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FINAL FANTASY Community Thread: XV Mainline Entries and Counting

Cool thing bout Type 0 is it actually implements it's terms in the game.

FFXIII touched upon the lore a bit, in some of the chapters. Sazh was a bit of an exposition fairy at first. I understood that the game was about the main six and how they dealt with being l'cie and trying to find the solution to defy fate, and that's fine. Even Nomura stated that XV was going to be a simple story of getting the crystal, but we'll see.No game is expected to show every lore play out in a cut scene and that's understandable.

The problem is lack of clarity. For example. I didn't find out until much later,after I beat XIII ,that it was Pulse itself that marked the main cast and not Anima. Those type of details should have been officially translated and shown someway.Not even that FNC video was officially translated.

Square will never localize their Ultimania's. They think it isn't worth it for the west.

I wish they would let Dark Horse publish them like they do for the Amano Artbooks.
 

Perfo

Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
Disregarding LR, most people are rather hopeful for XV.

Why being hopeful about something so distant when in 10 days ARR releases and sounds fantastic? The awesome is now, not in 2015. There's time to wait but just not now.
 

Mr. Fix

Member
Almost finished FF12. I absolutely love Ivalice, and its representation here the most. I would have loved to see Ezel from FFTA as an NPC here though, but I'll live.

Oh, and Larsa & Vossler should have totally replaced Vaan and Penelo.
 

Perfo

Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
Ivalice and Pulse&Cocoon are definetely one of my favorites settings in a videogame :p
 

CorvoSol

Member
Why being hopeful about something so distant when in 10 days ARR releases and sounds fantastic? The awesome is now, not in 2015. There's time to wait but just not now.

I think that's more a general "lots of fans are indifferent about the MMOs" thing. Aside from the debacle that was 14.1, I think most of the people I know who've played 11 had good things to say about it, and that ARR has gotten favorable reviews thus far. It's just that the MMOs don't hold the same wide-base appeal as the rest of their console entries, so people are indifferent or disappointed by them in the sense that they'd rather have gotten a console game than an MMO.

And so, since 14 is an MMO and people who don't care about MMOs are usually a majority, or at least have ever appeared to be such, people are looking forward to 15 instead. Not because they think 14 will necessarily be bad, but because 15 is the next console game.
 

Perfo

Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
I think that's more a general "lots of fans are indifferent about the MMOs" thing. Aside from the debacle that was 14.1, I think most of the people I know who've played 11 had good things to say about it, and that ARR has gotten favorable reviews thus far. It's just that the MMOs don't hold the same wide-base appeal as the rest of their console entries, so people are indifferent or disappointed by them in the sense that they'd rather have gotten a console game than an MMO.

And so, since 14 is an MMO and people who don't care about MMOs are usually a majority, or at least have ever appeared to be such, people are looking forward to 15 instead. Not because they think 14 will necessarily be bad, but because 15 is the next console game.

I do understand this and until one month ago I thought the same. I'm not a fan of the genre (completely left it in 2008 with WoW: WotLK) so I was not looking at ARR with interest, I thought I was going to buy it because I'm a fan of this series but soon after planning to stop it in favor of the next offline game because I'm not a fan of the genre anymore. When I played the BETA though everything changed, the game gave me the chance (differently from FFXI first-year) to play this almost as an offline Final Fantasy, thus I really had alot of fan. All I had to do was creating a character, loggin in, following the story, defeating monsters, getting new equipments and speak with NPCs. I told myself: this is like any other FF offline I played except this time "when I need" my 3 squadmates are controlled by humans instead of AIs like in XII and XIIIers a la XII/XIII – making the game not so different at all from these two. In the end I had 20 levels and tons of hours of a "offline FF"' experience I did not regret. Now I'm looking at ARR as if it's the next main line title in the series.
 

CorvoSol

Member
I do understand this and until one month ago I thought the same. I'm not a fan of the genre (completely left it in 2008 with WoW: WotLK) so I was not looking at ARR with interest, I thought I was going to buy it because it's a fan but soon after planning to stop it in favor of the next offline game because I'm not a fan of the genre anymore. When I played the BETA though everything changed, the game gave me the chance (differently from FFXI first-year) to play this almost as an offline Final Fantasy, thus I really had alot of fan. All I had to do was creating a character, loggin in, following the story, defeating monsters, getting new equipments and speak with NPCs. I told myself: this is like any other FF offline I played except this time "when I need" my 3 squadmates are controlled by humans instead of AIs like in XII and XIIIers a la XII/XIII – making the game not so different at all from these two. In the end I had 20 levels and tons of hours of a "offline FF"' experience I did not regret. Now I'm looking at ARR as if it's the next main line title in the series.

Right, but I still don't think you're going to convince people that that is worth the monthly subscription fee they're going to have to pay. Some people just don't do MMOs because it isn't for them, and others just can't afford that entry price. I don't think it is a matter of people questioning its quality (barring the occasional comment about "shitty MMOs" you hear from peeps who still think Nomura ruined everything), just that MMOs aren't as appealing to the fanbase as a whole.
 
A lot of people probably also don't have the time commitment that XIV requires. It is a MMO...and when you got a full time job and other stuff, is it worth plopping down a subby when you don't have the time to actually commit to it?
 

Perfo

Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
Right, but I still don't think you're going to convince people that that is worth the monthly subscription fee they're going to have to pay. Some people just don't do MMOs because it isn't for them, and others just can't afford that entry price. I don't think it is a matter of people questioning its quality (barring the occasional comment about "shitty MMOs" you hear from peeps who still think Nomura ruined everything), just that MMOs aren't as appealing to the fanbase as a whole.

I'm not trying to convince anyone even if I think complaining for the cheap monthly subscription plan is just an excuse to not try the game. I mean for 11 euros per month you get infinite hours of gameplay while a 69 euros game usually last 5/12 hrs at best. It's not a problem of money.

A lot of people probably also don't have the time commitment that XIV requires. It is a MMO...and when you got a full time job and other stuff, is it worth plopping down a subby when you don't have the time to actually commit to it?

The game is builded in a way in which you can stay sure with 1hr or 2 you get alot of content and fun. I'm planning to play the game just two days per week, probably 6 hrs per week in total and I don't have problem to spend 11 euros for 24 hrs of fun in a month. I mean... I bought for 20-30 euros (each, thus 40-60 euros) last months two games: Hitman and MGRising. In the end I got half of the amount of fun in terms of hours and content while spending 4-6 times more what ARR will cost me in just one month. Consider this.
 

Natetan

Member
Oh, and Larsa & Vossler should have totally replaced Vaan and Penelo.

I dunno, Vaan and Penelo get alot of crap, but i think it was good to have someone normal in the group who got pulled into the story by dumb luck. I mean everyone else is really high up and related to each other.

We maybe didnt need two of them.

I do think Larsa is pretty awesome though. I don't know why people think he's a girl. He looks like a noble

I think FFXII has the best, or at least my favorite, presentation of any game in the series. The story is a bit ??? at times and all the other complaints, but if FFXII was just a book of pictures it would be great.
 

Arthea

Member
I dunno, Vaan and Penelo get alot of crap, but i think it was good to have someone normal in the group who got pulled into the story by dumb luck. I mean everyone else is really high up and related to each other.

We maybe didnt need two of them.

I do think Larsa is pretty awesome though. I don't know why people think he's a girl. He looks like a noble

I think FFXII has the best, or at least my favorite, presentation of any game in the series. The story is a bit ??? at times and all the other complaints, but if FFXII was just a book of pictures it would be great.

It's so hard for me to see how can people knowing series consider FF12 good, let alone the best. What's so good about presentation exactly? You can't even talk with your characters, they have no development whatsoever, Balthier being only exception, well, may be Larsa too, if we consider him playable character. All lore was presented in the database in most dry and boring way possible. And don't get me wrong, I don't hate FF12, it's just really really bad FF. Gameplay diversity is close to 0, interesting sidequests and secrets non existent and I can go on and on about what's wrong with this game for hours.

edited: what I tried to say but forgot halfway, I don't see how FF13 is so different from FF12, to the point that when one loves one, hates other. They have exactly the same problems mostly, only FF12 has more open world and it is more open in general. Other than that, they are very similar in being bad FF games and lacking diversity, not being bad games as such, just not very good either.
 
I loved both XII and XIII, but, talking solely on the gameplay,they both have faults. XII though got an International version with some improvements, and from what I hear it sounds good. To me vanilla XII was more interesting when it came to making gambits,reminds me of VIII in a way. XIII on the other hand was more interesting in battle with the Paradigm system.

XIII could benefit from a proper International Version. Give it the tweaks from XIII-2. You could switch between the three playable characters in battle, for example.

And if they ever re-release these games. They need cut-scene viewers. X had one for heaven's sake!
 

Natetan

Member
It's so hard for me to see how can people knowing series consider FF12 good, let alone the best. What's so good about presentation exactly? You can't even talk with your characters, they have no development whatsoever, Balthier being only exception, well, may be Larsa too, if we consider him playable character. All lore was presented in the database in most dry and boring way possible. And don't get me wrong, I don't hate FF12, it's just really really bad FF. Gameplay diversity is close to 0, interesting sidequests and secrets non existent and I can go on and on about what's wrong with this game for hours.

edited: what I tried to say but forgot halfway, I don't see how FF13 is so different from FF12, to the point that when one loves one, hates other. They have exactly the same problems mostly, only FF12 has more open world and it is more open in general. Other than that, they are very similar in being bad FF games and lacking diversity, not being bad games as such, just not very good either.

I just said presentation. I didn't say it was a good game necessarily. I've only ever watched the cutscenes never played the actual game.

ffxiii and ffxii are like night and day to me presentation wise. Terrible voice acting, boring bishonen characters. Ffxii is classy and has great voice acting,
 

MagiusNecros

Gilgamesh Fan Annoyance
A lot of people probably also don't have the time commitment that XIV requires. It is a MMO...and when you got a full time job and other stuff, is it worth plopping down a subby when you don't have the time to actually commit to it?

I would play XIV for the GILGAMESH but my computer is garbage therefore can't run it plus the online only aspect really kills it for me so yeah.

Not to mention I probably wouldn't get around to it anytime soon since starting in October a bunch of games I want will be coming out so I doubt I will have time for an MMO.
 
It's so hard for me to see how can people knowing series consider FF12 good, let alone the best. What's so good about presentation exactly? You can't even talk with your characters, they have no development whatsoever, Balthier being only exception, well, may be Larsa too, if we consider him playable character. All lore was presented in the database in most dry and boring way possible. And don't get me wrong, I don't hate FF12, it's just really really bad FF. Gameplay diversity is close to 0, interesting sidequests and secrets non existent and I can go on and on about what's wrong with this game for hours.

edited: what I tried to say but forgot halfway, I don't see how FF13 is so different from FF12, to the point that when one loves one, hates other. They have exactly the same problems mostly, only FF12 has more open world and it is more open in general. Other than that, they are very similar in being bad FF games and lacking diversity, not being bad games as such, just not very good either.

No interesting side quests and secrets in FF XII? You define it only"more open" when it is the biggest JRPG on PS2? I think we've played two different games. If FF XII is the sun, then FF XIII is the moon. They're totally opposite.
 

SkyOdin

Member
I am probably one of the few people who thing Final Fantasy XII should have focused more on Vaan and Panelo, and dropped Ashe. Vaan's story and character arc fit the gameplay much better than Ashe's. One of the larger problems in Final Fantasy XII (among several) was the dissonance between the political plot and the gameplay which mostly took place in the wilderness far from civilization. Most of the gameplay that takes up a good chunk of time, such as the Mark Hunts, Rare Game, and Bazaar Good stuff, suits Vaan's side of the story. On the other hand, there is no good reason for Ashe to be tromping through deserts and jungles when there is a war going on and political machinations playing out in her country.

In my opinion, the only Final Fantasy that got a political story right was Final Fantasy 2 of all things. Firion actual feels like a leading member of the resistance who plays a major role in the twists and turns of the game's central political conflict. In both Final Fantasy XII and even Final Fantasy Tactics, you spend all of your time chasing ancient evils and lost artifacts while the war and politics are relegated to mere background elements.
 

MagiusNecros

Gilgamesh Fan Annoyance
XII was incomplete. They chased Matsuno out and you got what you have now. We could have had dastardly mindflayers, but no we got the Occuria instead. Quite the occurrence if I do say so myself.
 
Final Fantasy Tactics, you spend all of your time chasing ancient evils and lost artifacts while the war and politics are relegated to mere background elements.

Well if Matsuno has decided to let us play as Delita we wouldn't have had that problem.

There were two sides to the conflict, Delita had to handle one side, Ramza the other.
 

SkyOdin

Member
Well if Matsuno has decided to let us play as Delita we wouldn't have had that problem.

There were two sides to the conflict, Delita had to handle one side, Ramza the other.

Delita wasn't a protagonist. He ultimately wasn't even a good guy. He achieved his goals in the end, but only by becoming little different than the men he hated. There is little to indicate that he even achieved any sort of happiness, for that matter. I don't think Final Fantasy Tactics is written to actually support Delita's choices, merely to sympathize with his motivations.
 

CorvoSol

Member
It's so hard for me to see how can people knowing series consider FF12 good, let alone the best. What's so good about presentation exactly? You can't even talk with your characters, they have no development whatsoever, Balthier being only exception, well, may be Larsa too, if we consider him playable character. All lore was presented in the database in most dry and boring way possible. And don't get me wrong, I don't hate FF12, it's just really really bad FF. Gameplay diversity is close to 0, interesting sidequests and secrets non existent and I can go on and on about what's wrong with this game for hours.

edited: what I tried to say but forgot halfway, I don't see how FF13 is so different from FF12, to the point that when one loves one, hates other. They have exactly the same problems mostly, only FF12 has more open world and it is more open in general. Other than that, they are very similar in being bad FF games and lacking diversity, not being bad games as such, just not very good either.

That you're kind of wrong on several of these things also helps.

Every character gets good development. Look at Fran, remember the Eruyt village? Lots of development for Fran there, for instance. Basch has, you know, the entire game what with his relationship with one of the principle villains. Ashe has her relationship with the other villains. Balthier has his. Penelo doesn't need character development because she's perfect already. Vaan's weak, yes, but I think most people who do like Vaan will point out that he improves in the next few games.

Presentation usually means visuals and music, and while I am no fan of XII's score, it does what it wants to do, and XII is far and away one of the best looking games on PS2. Areas are detailed, cities are populated with characters that are detailed, there's a variety of enemies of different shapes and sizes and colors to fight, every weapon has its own unique model, nevermind the vast number of in-game movie sequences. XII is the definition of a well presented model, even if it isn't colorful and its music is not catchy.

The "lore" in the "database" was all secondary information to the plot of the game. It consisted of shout-outs to the rest of the Ivalice Alliance, but you didn't NEED to read it to get what was happening. Which was fairly standard ops for Square before they handed the series over to a jackass who can't write. "The most boring way possible" doesn't make a lot of sense, either. What, you had to read it? OH NO.

Gameplay diversity meaning what? That there were no minigames? Well there goes like, the first six games in the series right out the window.

And no interesting sidequests? The hunts alone were great. You could fight Gilgamesh, Ultros, the King Behemoth, Yiazmat, Phoenix, a Summoner, and more. That game had so many sidequests I spent a whole month doing them before fighting the final boss.

And this is without going into how HUGE the game is. Seriously the maps in that game are only small compared to fucking Xenoblade. You can go all over the place in FFXII, and you can even turn left and right to do it! If you want to wander your way into the Necrohol twenty levels too soon, go ahead and do it! The Pharos at Ridorana is positively mammoth in size.

XII was a great game, and I am surprised at how little I appreciated it when it came out.
 

Noi

Member
XII_trickster_render.png


This mark alone is more creative than a ton of the side-bosses in the series. The first time he bolted away from my party, I just stood there without knowing what the hell had happened.
 
XII_trickster_render.png


This mark alone is more creative than a ton of the side-bosses in the series. The first time he bolted away from my party, I just stood there without knowing what the hell had happened.

Except the Gilgamesh fight was the far more interesting mark imo.
 

CorvoSol

Member
I used to think Lightning's first design was the best of XIII but Fang's is pretty good.

I think they're both the best in the game. The only design I out and out don't like in that game is Hope. His stupid gloves and hanky combo and the clashing colors is just ugh. Mope had a much better design. Oh, and I guess I hate Team NORA's designs as a whole, but I mean, I hate them in ways that extend beyond their idiotic looks, so there's that.

I wasn't a fan of Snow's look (I hate his character to death), but that's because it's basically the same look as Beat (TWEWY) and Seifer (KHII), and I think Nomura can do better than that.
 
I think they're both the best in the game. The only design I out and out don't like in that game is Hope. His stupid gloves and hanky combo and the clashing colors is just ugh. Mope had a much better design. Oh, and I guess I hate Team NORA's designs as a whole, but I mean, I hate them in ways that extend beyond their idiotic looks, so there's that.

I wasn't a fan of Snow's look (I hate his character to death), but that's because it's basically the same look as Beat (TWEWY) and Seifer (KHII), and I think Nomura can do better than that.

I'll excuse Hope's because he's a kid...oh who am I kidding, it is pretty awful. I don't really get NORA's designs, it seemed all over the place.

Snow? Who's that?
 

Shadow780

Member
The concept, lore, characters, and locales are all good to great, but man the story implementation and writing just ruined a great portion.
 
XIII had plenty of good to decent designs when it came to characters.

Light Sazh Hope Fang Cid Jill Yaag Vanille Nora(the mom) Dajh and the pope was okay.

Like any Final Fantasy there will be some bad ones. In XIII's case

Nora(the group), Snow,and Serah.

Especially Serah. Ugh.
 
There has to be at least one outfit in the Barbie Dress Up Collection mode of LR that will look good. Just has to.

What about Dust and Shadow and those Samurai outfits? The latest trailer showed some decent variation of some of her outfits as well as some other good looking ones like this :


You can also get her XIII and XIII-2 outfits if you have a save file from those games.
 

Dark Schala

Eloquent Princess
Oh, I dug this up when I was sorting through some games the other day. I was wondering where this version went.

dsc00877pprnt.jpg

I should post my FF collection one of these days (because I remember that Lissar posted hers waaaaaaaaaay earlier on in the thread), but I don't have a lot of ultimanias, and I don't feel like digging out my soundtracks or digging up my copy of the FF7 PC version from 1998.

I know Perfo's got a crapton of stuff. He's posted it in this thread a while ago.
 

Heropon

Member
My Final Fantasy collection is pretty disappointing. For example, I don't even have a physical copy of FFVI to show... I suck at being a FF fan. ;)

Saw a scan for Lightning Returns. Sazh is unchanged. Just a heads up.

I suppose they don't want to screw up that nice design.
 
The concept, lore, characters, and locales are all good to great, but man the story implementation and writing just ruined a great portion.

Indeed, the concept was great, the execution is just boring.

No, it wasn't boring because it was political, Legend of the Galactic Heroes was for more political than FFXII and it held my attention for 160 30-minute episodes. It was just straight up boring dawg. Now would I like to see them do something like that again? Yes, absolutely. I would love Final Fantasy plots to start making sense from beginning to end.

Saw a scan for Lightning Returns. Sazh is unchanged. Just a heads up.

I would say that's nice, but I know it's just lazy.
 

Heropon

Member
And Hope. Lazy bastards. But if you get the same paycheck every week why bother with the effort.

They could have used the XIII-2 model for Hope, at least it would have made sense. How many paradoxes will need Toriyama to explain how he reverted back to being a brat?
 

MagiusNecros

Gilgamesh Fan Annoyance
They could have used the XIII-2 model for Hope, at least it would have made sense. How many paradoxes will need Toriyama to explain how he reverted back to being a brat?

Probably say it's not the real Hope.

And the entire game takes place inside an Oracle Drive.

Watch it happen.
 

Heropon

Member
At least I hope NORA doesn't appear with all those ridiculous outfits, hairstyles and personalities. I wonder how many shooting stars I have to see for my wish to come true.
 
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