REmake came out at a time where the classic RE formula was still prevalent, before RE took a new direction with RE4.
Who knows what REmake 2 will be like.
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Final Fantasy VII Remake: Nomura Confirms Combat is Action Based
- Thread starter Exentryk
- Start date
REmake came out at a time where the classic RE formula was still prevalent, before RE took a new direction with RE4.
Who knows what REmake 2 will be like.
Holundrian
Unconfirmed Member
pssst don't go and destroy the TB never ever successful dinosaur narrative!
XCOM and Pokemon don't count either.
Fact is TB means it can never be mainstream or good and will always feel slow and clunky :-x
Suburban Thug
Member
Don't forget Fire Emblem or Persona!
freeofgreed
Member
Yeah this definitely isn't surprising. As much as I'd hate to say it I don't think we'll ever see another AAA turn based jrpg from SE ever again. The fact that even Dragon Quest XI, which is suppose to be a franchise all about tradition and classical gameplay, might not even be turn based tells me this. So if even DQ isn't safe then FF sure as hell ain't.
Id be ok with this.
Jack The Nipper
Banned
Good news, I can't play turned based and that is what DQ usually is?
Sorry to those of you that want it
Sorry to those of you that want it
Chairman Yang
if he talks about books, you better damn well listen
Honestly, turn-based gameplay is arguably more popular than it's ever been. Like Hearthstone alone is a bigger success than any Final Fantasy game ever. For JRPGs specifically, Pokemon is apparently still doing amazing. Persona 5 will probably end up as a bigger critical success than FF15.
I agree with you--the gameplay of the remake will suffer for abandoning a turn-based system. Square has pretty much always screwed up their action combat, which almost invariably ends up as floaty-feeling and shallow; it baffles me that anyone expects anything different for this iteration.
Grim Patron
Member
I hope they replace Tifa with Ariana Grande
Neither Fire Emblem nor Persona sell as much as a Final Fantasy entry does. FFVII Remake will run circles around both in terms of sales and mainstream appeal.
And I have no idea why people are comparing design blueprints of 3DS RPGs to FFVII Remake. Jesus Christ.
sixteen-bit
Member
Not surprising considering the footage.
I welcome this expected change. Menu based combat is so limiting and quickly becomes boring because there is no skillful challenge.
So many turn based jrpg devs resorting to auto battle, turbo, etc options to get players out of the mindless gameplay pretty much confirms there is nothing fresh to be done with that style of gameplay. Just more redundant systems being added on top of redundant systems.
So many turn based jrpg devs resorting to auto battle, turbo, etc options to get players out of the mindless gameplay pretty much confirms there is nothing fresh to be done with that style of gameplay. Just more redundant systems being added on top of redundant systems.
ethomaz
Banned
Hold circle to win feels so fresh and better...
Turn based can be interesting, strategy and variable.
DrunkShogun
Member
Makes sense looking at the director and the general direction final fantasy has taken. Only thing i care about is whether we are tied to cloud or can change party members.
Sir_Crocodile
Member
So not only are the graphics not to my taste but they're changing the battle system. I've got to say, I've not heard one thing about this remake that sounds positive to me.
Do we know how materia works now? Are summons going to be based off a cool down system?
Do we know how materia works now? Are summons going to be based off a cool down system?
DrROBschiz
Member
Well arent you a peach
There isnt a precedent for remakes being completely new games so its not like the opposite position is somehow crazy or unreasonable
Its a big gamble so hopefully it pays of for Nomura since he seemed intent on tearing everything down and starting over
Even though they are basically building off the back of 15 starting with the engine. I imagine the similarities arent going to end there
You have to imagine the dissenting opinions are more than valid considering the criticisms levied against 15
LouisaFerre
Member
I just want Nomura to do what he wants, so I'm good.
freeofgreed
Member
Yeah ok, because spamming X button is so much more skillfull? It's fine if you like action over turn based. But don't try to paint it as if Turn based games are anymore monotonous or limiting as Arpgs are. Because let's face, in either turn based games or action rpgs, 90% the battles require no thought.
Holundrian
Unconfirmed Member
Mmmh this is actually a good point. I feel like a large string of their action efforts have been on the rather shallow side. Probably not thinking about certain titles right now but even stuff like Kingdom Hearts doesn't shine because it's amazingly deep.
Games like Type 0 it just becomes amazingly obvious how bad it can get when the game has to stand mostly on its combat system.
Again probably forgetting about a title maybe but actually Nier:A might be their best action effort in a while and that is also more because they got Platinum to do it.
DrROBschiz
Member
My issue with going action over turn based is you swap one set of strategic gameplay for another
Its a completely different experience
Its cools that they are flipping things on its head with the FF7 remake but we just came off of 15
I honestly thought it would have been much cooler to bring things back around with an enhanced turn based system.... maybe with a few twists like they did with 13
Instead they are piggy backing off 15 and going for spectacle.. Now I didn't enjoy 15 at first but it definitely grew on me
So ill keep an open mind and let myself play through whatever the first piece of content they give us
Its a completely different experience
Its cools that they are flipping things on its head with the FF7 remake but we just came off of 15
I honestly thought it would have been much cooler to bring things back around with an enhanced turn based system.... maybe with a few twists like they did with 13
Instead they are piggy backing off 15 and going for spectacle.. Now I didn't enjoy 15 at first but it definitely grew on me
So ill keep an open mind and let myself play through whatever the first piece of content they give us
Dark_castle
Junior Member
That's exactly what a remake is. Granted, it IS a remake remake where the game is majorly different in many aspects. If they called this remaster, then yeah it wouldn't make any sense. I for one still am glad for a full-blown remake that we're getting, even if it's no longer ATB turn-based. Still can't believe it's actually happening actually.
Vincent Grayson
Member
They're making this game in the mid-to-late 2010s, not the mid-to-late 1990s. If they just made the same basic game again, what would be the point? I've been viewing this as "what if we made FF7 in 2017 instead of 1997?" since it was announced, because it's been pretty clear that's the angle they're taking, and good on them, IMO.
But also, you're 100% wrong about the engine. It's not "built on the back" of 15 at all. 15 uses SE's in-house Luminous engine, whereas FF7r uses Unreal.
Zombegoast
Member
This begs the question.
What audience is this game trying to appeal to? There changing the story, redoing the gameplay and is going to be an episodic.
If I wanted a action combat Final Fantasy game i would play XV.
What audience is this game trying to appeal to? There changing the story, redoing the gameplay and is going to be an episodic.
If I wanted a action combat Final Fantasy game i would play XV.
Suburban Thug
Member
Nowhere did I argue sales, just pointing out that those are two successful modern turn based franchises to dispel the narrative that this type of gameplay is obsolete. Take a chill pill.
DrROBschiz
Member
Huh?
I just said precedent
The current precedent is.... Basically all the examples in this thread like REmake etc...
A remake can entail huge changes but having the core genre shifted is relatively new
So Im open to it but slightly disappointed since we arent getting as many turn based games these days and I love turn based RPGs
I'm okay with this as a design decision, but I do think that's the sort of criteria that means you probably shouldn't be calling it a 'remake' any more.
It sort of reminds me of the situation with the two Indys:
(Fate of Atlantis was the same, although few people remember the action game - an isometric affair - there!)
If we ignore the fact that they were contemporary with each other, if there had been a time gap between them, I wouldn't be happy with the action game being touted as a remake of the adventure.
But I guess this is part of where the nomenclature falls down a bit; there's nothing inherently wrong with what he's doing, and it's certainly arguable that it's a remake, it's just not what many would regard as one.
It sort of reminds me of the situation with the two Indys:
(Fate of Atlantis was the same, although few people remember the action game - an isometric affair - there!)
If we ignore the fact that they were contemporary with each other, if there had been a time gap between them, I wouldn't be happy with the action game being touted as a remake of the adventure.
But I guess this is part of where the nomenclature falls down a bit; there's nothing inherently wrong with what he's doing, and it's certainly arguable that it's a remake, it's just not what many would regard as one.
DrROBschiz
Member
Also can we dispel this damn myth that Genre's of games are somehow tied to being old or ancient?
Turned based RPG does not equal "oh this shit is 90's only gameplay"
Persona 5 is right around the corner
Turned based RPG does not equal "oh this shit is 90's only gameplay"
Persona 5 is right around the corner
Napalm_Frank
Member
I'd love to see FFXVI revert back to a turn-based system, but I doubt it. Knowing how tone-deaf Square Enix can be, they'll probably make another go of setting it in an open world again to add salt to the wound.
Let it go my friend, Persona is the future now.
Unless they're gonna take lessons from Neir Automata then we truly are in the darkest timeline.
Someone hasn't played the Pokemon metagame.
I'd love to see FFXVI revert back to a turn-based system, but I doubt it. Knowing how tone-deaf Square Enix can be, they'll probably make another go of setting it in an open world again to add salt to the wound.
Yes, SE is personally doing it to spite you and not to get the maximum return on their investments.
ShadowSoldier89
Member
How does "Same genre as the original" become "same basic game" to you.
I just compare all this to REmake 2
http://neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1339624
People still want that to be resident evil 2
Shin Johnpv
Member
And I'm out, no thanks Square.
If XVs battle system is truly the best in the franchise then I should probably not play another FF game. XV was my first Final Fantasy and it's combat is hot garbage.
DrROBschiz
Member
Lets get one thing for sure
People LOVE action rpgs
Bloodborne, Witcher3, FF15, Dark Souls, Monster Hunter (hunting game?), Dragons Dogma
I get they want to strike whats popular but it doesn mean turn based is dead by any means
I recognize this is Nomuras decision so we will see where he takes it. Not against the idea but i do mourn what is inevitably lost in the transition
People LOVE action rpgs
Bloodborne, Witcher3, FF15, Dark Souls, Monster Hunter (hunting game?), Dragons Dogma
I get they want to strike whats popular but it doesn mean turn based is dead by any means
I recognize this is Nomuras decision so we will see where he takes it. Not against the idea but i do mourn what is inevitably lost in the transition
LordOcidax
Member
Shame, love the combat system of FFVII... I remember using strategy to defeat the weapons, now everything is going to be a button mashing fest.. Youngest audience are not going to appreciate one of the best part of this game.
I don't know why people think a remake should always stand for pretty much the exact same game, like 90% of the same DNA + prettier graphics. These games aren't made by robots. If I was an auteur game director I would want to push my creativity to the limit even if I was making a remake to a beloved game, maybe even more so in that case. And I would also like to play to my strengths and implement a lot of the stuff I've learned over the years as director of Kingdom Hearts and various other games and even improve upon it, just to bring you the best possible product I can.
12 probably has the worst gameplay of any video game. It's debatable if it should even count as gameplay. You just want up to an enemy and you could put the controller down and your characters stab it over and over. The end. Great combat.
Vincent Grayson
Member
I don't see it as a genre change, for one.
Whether you're clumsily standing on opposite sides of a bespoke arena taking turns swinging, or dashing around the open world where each button press means an attack, it's still an RPG. An improved and more exciting combat system doesn't make FF7r a game in a different genre.