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[LordOcidax]

Oof at those PS5 hardware numbers. I am sure raising prices will definitely help those sales!

That strategy worked really well in Japan.

 

[nial]

How is the Death Stranding IP in Everybody's Golf tier of niche? Are we only going by sales?

Like others already said, it has ALL the hallmarks of cinematic single-player third-person story-driven AAA games that should appeal to many PS fans who like SIE's games in that same mold. It has a Hollywood cast rivaling or bettering Horizon Forbidden West's or God of War Ragnarok's. And like I said earlier in this very post, various similar game design elements too (combat loop, upgrade system, open world etc.).

On face value, DS2 is basically as close as you can get to a SIE AAA cinematic game without being one. Okay, maybe it's a couple degrees removed from something like GTA or RDR, but it's still much more similar to them than an Everybody's Golf. So it's natural to assume the game would be selling higher than the original launch-aligned, or at least doing par. Instead it's underperforming in virtually every region.

We can get into why it's underperforming (I gave my reasons above), but it underperforming is a fact at this point. It just is.

It's in term of sales. This talk is kind of meaningless when our biggest point of comparison (Death Stranding on PS4) didn't exactly do that much better. 'Underperforming' in relation to what, though? SIE's expectations (that we don't know of)? The same company that is publishing what is probably the last project directed by Hideo Kojima himself?

 

[RetroGamingUK]

Ignore

 

[Bumblebeetuna]

Please no more DreamcastGuy pictures

Wonder why RDR2 is still selling so well on Xbox. Sale maybe? Next gen patch

 

[EN250]

Switch 2 reign starts now and nothing will beat it for a long ass time...

 

[mayham2199]

Very true, yet it doesn't mean it's the right thing. The next 2 year will show that they shouldn't bleed to much into PC or they risk losing their PS audience to PC.

I used to feel this way to but after going back to PC and trying to turn it into a console I don't have that same belief anymore. It's a headache and as much as PC users wants to try and make it seem like everything is just as easy as a console now, it's not. Can you imagine the average casual gamer finding out they have to fuck with their bios to play BF6? PC might one day be a viable alternative to console gaming for the casual gamer but right now it's not. I also don't really see the appeal for the average person who buys 1 or 2 games a year is.

 

[Woopah]

Switch 2 reign starts now and nothing will beat it for a long ass time...

I think PS5 will win the month GTA launches.

 

[EN250]

I think PS5 will win the month GTA launches.

Good point, probably the last month PS5 will be at the top, I don't see any other game helping with that

 

[mckmas8808]

Good point, probably the last month PS5 will be at the top, I don't see any other game helping with that

Sony is currently making games still too. The thing that hurts is the increased price. A new SpiderMan 3 on a $399 device would have went CRAZY!!!

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

Also the fact DS uses high profile Hollywood celebrities……it can't be THAT niche especially compare to actual niche games from Vanillaware and Falcom.

Yeah, like I don't think Norman Reedus has done anything niche since hitting it big in Walking Dead. And other people like Del Toro definitely have a niche they like to play in, which isn't exactly mega-mainstream like say the MCU (well, even tho those films aren't doing so well these days), but a lot of non-dark fantasy film fans know about stuff like Pan's Labyrinth, for example.

If there is any game which proves how dumb Sony's multiplatform first party "strategy" is, it's DS2. Turns out expanding to other platforms doesn't really increase game sales. It mostly just bleeds users to the competition.

100%. And some of those competitors, like PC, offer a lot of feature advantages either of inferior value on PlayStation or MIA completely. And considering almost all the big timesink GAAS titles are cross-platform these days, the choice to jump main platforms couldn't be easier.

I bet the vast majority who played DS1 on PC or even Xbox, are just waiting for a DS2 to their platform because the cadence was already established with the first game. If DS1 took six months to get a Steam port, why not expect similar for 2? If you waited a few years to play DS1 on PC, you can probably wait six or so months to get the sequel on that platform.

SIE have basically trained non-PS gamers to "just wait" for their games on those other platforms. Also with how many core gamers at least (not so sure about casuals & mainstream) have at least two platforms to play on, the whole "won't abandon their digital library" argument doesn't hold up because that was never something they'd risk doing to begin with. Shifting new purchases to another platform ecosystem (i.e PC) doesn't mean that same person can't keep their sub platform (i.e PlayStation) around for their older purchases.

Couldn't disagree more with you analysis on DS2. It has ALL the hallmarks of a cinematic SP game that PS gamers love? Seriously? Who the hell loves being a delivery man? Sure it has the cinematics and everything else but the game play which I would argue is the most important part is completely different than anything else.

It's wild to me that people are shocked that DS2 is selling the way it is when DS1 wasn't that big of a seller to begin with. All I ever heard about this series is that it's a walking simulator and if you google gameplay that's exactly what you are going to see is a walking sim. Why did we expect DS2 to sell so much better than DS1 is my question? It took the first game like 2 years and the PC market just to sell 5 million. I'd argue it did those numbers just based on curiosity and Kojima's name a lone.

DS1 also went into Game Pass and got a lot of additional players that way, mainly through Xbox and PC. So it's possible they've trained latecomers to expect the sequel on Game Pass at some point, and those people are just choosing to wait until it shows up there (or until the game comes to their platform for B2P sale).

That could be another reason for DS2 underperforming, and I already mentioned the lack of traditional advertising. But this whole thing with some of you saying it's very "niche" with no commonality to SIE's AAA story-driven games is just cope, and you know it. Theme, style & cast-wise this is strongly in line with a Naughty Dog, SSM or Guerrilla AAA game.

The gameplay might be a bit different in some areas (no duh), but it still has modern trademarks like an open world, weapon crafting system, skill tree etc. that SIE's games also have.

You might think this way but Sony sure didn't, with the marquee first party marketing and the numerous prime time TV spots.

They marketed this like any of their own tent-pole AAA games.

This sounds like cap. I haven't seen a SINGLE commercial for DS2 on TV, because if there were any, they'd 100% at least show up on Toonami or Adult Swim (I still watch both periodically). That's where I saw HFW, GOWR, and even Metaphor commercials when those games were coming out (FF XVI and VII Rebirth too). Haven't seen anything for Death Stranding 2 so I'm inclined to believe that marketing budget is basically not there.

So that's actually one reason I can see DS2 underperforming: there's barely been any traditional advertising. And that is very surprising considering SIE are publishing.

It's in term of sales. This talk is kind of meaningless when our biggest point of comparison (Death Stranding on PS4) didn't exactly do that much better. 'Underperforming' in relation to what, though? SIE's expectations (that we don't know of)? The same company that is publishing what is probably the last project directed by Hideo Kojima himself?

Saying DS2 is niche by sales doesn't tell the whole story though. Let's be honest here: given who's involved with the game, the games that person's made in the past which have been very popular with PS enthusiasts in the AAA space on prior consoles, plus the style of games they're known to make (which is continued here, in overdrive, and that includes the Hollywood-studded cast), DS2 by all accounts should be doing better in sales than it appears to be doing. It should be selling better, especially if other talking points are meant to be taken as true (i.e ports of prior installments to other platforms drawing those players in to buy the sequels on PS due to FOMO).

Just running to "well DS2 is niche" feels like preemptive cope to me, because I think some folks are afraid that discourse over the sales will turn into an argument on the game's quality. I can't speak for everyone, but I know for myself, that is not the case. DS2 seems like a very high-quality experience, so I'd argue the two main factors for it underperforming in sales compared to the 1st game launch-aligned, are:

1: Lack of traditional advertising, at least going from anecdotal evidence on my end. My litmus is usually ads on Toonami & Adult Swim, because many of SIE's other major releases this gen had at least a couple ads there I was able to catch, like HFW, GOWR, and Astro Bot. Even Metaphor had some regular adverts on there when it was new, and that surprised me because MS usually suck horribly in traditional advertising for games post-360 era.

2: Trained player expectations for eventual DS2 ports to PC and Xbox. DS1 got ported to PC in six months; I think SIE's FOMO strategy isn't as strong as they thought it'd be in the case of games like this, so a good portion of people who played the game on PC (either through Steam or PC Game Pass) feel they can just wait. After all, it's "only" six months, and there are plenty of major releases coming in the meantime, like Silksong (major hype; I don't get the hype myself, tho Hollow Knight is a quality experience) to tide them over.

To me those are the clearest explanations for any potential sales underperformance of DS2 compared to DS1 launch-aligned.

 

[adamsapple]

This sounds like cap. I haven't seen a SINGLE commercial for DS2 on TV, because if there were any, they'd 100% at least show up on Toonami or Adult Swim (I still watch both periodically). That's where I saw HFW, GOWR, and even Metaphor commercials when those games were coming out (FF XVI and VII Rebirth too). Haven't seen anything for Death Stranding 2 so I'm inclined to believe that marketing budget is basically not there.

When I saw prime time spots, I mean prime time spots. There were relentless DS2 ads between WWE Raw and Smackdown episodes before it came out, which like you watch Toonami, I watch those.

They played Death Stranding 2 trailers before movies in the cinemas as well.

I can't help it if you missed it.

 

[calico]

I feel it hasn't been adequately appreciated that Ubisoft ragequit the whole process forever rather than watch Shadows start sliding down the chart.

 

[mayham2199]

DS1 also went into Game Pass and got a lot of additional players that way, mainly through Xbox and PC. So it's possible they've trained latecomers to expect the sequel on Game Pass at some point, and those people are just choosing to wait until it shows up there (or until the game comes to their platform for B2P sale).

That could be another reason for DS2 underperforming, and I already mentioned the lack of traditional advertising. But this whole thing with some of you saying it's very "niche" with no commonality to SIE's AAA story-driven games is just cope, and you know it. Theme, style & cast-wise this is strongly in line with a Naughty Dog, SSM or Guerrilla AAA game.

The gameplay might be a bit different in some areas (no duh), but it still has modern trademarks like an open world, weapon crafting system, skill tree etc. that SIE's games also have.

I didn't say it had NO commonality. It has a lot but the most important one (gameplay) is very different. You are just a delivery driver that's it. It was a very hard sell for even me to try this game and I enjoy all the PS exclusives but I saw the gameplay and it looked boring as hell. It's selling inline with pretty much the first game on top of that if not just a little bit less. I really don't see anything surprising with these sales. I really just don't get why people expected this to perform above what the first game did.

 

[nial]

Saying DS2 is niche by sales doesn't tell the whole story though. Let's be honest here: given who's involved with the game, the games that person's made in the past which have been very popular with PS enthusiasts in the AAA space on prior consoles, plus the style of games they're known to make (which is continued here, in overdrive, and that includes the Hollywood-studded cast), DS2 by all accounts should be doing better in sales than it appears to be doing. It should be selling better, especially if other talking points are meant to be taken as true (i.e ports of prior installments to other platforms drawing those players in to buy the sequels on PS due to FOMO).

Just running to "well DS2 is niche" feels like preemptive cope to me, because I think some folks are afraid that discourse over the sales will turn into an argument on the game's quality. I can't speak for everyone, but I know for myself, that is not the case. DS2 seems like a very high-quality experience, so I'd argue the two main factors for it underperforming in sales compared to the 1st game launch-aligned, are:

1: Lack of traditional advertising, at least going from anecdotal evidence on my end. My litmus is usually ads on Toonami & Adult Swim, because many of SIE's other major releases this gen had at least a couple ads there I was able to catch, like HFW, GOWR, and Astro Bot. Even Metaphor had some regular adverts on there when it was new, and that surprised me because MS usually suck horribly in traditional advertising for games post-360 era.

2: Trained player expectations for eventual DS2 ports to PC and Xbox. DS1 got ported to PC in six months; I think SIE's FOMO strategy isn't as strong as they thought it'd be in the case of games like this, so a good portion of people who played the game on PC (either through Steam or PC Game Pass) feel they can just wait. After all, it's "only" six months, and there are plenty of major releases coming in the meantime, like Silksong (major hype; I don't get the hype myself, tho Hollow Knight is a quality experience) to tide them over.

To me those are the clearest explanations for any potential sales underperformance of DS2 compared to DS1 launch-aligned.

It does tell the whole story, though. Because, even then, pretty much all your observations apply to the original game as well, which again, sold 4.3M units on PS4 up to February 2022, and that was following a Value Selection price cut in May 2021. The series is of very high budget, but sales-wise? Definitely niche comparatively to the rest of SIE's heavy hitters.
The way Death Stranding is treated by SIE you can also see on, for example, how Nintendo treats Metroid. Prime 4 is looking to be one of their most expensive first-party productions ever (9 years of production, mostly developed in the US), and yet they probably aren't expecting more than 4M unit sales LTD for it, but they still see it as an important prestige release for their ecosystem.
I don't think the rest of your points rest much value. Lack of traditional advertising? If I'm taking adamsapple 's word for it, that probably wasn't the case (I can't speak for myself as 99% of games rarely get advertised in my territory, plus I don't use cable TV at that). Players expecting PC ports? Perhaps, but that wasn't a notable factor on the rest of first-party releases, so I have no idea why it would be here, and I know you're not seriously expecting a meaningful amount of PlayStation users who would rather play it on Xbox.

 

[Team Skoda]

DS2 was not made for children, so that makes sense why DK has sold more. Itsuno was right.

Anywho, have fun waiting another 7 years for that team to bring you another 3D Mario game.

 

[LakeOf9]

DS2 was not made for children, so that makes sense why DK has sold more. Itsuno was right.

Anywho, have fun waiting another 7 years for that team to bring you another 3D Mario game.

 

[Team Skoda]

 

[pulicat]

Based on Circana chart placement and unit asp, Death Stranding 2 is likely to be around 350k units sold in the US.

For a game with budgets over 250m, it's a catastrophic result. Stellar Blade and AstroBot were selling more units launch aligned despite having less budgets than DS2.

 

[poppabk]

I think PS5 will win the month GTA launches.

Right he said a long ass time.

 

[drganon]

Based on Circana chart placement and unit asp, Death Stranding 2 is likely to be around 350k units sold in the US.

For a game with budgets over 250m, it's a catastrophic result. Stellar Blade and AstroBot were selling more units launch aligned despite having less budgets than DS2.

Seriously, let it go and seek help.

 

[Ozriel]

DS1 also went into Game Pass and got a lot of additional players that way, mainly through Xbox and PC. So it's possible they've trained latecomers to expect the sequel on Game Pass at some point, and those people are just choosing to wait until it shows up there (or until the game comes to their platform for B2P sale).

That could be another reason for DS2 underperforming, and I already mentioned the lack of traditional advertising.

Death Stranding was only added to PC GamePass, which isn't THAT popular. Never came to console GP.


It was given away for free by Epic in 2023. That's where a ton of users came from.

 

[adamsapple]

Death Stranding was only added to PC GamePass, which isn't THAT popular. Never came to console GP.

Additionally, the PC GP version that came out in '22 wasn't even the then-already-out Director's Cut, it was the vanilla version.

Not sure how well it could have done when a more feature complete version of the game was already available. They never really followed up on that.

 

[Sephiran]

I think there is a bigger issue at play here. Is there any single player franchise that sells more on PS5 than it did on PS4? Rebirth, FF XVI, DS2 declining compared to their PS4 releases all point to live service domination during this generation means that pretty much every single player game on PS5 has lower sales potential than it had on PS4.

The fact that a game like DK Bananza can sell more physically during 2 weeks on a low install base compared to total DS2 sales for 2 months on a big install base shows how little the current PS ecosystem engages with such AAA single player releases.

 

[ecosse_011172]

Donkey Kong Bananza (physical) has outsold Death Stranding 2 (physical+digital). Pretty impressive for an exclusive game on a 2M user base.

Fun, dynamic game where you smash shit up, from one of the best dev teams on the planet vs Kojima Walking Sim.

 

[demigod]

Based on Circana chart placement and unit asp, Death Stranding 2 is likely to be around 350k units sold in the US.

For a game with budgets over 250m, it's a catastrophic result. Stellar Blade and AstroBot were selling more units launch aligned despite having less budgets than DS2.

Funny how you don't mention another game on that list that also bombed that was a multiplat game.

 

[ADiTAR]

I think there is a bigger issue at play here. Is there any single player franchise that sells more on PS5 than it did on PS4? Rebirth, FF XVI, DS2 declining compared to their PS4 releases all point to live service domination during this generation means that pretty much every single player game on PS5 has lower sales potential than it had on PS4.

The fact that a game like DK Bananza can sell more physically during 2 weeks on a low install base compared to total DS2 sales for 2 months on a big install base shows how little the current PS ecosystem engages with such AAA single player releases.

I think it could be a warning for devs, maybe people don't want brown depressing games. Personally, I've been watching game shows and reality the past few years, and try to play only playing happy games.

If the next Witcher is as grey as W3 I'm gonna pass. I'm just tired of depressing.