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[01011001]

I can't wait to see the next Fifa with a giant USK18 badge on it

This is stupid. Lootboxes are not gambling. It's the digital version of baseball cards. There have been multiple lawsuits against cardmakers alleging that those cards are gambling and they have been ruled not gambling every time.

I agree neither are gambling. the issue with lootboxes in games is not that they are gambling, but that they use the same audio-visual stimuli and the same immediacy as a slot-machine. they are deliberately designed to be addicting.
a card pack doesn't have even remotely the same stimuli and potential addictiveness due to it literally just being a plastic bag that you open up... no fanfare, no animation and sound that are designed to hook you in.

which is why I always said it is a stupid idea to argue that they're Gambling, as that will lead to cases being dismissed. but arguing that they use the exact same stimuli and tactics as casinos do in slot machines, THAT is a fact and that is why they should be regulated and made available only to adults.

 

[Endless Fluff]

This is stupid. Lootboxes are not gambling. It's the digital version of baseball cards. There have been multiple lawsuits against cardmakers alleging that those cards are gambling and they have been ruled not gambling every time.

This has nothing to do with gambling laws. This is about youth protections laws. The argument is that this fucks up a children's development (gambling addiction), hence it shouldn't belong in children's hands. Lootboxes are still not classified as gambling with this overhauled law.

I can't wait to see the next Fifa with a giant USK18 badge on it

Look forward to the humongous "has in-game purchases that may harm the growth of children"-label as well, as this is also one of the demands from the lawmakers. They want proper and easily visible labels for this shit.

 

[MrTroubleMaker]

The reich pics .. also good

 

[BlitzerRadic]

I agree neither are gambling. the issue with lootboxes in games is not that they are gambling, but that they use the same audio-visual stimuli and the same immediacy as a slot-machine. they are deliberately designed to be addicting.
a card pack doesn't have even remotely the same stimuli and potential addictiveness due to it literally just being a plastic bag that you open up... no fanfare, no animation and sound that are designed to hook you in.

I strongly disagree with this. I've spent many thousands on sports cards over the years and the act of opening up a pack can be very exciting. I remember when I was a kid I saved up money to buy a single pack of cards that cost like $10 which was a lot of money to me at the time. I bought it at a baseball card shop and my hands were shaking when opened it up and I was so excited and nervous at the same time as everyone in the shop was watching me to see what I got.

Ever heard of box breaking? It's the modern day equivalent of what I described above. You buy a box or case of cards and the place you bought it from opens it at a set time and it's live streamed to anyone who wants to watch. Obviously the act of opening packs is satisfying (even to people who have no stake) otherwise box breaking would not be so popular.

 

[MrA]

sony and microsoft can't like the sound of that either, they get 30% of that loot box money so we're talking hundreds of millions of dollars per year.

 

[AJUMP23]

Just about fell out of my chair when I saw the 4th Reich.
Merkel is a tough nut.

 

[ACESHIGH]

Hopefully this doesn't impact fortnite. I still want kids funding those epic freebies on pc.

 

[Shmunter]

Is German6 a relevant enough market to put EA into suicide watch? Is it the president?

 

[01011001]

Is German6 a relevant enough market to put EA into suicide watch? Is it the president?

I think many assume that Germany, being one of the most influential countries, if not the most influential country in europe, will start a domino effect. also it is one of the biggest markets in europe especially for FIFA

 

[Windle Poons]

That last image needs updating.....

Christ remember the time when you could have that many people in a room next to each other?

 

[Dunki]

If Germany takes my Gacha games I will become Antifa and terrorize Germany...

We can not even vaccine 5 Million people and this is what they are doing?

 

[HerjansEagleFeeder]

Thank god for lobbyism. Otherwise this country probably would've tried to save adults from themselves, again. Like with everything else. Well except prostitution because that's apparently completely OK, according to German leftists.

 

[Dunki]

Thank god for lobbyism. Otherwise this country probably would've tried to save adults from themselves, again. Like with everything else. Well except prostitution because that's apparently completely OK, according to German leftists.

Why should prostitution be illegal? By making it legal they pay taxes gets helath benefits and it is less sex traffic

 

[Cyberpunkd]

I strongly disagree with this. I've spent many thousands on sports cards over the years and the act of opening up a pack can be very exciting. I remember when I was a kid I saved up money to buy a single pack of cards that cost like $10 which was a lot of money to me at the time. I bought it at a baseball card shop and my hands were shaking when opened it up and I was so excited and nervous at the same time as everyone in the shop was watching me to see what I got.

The difference - for the 100th time - is baseball cards were not designed down to a border of the pack, the shine and the sound it makes when you open it to hook you up and excite you to buy another one. You bought them and got pleasure because you were into baseball. Loot boxes are engineered on purpose using psychology and the theory regarding satisfaction to be addictive, and then targeted at a group of population that is extremely ill-equipped to resist the pressure.
Even if your argument held true this is like arguing this should still be a thing:

 

[TheAssist]

....

While I do believe you, I also think there are a lot of variables. When looking at studies its always important to know what exactly your looking for and the way they were designed (also, who sponsored them). If you design a lootbox system with the maingoal of giving people some excitement and fun I'm pretty sure you can design it in a non predatory way that can even enhance the engagement of the player without harming him. Heck, thats how most games work in some way or another and most people dont get addicted to them (loot systems are nothing new after all).

However, there is also a science that studies exactly how to design systems that trigger people into spending more money. To create exactly the right reward loops, at the right time with audio visual feedback and what not (and something in me believes those werent the ones studied in your exmaples).
You're right that lootboxes dont have to be addicting if designed in an ethical manner. However, that also means trusting companies to always design these systems by a strict ethical code, which .... eh I dont trust them. Again the industry had the time and ability to self regulate and come up with "good loot box practices" but they didn't and let predatory companies ruin it for everyone. So the states had to come in and regulate it for them. Its really the industries fault in my opinion and they knew it was coming. Surprise mechanics my ass. They didnt even try to come up with a compromise.

Of course it sucks for companies that actually tried to protect their customers and designed system that did not try to provoke actual gambling behavior, but as far as I know there are gaming associations in all major countries who could have stepped in years ago but kept pretty much silent as far as I can remember. But maybe someone has more insight into this.

 

[HerjansEagleFeeder]

Why should prostitution be illegal? By making it legal they pay taxes gets helath benefits and it is less sex traffic

Yes, that's exactly the kind of bullshit leftists are repeating over and over here in Germany to legitimize it. It sounds wonderfully in theory. Just never lives up to it in practice. Like all leftist ideas. Why it should be illegal? Because civilized countries don't tolerate obscenities that undermine human dignity.

 

[Dunki]

Yes, that's exactly the kind of bullshit leftists are repeating over and over here in Germany to legitimize it. It sounds wonderfully in theory. Just never lives up to it in practice. Like all leftist ideas. Why it should be illegal? Because civilized countries don't tolerate obscenities that undermine human dignity.

If a women or men wants to sell his or her body for the benefit of Money and make it a legal business I really have no problem with it. Whx should anyone care?

 

[TheAssist]

This is stupid. Lootboxes are not gambling. It's the digital version of baseball cards. There have been multiple lawsuits against cardmakers alleging that those cards are gambling and they have been ruled not gambling every time.

Furthermore, I seriously doubt EA or any other company want to get kids paying for lootboxes because legally kids cant enter into contracts and if they get sued they have to give the money back. That's why whenever you hear these stories about some kid spending 10k on mtx the company always gives it back.

The reason they have not been ruled as gambling isnt because they arent inducing gambling like behavior, its because you dont earn physical good (with a real life value) or actual money. Virtual cards or currencies dont have any real life value, hence its not gambling. This has been the way these companies could argue in court every time.

You're talking about these extreme cases that are few and far between. The correct question would be, when do you want children to be exposed to these (sometimes predatory) systems that are designed to make you spend money. Sure with good parenting and supervision you can start sooner and teach them about the dangers so they have context. But in a time when both parents have to work all day, often 6 days a week its hard to keep up a constant supervision and its hard to get into all the details especially when the parents dont know anything about gaming at all. And as a parent I wouldnt trust a company like EA to do a good job pretecting my child from pretty much anything.

 

[Barakov]

Ze Germans are at it again.

Zauce: https://www.spiegel.de/netzwelt/net...uetzen-a-5dd1781c-c458-4165-a571-b0dcbe72ba3a

Also very nice.

 

[NahaNago]

Will this even matter that much in the future. More and more games are being bought digitally.

 

[Vae_Victis]

If you want fuck gaming market and make law that will allow companies to make dlc only with ratting as high as base game one then that's exactly how you get that law.

While ESRB is mostly a political lobbying group, my understanding is that the USK (German game rating group) and PEGI (most of the rest of Europe) generally are legally enforced with liabilities for stores that choose to sell games to minors with certain ratings. I know Germany tends to be stricter than the other two having outright banned games with images of Nazis and other things at times in the past.

EA could find themselves in hot water if they try to skirt around age ratings with updates or "free" dlc they they encourage everyone to get. My bet is that they'll just disable purchases of this stuff in Germany and hope people complain to the legal groups enough to change the policies.

I know for a fact this would be 100% accounted for and permitted as of now under PEGI. The rating is given for individual "items" to which the user can gain access, regardless of what is gated behind a paywall and what isn't.

For example, you can have a paid game rated 12+, and then a free DLC rated 18+. In theory, of course, a minor would not be allowed to access the DLC wherever PEGI is enforced by law (it's not the case in all the countries that adopt it, for example in Italy it has no legal value), but that is up to the online store the game is linked to to check, and it's obviously a lot easier to lie there.

I don't know how the USK treats these cases however, it's possible they also look at the additional content for the game when rating it, even though it sounds a bit unlikely to me.

 

[Old Empire.]

This is stupid. Lootboxes are not gambling. It's the digital version of baseball cards. There have been multiple lawsuits against cardmakers alleging that those cards are gambling and they have been ruled not gambling every time.

Furthermore, I seriously doubt EA or any other company want to get kids paying for lootboxes because legally kids cant enter into contracts and if they get sued they have to give the money back. That's why whenever you hear these stories about some kid spending 10k on mtx the company always gives it back.

EA prices the loot boxes extraordinarily high that you can look at it as gambling. You paying cash to buy better stat players to beat opponents online. Better stat players run faster, play the ball better, secure and defend better, that's the whole point of the ultimate team mode. You even see Fifa pros admitting online they pay out thousands in cash to play tournaments' matches. Above skilled player cannot do this at all unless the use their credit card or play every day for hours to catch up.

 

[HerjansEagleFeeder]

Edit: F**k this sh**

 

[Spukc]

HAHAHAHAH GET FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCKED

 

[CosmicHusky]

This is great, I hope things are going to continue this way!

 

[Orta]

Anything, ANYTHING that negatively impacts EA is fine by me.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

RIP FIFA Ultimate Team.

 

[Miles708]

This is great news and all but... what's stopping EA from patching microtransactions after launch?
Didn't the latest Crash Team Racing do the same kind of stunt, just to avoid backlash and ratings?

Never underestimate the power of a Big Company acting in bad faith.

 

[Kamina]

I think EA can move FUT from the game itself to a separate, free DLC.

So the game itself would get the same age rating it has now, and the DLC would be 18+. And since nobody gives a fuck about DLC age rating, this move wouldn't change anything for them.

If it's free DLC it still has age rating and also requires confirmation of payment information when you want to add it to the account. So it is subject to child protection settings.
But I agree that this could be a loophole.

Chance is that, if they go this road, more attention is drawn to the DLC market eventually and heavier regulations will be put in place there as well.