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DriveClub Review Thread.

benny_a

extra source of jiggaflops
It's just a high falutin way of saying "I don't like something, and that something is to blame." without going to the trouble of figuring out why I don't like it.
I think that is the difference between the art of critique and many reviewers.

This discussion goes back more than 10 years and the former are trying to figure out why (and why not) they like something while the latter just give their feelings and try to save people from spending money on a product they don't think is worthwhile.
 

QaaQer

Member
I just read that Jeff at Giant Bomb gave this a 2/5. Jesus that's bad. Listening to him on the bombcast right now, atleast he isn't chirping the lack of open world.

Jeff is awesome because of his honesty. But dude is like 45 and really tired of videogames.
 
I dunno man. We adapt. Easily. That's our key feature. Having said that, the game has excellent handling imo. So it will differ from person to person. And from car to car..

Yeah. Handling is awesome. Comparing DC's handling to The Crew's is like comparing night and day. I HATED The Crew, it's like shitty Watch Dogs.
 

Ploid 3.0

Member
all the shit aside, I am looking forward to it and for it to expand.

I mean if I don`t support it...what hope do i have in seeing yakuza lambos on tokyo night tracks?

jlf1OP_resize.jpg

0yakuzalambos1.gif

What the heck. This is awesome.
 
LOL! I just realized Gamespot gave LocoCycle a higher review score than Driveclub:

LocoCycle: 6/10

Similar but not identical genres, it's hard to believe Driveclub is worse than LocoCycle.

The similarities between Driveclub and Lococyle end at both games taking place on pavement. You can't just take a review for a different game and use that to prove why the score for another game is wrong.
 

Atomski

Member
Jeff is awesome because of his honesty. But dude is like 45 and really tired of videogames.

He seemed to like Forza Horizon 2 just fine..

LOL! I just realized Gamespot gave LocoCycle a higher review score than Driveclub:

LocoCycle: 6/10

Similar but not identical genres, it's hard to believe Driveclub is worse than LocoCycle.

Im sure someone found the ridiculous stupidity of the game redeeming.. the whole its so dumb its good.

DC surely doesn't have that quality.
 

Curufinwe

Member
The similarities between Driveclub and Lococyle end at both games taking place on pavement. You can't just take a review for a different game and use that to prove why the score for another game is wrong.

It doesn't prove the GS DC review is wrong. But it is amazing such a terrible, throwaway game got 6 from GS.
 

XGoldenboyX

Member
There are the kind of journalism criticism that has no value what so ever.. its all pure complaining...

Eurogamer: a massive reduction in environment detail visible in the rear view mirror when driving via the cockpit view - spectators, trees and geometry details are all ruthlessly culled, although these have no impact on the mirror's practical use.

its the same for all racing games outhere....Whats the point sometimes with these type of comments ? its like nitpicking
 
Hope for a better written review maybe



This encapsulates the problem with so many of the DriveClub reviews today. It's embarrassing that this is just the first paragraph, but the entire review is case after case of reviewing the game for what he wishes it was rather than what it actually is. In this paragraph, for example, he's not actually telling us why this so-called era of "arcade-to-simulation.. car upgrades" is inherently superior to the alternative, or why not having that impacts the game negatively. And he does not address that issue at any point in his review, in fact later going so far as to shamefully suggest that the lack of upgrades meant the game felt unfinished. This is an acceptable critical thought? This is the bullshit that passes muster these days? Instead, it's Jeff gleefully wishing right from the start that he was playing a completely different racing game with completely different goals, rather than evaluating DriveClub as it succeeds (or not) at its own unique racing goals.

DriveClub is a pure skill-based racer; it intentionally does not have those upgrades because it harkens to a time when racing games had no inhibition between the skill of the player and the competition on the road. There's no amount of hours you can play to earn an arbitrary upgrade to make your race ever-so-slightly better than the others around you. There's no skill bonus you get from playing 20 hours more than your next competitor. It's just your skills, your competitors and the finish line. And there's absolutely no reason why any reviewer worth their salt should be even implying that upgrades are now some necessary component of the genre. They're not. They're one specific path in the genre, of which we exist in an industry perfectly capable of having great entries in all types of racing games.

There are both positives and negatives to this design strategy, and the goal would be to discuss how exactly DriveClub mishandles this approach rather than wishing it chose goals which would make it a completely different racing game. These criticisms are from a position of someone who thinks it's his place to dismiss an entire subcategory of racing games simply because he's too daft to understand the many myriad of ways such things are positive. It's the very definition of lacking the ability to properly analyze a product, and this is his fucking job. He's reviewing from the premise that it's bad from the get go, because he feels since other racing games have upgrades, that means ones which don't feel empty or boring by comparison!

He ends his opening nonsense salvo with an attack of "old school" racing games, as if there was anything inherently negative with those. Some of the best racing games ever made are old school, and are as no-frills and no-bullshit as DriveClub.

So many of these game reviewers don't actually understand the concept of criticism.



as i've said earlier, most reviewers are skewed to a certain tastes these days. instead of talking about the game, their reviews devolve into "this doesn't have this..it would've been better had it had this...where is this..." trying to transform games into what they think is ideal for that genre.


it's a good thing devs only listen to player feedback. otherwise we'd be getting the same types of games for genres which these reviewers are ignorant of.


i often see reviewers go to details like bullet drop in fps games, but when it comes to genres where they're unfamiliar with they go "driving is great. handling is clunky." you see this in every genre that has a specific audience.
 

benny_a

extra source of jiggaflops
There are the kind of journalism criticism that has no value what so ever.. its all pure complaining...

its the same for all racing games outhere....Whats the point sometimes with these type of comments ? its like nitpicking
It's still true and their analysis of the game includes that part because it's an analysis.

If they didn't mention it, it would be a worse analysis than it is.
 

KOHIPEET

Member
Hope for a better written review maybe



This encapsulates the problem with so many of the DriveClub reviews today. It's embarrassing that this is just the first paragraph, but the entire review is case after case of reviewing the game for what he wishes it was rather than what it actually is. In this paragraph, for example, he's not actually telling us why this so-called era of "arcade-to-simulation.. car upgrades" is inherently superior to the alternative, or why not having that impacts the game negatively. And he does not address that issue at any point in his review, in fact later going so far as to shamefully suggest that the lack of upgrades meant the game felt unfinished. This is an acceptable critical thought? This is the bullshit that passes muster these days? Instead, it's Jeff gleefully wishing right from the start that he was playing a completely different racing game with completely different goals, rather than evaluating DriveClub as it succeeds (or not) at its own unique racing goals.

DriveClub is a pure skill-based racer; it intentionally does not have those upgrades because it harkens to a time when racing games had no inhibition between the skill of the player and the competition on the road. There's no amount of hours you can play to earn an arbitrary upgrade to make your race ever-so-slightly better than the others around you. There's no skill bonus you get from playing 20 hours more than your next competitor. It's just your skills, your competitors and the finish line. And there's absolutely no reason why any reviewer worth their salt should be even implying that upgrades are now some necessary component of the genre. They're not. They're one specific path in the genre, of which we exist in an industry perfectly capable of having great entries in all types of racing games.

There are both positives and negatives to this design strategy, and the goal would be to discuss how exactly DriveClub mishandles this approach rather than wishing it chose goals which would make it a completely different racing game. These criticisms are from a position of someone who thinks it's his place to dismiss an entire subcategory of racing games simply because he's too daft to understand the many myriad of ways such things are positive. It's the very definition of lacking the ability to properly analyze a product, and this is his fucking job. He's reviewing from the premise that it's bad from the get go, because he feels since other racing games have upgrades, that means ones which don't feel empty or boring by comparison!

He ends his opening nonsense salvo with an attack of "old school" racing games, as if there was anything inherently negative with those. Some of the best racing games ever made are old school, and are as no-frills and no-bullshit as DriveClub.

So many of these game reviewers don't actually understand the concept of criticism.

Exactly.

Giving less points for a racing game because it basically does nothing else than just racing itself (and itn a really pure and challenging form) is nuts. Also when did "I don't like it" and "I would like some" become commonly used terms in the so called "objective" reviewing.

Smash a game if it promises the stars but delivers a ceiling with led lights in it, not a game that promises racing and delivers EXACTLY that.
 

Amneisac

Member
Exactly.

Giving less points for a racing game because it basically does nothing else than just racing itself (and itn a really pure and challenging form) is nuts. Also when did "I don't like it" and "I would like some" become commonly used terms in the so called "objective" reviewing.

Smash a game if it promises the stars but delivers a ceiling with led lights in it, not a game that promises racing and delivers EXACTLY that.

But when the "racing itself" isn't good, you have a problem. Quoting GB:

Driveclub looks nice and has a couple of good ideas about handling leaderboard challenges, but the core of it--actually driving a car--drags the entire thing down.

I don't know, review threads are getting pretty hostile. So many people out to flame and defend, it's a shame really.
 
But when the "racing itself" isn't good, you have a problem. Quoting GB:



I don't know, review threads are getting pretty hostile. So many people out to flame and defend, it's a shame really.


if you read further the person goes on to say being in the middle between sim and arcade is a negative.

apparently we can either have a sim or an arcade and anything else is inauthentic.
 
LOL! I just realized Gamespot gave LocoCycle a higher review score than Driveclub:

LocoCycle: 6/10

Similar but not identical genres, it's hard to believe Driveclub is worse than LocoCycle.

They were both reviewed in the context of price and type of game they are. Hence why so many smartphone games get 9/10 and yet so few console games do these days.

Apples to oranges, basically.
 

KOHIPEET

Member
if you read further the person goes on to say being in the middle between sim and arcade is a negative.

apparently we can either have a sim or an arcade and anything else is inauthentic.

Yeah. Would have been a bit less irritating if he had wrote it like this.

"The driving mechanics of this game tries to navigate between simulation and arcade, which isn't bad, but if you like either the former or the latter there might be a chance you won't like driveclub's driving."

This way he could have phrased his opinion without actually describing the game's driving as bad and the reader would still know if this game is for him/her or not. IMO
 

benny_a

extra source of jiggaflops
Usually the deflection is when someone compares from the same outlet that it wasn't the same reviewer. When that deflection fails then it's always something else.

Reviewers have it good, nothing they write can ever be compared. ;-)
 

nib95

Banned
But when the "racing itself" isn't good, you have a problem. Quoting GB:

Because he wanted it to be more sim like and didn't like the fact that it was something in-between. In other words, it didn't handle how he personally wanted or preferred, which is nonsense. If a game is not going for simulation racing, there's no need to dock it for that. This is a Simcade track based title. Not an arcade racer, not a sim racer, not an open world racer.

This quote just comes off as so arrogant to me.

Jeff | GiantBomb said:
But it's worth pointing out that Driveclub isn't an especially realistic simulation of driving, and apparently that's by design. The cars have an overly grippy feel on the track, letting you get away with some occasional shenanigans by braking at the last possible moment instead of gently braking or coasting into the curves. The developers claim this is an attempt to make the game easier and fun for everyone. But this doesn't make the game feel more fun or thrilling. It just makes what otherwise feels like an attempt at simulating real cars instead feel like it misses the mark by a mile.

Apparently. The developers claim. An attempt at simulating real cars. Talk about contradictory. If they tell you they're going for simcade, it's because they are. There's no apparently about it. By virtue, this also means they were not attempting to simulate real cars, otherwise they would have actually gone for sim, instead of simcade.

Review totally misses the mark.
 
It's the same sources every time that are hard to please when it comes to PS4 exclusives: Eurogamer, Gamespot and Giant Bomb.

I expect a cynical reception from these guys when it comes to PS4 1st party titles every time. I think all to some degree are more aligned to Xbox historically, and you have to accept that this will skew their opinions in some way just as it would any gamer that has a system preference.

Just because Gertsmann is on the internet doesn't mean he won't have a platform preference. It's not a crime obviously, but I don't think it's the best perspective to review games.
 

Draft

Member
Hopefully Metacritic will start counting Neogaf.com forum posts and give #Driveclub the aggregate score it deserves.
 

benny_a

extra source of jiggaflops
Just because Gertsmann is on the internet doesn't mean he won't have a platform preference. It's not a crime obviously, but I don't think it's the best perspective to review games.
Everyone has biases and all you can do is accept it.

Gerstmann has said he thinks Sony has the weakest first party portfolio of all the platform holder every time it has come up.
The only thing Sony can do to win him over is trying new IP. Obviously they've failed in this instance.
 
It's the same sources every time that are hard to please when it comes to PS4 exclusives: Eurogamer, Gamespot and Giant Bomb.

I expect a cynical reception from these guys when it comes to PS4 1st party titles every time. I think all to some degree are more aligned to Xbox historically, and you have to accept that this will skew their opinions in some way just as it would any gamer that has a system preference.

Just because Gertsmann is on the internet doesn't mean he won't have a platform preference. It's not a crime obviously, but I don't think it's the best perspective to review games.


That's quite an assumption you're making there.

Everyone has biases and all you can do is accept it.

Gerstmann has said he thinks Sony has the weakest first party portfolio of all the platform holder every time it has come up.
The only thing Sony can do to win him over is trying new IP. Obviously they've failed in this instance.


That's because, arguably, that is very much true (at this point in time anyway).

(fyi: I went with a PS4 over an XB1)
 

MegaboyX

Neo Member
That's what I've heard from most people. Shame really, but can't say my expectations were high.

Different games for different folks. I like it for that very reason. I think it controls great and I don't like games where you can customize all the different options. I just want to get in and race, nice and simple.

If you don't like that kind of game, fine but I like that there are different games out there for different people and I think we need more of it.
 
Oooh so this ISNT open world? Well that's great. I hate open world in my racing games. I spend more time focused on the map instead of the race(I'm looking at your burnout paradise). Well now I look forward to trying out the demo when its finally out on PS+
 

flkraven

Member
Comparing games like this used to get you banned. I'd watch out.

I didn't mean it in any sort of malicious way. Noticed both games involve the player driving a vehicel, both reviewed by same reviewer, and both on new gen consoles. They are, without question, different games appealing to different markets, but I find it interesting how 1 scored higher than the other while most everyone else feels it's the other way around. It's just interesting how this stuff shakes out, and how perspectives and timing really have a big impact on how games review (ie. the Perfect Dark Zero reviews when 360 launched, etc).
 
He is as susceptible as everyone else. Every memory that makes up the person Jeff Gerstmann factors into his reviews.

Of course, that is the entire point of a personality based website. But the idea that his (supposed) dislike for the Sony platform colored this review is pretty ridiculous.

Did anyone say that about PGR games? And if a PGR game came out today, it has to be judged by the current standards. PGR4 was 7 years ago.

Couple pages ago.
 

whybag

Neo Member
The cars have an overly grippy feel on the track, letting you get away with some occasional shenanigans by braking at the last possible moment instead of gently braking or coasting into the curves.

For a racing game, he's really going to have to define "gentle" braking to me. I've never done much in cars on a track, but from my experience racing motorcycles this is kinda how you set PR times. Accelerate hard, brake as hard as possible w/o locking up tires, lean in while rolling throttle, accelerate hard out of turn and repeat. Unless it's hilariously overdone 200-20mph in a second, I've seen several videos where people lock up tires and fish tail into turns.

Apparently. The developers claim. An attempt at simulating real cars. Talk about contradictory. If they tell you they're going for simcade, it's because they are. There's no apparently about it. By virtue, this also means they were not attempting to simulate real cars, otherwise they would have actually gone for sim, instead of simcade.

"It's attempting to simulate real cars, except the developer says they aren't, and I don't like that they aren't simulating real cars real enough."
 

benny_a

extra source of jiggaflops
Of course, that is the entire point of a personality based website. But the idea that his (supposed) dislike for the Sony platform in any way factored into this review is pretty ridiculous.
But if you agree that he is as susceptible as everyone else, why is it impossible that these things factor into his review?

I'm not saying it is (I think his reviews reveal that he values certain things that are not found in Driveclub), but you say it's ridiculous to even entertain the notion that he might be influenced by what Coloumb says.
 
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