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[FunnyBunny]

I think this would be an unfortunate policy by Microsoft if true.

• 20% of Americans do not have internet
• 34% of Americans do not have high-speed internet
• http://dashboard.digitalinfo.org/trends/view/internet

Microsoft, or any company that forces a constant connection, is willingly giving-up on a third of US homes.

 

[RedNumberFive]

Are people really defending this? Wow.

Microsoft could go around pouring sugar into gamer's gas tanks, and someone on GAF would defend it.

 

[GlamFM]

Originally Posted by BruceLeeRoy:




Not every gamer is rich and some people like to be able to buy multiple games in a relatively short time frame. Not everyone buys only 1 game a year. Not everyone wants to blow $60-$70 on a new unproven IP or franchise. If you do not like the game or if you get bored of it quick, you re stuck with it. Demos are not always indicative of the final product either. Plain and simple, if companies even consider getting rid of used games which imo is anti-consumer, they need to lower game prices to more reasonable prices. We had so many bombs and studio closings this generation where you can actually get rid of the game if you weren't satisfied with it. What's going to happen when games cost more to procure and you cannot get rid of them or try them out?

Call Of Duty 14 cant come soon enough!

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

The reason people are taking this "rumor" serious is because we've seen rumors similar to this materialize more than once.

 

[Portugeezer]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mHGq-SWqjg

.

 

[pixlexic]

how many pc games are even sold physically anymore?
aren't the majority of pc game sales on steam
which is a...drm service where you have to be online to play the games?

PC gamers are a elitist group it's a bit different. Even though you see everyone here talking up PC gaming doesn't mean the vastly larger mass consumer base is the same.

 

[xandaca]

I don't see the 'always online' thing happening - internet connections in Europe and the US aren't good enough yet for it to be a serious possibility, not to mention that such a feature would surely weigh heavily on the many households with download limits. The second-hand game blocking I can see though, it would win MS big kudos with third parties and as long as they're still making money by the metric tonnage - and they will, because protestors would only represent a tiny minority of the userbase and even then, likely be suckered in by a handful of exclusives - they won't care if it attracts a few complaints.

 

[j0hnny_385]

24 -> 41 pages...I can't follow this thread any more. *sigh*

 

[abadguy]

Good for you, just no need act obnoxious to people who want to believe a respected site over patents, especially since many patents get filed and nothing comes of it.

Is what i said anymore obnoxious than

The deflection by Xbox fans in this thread has been nothing short of masterful.

Also a patent shows that they at least had intent even if they don't use it. I doubt they just filed it for shits and giggles.

 

[Corto]

How ignorant. Third parties will only use this for further justification of draconian DRM on PC as well for parity, especially when always-online becomes integrated into game's featuresets to make it further justifiable.

That's completely ignoring the importance on the PC of Steam, GOG.com, and direct access to indie developers stores. Windows 8 could be a hint going towards a walled garden ecosystem with one gate keeper instead of the free environment we have now, but until then, PC remains the most open platform for gaming.

 

[Zombie James]

As excited as I am about new hardware, preventing the borrowing/trading/buying of used games is something I can't and won't support.

 

[InfiniDragon]

Whoa wait up...always online and DRM?

That seriously might be deal breaker for me. I already have a PC, MS.

That could hurt their sales badly if true.

 

[quest]

Yeah, if the trade off is steam like holiday sales, I could get behind it. Honestly if a game system and a game doesn't have a whack control scheme, I will put up with BS to play it.

Never going to happen they won't under cut retail prices that is why current DD is horrible. And secondly console gamers subsidize those steam sales buying games at 59.99. Publishers need money from some where selling a game that costs 100 million to develop for 10 dollars is a good way to go out of business quick.

 

[Nibel]

Are people really defending this? Wow.

The hunger for a new console lets some people forget about their rights and things like.. freedom of choice? Dunno, seems pretty dumb to defend stuff like this

 

[ASIS]

You can bet that is the perspective both companies are looking at. They don't care that you borrow games or use Redbox exclusively. That [purchaser] makes them no money.

So getting rid of market share and mindshare is exactly what MS and Sony are looking for, with no real increase in revenue since those "second hand" buyers aren't likely to kneel over the new business model.

If the industry is really getting too big then why not just reduce the costs?

 

[Pociask]

It should be easy to "flip" games. If a game no longer holds any value for you, the market benefits most if you can sell it to someone for whom it does have value. The publishers evidently expect that person to buy a brand-new copy while your copy sits on your bookshelf gathering dust and never being played.

If publishers want us to hold on to our games forever, so that there's little or no used market, they can start by producing games that people want to hold on to forever.

I'd add in, it's apparent that a lot of people who trade in games really only value their new games at about $20-30 - they pay the initial $60, but only on the expectation that they'll get back $30-$40 of that. Then you have price sensitive consumers, who buy new, but wait for a price drop. Then again, you have price sensitive consumers who buy used. The pool of people who are willing to buy a brand new $60 release, and then let it sit pristine on their bookshelves (presumably the same people that buy collector/special editions) is very small compared to people who just aren't willing to consistently pay 60 bucks for ~8-12 hours of entertainment.

The obvious lesson from this is that a lot of games are overpriced and need to come down to $20-$30. The lesson the publishers took is fuck price sensitive consumers, we're entitled to $60 and we'll force everyone to give us that much.

 

[8sanders]

As excited as I am about new hardware, preventing the borrowing/trading/buying of used games is something I can't and won't support.

or even renting games... screw that.

 

[flyinpiranha]

The deflection by Xbox fans in this thread has been nothing short of masterful.

It's not a deflection. At least not on my part. I just don't believe rumors until I see more proof behind them. So far this seems to be just an idea.

I honestly can't imagine they'd just say NO to used games. It seems almost unfathomable, like they don't realize that many users trade in old games to buy new ones. It's a cycle.

 

[SteveWinwood]

Microsoft could go around pouring sugar into gamer's gas tanks, and someone on GAF would defend it.

They don't deserve to drive. Microsoft is saving us from them.

 

[Rad-]

Never understood why people are so against this. Always online is not a problem whatsoever in this day and age. I don't think my Internet connection has gone off in like 2 years. No second-hand games, well Steam has been doing it for years.

 

[Majine]

And nintendo....:0

It is The Prophecy©. The third homeconsole is bound to be the fall from grace. It is unavoidable.

Make your time, MS.

 

[FordGTGuy]

Microsoft could go around pouring sugar into gamer's gas tanks, and someone on GAF would defend it.

Same goes with Sony, Nintendo or Steam...

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

Technically Redbox buys rental copies from the publisher for higher prices to make use of them for longer periods of time.

So they probably make money off me, but might not make money off the 25th person to rent that copy.

I know they make money off the games but I really doubt even Redbox is paying full price.

So getting rid of market share and mindshare is exactly what MS and Sony are looking for, with no real increase in revenue since those "second hand" buyers aren't likely to kneel over the new business model.

If the industry is really getting too big then why not just reduce the costs?

They can reduce the cost(who knows if they will) and control market prices easier from this kind of model.

 

[BrLvgThrChmstry]

When did I say I was more of anything than anybody else? I simply said that MS' used game idea doesn't effect me one bit. I don't buy a game because of the possibility to get money back from it. I buy games because I enjoy playing games. No other reasons for incentives are needed for me to enjoy my favorite hobby.

Take it as you will.

Quotes like this make me think maybe this is the work hobby for me.

 

[Gbraga]

how many pc games are even sold physically anymore?
aren't the majority of pc game sales on steam
which is a...drm service where you have to be online to play the games?

You can play offline on Steam though.

 

[dreamer3kx]

This is bullshit.

.

 

[Huff]

I think this would be an unfortunate policy by Microsoft if true.

• 20% of Americans do not have internet
• 34% of Americans do not have high-speed internet
• http://dashboard.digitalinfo.org/trends/view/internet

Microsoft, or any company that forces a constant connection, is willingly giving-up on a third of US homes.

I mean, if you don't have internet, are you really going to be buying the latest console anyway?

 

[seattle6418]

For all the shit he takes, lisen to this Pach comment: http://www.gametrailers.com/videos/hhgq98/pach-attack--why-all-the-gamestop-hate-

He's right, and it's not like you guys are reading it.

Always online is out of question by now, it should be read as going online to activate.

The enemy is Gamestop, not Used games. They know used game can generate revenue to use in new game purchases.

I think if they do something, it's something along the lines of online pass for used games, because with this model, the publisher gets a share on it, unlike Gamestop raping consumers and charging 55 dollars for games that they bought in cheap.

Sony's patented stuff might even allow the used game to work for a day or two or more (would still work for borrowing, renting), but still to me it appears that they are just testing waters until DD only is established.

It is a terrible thing, i'm just saying they will sugarcoat a bit if they indeed go this route. But there are even worse things going on in that Edge article, like the Kinect built in confirmation. That's the real shit.

 

[Mononoke]

What I find bizarre is that people think there isn't a fair comparison to be made.

If Steam and PC games with serial codes hadn't set the precedent for this, MS wouldn't be making this move.

How is it a fair comparison to be made? Steam has offline mode. Not all games require Steam or online always.

And the PC market prices are flexible. So a lot of those that do wait for used games, or use the trade in process to pay less - are the same people waiting for sales. How is the comparison apt at all? If MS or a closed console system implements it - that's it. That is 100% the standard for all games across the board on that platform.

That is not the case with PC gaming. Some games have less DRM and some have more (Ubisoft is really terrible in this regard).

 

[Camp Lo]

Exactly. PC games had always-online bullshit way before consoles. And now/if consoles have it too, this just makes it easier for third parties to slap this DRM on their games and add elements into them to make sure you HAVE to be always online. To unify this as a new norm in gaming. Jim Sterling doesn't know what he's on about. PC is not immune to these practices, it spearheaded them.

You make it seem as thought DIII is a normal occurrence in PC gaming; unless Steam is too terribly intrusive on you, DRM as a whole is a fucking non-issue

 

[CambriaRising]

Microsoft could go around pouring sugar into gamer's gas tanks, and someone on GAF would defend it.

You just made my day with this, thank you. Lol

 

[JimmyRustler]

Originally Posted by BruceLeeRoy:




Not every gamer is rich and some people like to be able to buy multiple games in a relatively short time frame. Not everyone buys only 1 game a year. Not everyone wants to blow $60-$70 on a new unproven IP or franchise. If you do not like the game or if you get bored of it quick, you re stuck with it. Demos are not always indicative of the final product either. Plain and simple, if companies even consider getting rid of used games which imo is anti-consumer, they need to lower game prices to more reasonable prices. We had so many bombs and studio closings this generation where you can actually get rid of the game if you weren't satisfied with it. What's going to happen when games cost more to procure and you cannot get rid of them or try them out?

Please, today it's easier than ever to know in advance if you'll like a game or not. There are videos, demos, reviews....

And please let's not forget that gaming was always an expensive hobby, so I don't really get that "some people don't have a lot of money" argument. It doesn't make any sense at all.

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

Call Of Duty 14 cant come soon enough!

Well, they can charge $100 for that and it will sell still, but most franchises will not have that luxury.

 

[Gravijah]

Never understood why people are so against this. Always online is not a problem whatsoever in this day and age. No second-hand games, well Steam has been doing it for years.

It's great that always online isn't a problem from your perspective, but think of people in different situations, please.

And Steam as a platform is pretty horrible. All it has is great pricing.

 

[saladine1]

Two weeks..

 

[RedNumberFive]

Same goes with Sony, Nintendo or Steam...

Agreed, but this is a Microsoft related thread.

 

[MVP]

Time to short Gamestop (GME) stock?

EDIT: oh...stock already getting hammered

 

[FordGTGuy]

I mean, if you don't have internet, are you really going to be buying the latest console anyway?

I've known people without internet that own a Xbox 360.

Agreed, but this is a Microsoft related thread.

And? Doesn't mean Microsoft isn't the only company in this thread being blindly defended.

 

[Deadly Cyclone]

Weaker system? Check.
Always online? Check.
No used games? Check.
More OS overhead? Check.
More motion? Check.
Pay to play online? Check.

The Xbomba has been completed and is ready for deployment.

Additional Sony hype trains deployed to accommodate the high increase of new riders.

Very disappointed in MS if the rumors hold up. Sony, take my money please.

Sony is doing the exact same thing... Also they have motion.

 

[NervousXtian]

I wish people would stop over stating what Steam sales really are.

You can't buy brand new games for $10 that are normally $40-60 not on sale.

You can buy older games for cheap, but yeah go try and buy new releases for the prices people keep saying. That doesn't happen.

Yeah, you can buy Witcher 3 or Alan Wake for $10 right now. Both are at least year old at this point.

 

[WalkMan]

The way they'd have to do it is to have a unique key per disc that is queried with their database - the server will respond with the proper key to decrypt the game and play it. The database will also only respond if you are an authorized user. Hence the need for always-on for the system.

They can easily charge for the ability to dissociate disc from user account so that it can be resold. So they solve the problem of not dipping in on second-hand sales.

 

[aeolist]

What I find bizarre is that people think there isn't a fair comparison to be made.

If Steam and PC games with serial codes hadn't set the precedent for this, MS wouldn't be making this move.

The point is that it's not comparable because Steam gives you advantages in return for losing the ability to resell.

If you seriously think Microsoft will be overall as good to their customers as Valve and have comparable sales then I have a bridge to sell you.

 

[LakeEarth]

Clever marking by Microsoft; release horrible rumor, when only half of said rumors are true people celebrate.

We can only hope.

 

[Xanadu]

But a PC capable of running games at Nextgen fidelity is not. Also, exclusives.

did you know pc has exclusives too?

 

[Dunan]

Like someone said, you can bring your console.

Then all your friends should bring their own console on which that game/licenced is tied to and BAM! ...problem solved.

Are you guys serious? You want me to box up my 25-pound PS3 and carry it somewhere on the subway? You want kids to have to lug those behemoths when visiting friends down the street? We're talking about consoles, not little handhelds that you can toss in a backpack. Carrying these giant consoles to other people's homes is absolutely ludicrous.

 

[gaming_noob]

The German Consumer Group is going to sue MS just like they're doing with Valve.

 

[Mandoric]

Also a patent shows that they at least had intent even if they don't use it. I doubt they just filed it for shits and giggles.

Do you believe that Sony intends to release a version of the Move that you wear on your feet?

 

[Uno Venova]

Is what i said anymore obnoxious than

Also a patent shows that they at least had intent even if they don't use it. I doubt they just filed it for shits and giggles.

People have known they have intent since the PS3 rumor days, but there isn't any recent rumors about it for the PS4.

 

[eso76]

that's great, because it means new games will retail for 29$ on BD and even less by digital distribution.



Wait, that's not what it means ? suicide move then.

Sorry, i wasn't planning on buying both system this time (i have so little time these days, i can't justify buying a PlayStation AND an xBox) and this makes the choice a lot easier.
Sorry Forza 5, sorry PGR5, sorry Alan Wake 2. I'll miss you.

 

[TouchMyBox]

What if both the consoles do the same thing? PC Gaming would EXPLODE this fall.

If one has anti-used game measures, then both will.

I doubt Sony will have an always online requirement though.