in more popular licensing deals (ie. media franchises). Do I think they'll become better as a developer? No. Many of the famous game designers (those that are left) are working in better paying divisions (mobile games, sports). Even when Sega explores past glories, it's done with slipshod effort for the most part.
 
It's possible but they've gotta start changing alot of things. Like the current Sonic engine. Why is that still the DC engine when its their most popular series but PSU is suddenly getting a completely new engine? They don't need to make a new one for every Sonic game, but considering how flawed that engine still is it needs to go.

Another thing is the NiGHTS issue. Yah it wasn't the most popular game when it was released, but its now one of Segas most in demand games. To keep ignoring that while making stuff like Billy Hatcher makes no sense. They don't even have to make a new one right now, test the games popularity out by remaking the original. Same for Burning Rangers or PDS, remake them first to test the waters. When next gen hits and all 3 systems are on the market start releasing each of those games in remake form for all 3 systems at the sametime.
 
Sega is the one devloper/publisher that i believe has a chance at a true comeback. The reason they are down and out right now is because of stupid business decisions (i.e not giving major support to the market leader). Sega has all the right Ips but they just need to have the business sense to put the games on the right system. If Sega would revert to the sega of old when they made new and really good games i think they can bounce back.

Stop wasting money on games that go nowhere(Shemune, Sonic) and give the fans what they have been waiting for (Nights, Streets of rage). Sega also has to demand perfection from their devs teams once again.

I hope Sega bounces back, they are one of my favorite developers.
 
They can't ignore Sonic. Old school Sonic fans might roll their eyes at the current games, but it doesn't change that they're consistantly Sega's most succesful games. The main thing they need is a new engine and it should've got that before Heroes was even released and definetly before Shadow.
 
Sega has some great talent, but I think they need to respect their fanbase a little more. It's not good enough to just think "Americans like shooting so let's give Shadow a gun... Hey presto, a game that America will love!" They need to be more in touch with the people that used to buy their games. Get the old fanbase back, and more people will follow later.
 
I think they can come back as a developer, and see things like Outrun 2 and PSU as indications thereof. Sega surviving only as a publisher for other companies is to me an utterly meaningless idea.

I think, though, that the only thing that could really reinvigorate the teams all the way to former levels of glory would be a new console, or at least collaboration on one.
 
The recent reorganization makes some sense though I'm wary of Naka being in charge of the entire consumer division... at least Nagoshi and Suzuki have their own entirely seperate teams still. As a developer, I think we'll see Sega making the real comback in arcades. They already have actually.
 
I doubt it.

Sega is dead to me. I'll play my Dreamcast and try to forget all of the horrible mistakes they've made and the trash they've released since going 3rd party.
 
Dreamcast was actually the start of their fall, at least for Sega's great legacy teams (AM2 & Sonic Team). AV, UGA and Smilebit rose into the limelight but AM2 got totally blown off course by Shenmue and Sonic Team really hasn't been the same since their DC mediocrity.
 
SEGA is going to kick ass and take names in the next few years. This E3 will bring them lots of attention and will only be the beginning.
 
ChronoMagnus said:
Stop wasting money on games that go nowhere(Shemune, Sonic) and give the fans what they have been waiting for (Nights, Streets of rage).

why bother? if they make another Streets of Rage they're most likely going to 3D it, which isn't exactly what the fans want
 
Sega could easily make a comeback as a development house, if they learn how to stop mismanaging their IP. They've driven obviously strong brand recognition into the ground while focusing on obscure titles that no one gives a shit about.

Looking at sales of games like Headhunter , Amazing Island, Samurai Jack, Worms should be an indicator that no one gives a shit about these properties. Abusing established IP in the form of games like Virtua Quest, Project: Altered Beast and Sega Classics Collection should be a warning sign that people don't like their games fucked with on this level. Where's the crossover market here? Virtua Fighter skews mature, so why make a kids game with that IP? Altered Beast was a great Greek fantasy arcade game, so why is it edgy, bloody and dark now? Dozens of arcade, Genesis, Master System and Saturn games and you birthed the deformed Sega Classics Collection. Brilliant! The folks who give a rats ass about classic Sega games want them preserved in a playable fashion, not remade into 3D garbage.

Now, before I sound like some disillusioned fanboy who thinks that a Nights or PDS sequel is the answer (and they could help), the real need comes in the form of a brand steward, proper whoring of franchises and smarter publishing.

Respect the franchises. If you're going to make a Golden Axe game, make it look like fucking Golden Axe. You did an awesome job keeping OutRun 2 together because it didn't veer away from the OutRun design practice. Look at that rich back catalogue and pick out the good stuff.

Keep those Sonic games coming. Spin them off into smart territories and don't just shit out more Sonic Shuffles. Look at Nintendo's Mario whoring and follow their lead. It might piss off the fanboys, but they sell.

Publish the good stuff on the right console (everyone's tired of hearing this). I loved Otogi and JSRF, but what's the target market? It doesn't exist.

Maybe that Mushi King and Fist of the North Star pachislot nonsense will take off in the states and I'll be horribly wrong about everything.
 
SolidSnakex said:
It's possible but they've gotta start changing alot of things. Like the current Sonic engine. Why is that still the DC engine when its their most popular series but PSU is suddenly getting a completely new engine? They don't need to make a new one for every Sonic game, but considering how flawed that engine still is it needs to go.
They already switched to a new engine with Sonic Heroes... Renderware.
 
Anyway... I've tried to narrow down the 2005 Sega developed releases known so far...

Global Entertainment Software

R&D Dept. #1
-Project S (PSP)
-Sonic DS (NDS)

R&D Dept. #2
-Sakura Taisen 3: Paris ha Moeteiru ka (PS2) co-developed with Red Entertainment
-Sakura Taisen 4: Koi Seyo Otome (PC) co-developed with Red Entertainment
-Sakura Taisen 5: Saraba Itoshiki Hito Yo (PS2) co-developed with Red Entertainment

R&D Dept. #3
-Phantasy Star Universe (PC/PS2)

Mobile Content R&D
-Bleach (GBA)

Sega Studio U.S.A. R&D
-Shadow the Hedgehog (GC/PS2/XB)

Sega Studio China R&D
-Project: Altered Beast (PS2)


New Entertainment Software

R&D Dept. #1
-Shining Force NEO (PS2) co-developed with Neverland
-SpikeOut: Battle Street (XB) co-developed with DIMPS
-Super Monkey Ball Deluxe (PS2/XB)

R&D Dept. #2
-Shenmue Online (PC) co-developed with JC Entertainment


Amusement Software

R&D Dept. #1
-Sangokushi Taisen (CHI)
-The House of the Dead III (PC)

R&D Dept. #2
-Sega Golf Club Network Pro Tour Version 2005 (CHI)

R&D Dept. #3
-The Key of Avalon II: Order and Commandment (TF)
-Virtua Tennis (PSP)

Racing Games R&D
-Sega Rally 2005 (PS2)

Sports Design R&D
-Pro Yakyuu Team o Tsukurou! 3 (PS2)
-Virtua Striker 4 (TF)

Family Entertainment R&D
-Beetle MushiKing: Road to Greatest Champion (GBA)


...hopefully there's some big surprises at E3. Super Monkey Ball 3 and Virtua Fighter 5 would be a good start.
 
They can.
They still have all the requisite talent, but it's been very misapplied for the past few years.
They need to refocus on fewer titles with more polish put into them, but that's mostly up to the upper management to dictate.
 
Not the Sega of old. They've lost all their mindshare (except in 3D fighting).

they wanna get good again, they'll be starting from scratch.
 
I don't see why not. If they make good games, then people will come. VF4 was the most successful VF in America and it was when they were a third party. They're going to have to do a hell of a lot better.
 
PhatSaqs said:
Not without putting out quality games. More games with the quality found in gems like Orta, JSR, PSO and less shit like Gungrave, Headhunter and Billy Hatcher

headhunter is no shit - its gameplaywise better than 90% of american videogame garbage!
 
jarrod said:
Amusement Software

R&D Dept. #1
-Sangokushi Taisen (CHI)
I saw this in japan.... If Sega brought this out to America it would be huge. I swear to god it would have RTS fans creaming their pants.

To explain this for those who don't know, it is a collectible card RTS arcade game. you basically buy packs of cards (real cards) that are then read on the table for the game. you use the cards like a mouse to control your units and platoons within the game and play it like an RTS. So to move this army over here you slide the card over there.

It was flat out one of the collest arcade concepts I have ever seen. Card packs I believe were a few hundred yen each (300-350 IIRC) and play was 300Y a pop but if you were good a scenario could last for a good 10 or more minutes...

anyway, just wanted to chime in. Also wanted to say that you should retitle this "Can sega make a comeback in the home" because judging by the action in Japan on VF4: Final Tuning, Sangokushi Taisen, Outrun 2, and others, sega is tearing it up in the arcade...
 
Sega Sega Sega. I always had the utmost respect for Sega, even if I did not own one of their systems until the DC. I enjoyed their games, but they lost their way when they went multiconsole. The beginning of the end for them was when I found out that Shenmue 2 would not make its way to the DC, but to the Xbox. Their biggest mistake was how they distributed software to the different systems this generation. I'd just bought a Gamecube (an easy choice because I cannot do without Nintendo software which hasn't been all that great lately either) and I just could not afford an Xbox. So, while I was greatly looking forward to Sonic although I could have played it on the DC if I wanted to, I could not get to those awesome games like Jet Set Radio, Panzer Dragoon Orta, and Gunvalkyrie. All of these were titles I would have jumped on at day one. I was fortunate enough to get a copy of Phantasy Star Online which I spent much time playing offline with my friends cheat free. Fast forward to the future and the titles that they are giving are titles that just don't appeal to me. Billy Hatcher? Virtua Fighter? The mediocre Astro Boy (I bought a PS2 along the way). I've picked up an Xbox last week and copies of some of the Sega games I missed, but it's obvious with the state the company is in that not enough people did the same. Sega just hit the wrong systems with their titles at the wrong times.

What are Sega DOING these days? Sonic is no longer the exhilierating experience it once was. In fact with all the characters you have to contend with you can't even call it Sonic anymore. Where's Golden Axe? Where's Shenmue? Where's Streets of Rage? Where's Panzer Dragoon? I really don't need to go on. I don't want them to only focus on sequals, but they've got titles that they can really capitalize on. They're got experiences that people would love to reimurse themselves in. And the titles that they've given us are just not the stand out titles they once were. Where is Yu Suzuki?

Can Sega make a comeback? Yes. They can't do this without tightening up their releases though. They need to release consistently good software to a consitent audience. Stop sending their releases to different consoles thus seperating their fan base. Sharpen up that edge that was lost. Phantasy Star Universe is a damn good step in the right direction. I just hope that it's not bad timing on Sega's part again.
 
Remember when Sega were going to be bigger than EA? :lol

Sega were on fire during the Dreamcast days in terms of games. Now it seems like they just can't be bothered. Shit like Virtua Fighter, Sega Classics Collection is just embarrassing.

Will they ever get back on track? I doubt it. Sega just isn't the same without it's own console and they know it. The Sega that blew the world away with the Genesis, Sonic the Hedgehog, Sega Rally and Streets of Rage was a long time ago, and I don't see it ever returning.
 
at one time or another, Sega was putting out 90-100 games in one year. now it seems like they're down to less than 30 games a year.

quantity and quality is WAY, WAY down. poor Sega.
 
Looking at PSU and Condemned, I would say yes. Good decisions on both the developer and publisher side of things. Next-gen could change a lot of things. Let's hope Sega is one of them.
 
IMO, no. It's sad because the Genesis was my favorite 16-bit console, and so many of the awesome games came from SEGA themselves. I dunno what happened to them. I'm not aware of any major people leaving the company since the 90's, so what's the deal? Did they just not adapt well to the 3D transition? Did they loose their passion for creating software? It makes no sense.
 
I'll wait to see how the restructure has affected game development to see if they're making a comeback.

I was actually disappointed by the preview I read of Phantasy Star Universe. It has a single player adventure, but for some reason they're just dropping the Phantasy Star mythology established in the RPG's (in favor of mythology 'inspired' by it), as well as the turn based gameplay. Okay, so it's really Phantasy Star Online: Single Player Adventure. Why? They've got three new planets in a new star system that are just like the three old Algol system planets (Motavia, Dezolis and Palma). Why, Sega? They've also got the same kinds of races on those planets.

Why not just make a new Phantasy Star RPG? The PSO series, to me, just (mis)used the license to sell. Now it has replaced the old games and uses their story to make a different story. What the hell? It could always be a good game, but it sure as hell isn't the rebirth of the old Phantasy Star series I've been waiting for.
 
PhatSaqs said:
Not without putting out quality games. More games with the quality found in gems like Orta, JSR, PSO and less shit like Gungrave, Headhunter and Billy Hatcher


Headhunter was an enjoyable game with a superb soundtrack and a good sense of humour

HH_News.JPG


You should bear in mind Amuze have only made two games: Headhunter and Headhunter: Redemption.

They should also get credit for posting not only the postive but the negative reviews on their website too.
http://www.amuze.com/hh2.html
 
Jibber Hack said:
Sega Sega Sega. I always had the utmost respect for Sega, even if I did not own one of their systems until the DC. I enjoyed their games, but they lost their way when they went multiconsole. The beginning of the end for them was when I found out that Shenmue 2 would not make its way to the DC, but to the Xbox. Their biggest mistake was how they distributed software to the different systems this generation. I'd just bought a Gamecube (an easy choice because I cannot do without Nintendo software which hasn't been all that great lately either) and I just could not afford an Xbox. So, while I was greatly looking forward to Sonic although I could have played it on the DC if I wanted to, I could not get to those awesome games like Jet Set Radio, Panzer Dragoon Orta, and Gunvalkyrie. All of these were titles I would have jumped on at day one. I was fortunate enough to get a copy of Phantasy Star Online which I spent much time playing offline with my friends cheat free. Fast forward to the future and the titles that they are giving are titles that just don't appeal to me. Billy Hatcher? Virtua Fighter? The mediocre Astro Boy (I bought a PS2 along the way). I've picked up an Xbox last week and copies of some of the Sega games I missed, but it's obvious with the state the company is in that not enough people did the same. Sega just hit the wrong systems with their titles at the wrong times.

Yes to all this. I had a Dreamcast and bought tons of SEGA games for it. Now I've got two of the three consoles - Xbox and Gamecube, but I've been denied Virtua Fighter 4 and Sega Rally 2005 and Shinobi. It would make more sense to put ALL their games on one of the consoles and then port to the others when they feel like it. Then their fanbase could follow them to whatever console they choose, yet they still would have the advantages of having access to multiple platform's users when they think a game would do well on a particular platform.

Seriously SEGA, pick Xbox 360, PS3 or Revolution, and publish ALL your titles for one of them. Any one of them!
 
Sega has had zero ambition since going 3rd party, content to just shovel games onto the marketplace. They need to get some of that drive back, to be #1 at something, and not just some random publisher.

I'm not holding my breath.
 
RE4 vs. SH4 said:
IMO, no. It's sad because the Genesis was my favorite 16-bit console, and so many of the awesome games came from SEGA themselves. I dunno what happened to them. I'm not aware of any major people leaving the company since the 90's, so what's the deal? Did they just not adapt well to the 3D transition? Did they loose their passion for creating software? It makes no sense.


I can answer this. For one, Sega lost major mindshare for having so many failed consoles in a row. Competitors such as Sony developed a large market, basically marketing against Sega style games. There's a reason why the word arcade is negative when associated with Sega. The fanbases of Sony and Nintendo consoles are made up of people who chose not to support Sega, and would not go out of their way to seek out Sega games like the Dreamcast fanbase would.

Then ofcourse, Sega really did give their all to make the Dreamcast work, using their strengths in the arcade and whatnot, but third parties and the industry as a whole treated the console (and Sega) as a joke. All it took was some shady numbers and some demos by Sony to cause everybody to lose total confidence in the Dreamcast. Even showing out and dominating a couple E3's in a row meant nothing, something even Nintendo reps have commented on.

After Sega became a third party, they had a confused strategy to return to the top. They thought if they just made some games of the quality they had on the Dreamcast, things would take care of themselves. That did not happen because the fanbases of the 3 current consoles were not Sega fanbases, and really could care less about Sega in general (nor do they believe Sega's games are good). Sega did not realize that they were really starting from scratch. So Sega splitting their best games among 3 consoles just divided their hardcore base, and basically made their hardcore fans unhappy.

And now, it's been really 2 years since Sega has released large budgeted games in abundance on console, as if they gave up on this gen to load up for the next gen. So ofcourse, you have people thinking Sega will always be this dire. I don't believe this to be true, as they have obviously been tooling up for the next gen, but I realize that they cannot make many more mistakes.

I agree that Sega should pick one console, and treat that console as if it's their own console (by releasing all the games for it.. Sega has to develop a large enough fanbase that is enthusiastic about their games. They also need to curb the small, niche, arcade ports and lower priced games until they have developed this fanbase that will support them. Nothing but the big stuff for about 2 years. Getting that drive back is important. I still believe they have the best artists and R&D in the industry, and this time they will be starting at the same time as the rest of the third parties instead of being 1-3 years behind. Sega needs to find out what people want. I personally think Sega's image is on the nerdy, cheesy side...they need to find that coolness that they had during the Genesis era. Hell, even my bro thought Outrun 2 had a gay ass vibe to it which is not cool, and that game is one of their best of the past couple of years. Spikeout is similar with its cheesy vibe. Less cheese please.

Also, start playing hardball with the fanboy game press. They should work hand in hand with them, that EGM PSU article is a good start. No tolerance for bad reviews for product that needs to sell in large numbers or is high quality. Nobody dares diss a EA game that EA needs to sell a lot of copies,and besides, they don't want naysayers using fanboy reviews to continue the line that Sega sucks. This is a large reason why EA is on top, they never really get bad reviews for any of their games. Everybody besides maybe parents who buy games for children (where the license takes precedence) listens to reviews whether they should or not. Also, there's a reason why that person at GA remains anonymous after giving that C+ review for Ninja Gaiden. Fear of being blacklisted out the industry (especially this good ol boy network industry) is a pretty big motivator for keeping scores high. It's time Sega starts acting like the big corporation that they are.
 
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