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Divinity: Original Sin |OT| Sandbox RPG. Co-Op friendly. Bread.
- Thread starter Casimir
- Start date
Question about an early fight on the second map:
The fight on the way to the White Witch with the multiple Earth Elementals. Running Pyro/Geo & Air/Hydro casters, everyone's favorite 2H ex- Source Hunter and a Wayfarer (Marks/Hydro). All level 10. Most other fights are no problem thanks to copious amounts of pyro AoE, two heals and an Oath + Fortify buffed Madora.
This fight however is much harder even when attempting to lure them back to the bridge as the summoned Elementals just wreck my casters after appearing in the middle of my group. Thinking I might need a banish summon scroll or book to 'cheat' it.
This fight however is much harder even when attempting to lure them back to the bridge as the summoned Elementals just wreck my casters after appearing in the middle of my group. Thinking I might need a banish summon scroll or book to 'cheat' it.
You can just disable the dual dialogue in the game options for single-player.
LurkerPrime
Member
I need to admit that I used a bad example in Fire Emblem, since the hit/critical chances are stat-based and can happen "randomly." But it is very well designed, since good tactics can limit the randomised risk inherent in its design. Divinity: Original Sin is the same.
There are a multitude of options to limit risk and uncertainty. If you fear critical attacks, cast armour/resistance increasing spells, disable/debuff the enemy, or avoid them altogether. If you cannot hit your target, buff your attack, use precision stances, or simply move closer or flank them. There are always many options.
What I'm saying is, while you cannot prevent a critical hit from possibly occurring, you can use strategy and tactics to limit the possibility of it causing problems. Allowing a cloth-wearing ally to be critically hit is a tactical failure on the player's part, there's no question about it - especially in a game with a plethora of options at all times. For goodness sake, you can even retreat from battle if necessary.
Random chance is built into this game's design. Critical hits are not "luck" they are a risk you are taking by engaging that enemy. Removing the randomness would only make the game more sterile and less interesting. You would no longer expect the unexpected, and would instead anticipate the obvious.
Sentenza
Member
Of course it is, isn't preferences what we were talking about?
as I already pointed more than once I prefer deliberate design over randomness.
Well, no?
I can see where it comes from, but I will never concede it's a good idea, if that's what you are asking, because I genuinely don't feel it is. It cheapens the experience for me.
It's not there, but where would you look for a dead body?
Oh I get it, you're a Creationist.
I guess I just find it weird to consider other people's tastes in stuff like this wrong instead of merely different and/or conflicting with my own.
LurkerPrime
Member
First with Durante, now Tuco... the next thread will have to be:
Divinity: Original Sin |OT2| Let's Play Janken Together
Divinity: Original Sin |OT2| Let's Play Janken Together
Sentenza
Member
The very opposite of it, if we really want to talk about it.Oh I get it, you're a Creationist.
I just don't think evolution is that great as a gameplay mechanic. Especially over a limited amount of time.
What makes them bad for you?
I really like role playing both, managing their personalities to create two consistent but differing personalities is really fun!
Aside from just criticals, in multiple battles I've been frozen, and I don't currently have the option to prevent that (though even if I did through scrolls, which are also given out randomly, that still only works once, and thus isn't a consistent option). Even so, I still have the highest level of Willpower and Body-building currently available on my characters, and am still getting hit with status effects on a consistent basis. I do not find fights enjoyable if I get hit with a status effect at the beginning of the battle that takes a character out of the fight. I simply restart and go "welp, hope I don't get hit with that and have to restart the fight because my character is now stuck for two turns while the enemies wail on me." Strategy is not accounting for the randomness, and it can't because, you know, it's random. It can't, because there is so much of it in any given battle. Thresholds are a much better solution to this problem where I feel like I have some control over what's occurring on the battlefield. Thresholds even make more sense in most contexts! The fact that warmed and chilled are states before frozen and burning seems to be an admittance by the developers of this reality, but it never dawned on them that there was a fundamental problem with the randomness inherent in the battle system.
Also, I've yet to find a strategy that accounts for ranged enemies. Your mage is going to take some hits if they're engaging in the battle with anything but summons (and while summons are good, they're not that good).
Backed this game thanks to Durante's thread last year but just now had time to redeem my code after spending some weeks doing job hunt related stuff. Is there any kind of character builder I can tinker around with before committing to a starting build in game? It's kind of hard to keep track of everything in the ingame character creator.
I disagree with this scenario. There's some very intuitive ways to deal with most status effects if you want, if you don't mind hurting your partners a bit that is.
Dealing with status effects on the fly with creative solutions has been one of the most fun parts of combat for me so far.Madora might get a bit pissed off that I Firefly/Fireball her constantly, but it does the job of dealing with Frozen. Haste works as well if you have that.
I've done this in contexts where it makes sense (character gets frozen and is surrounded, fireball makes sense), but stating that it makes sense at the beginning of a battle, where you're basically just starting with a large life deficit, is silly. At that point it's just far better to restart the fight to save time.I disagree with this scenario. There's some very intuitive ways to deal with most status effects if you want, if you don't mind hurting your partners a bit that is.
Madora might get a bit pissed off that I Firefly/Fireball her constantly, but it does the job of dealing with Frozen.
Haven't found a morgue yet, which is what I was first looking for.
The random loot at least needs to be smart loot based on item type (why dex on heavy plate armour and strength on leather armor ffs) and also base it on party makeup that looks at how many points you have in a class, i.e. at beginning more random then as you get more focused in a class then have actually useful drops. I get so many 1 handed weapons that are 100% useless to me as well as tons of armor pieces that have stupid stats on them, while some of my characters are wearing the starting gear or level 4-5 gear when I am level 10.
Good thing gear isn't really needed other than nice weapons for fighter/ranger/rogue and +con gear for those with glass cannon....
Good thing gear isn't really needed other than nice weapons for fighter/ranger/rogue and +con gear for those with glass cannon....
Moff
Member
maybe its just a question of understing.
while I certainly understand the "thrill" of random loot for games like diablo, where you play the same content over and over and over again, its baffling to me how you can say its equally good as set loot in this game, when we talk about original sin.
the problem with random loot is that quests and other special tasks like exploring and finding a special ornate chest loose all sense of rewards. now you might argue that not everyone values "reward" as much as others, thats ok. but original sin is really an extreme example, it was done especially bad here.
I have played this game for over 60 hours, and I kid you not, my main char, a mage, does not wear a single decent item whre I'd say its good, thats how crappy the loot in this game is. there were even caes of ornate chests where a grey item witthout stats was in it, its incredible. there is absolutely zero sense of reward, zero, and that sucks, its really a flaw of this game and something they should have done differently.
random loot is ok for barrels, crates and trath mobs, sure, but bosses and ornate chests? there arent so many, they should have set that loot by hand, and with uniques. and IF its random, why not make sure its good loot? why not make sure that its ALWAYS and orange item, or two? there were maybe 2 or 3 bosses where you had a guaranteed orange item. and if you do that, why not guarantee that an orange item always has + main stats on it, like + strenght for items that need strenght. not only was random loot bad, but they also didnt do anything to ensure that at least that random loot has a certain usability. its really, really badly done.
and I have to agree with tuco that I do not see how random loot, in anyway, makes a replay more valuable. I have now on my mage a crappy robe and a crappy staff and I'll have a crappy robe and a crappy statt with him in the replay. what does it change if he uses a fire staff instead of a water staff in the replay? or my warrior uses a 2h hammer instead of a 2h sword?
and spells are common enough to get all you want every time you replay the game.
no, I dont really see how random loot is good, its only lazy and cheapens the experience.
Then you revert that large life deficit by using heals and crowd control/stalls. It's only fair that if you tend to get the upper hand on combat, enemies should be able to as well, right? I think it makes for more fun scenarios in the long run.
Losing a turn instead of not losing that turn can be crucial. I'm playing on Lone Wolf so losing that turn becomes huge.
I haven't tried it yet, but I'd imagine Lone Wolf is more suited to a very careful play-style where you're already aware of everything that is coming up and you set up the battles to your advantage as much as possible (even ending some boss fights in 1 turn with the environment). Ideally you'd have already disabled any chances of you getting hit by a status effect in that case by walling off/disabling anyone that can do it before the battle starts. Basically for fans of something like a BG2 solo run, which require some heavy preparations.
I think there'd be a huge balancing problem if you were to reduce the chances of status effects on your own players. If the saving throws for enemies were much lower and for players much higher, then the combat would no longer be as fair as it needs to be. If they were balanced to be less effective, I'd probably not use status effect skills at all for crowd control, making the current battles a lot more overwhelming and longer.
If this were the case, just taking it out until NG+ is not difficult. Also, I've done BG2 solo runs before and I've largely found that using summons can solve most problems (with some caveats). Playing as a Warrior is super ballsy and fun though.
I'm not talking about removing or making the chance smaller on the player, rather that thresholds seem like a better solution to the issue. Warm and Chilled statuses are central to the issue, seeming like there is an awareness of the problem but not ultimately implementing the easy solution.
Anyone who finished it or is near the end can tell me how close to the end I am?
I just
I'm 45 hours into the game and just curious how many hours more I'll need.
I just
finished the fight in the Immaculate cathedral and got myself the blood and got only that spider area in the west to clear in the second act.
Around 15 i would say.
Barack Lesnar
Banned
I might just start over. I don't like the fact that my 'fighter' and Madora basically use the same skills. My Wayfarer (the bow ranger with a point in Geomancer) kinda sucks too... she's just ugh, attacks once per turn and usually misses, Richochet is always on cooldown, even the Spider sucks... spider misses a lot. I guess it's just the early game blues, I'm sure she gets better.
Fuck it, I'm starting over.
I'll do:
Wayfarer + I dunno... dammit lol.
Wayfarer + someone quite different from Madora and Jahan. Any suggestions? Maybe a shadowblade or rogue? but people are saying you don't even need to sneak around or lockpick.
LurkerPrime
Member
There are henchmen available very early in the game that will allow you to make whatever party you want. You're not obligated to use Madora or Jahan.
Barack Lesnar
Banned
I like the fact that Madora and Jahan have their own dialogue, though. Do the henchman (you mean the 3 sailors?) also have it?
LurkerPrime
Member
No dialog or personality. They're just there as mindless automatons for you to command. But they are available in a wide variety of builds and levels, to fill any hole in your party. It certainly beats restarting.
But they aren't sailors. If you want to know how to access them, highlight this:
Visit the crime scene in the Inn, then teleport back to the End. Follow the Imp's lead from there to the Hall of Heroes (I think that's the name). If you don't know what the End is, you'll find out soon enough - visit the healer's house in Cyseal to get started on your journey there.
I restarted the game three or four times and basically just designed my own characters that I felt worked with my playstyle. I was never comfortable with the pre-designed characters.
If you get that OCD itch, you can really design your starting characters any way you want. I always love a good character design sheet.
You hear that Larian, you lazy fucks? Your grand, overarching design choice of a randomised world in which strategy and adaptation is the play focus is wrong. I mean, what kind of adventure doesn't have guaranteed epic loot with big golden numbers in their description? A cheap lazy adventure, that's what kind. I bet the DMs in your P&P games even do things differently when they re-run their campaigns, don't they? You disgust me Larian!
Ugh, quite a lot then
You could be faster than me but you are missing quiet a bit.. Steam says i spent 57 hours ingame.
Prototype Viktor
Member
far too much poison in the game
That's what rain is for!
Does rain work indoors/caves? Thinking on it, I've never tried it.
I gotta admit I like doing this. The smoke causes some significant vision problems though.
Just find it annoying having to answer twice.
In coop it would be great but in singleplayer it just feels weird and wastes time. I know what I want and I'm not into playing two different characters with different personalities.
Cool I'll check it out.
Wheelatron
Member
Madora makes my Ranger look like useless peasant. I get 16 ap/turn on the Ranger with barely any skills worth using them on. Richochet, a starting skill, has been the most useful skill so far. After picking up Mute, Rapture, and all the special arrows, Ranger feels more and more like a support class, even with Glass Cannon. Meanwhile, Madora will walk in and Whirlwind 6 dudes.
Smoke visibility is the worst! I just hate it when I set a whole area on fire and damage a bunch of enemies and feel great, only to realize that the next step of my strategy has to be delayed because I can't target anyone inside that area now. Lol.
Moff
Member
but its not a randomised world, what makes you think that?
there are no varying quests. every barrel and crate is always the same, every mob and boss hand placed. the only random in this world is the loot.
Are we entering a world of meta-sarcasm now or something?
Still loving Fire Elemental. Considering investing in Aerotheurge for teleport spells. Thoughts/opinions?
Only randomised in the sense that it's attempting a level of simulation in how it models vendor stock levels changing and whatever might be within any given container, stuff that would be 'random'. You don't go adventuring in an unknown region knowing exactly what items stores are going to have in stock, nor what Mrs McGumble will have in her trash barrel that day. You're right though, randomised was a poor choice of word. Replace with, I don't know, 'unpredictable'? I consider the early unknown skill-book progression that's inherent to the game a bit of a random element. Similar to how loot's handled, I think the unpredictable skill-book system is by design rather than laziness.
IMACOMPUTA
Member
Pretty early in the game question : (murder quest)
Where do i find the sorceress' secret hideout? It said northwest beach but I'm not finding it. Also, I just read the poem thing while in the right position to reveal it, right?