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Etrian Odyssey IV: Legends of the Titan |OT|: Fight & Heal Brings 3D To Europe!

Already have most of my team set but I can't decide on that last member to bring along with me. So far I have L/F/D and Medic in the back, but I can't decide on whether I want a sniper or a runemaster. This is my first EO game, which would possibly be the best to go with for someone knew. Who has more usefulness overall?

Sniper.

They start out underwhelming but their binds will become more effective as you progress. Also their class skill unlocks the ability for their skills to crit, and they can buff themselves to increase their crit, and they can passively increase their crit. It gets kind of nuts.

Also if you pick him you will have the same party as me and it's a really nice party overall!

Without the Runemaster, you will want your Landsknecht to learn the elemental attack skills so you can target elemental weaknesses, keep that in mind.
 

Hugstable

Banned
Sniper.

They start out underwhelming but their binds will become more effective as you progress. Also their class skill unlocks the ability for their skills to crit, and they can buff themselves to increase their crit, and they can passively increase their crit. It gets kind of nuts.

Also if you pick him you will have the same party as me and it's a really nice party overall!

Without the Runemaster, you will want your Landsknecht to learn the elemental attack skills so you can target elemental weaknesses, keep that in mind.

Does going for the Landschrek's elemental skills in any way hinder him as a good character damage wise? I'm not familiar with the skills in the game yet, but what would the Landshreck normally go for if you had a runemaster? I finally played teh demo yesterday before going to pick up the game, and my Sniper was really dealing damage on the low-end compared to some others, and his binds always missed. Restarting the game with the whole new party though and want to make sure I get a good combo of classes going in.
 

Ryuukan

Member
two more questions:

1. Runemaster is there any point in putting more than 2 points in the novice elemental spells? Shouldn't I save the points for the stronger spells that replace them?

2. Sniper Leg/Arm snipe skills. Are these good, do they stack, and should I max them
 
Can anyone help push me over the edge into buying this? The demo seemed pretty neat (I've never played EO), but I'm pretty intimidated by the genre and the game's customizability. Are there any good beginner guides out there? I'd love for something to tell me what classes I should use when starting out or something like that.

Also, Soul Hackers is coming out soon and I feel like I may like that game more simply because of the SMT universe.
 

slayn

needs to show more effort.
two more questions:

1. Runemaster is there any point in putting more than 2 points in the novice elemental spells? Shouldn't I save the points for the stronger spells that replace them?

2. Sniper Leg/Arm snipe skills. Are these good, do they stack, and should I max them
Resting to rebuild a character only costs two levels. There is no need to have shitty spells now for good spells later when you can have good spells now, rest, and have good spells later.

I definitely plan to max all 3 bind skills on my sniper. Head snipe does a lot more damage than leg/arm and getting an arm bind is generally the most useful to lower their damage but most tough monsters have 1 specific dangerous move and if you want to shut it down you need the appropriate bind ready to go.
 

Velcro Fly

Member
Don't have much time to play today so I think I'm going to take what little time I do have and maybe grind up a sniper? I used one in the demo and didn't like it much. I have a NS in my main party and I find that getting blind on something is useful sometimes. Also had that sword that could inflict poison and then the damage really rolled in. Only bad thing was he was a little squishy in the front row. Also might level up a dancer too just for the fun of it.
 

kunonabi

Member
So what is the likelihood or developing a party and ending up being incapable of dealing with late game enemies? I really don't want to have to resort to an FAQ or some widely accepted best build to beat the game. I know EO3 had that retirement system but I don't want to be resetting my party constantly.
 

Anteo

Member
So what is the likelihood or developing a party and ending up being incapable of dealing with late game enemies? I really don't want to have to resort to an FAQ or some widely accepted best build to beat the game. I know EO3 had that retirement system but I don't want to be resetting my party constantly.

As long as your party is varied enough to deal with magic and weapons resistence you should be fine. Even then in EO3 you could forge weapons to have elemental properties, I don't know if is the same here, as I don't have any elemental hammer yet but you should be fine anyways.

The above was not true in the post game content of the previous 3 games. I guess will be the same here, the post game bosses generally require a specific setup.
 

lingiii

Banned
As long as your party is varied enough to deal with magic and weapons resistence you should be fine. Even then in EO3 you could forge weapons to have elemental properties, I don't know if is the same here, as I don't have any elemental hammer yet but you should be fine anyways.

The above was not true in the post game content of the previous 3 games. I guess will be the same here, the post game bosses generally require a specific setup.

There are so many empty slots in the hammer pallet I gotta imagine there are elemental effects. You can fall back on oils if nothing else--I've got fire/elec/ice oils before beating BF2 boss of first dungeon.

Someone asked last page about similar games so I'll point out a couple:
  • Legend of Grimrock (PC)
  • Etrian Odyssey I-III (winkyface. listing these because they just reprinted them all)
  • DoomRPG (iOS, probably more. this one is kind of a secret answer to the question)
  • Wizardry (old PC series, if you want to go classico)
 

scy

Member
Does going for the Landschrek's elemental skills in any way hinder him as a good character damage wise? I'm not familiar with the skills in the game yet, but what would the Landshreck normally go for if you had a runemaster?

Their Elemental Links are essentially their best build ... but it's a party-combo, not really a Landsknecht one. With a Runemaster, you could just go for the actual Sword skills but, honestly, the Links will eventually win out for damage.

Though, worth noting that it takes until Level 20 and 40 for Links to really take off due to their true value being tied to later skills. Maxing the Links does relatively little.

Edit: Early on, you'll basically have a Landsknecht to Power Break (or Mind Break, if applicable) and have Vanguard to up their base damage. Their Novice skills for actual damage aren't that great.

I finally played teh demo yesterday before going to pick up the game, and my Sniper was really dealing damage on the low-end compared to some others, and his binds always missed. Restarting the game with the whole new party though and want to make sure I get a good combo of classes going in.

Sniper is going to be a slow burn at the start since they're weapon dependent for damage and starting weapons are mediocre. That and how stat reliant things are. They'll take off after awhile but I think that their end-game usefulness is a little lackluster compared to some of the other options.

Which, really, is more a testament at the damage of other combos and not really something against the Sniper.

two more questions:

1. Runemaster is there any point in putting more than 2 points in the novice elemental spells? Shouldn't I save the points for the stronger spells that replace them?

Well, the later spells are actually fundamentally different (e.g., Volt goes from line target to single-target, to random multi-hit).

...that said, I didn't spend extra points in them. I just maxed Runic Gleam and got myself more TP.

2. Sniper Leg/Arm snipe skills. Are these good, do they stack, and should I max them

It's the route you'll most likely want to take them. They have a multi-hit skill in one of their lines that you'll want to get as well most likely but, yeah, Snipers will basically be there to setup and chase Binds.

As long as your party is varied enough to deal with magic and weapons resistence you should be fine. Even then in EO3 you could forge weapons to have elemental properties, I don't know if is the same here, as I don't have any elemental hammer yet but you should be fine anyways.

The above was not true in the post game content of the previous 3 games. I guess will be the same here, the post game bosses generally require a specific setup.

Well, it depends. EO1 was very limited (essentially one class was a hard requirement), EO2 had a few more options (two options, not counting gimmicks), and EO3 brought the most variety (two classes, could be covered by sub-classing, proper itemization could also work) with the exception of one-encounter ... though that still had cheese strats for it.

From what I've seen of EO4 so far, you're limited in the power of sub-classing but itemization seems better. There's a greater focus on how encounters work as well as even early FoEs showcase off scripted behavior (e.g., HP% triggers, varying Priority attacks, Turn count triggers, skill sequences, etc.).
 
Is it just me, or does the music sound like shit when you turn the volume up? All of the sound in this game seems to be at a pretty low bitrate.
 

Ryuukan

Member
Does "resistance" only mean chance to hit with the spell? Or does lowered resistance mean I will do more damage with it too?
 

LegatoB

Member
Is it just me, or does the music sound like shit when you turn the volume up? All of the sound in this game seems to be at a pretty low bitrate.
You're still playing the demo, right? They intentionally used lower-quality audio in that to make the download smaller. The full version sounds much nicer.
 

duckroll

Member
You're still playing the demo, right? They intentionally used lower-quality audio in that to make the download smaller. The full version sounds much nicer.

They weren't kidding when they said the full game has better visuals too! I immediately noticed the higher resolution portraits. It's a really pretty game. :D
 
You're still playing the demo, right? They intentionally used lower-quality audio in that to make the download smaller. The full version sounds much nicer.

Oh thank goodness! I was honestly sort of worried about those things. The map screen had compression artifacts even on the low res bottom screen. I was worried...
 
You're still playing the demo, right? They intentionally used lower-quality audio in that to make the download smaller. The full version sounds much nicer.

They weren't kidding when they said the full game has better visuals too! I immediately noticed the higher resolution portraits. It's a really pretty game. :D

Woah, really? My interest in this game just went up exponentially (shallow, I know, but the arrangements are so good!)--now if I only I could find a good beginner's guide...
 
Someone asked last page about similar games so I'll point out a couple:
  • Legend of Grimrock (PC)
  • Etrian Odyssey I-III (winkyface. listing these because they just reprinted them all)
  • DoomRPG (iOS, probably more. this one is kind of a secret answer to the question)
  • Wizardry (old PC series, if you want to go classico)

Also the old 8-bit computer then PC series "Might and Magic" (NOT Heroes of Might and Magic), though by Might and Magic 6 the games were quite a bit evolved from this point (in 6 they replaced the step-by-step walking with smooth walking, starting to evolve into the Elder Scrolls games like Skyrim). I would put Might and Magic 4 and 5 (Clouds of Xeen, Darkside of Xeen) as the ultimate evolution of the "dungeon-crawler" genre, with large overworlds, explorable towns, alternate dimensions, lots of story, and elaborate voiced cutscenes.
 

n64coder

Member
Is this game usually found at Walmart? It's hard to tell whether a Walmart store has it as I only see a ship-to-store option. I'm planning to pick up a second copy at Gamestop but if they only have the "new but opened" copies, I'll check out the Walmart that is next door.
 

slayn

needs to show more effort.
Anyone have thoughts on weapon selection for landsknecht? Something that worries me about their link attacks is the need to have both vanguard and link plus buffs up all the time. Vanguard being a 5 round buff instead of 3 helps a little but that still feels like a bit too much setup/maintenance for my liking.

I find myself wondering if its possible to have them sub nightseeker, dual wield rapiers, and get 5 points into the speed passive would be enough to get them going first without the need for vanguard. And they have that defensive dual wielding passive to counteract not having a shield. I'm not sure if that will be enough though if you have a pretty fast team.

side question: does wielding both a rapier and a dagger give you a weapon based speed boost for both or does it only care about the weapon you are actually making the attack with? Probably the latter, but a shield hurts your speed anyway so I probably wouldn't want to use one for this.

I also noticed that power break/mind break are actually shield skills and you must have a shield equipped to use them. So by going this route I would unfortunately have to abandon those skills.
 

scy

Member
Does "resistance" only mean chance to hit with the spell? Or does lowered resistance mean I will do more damage with it too?

A Resistance to something will influence the damage only (or chance-to-land in the case of Status Effects/Binds). If something has a 0%, they will take 0 Damage; 100% will be 100% of the damage; 200% will be 200% of the damage.

Woah, really? My interest in this game just went up exponentially (shallow, I know, but the arrangements are so good!)--now if I only I could find a good beginner's guide...

It's not as complex as it seems. If all else fails, there's this thread :x
 
I would put Might and Magic 4 and 5 (Clouds of Xeen, Darkside of Xeen) as the ultimate evolution of the "dungeon-crawler" genre, with large overworlds, explorable towns, alternate dimensions, lots of story, and elaborate voiced cutscenes.

I actually wouldn't, I played them recently and was very disappointed. It's poorly balanced, and you don't have a lot of nice crunchy customization you can do. They tried to streamline things, hide the numbers, don't show HP, just show a color for how they're feeling. They hide all the important information from you about how equipment affects you and the bonuses it provides. The wandering monster format they used trivializes encounters and makes them feel less significant - you just let fly with your enchanted bows and kill everything before it gets to you.

I mean I guess some of that is just how Might and Magic is. Xeen's just not like EO or some earlier representations of the genre. I prefer something more like Shining in the Darkness. Heck, I even prefer Might and Magic 1 to Xeen, just rubs me the wrong way.

Now if you guys want a cool crawler on your DS/3DS, look into the Dark Spire.

It has a dual modern/retro mode that you can switch between at any time, changing all the graphics including enemies, and the music to more 8-bit style:

ucxLoKx.jpg


jg0Xplf.jpg


PkauRUh.jpg


However it's kind of at a premium price by now. Like $80 new. I think I got it for $60 a while back and it was worth it.
 

Anteo

Member
In that case, can you recommend a certain party make-up to someone who has never played EO before?

Get the basics, medic for heals, rune master for elemental spells, fortress as your main tank and two damage dealers like Landshnecht, Nightseeker or Sniper.
 

Ricker

Member
Did anyone in Canada pick this up yet at a Best Buy or Future Shop or Gamestop? ...can't seem to find it anywhere and my pre-order was kinda messed up...
 

scy

Member
Anyone have thoughts on weapon selection for landsknecht? Something that worries be about their link attacks is the need to have both vanguard and link plus buffs up all the time. Vanguard being a 5 round buff instead of 3 helps a little but that still feels like a bit too much setup/maintenance for my liking.

A lot of the combos in this game have a lot of setup it seems. They definitely went for a more preparation based system this time than one-turn ones.

I find myself wondering if its possible to have them sub nightseeker, duel wield rapiers, and get 5 points into the speed passive would be enough to get them going first without the need for vanguard. And they have that defensive duel wielding passive to counteract not having a shield. I'm not sure if that will be enough though if you have a pretty fast team.

side question: does wielding both a rapier and a dagger give you a weapon based speed boost for both or does it only care about the weapon you are actually making the attack with? Probably the latter, but a shield hurts your speed anyway so I probably wouldn't want to use one for this.

Link's have a pretty good +Speed modifier too, I believe, so you might be able to get away with it. Honestly though, I'd just deal with having to use both. It's a +Damage buff anyway on Vanguard.

In that case, can you recommend a certain party make-up to someone who has never played EO before?

Front-row: Landsknecht, Fortress, Nightseeker
Back-row: Medic, Sniper or Runemaster

Basically:

Warrior, Tank, Rogue
Healer, Ranged DPS or Caster

Covers your bases and is rather straight forward in use. If you want something a bit more involved:

Front-row: Landsknecht, Fortress, Nightseeker
Back-row: Dancer, Sniper or Runemaster

Trades the Medic for a Dancer who provides buffs that effect their current row, one of which is a Healing-per-turn buff. EO4 allows you to switch party members positions (e.g., send someone from the Front Row to the Back) without spending a turn so you can utilize this to move people as needed to get your Healing done.

The Fortress can tank effectively from the back-row (better, lower damage taken anyway) via Taunt so swapping them to the back-row and moving the Dancer up front works fairly well. It's overall a more offensive oriented setup but it is a bit more involved than the Medic group. I'd recommend this over the Medic group just because it's "more fun" to me but the Medic group is a lot easier to deal with, especially if you're new.

Also, I find Medics boring. So take that for what it's worth :x
 

cjkeats

Member
Did anyone in Canada pick this up yet at a Best Buy or Future Shop or Gamestop? ...can't seem to find it anywhere and my pre-order was kinda messed up...

Best buy confirmed they wouldn't be carrying it in stores(There's a link a few pages back to the BB forums), I'd say FS will be the same. My EB had a bunch of copies.
nothing to see here folks, move along.
 

Ricker

Member
Best buy confirmed they wouldn't be carrying it in stores(There's a link a few pages back to the BB forums), I'd say FS will be the same. My EB had a bunch of copies.

Ah ok thanks....I'll give the local store I pre-ordered this from another day otherwise I will try Gamestop or get the digital version.
 
(Credit goes to LakiIester from GameFAQS)

http://etrianodyssey4.blogspot.com/2013/02/game-available-today.html?m=1

Some new QR codes:

Helpful Letter (piece of equipment)
Yggdroid Doll (item to sell?)

and 3 quests:

The loud croaking frogs quest
The peacock mourns quest
Moth to the flame quest

The Loud Croaking Frog quest should be available to everyone right now since it's located the Small Orchard cave. (btw, the recommended level for this quest is "8")

I'm in the 3rd Stratum and I can't use the other 2 quests yet so no need to scan those right now unless you're very far into the game.

Adding QR codes as they appear. Atlus USA just posted a new one on their Twitter (http://www.twitter.com/atlususa) , could someone get the image link for that? (Blocked at work)

(Juncto Hammer)
https://twitter.com/AtlusUSA/status/306841178333143040/photo/1
 

lingiii

Banned
Trades the Medic for a Dancer

I really wanted to love Dancer, but the Medic's passive skill to heal the whole party after battles is just too incredibly useful. On non-FOE monsters, my Medic usually just blocks and keeps everyone tip-top between battles, saving his TP for FOEs. Lets me stay out a lot longer on a run than the Dancer would; bro'd run out of TP real quick if healing dance was your only non-item source of heals.
 

scy

Member
I really wanted to love Dancer, but the Medic's passive skill to heal the whole party after battles is just too incredibly useful. On non-FOE monsters, my Medic usually just blocks and keeps everyone tip-top between battles, saving his TP for FOEs. Lets me stay out a lot longer on a run than the Dancer would; bro'd run out of TP real quick if healing dance was your only non-item source of heals.

My limiting factor in runs is Inventory Space, not really TP. Only one person on my team really takes a lot of consistent damage (Fortress) and they can self heal at 70% the damage they deal via Holy Smite.

My Dancer is usually one of the last people to run out of TP for me.
 

tuffy

Member
I really wanted to love Dancer, but the Medic's passive skill to heal the whole party after battles is just too incredibly useful. On non-FOE monsters, my Medic usually just blocks and keeps everyone tip-top between battles, saving his TP for FOEs. Lets me stay out a lot longer on a run than the Dancer would; bro'd run out of TP real quick if healing dance was your only non-item source of heals.

Just stick with what works for you up until it doesn't. I remember people were getting use out of the princess' version of patch-up in EOIII up until the mid game, so there's some precedent. In the long run you'll be optimizing for drawn-out boss fights at which point automatic healing will be much more helpful than the per-fight healing, but I'll worry about that when I get there.
 
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