Yeah, which is why I can't talk about it until the embargo lifts.
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FINAL FANTASY XIII-2 |OT| Change the Future
- Thread starter Kagari
- Start date
Yeah, which is why I can't talk about it until the embargo lifts.
Welp.
Perfo
Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
Full english opening leaked: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53FsAOWV2K8
Kagari... I hope your laughs about the western version don't have anything to do with them ruining my favorite soundtrack in the series...
Kagari... I hope your laughs about the western version don't have anything to do with them ruining my favorite soundtrack in the series...
Lady Bird
Matsuno's Goebbels
That must have been the worst opening for a FF ever, IMO. It starts with pretentious & bad poetic dialogue, and when you try to analyze whatever Lightning's trying to say, it directly contradicts FFXIII's story (but then again, its ending already did so). The bad writing doesn't stops here, as it tries to make the player interested in the place by having Lightning saying "cool things" about it (that doesn't seem to mean anything at all) in a monotonous tone, and without any context to back it up. Then it focuses on new characters, with more bad poetry dialogue, and some vague stuff that it's hard to care about because the player doesn't even know what it's about. Finally, it blows into a childish, shallow action moment that contributes nothing to the story, feels completely random, and is even coupled with 12-years old "cool" villain lines that mean nothing and have no purpose but to "look cool" to the little kids.
Perfo
Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
It's funny how far our opinions can diverge. That's probably my favorite Final Fantasy opening in a long time. It sets the stage perfectly showing an ongoing endless battle; letting you peak for a moment at the beauty of the Valhalla; then hints at the drama all the characters are suffering, and then goes on with cool fighting scenes. All this engulfed in Visual Works' style and techs. Gotta love it.
That opener reminds me a lot of X-2's in that if you don't know the events leading up to it before you watch it, it's horribly confusing. Having read Kagari's import review, I understood what was going on, but for an en media res opening, it's way too vague.
However, we already know that the game's story is pretty atrocious so I consider this just the tip of that iceberg. The action was great and the visuals were pretty. I'm still probably going to hold off until the game is bargain bin priced especially if the US soundtrack has been altered. :S
Lady Bird
Matsuno's Goebbels
Between robotic woman motocycles and bugs, hundreds of bugs. All taken too seriously for how cheesy it is.
And trying to explain it through horrible, monotonous dialogue. But hey, that's how Motomu Toriyama and Daisuke Watanabe write their stories. Eventful moments are mostly left to filler action cutscenes that serve no purpose to the story, and then they come crying at interviews that they did not have enough development time. And any meaningful plot exposition is told through monologues, monologues, monologues, monologues, datalog, monologues, monologues and monologues. And the datalog, of course, because half of their cutscene time is spent on filler.
The opening sure had good graphics. And Kamikokuryo sure is an excellent art director, that's why the place looks so gorgeous.
...Without explaining what the hell is happening, without offering any context to make us care, and then the opening goes to completely ignore any "drama" as the villain is all happy battling and saying to Lightning to rejoice his terror.
In other words, pretty graphics.
R_thanatos
Member
Perfo
Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
It's Final Fantasy, not Call of Duty.
I find the dialogue quite entertaining actually, I've seen worse sincerely. Sure, there are some cheesy lines here and there, but really, it's standard jRPG/FF stuff. You should be used to it by now and know what to expect from a 25 years old series.
I agree, and also M.Hamauzu's contribution is quite lovely.
That's exactly the purpose, it's a classic cliché strategy for catching the attention of the player and letting him guess what's happening. Final Fantasy VII starts like this, so does Final Fantasy XIII, The Last Story, Xenoblade Chronicles and so on. Again, it's standard jrpg/FF stuff. I'm not surprised nor shocked, nor even offended by it like you imply to be. It sets the stage for the events to come in a quite epic way.
Perfo
Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
I could really get made with S-E if every fucking vocal track has been edited for some dumb reason. I accepted the rap missing from the Breasha Ruins, I can even forget about Crazy Chocobo... but it must end there. No anymore random edits and cuts. Respect for the original work. I'm buying a japanese game because I expect japanese sensibility in it. That's exactly what I want and I don't want to see it edited.
R_thanatos
Member
Square want to adapt to conquer new grounds..weaboos like us don't matter. remember leona lewis ???
No i'm not mad ...just pitifull
Lady Bird
Matsuno's Goebbels
If you consider FFXIII(-2) and FFVIII to be the entire FF franchise, sure. All other FF games either don't take themselves too seriously, or when they do, they're not that full of cheese.
Except the FF series never had dialogue this bad before XIII.
I agree.
Except that for FFXIII, you can actually understand what the hell is happening, and for FFVII, it is simple, iconic and doesn't throw you filler action and incomprehensible drama. It also happens that both of those have a lot of ambience and a clear, specific mood, which makes them much easier to immerse in for the player. Something that you can't acchieve with random monologues upon pretty graphics leading to drama you can't care about leading to filler action that serves no purpose.
Rahxephon91
Banned
It would make me mad if they cut out the lyrics. There's really no point trying to make the game more suitable for supposed Western taste. I mean you lost that battle from the beginning.
What makes the OST great for me is the fact that it's diffrent and doing stuff few western games would do. Getting rid of lyrics really hurts that appeal and in the end since they probably didn't change the music, just cripples what's left.
I was buying the CE for the OST, now I don't know anymore.
And while I don't want to argue about the quality of XIII anymore and can't speack for XIII-2. Playing XIII again, yeah I sure don't find the dialogue worse then most jrpgs. Outside of XII, it's actually fine and far better then most of the series in genre. But that's just opinion and I can't argue it, but likewise I haven't read a argument that proves it is terrible. It all comes down to hersay and my hersay isnt worth more then others.
I also find the idea that other FFs arent full of cheese to be very funny. 4 takes itself extremely seriously and is the most melodramatic thing ever. 6, is incredibly cheesy, every Tera development scene is this. 8, well 8 is 8. 9 has the best balance between humor and seriousness, it's tone is usually right. X almost but it's plot is full of cheese. XIII is completely dry. Not full of cheese, but when it did try humor it fell flat. I will say XIII, is a bit too serious for its own good, so it is full of cheese. But that just seems par the course. And compared to most other games, its nothing terrible.
But hey this is just my opinion.
What makes the OST great for me is the fact that it's diffrent and doing stuff few western games would do. Getting rid of lyrics really hurts that appeal and in the end since they probably didn't change the music, just cripples what's left.
I was buying the CE for the OST, now I don't know anymore.
And while I don't want to argue about the quality of XIII anymore and can't speack for XIII-2. Playing XIII again, yeah I sure don't find the dialogue worse then most jrpgs. Outside of XII, it's actually fine and far better then most of the series in genre. But that's just opinion and I can't argue it, but likewise I haven't read a argument that proves it is terrible. It all comes down to hersay and my hersay isnt worth more then others.
I also find the idea that other FFs arent full of cheese to be very funny. 4 takes itself extremely seriously and is the most melodramatic thing ever. 6, is incredibly cheesy, every Tera development scene is this. 8, well 8 is 8. 9 has the best balance between humor and seriousness, it's tone is usually right. X almost but it's plot is full of cheese. XIII is completely dry. Not full of cheese, but when it did try humor it fell flat. I will say XIII, is a bit too serious for its own good, so it is full of cheese. But that just seems par the course. And compared to most other games, its nothing terrible.
But hey this is just my opinion.
RPGCrazied
Member
Maybe we get a directors cut? Sure it has to be something of value, if Kagari can't wait to talk about it.
Perfo
Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
I think her statement was more negative than anything lol ~
edit. A video tour for the Collector's Edition Guide: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hn7gualHf-s
RPGCrazied
Member
That guide looks nice, will look great next to the XIII one I have. Why negative? Just cause they took out the vocals from some of the tracks? That doesn't bug me, I mean, if you want to hear them, just listen to the soundtrack.
Perfo
Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
It bugs me when they remove a main instrument (/a voice) from a track just for no reasons.
Dusk Golem
A 21st Century Rockefeller
"That time was lost; yet time continued onward."
Stay classy translators. I'm still on the verge whenever I should get this game or not. On one hand, I seemed to have enjoyed the original XIII more than most people. With that said though, the sequel isn't entirely high on my priorities list, especially with so many horror games launching this year.
Stay classy translators. I'm still on the verge whenever I should get this game or not. On one hand, I seemed to have enjoyed the original XIII more than most people. With that said though, the sequel isn't entirely high on my priorities list, especially with so many horror games launching this year.
They removed it for a reason, and you know why. If you're that desperate for vocals, import the Asian version with English subtitles.
Edvardelis
Member
Everyone does up to the last minute embargoes these days, Bethesda even did it with Skyrim.
Zoe
Member
But what reason is that? It's in English.
If they think the vocals on the soundtrack may be unappetizing to western audiences, then they'll remove it under the impression that this will improve their product for the specified audience.
The idea isn't to appeal to people who want that specific flavor. Those are the people who are already locked into buying this product. SE is looking for the audience beyond that, and if removing vocals is the way to draw some random idiots in then so be it.
I don't agree that out of all the things they changed vocals will make much any difference. But to say SE removed the vocals for "no reason" is incorrect.
Rahxephon91
Banned
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
Well that doesn't sound good.
Looking forward to what you have to say on Saturday because that'll give me enough time to cancel the English version and import the Asian English version. You've gotta be friggin' kidding me.
I'll be extremely annoyed if this turns into an FFIV EasyType scenario. This is not what I want.
Aaarrrrrrgh. >_<
You said it better than I could. I wish they'd stop caring about shit like this and just do their own thing. Set the standard rather than trying to live up to a "supposed" standard.
Perfo
Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
If they're developing a game for an international audience then why letting Mizuta, Suzuki and Hamauzu going crazy with it? It doesn't make any sense to me. First you give your composers total freedom (and thanks to that we got probably the best soundtrack in years), then you strip that away from them for some idea of cultural differences. Dumb. This is far worse than adding L.Lewis if you ask me.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
Castor Krieg
Banned
@Perfo - sorry man, just looked at the opening, it's terrible and just reinforces my choice not to get this Day 1. Compare it to X-2 opening, that one was fun, hip, concise. This one is paper characters saying one-liners with no sense or emotions.
I love how they constantly say they want to make FF games for everyone, because the more they try, the worse the series gets. It would be funny if someone said that to Kitase, or Wada. Just look at sales.
I love how they constantly say they want to make FF games for everyone, because the more they try, the worse the series gets. It would be funny if someone said that to Kitase, or Wada. Just look at sales.
Perfo
Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
Why I don't hear these type of comments for every other jRPG out there? You're not going to convince me that Tales of has better openings or overall better scripts. Sometimes the hate for this series is so exaggerated if not totally unfair. I'm quite happy with the current state of Final Fantasy and I'm quite happy about its qualities when compared to all the other home console jRPGs I played in this generation.
It would have been pretty fun years ago to use the same "lens" over games like Lost Odyssey and Blue Dragon.
UberTag
Member
Try not to get too frustrated, Perfo. You're going to be awfully busy defending this game over the next month and I say this as someone who feels XIII received an excessively bad reception around these parts.
It certainly didn't drag in sleep-inducing tedium as was the case with Discs 1, 2 & 4 of Lost Odyssey. It also delivered some incredible visuals and some of the most strategy-intensive JRPG battle mechanics once the game opened up in Pulse. Juggling paradigms to take down some of those bosses turned into a game of finesse that proved quite invigorating. It's not quite on the level of Vesperia or Xenoblade for me but it's certainly not the bane of all JRPGs it's been painted as.
It's not worth getting bent out of shape over how people feel about XIII-2. You enjoy it and that's all that should really matter for you.
Perfo
Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
You're right about this, but it comes out natural from me supporting Final Fantasy considering how much I care for this series. I understand discussing about something, but bashing on everything (and with this I mean literary everything, if you read this topic you know there's no a single aspect of XIII or XIII-2 that hasn't being called a crap by someone: name it and it's there, from character design, straight to script, music, graphic, framerate, opening, QTEs, mog clock, ending ect. – I think only the start menu didn't get any negative feedback, for now) just gets annoying after so long. And this happens only with FF, when maybe others are willing to pardon a game that doesn't even run well (like Skyrim on PS3), or ignoring similar faults in games that because are directed by their favorite director (name every Mistwalker game) they don't care about criticizing those. I'm not speaking of any specific individual of course, just making a generic comment on what I've seen in the last years around.
I'll do it, of course. But let's remember something: others (and ours) opinions can even influence Square Enix making bad (/good) decisions based upon those, like for example removing lyrics from certain tracks. I stay here supporting what I like because I want also my opinion to have chances to be considered like theirs
I'm here to say: not everyone hates Final Fantasy! Keep up with the good work!
Well I'd say some Tales of games (Xillia, Graces f, Vesperia, etc) have better openings than FFXIII-2 but I see nothing wrong with the opening for FFXIII-2 myself. Seems perfectly fine and just makes me want the release date to come sooner personally.
But meh, I don't care much if others don't like it as long as I do personally. With a popular series like Final Fantasy, you're going to get much more in the way of mixed reactions than a less known or less popular series/game.
Paracelsus
Member
Some people should stop comparing glorified cutscenes with opening videos.
Lightning's VA work is ridiculously stilted in most of the English scenes I have seen so far (haven't seen the intro yet, still in class). It's different from her performance in XIII, where she was more stoic than anything else. But here... I can't put my finger on it and maybe someone can help me on this; she just sounds unnatural.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
Yeah, seriously, Perfo. Don't concentrate a lot on defending the game, because I get the feeling you're going to have to do it a lot... and it'll get tiring. Enjoy the game because you're allowed to do it. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise. Final Fantasy is a series where you're always going to get mixed opinions about all the games in the series, so don't let it get to you much.You're right about this, but it comes out natural from me supporting Final Fantasy considering how much I care for this series. I understand discussing about something, but bashing on everything (and with this I mean literary everything, if you read this topic you know there's no a single aspect of XIII or XIII-2 that hasn't being called a crap by someone: name it and it's there, from character design, straight to script, music, graphic, framerate, opening, QTEs, mog clock, ending ect. – I think only the start menu didn't get any negative feedback, for now) just gets annoying after so long. And this happens only with FF, when maybe others are willing to pardon a game that doesn't even run well (like Skyrim on PS3), or others similar but because there's their favorite director behind those (name every Mistwalker game) they don't care about criticizing those.
I'll do it, of course. But let's remember something: others (and ours) opinions can even influence Square Enix making bad (/good) decisions based upon those, like for example removing lyrics from certain tracks. I stay here supporting what I like because I want also my opinion to have chances to be considered like theirs
I'm here to say: not everyone hates Final Fantasy!
While I'm indifferent to FFXIII (and I don't like its narrative too much), I do think it gets a lot of unwarranted exaggerated hatred by a lot of people (not just on GAF), with some people saying it's the worst game they've ever played! If that's truly the case, then I'm jealous, because I've played worse games than FFXIII. At least FFXIII is actually playable, y'know?
I'll say this, though: Final Fantasy is not the only series that this happens to, so it isn't a special case at all. It's just like how I don't really care to defend lesser games of the Suikoden series or Skyward Sword (though Sonic Colours, CD, and Generations are exceptions to the rule since they get piled on a lot and sometimes I just can't help it, lol). No game series is immune to criticism like that. It happens to Zelda, it happens to Castlevania, it happens to Metroid, it happens to Tales, it happens to Suikoden, and so on and so forth.
I did like a few Tales openings better than FFXIII-2's, though. That's just a personal preference since I like stylization over photorealistic stuff. I really loved Xillia's OPs, for instance, because Ufotable did the animations. I liked FFX-2's opening more because it so silly and out-there, and I liked the stylization used for introducing the characters' names.
btw, you should post in the FF Community Thread more.
Yeah, I didn't really like Ali Hillis's take on Lightning at all.
She sounds stilted because she's narrating, I guess she's not used to it? I dunno. It sounds... very strange and unnatural, I agree.
Perfo
Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
It's legit to have different opinions, as I have mine and it's obviously different
We need more duckroll here!
Jokes aside, I'm pretty confident in saying that the japanese VA is still better, but XIII and XIII-2's english VA isn't that terrible at all. Plus I appreciate they tried to choose voice actors that somehow resemble the originals and at the same time trying to make them act like them. There were times in which voices were pick randomly and acting was flat as hell. Ali Hillis is a decent Lightning and Liam O'Brien can make up for a cool villain. Of course, speaking of wings of night (that's cheesy, I admit it!) would sound funny even in the mouth of the best VA ever, lol ~
Yeah thanks, I'll try to pass by there more often when I get the time. Defending Final Fantasy keeps me busy all over the internet you know! lol ~
<3 Ufotable.
Also, FFX-2s opening was pretty nice I thought, thought it was pretty fun the way they introduced the characters and it wasn't trying to be serious or anything.
That said, I know some people who absolutely despise the opening because of how silly it is so *shrugs* can't please everyone.
VA wise: I'd say, blame it on the Voice direction. If she is doing it badly/not the way they want it to sound then it's really not the VAs fault that she gets no feedback or asked to do it again.
UberTag
Member
Typically, a change in delivery would be attributed to the game having a different voice director.
Jack Fletcher was at the helm for both direction & casting of most of the recent Final Fantasy adaptations including X, X-2, XII, XIII and FFT: War of the Lions. I have not seen anything as yet to indicate he was retained for XIII-2.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
I love FFX-2's opening. Colour palette, lighting, cuts, direction, music selection, etc. A lot of it added up to being just delightful fun and ultimately set the tone for the rest of the game (aside from the minor political parts). *shrug* I like FFX-2 and its various systems, so I don't have a lot of criticism for it.
And regarding the voice direction, I wouldn't be surprised if that were the issue once again here (since that seemed to be the issue with Georgia van Cuylenberg as her normal voice seems alright and they apparently told her to squeak and squeal like Yukari Fukui based on what she said in that Gamespot interview). Based on the demo, Noel and Serah seem alright.
Since Lightning takes on mostly a narration role in this game, I guess Hillis might not be used to it and the voice direction.
(Also, I want another Tales game with Ufotable animation again because it was sooooo gooood. Tales of Symphonia's OVA and God Eater Burst's OP aren't enough, lol.)
jimmypython
Member
I'm totally with Perfo about the opening.
for me, ff13-2 has the best *opening sequence* of all 3D FFs.
Because one thing I should point out is that FF13-2 opening is much more than one single piece of FMV shown in that youtube video.
for me, ff13-2 has the best *opening sequence* of all 3D FFs.
Because one thing I should point out is that FF13-2 opening is much more than one single piece of FMV shown in that youtube video.
Go_Ly_Dow
Member
I don't really care much about the vocal removal in the demo tracks, but if they remove the vocals from the track in the Historia Crux trailer...I WILL RAGE!1!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i8F3epUlefo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i8F3epUlefo
Does the opening actually go on to explain what's happening and give us a reason to care after that 4 or so minutes of FMV or do we have to read the datalog again for information that should be apparent in cutscene or gameplay?
Personally, if I'm not invested in a plot within the first ten or so minutes of a movie, I won't like the rest of the movie.
If I'm not invested in a plot within the first hour of an RPG, then I won't like the rest of the RPG.
The latter is the direction that I'm leaning in with 13-2 right now. =p
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
That's the New Bodhum theme. It's great.
I'll be disappointed if they remove the vocals from the Historia Crux theme.
djplaeskool
Member
TIME AND SPACE! TIME AND SPACE! TIME AND SPACE!
Anyways, Play-Asia just authorized the billing for my HK Edition.
Should be shipping soon.
Go_Ly_Dow
Member
Same.
I can understand tinkering around with the rapping, but the vocals in these tracks is what makes them so awesome.