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[Vodh]

Why cant Wizards use xbows, they are smart enough to conjure magic...yet they cant pull a trigger on a bow?

It's not even like they would have to use it. They'd just go like 'Man i have no idea how the fuck this thing works, but apparently my Blizzard is way stronger when I hold it!'

Spoiler

I actually love the design decision of basing all the skills' DPS on weapon, but yeah, from the 'realism' point of view it is a bit ridiculous

 

[Tarazet]

It's still useful to a DH who can't afford one with dex.

I also think the extra socket might make it useful to someone. An int crossbow still isn't good, but two sockets on any weapon sounds fantastic.

 

[larvi]

I also think the extra socket might make it useful to someone. An int crossbow still isn't good, but two sockets on any weapon sounds fantastic.

But other 2 handers can roll up to 200% chd where the manticore can only get up to 100% so it's basically a wash even with the 2 sockets as it stands today. In 1.07 the manticore may be more useful though with the new gems, but it sounds like they a nerfing the damage calculation on the red gems. But in 1.07 you will be able to get a max of 320% chd on a manticore vs 310% on a skorn.

 

[DSmalls84]

Rolled my third Hellfire Ring last night and it was an improvment over my last in every category . Always nice to see all green when you compare items!

24-56 damage
174 intelligence
69 vitality
46 All Res
138 Armor

Actually a really nice roll for my Witch doctor. My friend who had one of the worst rolls I have ever seen also got another and his rolled Crit Damage and IAS. Good night of Uber Farming.

 

[TUSR]

I wanna über farm

 

[ertitoagus]

what about this?:

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/7810091773

Blizz finally changing only the joke bonus of the sets?

 

[larvi]

what about this?:

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/7810091773

Blizz finally changing only the joke bonus of the sets?

Blizzard can't release a patch without finding a way to nerf demon hunters. Granted the dh have (had) one of the nicer set bonuses for the nat's pieces but this was made up for by the generally crappy standard affixes on the nat's gear. Fear on hit, really? None of the nat's gear is BIS with the exception of possibly the ring but I suspect you could get a yellow ring better than the best nat's ring.

 

[prodystopian]

Wow, a boost to the 3-piece Inna's would make me consider picking up another Inna's piece if it's good enough. I was close to picking up Nat's boots and ring for that 7% CC though...

 

[oktarb]

Soloed three runs last night at MP 5, still no Infernal Machine Key. Diablo hates me. But at least my Barbarian can solo MP 5.

 

[turnbuckle]

It would be amazing if the 3 piece bonus gave some fury generation instead of the 5 piece, but that doesn't look like it's in the cards. Would be awesome if the new bonus increased something for dps since that set bonus might be the only one that doesn't have any dps component at all.

Like, give us 100 strength or crit damage, or attack speed or something.

 

[turnbuckle]

Other than the fun factor, it's actually a bit of a buff - more of your zaps hit the target (by cyclones traveling across it, or into the crowd)

Saw you posted in the gem thread on Reddit. I never really got much into posting there until recently. 2 of my posts in the 'ask the devs" thread single-handedly dropped my comment karma and now I'm hesitant to post again lol.

Short of them fixing gem crafting I might have to get one of those devices you mentioned

 

[Tarazet]

Wow, a boost to the 3-piece Inna's would make me consider picking up another Inna's piece if it's good enough. I was close to picking up Nat's boots and ring for that 7% CC though...

Nat's 2-piece for the CC is amazing, and the 2-piece Inna's helm and pants for the Dex, IAS and movement speed makes the most sense for pretty much any Monk or DH. Belt pretty much has to be a Witching Hour.

 

[Fenderputty]

what about this?:

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/7810091773

Blizz finally changing only the joke bonus of the sets?

Wait wat? The 2PC nats set bonus is gone? That makes two pieces of my monks gear uselsss. Has this been confimed?

 

[turnbuckle]

Wait wat? The 2PC nats set bonus is gone? That makes two pieces of my monks gear uselsss. Has this been confimed?

At work right now so can't test but from my barb and monk right now:

 

[Fenderputty]

If they nerf the 2 set bonus for 7CC on the nats set I'll consider selling my shit and quitting. It would make two pieces worthless and force me to buy a soon to be increasing in value set of icewalkers and laccuni's. I would have more life, but proably lose a ton of damage.

I would be supremely pissed off.

 

[Fenderputty]

They didn't change the old sets retroactively though so I'm hoping it's a glitch.

 

[turnbuckle]

It might be a glitch. I saw there's a glitch going right now in the PTR that effectively halves the mana regen of witch doctors.

Or it may be a change to the set. I don't think they're going to nerf anything that's been used by so many people retroactively.

 

[Fenderputty]

It might be a glitch. I saw there's a glitch going right now in the PTR that effectively halves the mana regen of witch doctors.

Or it may be a change to the set. I don't think they're going to nerf anything that's been used by so many people retroactively.

I doubt it's a buff because the 2pc nat bonus doesn't need a buff. I hope it's not a nerf because they didn't retroactively screw people last time.

Which leaves glitch as mostly likely I guess.

Spoiler

hope

 

[Tarazet]

I doubt it's a buff because the 2pc nat bonus doesn't need a buff. I hope it's not a nerf because they didn't retroactively screw people last time.

Which leaves glitch as mostly likely I guess.

Spoiler

hope

Yeah, there are tons of people who are using subpar Nat's pieces for the sole reason that the 7% crit chance makes up for the lack of firepower on the pieces themselves. If that bonus gets removed or nerfed enough, I'll be eating the loss and going back to yellows. But wow @ quitting over an OP set bonus, jeeze.

 

[turnbuckle]

Yeah, there are tons of people who are using subpar Nat's pieces for the sole reason that the 7% crit chance makes up for the lack of firepower on the pieces themselves. If that bonus gets removed or nerfed enough, I'll be eating the loss and going back to yellows. But wow @ quitting over an OP set bonus, jeeze.

Yeah, I thought that a little ridiculous. That 2 piece bonus is clearly the best, better than most or all 5 piece bonuses. There's not a single DPS set bonus for barbs, and unlike monks a barb has to break their own set bonus if they want to take advantage of the nats bonus (barb have set boots, monk doesn't)

Perhaps they should swap it and make the 7% crit the 3 piece bonus, and even still that's incredible.

/class whine

 

[Shifty76]

Yeah, there are tons of people who are using subpar Nat's pieces for the sole reason that the 7% crit chance makes up for the lack of firepower on the pieces themselves. If that bonus gets removed or nerfed enough, I'll be eating the loss and going back to yellows. But wow @ quitting over an OP set bonus, jeeze.

Heh, glad I moved on from Nat's 2pc.

That's gotta be a glitch though. 2pc Nat's is one of the most common set pairings and a bunch of people would be super pissed if they nerfed that.

Would be nice if they buffed other set bonuses though. Keep them consistent throughout classes too:

2pc: +150 main stat (or, 7%cc for Nats, as it is now)
3pc: +50 AR or +100 vit or something useful for all classes.
4pc: Keep similar to now, or buff as needed (only really familiar with Inna's)

 

[turnbuckle]

Heh, glad I moved on from Nat's 2pc.

That's gotta be a glitch though. 2pc Nat's is one of the most common set pairings and a bunch of people would be super pissed if they nerfed that.

Would be nice if they buffed other set bonuses though. Keep them consistent throughout classes too:

2pc: +150 main stat (or, 7%cc for Nats, as it is now)
3pc: +50 AR or +100 vit or something useful for all classes.
4pc: Keep similar to now, or buff as needed (only really familiar with Inna's)

I would simply love if they made the IK bonus a 4 piece bonus instead of 5. The bonus is so bad by itself except for farming low MP.

 

[Tarazet]

Yeah, I thought that a little ridiculous. That 2 piece bonus is clearly the best, better than most or all 5 piece bonuses. There's not a single DPS set bonus for barbs, and unlike monks a barb has to break their own set bonus if they want to take advantage of the nats bonus (barb have set boots, monk doesn't)

Perhaps they should swap it and make the 7% crit the 3 piece bonus, and even still that's incredible.

/class whine

Making it the 3 piece bonus would be better. It would be less of a nerf, but it'll still mean any Monk running with that 2pc will be regearing.

 

[Fenderputty]

Yeah, there are tons of people who are using subpar Nat's pieces for the sole reason that the 7% crit chance makes up for the lack of firepower on the pieces themselves. If that bonus gets removed or nerfed enough, I'll be eating the loss and going back to yellows. But wow @ quitting over an OP set bonus, jeeze.

Yeah, I thought that a little ridiculous. That 2 piece bonus is clearly the best, better than most or all 5 piece bonuses. There's not a single DPS set bonus for barbs, and unlike monks a barb has to break their own set bonus if they want to take advantage of the nats bonus (barb have set boots, monk doesn't)

Perhaps they should swap it and make the 7% crit the 3 piece bonus, and even still that's incredible.

/class whine

Meh ... I've played this game for a long long time and haven't really taken a break since launch. I have my character built up to play effectively in short burts. At this point I'm not interested in farming another 200+ million in gear simply to be as effective as I currenlty am because Blizzard decides retroactively screw a rather loyal player.

Another thing, Barbs don't need a DPS set bonus because you already have passives that monks lack. Perhaps if Blizz would provide me with a passive that increased my CC in return I wouldn't care so much.

EDIT: Our whole set is a giant mess. None of the pices come with AR as it has to pop as a random stat. Stupid. I also think it's ironic you're against nerfing antying Barb under the premise of, "nerf suck buffs for all!" (something I agree with) yet here it would be totally cool to nerf the set beacuse barbs don't get to benefit from it.

 

[dog$]

Well, I forgot to post this here yesterday so for a small interruption, I'd like to draw some attention to a picture that my wife finished drawing - http://ammosart.tumblr.com/image/41979166988 . Female Wizard in Tyreal's, per my request.

Meanwhile, chalk me up as another person who may quit if the 7%CC from 2 piece Nat's gets cut. It would be 102 IAS Nerf Part II. I'm rather exhausted with the bad personal drama that I encounter in this game, and I'm tired of discussing this game with anyone else beyond those of us who still play this damned thing (because that's the equivalent of punching a brick wall), and I'm almost just as worn of discussing this game with those of us who actually do still play when we and everyone else can see ways that the game can improve, but won't actually happen.

I've said it countless times - every single nerf causes more players to quit this game and spread poison everywhere about how bad this game is. This circumstance would be the new prime example.

I've been on this precipice before, and if this is what finally pushes me over the cliff, so be it.

 

[turnbuckle]

Meh ... I've played this game for a long long time and haven't really taken a break since launch. I have my character built up to play effectively in short burts. At this point I'm not interested in farming another 200+ million in gear simply to be as effective as I currenlty am because Blizzard decides retroactively screw a rather loyal player.

Another thing, Barbs don't need a DPS set bonus because you already have passives that monks lack. Perhaps if Blizz would provide me with a passive that increased my CC in return I wouldn't care so much.

EDIT: Our whole set is a giant mess. None of the pices come with AR as it has to pop as a random stat. Stupid. I also think it's ironic you're against nerfing antying Barb under the premise of, "nerf suck buffs for all!" (something I agree with) yet here it would be totally cool to nerf the set beacuse barbs don't get to benefit from it.

whoa you are entirely you defensive. I don't think it would be totally cool for them to nerf the set bonus. I said I don't think they would and at most switching the 2 and 3 piece bonus. I never said I'm cool with it, I would prefer they only ever buff stuff people already worked for. I only said it's a bit extreme to quit because of it. if you're burned out on the game and that's the tipping point I understand, but the hypothetical set change alone causing someone to quit seemed overly dramatic. which you're being towards me right now by putting words or thoughts in my mouth.

 

[larvi]

EDIT: Our whole set is a giant mess. None of the pices come with AR as it has to pop as a random stat. Stupid. I also think it's ironic you're against nerfing antying Barb under the premise of, "nerf suck buffs for all!" (something I agree with) yet here it would be totally cool to nerf the set beacuse barbs don't get to benefit from it.

DH would love to be able to wear monk headgear vs theirs

120-200 dex/30-100vit/5-6%cc

vs

90-100dex/241-397armor/%fear on hit

No comparison.

Quite a few DH prefer the torso as well as getting an AR roll on the innas is much more common (hence much cheaper) than getting an ar roll AND a dex/vit roll on the DH cloak.

Essentially I see the nat set cc bonus as a way of compensating for otherwise substandard equipment. I do agree that the monk set bonus could use some work though as well as the wiz set bonus.

 

[turnbuckle]

basically every set bonus needs to be buffed imo. Perhaps they will do that to create more separation between them and new crafted stuff. who knows.

 

[Fenderputty]

whoa you are entirely you defensive. I don't think it would be totally cool for them to nerf the set bonus. I said I don't think they would and at most switching the 2 and 3 piece bonus. I never said I'm cool with it, I would prefer they only ever buff stuff people already worked for. I only said it's a bit extreme to quit because of it. if you're burned out on the game and that's the tipping point I understand, but the hypothetical set change alone causing someone to quit seemed overly dramatic. which you're being towards me right now by putting words or thoughts in my mouth.

Dude ... you yourself suggested the nerf from a 2 piece set bonus to a 3 piece set bonus. This was after proclaiming it the best set bonus in the game with only 2 pieces needed. If that's not OK with it, I don't know what is. I wasn't putting words in anyones mouth. It's a rediculous nerf that should never happen. I have not been dramatic with either of my posts. I think after having played the game for 8 months I can decide to quit after a fat nerf without being called "rediculous", which was also your words. A move like this would seriously scew me. I completely forgot I would have to get a new ring too.

DH would love to be able to wear monk headgear vs theirs

120-200 dex/30-100vit/5-6%cc

vs

90-100dex/241-397armor/%fear on hit

No comparison.

Quite a few DH prefer the torso as well as getting an AR roll on the innas is much more common (hence much cheaper) than getting an ar roll AND a dex/vit roll on the DH cloak.

Essentially I see the nat set cc bonus as a way of compensating for otherwise substandard equipment. I do agree that the monk set bonus could use some work though as well as the wiz set bonus.

The DH set blows hard ... completely agree. The only posistive is the 2 set bonus.

 

[Vio-Lence]

got 8 machines and time to kill, anyone want to do ubers?

 

[turnbuckle]

Dude ... you yourself suggested the nerf from a 2 piece set bonus to a 3 piece set bonus. If that's not OK with it, I don't know what is. I wasn't putting words in anyones mouth. It's a rediculous nerf that should never happen. I have not been dramatic with either of my posts. I think after having played the game for 8 months I can decide to quit after a fat nerf without being called "rediculous", which was also your words. A move like this would seriously scew me. I completely forgot I would have to get a new ring too.



The DH set blows hard ... completely agree. The only posistive is the 2 set bonus.

I think the issue is where I said " should" instead of could. I meant the latter. I plan on playing my monk a bunch after the patch, I surely don't want a nerf. Sorry if my wording implied that, I was just speculating since we have no idea.

I am pretty consistent on never nerfing gear. I hate class nerfs too. Sorry I worded it poorly. no, I'm no backpedaling either, I sincerely intended my comment to be speculation rather than a recommendation.

anyways, I love you all.

 

[Fenderputty]

No hard feeling man.

 

[Vodh]

They need to focus on unique utility and specific build buffs on legendaries and sets in order to create some sort of diversity. With flat, boring DPS/Survi gains, there's always going to be a best-in-slot. It kind of boggles my mind how they got rid of the most interesting set bonus they've created which was the old Nat's discipline thing - instead of removing it, they should aspire to make other sets up to par with that one.

 

[Wickerbasket]

Had a weird bug tonight while playing, I got disconnected and when I rejoined the game we had 5 people playing.

Game ran completely normally, apart from the extra player being there of course.

 

[VALKYRAY]

what about this?:

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/7810091773

Blizz finally changing only the joke bonus of the sets?

I felt the nerf on 2 piece natalya's is necessary because gaining 7% crit chance from 2 piece is way too much bonus. that's more than a perfect rolled ring, helm and bracer.
if you go on diabloprogress, all monks and DHs are using natalya's boots and ring. there's no itemization variaty at all. keep in mind natalya's helm and ring can also roll crit chance, thus 2 piece natalya's gets bonus 7% crit chance is unbalanced and overpowered. it's so overpowered even some barbarian and wizards are using that combo.
if you want more crit chance, perhaps you should use a shield, or inna's pants + belt.

http://www.diabloprogress.com/rating.stat_dps_unbuffed/class.monk

 

[dog$]

If you want more crit chance, everything that isn't a Nat's piece is going to cost more now because you can't get 7%CC from the set.

Not to mention that asking a Wizard, Monk, or Barb to use a shield and cut their sheet DPS roughly by half now in the name of CC is tantamount to neutralizing the character.

So yeah, let's nerf more stuff because we can just keep taking everything away from players and figuratively shit down their throats, and they'll lick the rim and ask for seconds.

 

[VALKYRAY]

nerfing 2 piece natalya will open a lot of item variaty.
if you want more DPS, you can go with zunimassa boots for more DPS
if you want more eHP, go with iceclimbers or immortal king
I like to see monks and dhs build differently, not just natalya boots + ring.
I welcome the nerf.

PS: I have fairly well geared monk and DH, and I dont use natalya set, because its too generic.

 

[dog$]

Good for you.

I have a CM Wiz. I want CC. I sacrifice sheet DPS and EHP so that I can get CC (without spending billions).
I have a Barb who has a unique build that lets me use Seismic Slam repeatedly (read: not infinitely, read: not broken). I want CC.

I don't have a problem with you not using a Natalya's set.
I don't have a problem with how you play the game.

Why do you have a problem with how I play it?

 

[VALKYRAY]

pvp, do you play it?
I care cause I play pvp
its like playing Marvel vs Capcom 2, everyone just with sentinal, magneto, cable, why cause they OP.

 

[dog$]

No, I don't.

Answer my question, please.

 

[Wickerbasket]

pvp, do you play it?

its like playing Marvel vs Capcom 2, everyone just with sentinal, magneto, cable, why cause they OP.

Blizzard have said they don't plan to balance the game around PVP.

Spoiler

Everyone's going to be one shotting each other anyway.

 

[turnbuckle]

nerfing 2 piece natalya will open a lot of item variaty.
if you want more DPS, you can go with zunimassa boots for more DPS
if you want more eHP, go with iceclimbers or immortal king
I like to see monks and dhs build differently, not just natalya boots + ring.
I welcome the nerf.

PS: I have fairly well geared monk and DH, and I dont use natalya set, because its too generic.

Forcing players to play one handed with a broken keyboard and dirty mousepad while using a cracked monitor outside in the snow on an unstable wifi connection would make things less generic.

Nerfing Crit Damage would open up a lot of variety.
Nerfing Movement speed to make the cap 12% would open up a lot of variety.
Nerfing X will open up variety.

But only because it's making one particular item combination worse, not by making all of the other item combinations better.

 

[dog$]

I care cause I play pvp

So let's eliminate the investment that thousands of players have made, and let's reduce the number of viable builds the game still manages to have - all so that people like you can have a better chance of getting untallied PVP kills against xX_SEPHIROTH_Xx or Goku9000, and subsequently exchange shit talk after the match to see who bitches the most about having the worst ping against the servers.

Seriously?

 

[VALKYRAY]

make other items better how? make boots roll crit chance?
I think everything else are good and balanced as it is.

 

[turnbuckle]

make other items better how? make boots roll crit chance?
I think everything else are good and balanced as it is.

You honestly can't think of any ways to make other items and set bonuses better? You really believe itemization in Diablo is at its pinnacle except for the Nat's 2 piece bonus?

I don't use the nats set for my monk either but that's besides the point.

 

[VALKYRAY]

whats your suggestion

 

[Tarazet]

Forcing players to play one handed with a broken keyboard and dirty mousepad while using a cracked monitor outside in the snow on an unstable wifi connection would make things less generic.

Nerfing Crit Damage would open up a lot of variety.
Nerfing Movement speed to make the cap 12% would open up a lot of variety.
Nerfing X will open up variety.

But only because it's making one particular item combination worse, not by making all of the other item combinations better.

Nerfing black weapons would also open up a lot of variety, but they're noncommittal on even doing that. Critical Damage is definitely out of control. SW:ToR has a similar stat, called Surge, but even if you stack it at the expense of all else you're not going to get it anywhere near the silly levels in Diablo III. Particularly if you're running with 50%+ crit chance, it's just stupid. The #1 monk in the world has 686% CD and 56% crit chance. That means every point of Dexterity or every bit of weapon damage he picks up, he gets almost a 400% additional multiplier in damage.

 

[ertitoagus]

if 100% of people thinks that a change of the 2nd Nat bonus only could be a nerf that only means that inside us, all we know that bonus is so OP compared to the rest of 2nd bonus sets...

that said, why not a buff? (10% cc), or a change (who knows the direction...)

 

[VALKYRAY]

quot from someone on official forum, I think it is very true.

I wouldn't count it as bug. Notice the bonuses missing are the ones that suck the most (with the exception of Natalya). It could be coincidence, but very unlikely one.What I believe is that:1. Weak and useless set bonuses are getting changed or buffed.2. Nat's 2-set is going to get a nerf. Not that I am happy about it, but it's a bonus so good it is used by everyone, not just the DHs, My guess it's going to be changed to something DH specific like Discipline regen.Inna 3-set will most likely have 2-3 spirit per second regen. I think it is in line with 1.0.7 goal of making spirit spenders more attractive. Other choices like AR or LS would also be great but seem less probable to me.

 

[Cipherr]

Nat's 2-piece for the CC is amazing, and the 2-piece Inna's helm and pants for the Dex, IAS and movement speed makes the most sense for pretty much any Monk or DH. Belt pretty much has to be a Witching Hour.

If they nerf my Nats retroactively I am going to fucking rage.

I don't give a fuck about PvP. Fuck that tacked on bullshit. I swear to god if my class eats a fucking nerf BECAUSE of PvP on the same day PvP is added I am going to lose my shit.

Jesus fucking Christ I hate the effect afterthought PvP has on games.