Link please? Not finding anything on the citizenship offer.
edit: nevermind, I found the update here: http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/syria-migrants-canada-drowned-migrants-1.3213772
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Canadian General Election (OT) - #elxn42: October 19, 2015
- Thread starter matthewwhatever
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Link please? Not finding anything on the citizenship offer.
edit: nevermind, I found the update here: http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/syria-migrants-canada-drowned-migrants-1.3213772
Agreed. Good combo attack. Canada should make a deal with the EU to make sure places like U.K. start accepting immigrants. We should accept immigrants either way though.
I'm glad that racist bastard is finally being exposed. He's been doing this shit for years.
gutter_trash
Banned
I'm listening to the radio while news comes in, when I usually don't link links it's because its live audio
CBC Radio outpaces their online news items by a fair margin, yeah.
Zombie James
Banned
What the fuck? Someone actually thought offering citizenship to someone who's life they helped ruin would be a good idea? Inept doesn't even begin to describe Conservatives.
I agree. Even if the offer was genuine, it was a tactless, tasteless move on their part.
I bet they even thought it would make them look good and get them votes.
gutter_trash
Banned
It feels like an out of court settlement trying to sweep the problem under the rug,
but the father is saying fuck you, too late
gutter_trash
Banned
you can check to 308 seat projection to see how it is pulling
http://www.threehundredeight.com/p/canada.html
scroll down
TheRealTalker
Banned
rightly so... how much pain must this parent be feeling and they try and do such a inconsiderate thing
too late
Because of them, his entire family is dead. I'm not sure how they expected him to respond.
Lone_Prodigy
Member
Just the picture alone is tragic. The circumstances around it are heartbreaking.
I think I'm gonna leave this thread. Many of you are as bad as hardcore conservatives.
And that's the way it should remain. The rich are rich, but the average citizen isn't. If Trudeau doesn't win the middle class won't even exist. I dunno about you, but I'm just scraping by. Immigration ain't going to help the economy or the dollar.
Canada does a lot to alleviate suffering worldwide. But the notion that this is a safe haven for every crisis just doesn't seem sustainable.
Also, the whole statement that an immigrant's family supporting them upon arrival is laughable. As soon as medical care is required that equation quickly disintegrates.
gutter_trash
Banned
if they applied today's requirements in the 1970s, I wouldn't be here today
if they applied today's requirements in the early 20th Century, like 80% of us here on this board wouldn't be here today.
It is all to easy to say NO to new immigrants when our parents, grand parents or great-grand parents were immigrants too
TheRealTalker
Banned
link please
The country as a whole is one of the richest in the world.
It does. An aging population is what doesn't help the economy. Immigrants counteract that.
Far less than it used to.
Turkey has taken in 2 million refugees. Lebanon, a nation of 4 million, has taken in 1 million. Germany is taking in 800,000. Canada isn't pulling its weight.
Canadian rules on who even qualifies as a refugee appear to be very difficult to satisfy and really need to be modernized. Living in a warzone is not typically enough. The last I looked into this, I believe you had to be specifically targeted for death by the government of your country for reasons like your ethnicity or religion. If you're just in serious danger due to heavy fighting between groups who don't have anything against you specifically, you're not a refugee, even if your entire city is leveled. In those situations, the Canadian government thinks you can just move to another part of your own country where there is no fighting, so you're not a refugee. Even if you are a refugee, Canada thinks you should just go to a neighboring country too, which is often not realistic.
This was the case when my wife's cousin's husband was killed when the bus he was riding in was hit by Russian rocket fire in the Donetsk region of Ukraine earlier this year. According to the government official my wife talked to, Canada does not consider her cousin or infant son to be refugees despite our ability to support them and the continued heavy fighting between armies there, even though the rest of Ukraine makes life very hard on anyone from Donetsk trying to relocate within Ukraine. The Ukraine situation continues to be disastrous as well, despite its absence from the media these days.
At the very least in situations where there are already family members in Canada who are Canadian citizens who can support their family members in trouble overseas, the government should provide more flexibility to allow them to immigrate safely and legally.
This was the case when my wife's cousin's husband was killed when the bus he was riding in was hit by Russian rocket fire in the Donetsk region of Ukraine earlier this year. According to the government official my wife talked to, Canada does not consider her cousin or infant son to be refugees despite our ability to support them and the continued heavy fighting between armies there, even though the rest of Ukraine makes life very hard on anyone from Donetsk trying to relocate within Ukraine. The Ukraine situation continues to be disastrous as well, despite its absence from the media these days.
At the very least in situations where there are already family members in Canada who are Canadian citizens who can support their family members in trouble overseas, the government should provide more flexibility to allow them to immigrate safely and legally.
CitizenVectron
Member
Actually immigration does directly help the economy. In order for society to prosper you need more workers than retirees, at a certain ratio. As the population gets older, there are more people drawing from the system and less contributing, so you need more immigrants coming in to work and contribute to taxes, etc. The only other solution is to have the birthrate double or triple, and that doesn't happen in developed nations.
He's not even giving tax cuts to the "middle class." Unless his definition of "middle class" means "the top 10%." Of course "middle class" is this absurd, amorphous concept that can mean anything. Everyone thinks they're part of the middle class, but they're not.
The tax cut affects income earned in the $44,700 to $89,401 bracket, and he's increasing taxes on those who earn over $200k. Due to how marginal tax rates work, the maximum benefit of this tax cut goes to those earning around 90k to 200k, which is the top 10%.
In Canada you "only" need $190k a year to squeak into the top 1% of earners, so under this tax plan there'd actually be a small amount of 1%ers that would get the maximum benefit of $670.
Why are we giving the top 10% $670?
The average income of Canadians is $38,700. These are the people that need support, not the top 10% that are already doing great.
Macleans wrote a good article about this here.
PumpkinSpice
Banned
Just watched this. Totally brutal.
What are you talking about? That doesn't even make sense.
This is wrong. Without immigration, we will end up with the same crisis as Japan. And Canada could do a lot more, especially with the crisis happening in Europe right now.
It seems that your thing against immigration is that it inconveniences you (it actually does the opposite). If you have two choices, accept refugees and inconvenience yourself, or decline them to keep the country's riches for yourself, what would you choose? Because going by your posts, it sounds like you would pick the second...
Exactly.
In one year alone, more immigrants passed through Toronto than its population. That was 1847 and they were Irish, but the nation to be survived. In 1979, we accepted 60,000 boat people in a year and a half. They were Vietnamese and the economy wasn't so hot and the country survived.
In the last three years, we have accepted 1,200 Syrian refugees. In the last six, 20,000 Iraqis. Since 2000, have fallen from 5th to 15th in refugees recipients.
You assert that Canada is a country, not a charity. What's at issue is exactly how charitable we should be. Personally, I see it to be an excellent use of my tax dollars. I'd rather that than all the boutique tax refunds and War of 1812 crap in the world.
In the last three years, we have accepted 1,200 Syrian refugees. In the last six, 20,000 Iraqis. Since 2000, have fallen from 5th to 15th in refugees recipients.
You assert that Canada is a country, not a charity. What's at issue is exactly how charitable we should be. Personally, I see it to be an excellent use of my tax dollars. I'd rather that than all the boutique tax refunds and War of 1812 crap in the world.
Blaming Alexander/Harper for the kid's death is absurb. It's seeing things in black and white only. It's what hardcore partisan do. This basically sums up what I think.
Obviously you can't blame them individually for each individual case, but you absolutely can blame them for enacting and acting on policy that has a broad negative effect on refugees and our ability and willingness to take them in. The Minister is in charge of his department and is ultimately responsible for what goes on in it, just like any boss is. And the Prime Minister is ultimately responsible for what his ministers do and don't do.
I don't think anyone, even hardcore partisans, are thinking of this as if he literally went and held a gun to this kid's head, but they are the rightful targets of anger at our country's failure to help people in need while spending billions on things like trying to buy a broken warplane that no one wants, for example.
We can easily take on more immigration in this country, and this particular case is highlighted because it seems like it should have been a slam dunk. They had family here with the money to support them. In the end it appears to be Harper's anti-immigration policies that caused them to be rejected. Being angry about that is entirely valid.
This isn't an isolated incident. It wasn't that long ago that I read about that asshole keeping Romani people out of Canada. He's a shit immigration minister and these are the results of his actions.
Sigh, but what you're saying that he deserves no blame in the matter. Which is not true.
He is the Immigration Minister, and Harper is the PM. They are partially responsible for what happens due to the laws they enact, whether they like it or not.
It's just the way it works.
TheRealTalker
Banned
Muclair's Opinion on the Situation
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNGI3_eyByk
Trudeau's
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iHr-crS8yPc
and lastly Harpers
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOZTsO5ofnE
I say Muclair handled this the best way
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNGI3_eyByk
Trudeau's
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iHr-crS8yPc
and lastly Harpers
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOZTsO5ofnE
I say Muclair handled this the best way
His stance on Zehaf-Bibeau got him roundly criticized/attacked by Harper and Co for saying we should look into the root causes of such attacks, not surprising he'd try a different approach this time.
Yeah, Mulcair is standing on solid ground. Meanwhile, Trudeau has opened himself to criticism. I agree with both of them though.
I think the attitudes and types of immigrants has changed in that time. The entitlement is fucking insane lately, specifically as it pertains to religion. My grandparents didn't show up with their hand out, trying to change the country to suit them. They came with skills and worked the jobs no one wanted. And when Canada went to war, so too did my relatives.
You keep saying the country is rich, but I'm not feeling the love. You should talk to anyone who has used Ontario Works about compassion (I never have had the pleasure luckily). We are capitalist and resource rich. The 1% don't give a fuck about you and me. Years from now you will be arguing that it isn't ethical to save our natural resources and we should share them with poor countries. Also, the fact that Turkey and Lebanon are doing something would push me to do the opposite. Germany has never been wrong either, lol.
I wouldn't say stop all immigration, but certainly be extremely selective. Just don't open up the flood gates every time some new country decides to turn to shit.
I think Japan has had many other factors at play, but I can see your point. If I had to choose between immigrants taking jobs that Canadians need and increasing the strain on our healthcare and other social services, the decision is pretty easy. Immigration should be based on helping our country, not hindering it.
I'd love to live in Sweden, but I don't feel entitled that they must accept me if I apply and know someone who lives there. That's the part I can't fathom. And even then, people will bitch that Canada won't let them keep dual citizenship because god forbid you can't go back and forth as you please.
I hope not especially I'm on his riding. Based on one of the poll I saw, there's a 65% chance that the Liberal will take the seat. I'm also planning to vote for Liberal this October. I don't want to see him again on my riding.
He has pretty said that verbatum, among other things.
This is just prejudice. Firstly did your grandparents give up their religion when they came here? I'm guessing not. Secondly do you have any evidence other than 'gut feeling' truthiness that the attitudes and types of immigrants have changed in that time?Willectro said:
Newsflash man, there's a reason why immigrants are manning 24/7 gas stations. It's because nobody else wants those jobs.Willectro said:
I have no idea where you're going with any of this. Since the 1% don't give a fuck about you and me we should turn around and not give a fuck about Syrian refugees who are dying? What kind of philosophy is that? Being shit on shouldn't make you want to shit on others. And what the hell is up with bashing Turkey, Lebanon, and Germany for helping people in need?
??? Canada allows dual citizenship.Willectro said:
Germans are Nazis and Turkey massacred Kurds. We shouldn't be copying them! /s
gutter_trash
Banned
religion is also the main root of the problem of the conflict where perceived allies that happened to be Sunni nations do not want to help in squashing ISIS because Saudi Arabia, Qatar and Turkey wanted Assad removed at all costs even if it meant arming Sunni rebels who then happen to be affilatied with ISIS
Saudi Arabia buys our weapons and vehicles but DOES NOTHING to fight ISIS.
Instead, the Sauds are busy bombing Yemen just because there be pro-Iranian Shiite factions there.
Canada can bomb Syria and Irak for years, but that will be useless if the other Sunni nations in the region continue to bat a blind eye to ISIS
Saudi Arabia buys our weapons and vehicles but DOES NOTHING to fight ISIS.
Instead, the Sauds are busy bombing Yemen just because there be pro-Iranian Shiite factions there.
Canada can bomb Syria and Irak for years, but that will be useless if the other Sunni nations in the region continue to bat a blind eye to ISIS
Zomfg prejudice.
gutter_trash
Banned
Sauid Arabia is the main exporter of Wassabism and Salfist extremist ideology abroad.
but but but but George W. Bush decided to remove Saddam Hussein who had nothing to do with 9/11 while the majority of the 9/11 hijackers were Saudi nationals
oh, the oil, I get it
but but but but George W. Bush decided to remove Saddam Hussein who had nothing to do with 9/11 while the majority of the 9/11 hijackers were Saudi nationals
oh, the oil, I get it
I don't understand.
They're making Harper's/Conservative's heartless stance look all that more heartless and shortsighted on an international level, where he likes to think he's above it all.
matthewwhatever
Member
Canada's contributions to foreign aid are absolutely abysmal, yet somehow, that hasn't permeated the public consciousness. Most people still seem to think of country as a nation of peacekeepers who are a force for good in the world, even when the reality hasn't matched that since probably the mid-'90s (if it was even true then).
Ordinarily I'm all for reason and moderation, but you know what? Why not be angry now. This government has been implementing policies that are *this* far from being flat out racist (and sometimes not even that much) for several years now, so I feel like rage is an acceptable solution at this point. Even if there weren't a dead kid in Turkey, this government deserves to be called to task for their actions. Yes, fix the overall problem with the system, but in the meantime, they deserve to be called out and shamed.
Like, this post got overlooked, but it captures so much of what's wrong with this government:
And this is in a region where Harper's been blustering about Canadian strength and not being intimidated by Putin and whatnot. Ordinarily, you'd think solidarity with the Ukrainians would involve helping those most affected by the crisis start their lives over somewhere else, but we don't even do that. Instead, we have a PM who talks a big game, and then does nothing concrete.
So when we're talking about a region in which the Conservatives are running ads at this very moment mocking Trudeau for suggesting we send aid...yeah, Harper et al may not have literally killed anyone, but they should still be ashamed for how little they've done to help alleviate the problems of the region. Simply dropping a couple of bombs doesn't cut it -- though, ironically, if it were, he'd still deserve condemnation, since we're responsible for less than 1% of the bombing runs there, according to the last numbers I saw a few weeks ago. That's Canadian foreign policy under Harper: big talk wherever white people are in danger, but next-to-nothing in the way of action.
You know, if the Conservatives were even trying to buy warplanes, it would be one thing: you may or may not agree with spending money to fix the military, but it's at least a defensible position from a certain mindset. But they haven't even done that. They've let our military fall into an abysmal state of disrepair, so they've basically just talked about spending billions on broken warplanes for a decade, while not doing anything. For them to do that, then turn around and brag about our military (while essentially outsourcing all our defense, peacekeeping, etc. functions to the Americans) is appalling. I'm not even a very pro-military person, and it enrages me.
EDIT: On reflection, I wonder if the two -- the lack of military spending and the abysmal treatment of refugees -- are connected? We can't even get Canadians out of dangerous spots without help from others, so it's not like we'd have the capacity to get refugees out of war zones, either.
Also enraging: Peter Penashue is running for the Conservatives in Labrador. Penashue, of course, had to resign in disgrace in 2013 when it came out that his campaign spent and raised money illegally in the 2011 election. His official agent is going on trial next week on charges of violating the the Canada Elections Act. And somehow, that's not disqualifying for him to run as a Conservative.
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