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Final Fantasy XIV: Heavensward |OT2| RIP Bowmage 2015-2017.
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BossDarkseid
Member
Having barely played a Tank in any MMO before this talk is making me want to try one out...
Enjoying my Lancer atm but since I'll have to level Marauder (?) to go Dragoon I might dabble in it. The responsibilities don't irk me, I just have little confidence in my tanking abilties. Still, should be fun.
Enjoying my Lancer atm but since I'll have to level Marauder (?) to go Dragoon I might dabble in it. The responsibilities don't irk me, I just have little confidence in my tanking abilties. Still, should be fun.
A Sentient Keyboard
Member
Hey thread! I'm thinking about getting into this game, but before I do, could I get some job recommendations? I've never played an MMO or a Final Fantasy game before, so I don't have a lot of context to help me make my choice.
- Obviously, I'm looking for a job that is fun and engaging to play. Ideally all jobs are, but maybe there are some that are more straightforward or just boring that you'd advise me to stay away from. I don't mind a steep learning curve.
- I enjoy min-maxing stats, optimizing strategies, reading/watching guides, etc. I would like a job that rewards optimization.
- I don't mind a bit of responsibility, and once I feel comfortable with the game, I might even get into playing the leader role.
Based on these, what jobs would best fit me? I'm seeing a lot of recommendations for summoner and monk online, but I'm not above playing a tank or healer.
PS: I know that this game allows you to change classes easily, but I'd also like to pick my race with my intended job in mind. Every guide I read said that race stats have barely any relevance at high levels, but, like I said, I'm a min-maxing dork.
- Obviously, I'm looking for a job that is fun and engaging to play. Ideally all jobs are, but maybe there are some that are more straightforward or just boring that you'd advise me to stay away from. I don't mind a steep learning curve.
- I enjoy min-maxing stats, optimizing strategies, reading/watching guides, etc. I would like a job that rewards optimization.
- I don't mind a bit of responsibility, and once I feel comfortable with the game, I might even get into playing the leader role.
Based on these, what jobs would best fit me? I'm seeing a lot of recommendations for summoner and monk online, but I'm not above playing a tank or healer.
PS: I know that this game allows you to change classes easily, but I'd also like to pick my race with my intended job in mind. Every guide I read said that race stats have barely any relevance at high levels, but, like I said, I'm a min-maxing dork.
BossDarkseid
Member
Thank you! I will pin this for later.
Hmm. I'm of the opinion that whether SAM is DPS or not is largely going to depend on RDM's role (unless they release 2 DPS jobs, which could totally happen since they might have released 2 DPS classes for HW if not for Rogue/Ninja coming out early, but I digress).
There's going to have to be at least 1 tank and 1 healer job released to keep queue times down and expand the role for those currently playing them and those that would play if enticed. To say otherwise is pretty silly.
Since RDM is famous for being able to do a lot of stuff, narrowing it down for a game like this is rough, but for now I am gonna guess they would be a DPS with support options like MCH/BRD or even SMN (Rez), OR a healer with heavy emphasis on offense/debuffs as well to keep the class flavor. However, this same categorization could also apply to a theoretical Dancer as well, as that job has been known to both heal/support (FF11, and Mobius both examples that immediately come to mind) and deal damage/debuff (Tactics games, FF5).
It's still a bit of a stretch to assume SAM and DNC are confirmed jobs without more info, of course, but RDM is such a wild card that knowing more about that job (and whether or not we get more than 3 new jobs) will guide the discussion quite a bit more. "If SAM isn't going to tank, who will?" is the question to be answered, imo.
There's going to have to be at least 1 tank and 1 healer job released to keep queue times down and expand the role for those currently playing them and those that would play if enticed. To say otherwise is pretty silly.
Since RDM is famous for being able to do a lot of stuff, narrowing it down for a game like this is rough, but for now I am gonna guess they would be a DPS with support options like MCH/BRD or even SMN (Rez), OR a healer with heavy emphasis on offense/debuffs as well to keep the class flavor. However, this same categorization could also apply to a theoretical Dancer as well, as that job has been known to both heal/support (FF11, and Mobius both examples that immediately come to mind) and deal damage/debuff (Tactics games, FF5).
It's still a bit of a stretch to assume SAM and DNC are confirmed jobs without more info, of course, but RDM is such a wild card that knowing more about that job (and whether or not we get more than 3 new jobs) will guide the discussion quite a bit more. "If SAM isn't going to tank, who will?" is the question to be answered, imo.
Quote
Member
Thanks for this! I want to go for Mentor soon and tanking is last on my list.
Arg, I'm so jealous that this gets to be your first MMO.
I don't have any recommendations for a job/class, but the nice thing about FFXIV is that you don't need to make separate characters for each job/class, you just change out your main weapon and you're good to go (edit: I just saw your PS, so ignore this). So you can experiment with all of them pretty quickly. I guess my only recommendation per your reqs is that you'd probably hate Thaumaturge (Conjurer as well) as it's very boring in the early levels. I think tanking would give you a lot of responsibility if that's what you want, and it comes with it's own perks like instant queuing.
Also, make sure you get an referral code from someone here (I can, but I think others might need it more than me), you will get extra items that make life easier.
A Sentient Keyboard
Member
Ooh, good call on the referall code, thanks.
About the class changing, thats what I meant with my PS edit. I realize race stats hardly matter, but I also know myself and it would always nibble at me if I pick a magic oriented race to play a summoner and then switch to a monk later. My stats could have been half a % higher!
VanillaCakeIsBurning
Member
If SAM isn't the tank maybe a blunt weapon class could be?
I've heard people say that Monk lacks utility that the other two melee dps have so that's something they could change for the expansion. One idea I had is if the new tank deals blunt damage so Dragon Kick would benefit them and in term benefit that specific combo with Monk.
Just an idea since they're probably planning something completely different.
Quote
Member
Ha, yeah I saw the edit after.
I can't stress enough how unimportant race stats are, they're left over from 1.0. But I can understand that it might nag at you. You can always change your race later too which I assume comes with stat changes as well with a Fantasia Potion. They cost money, but somehow I have a few free ones. Maybe you get a free one along the main story, I can't remember. Hopefully some others will chime in on a recommendation for a class.
Edit: Oh, you get it after your first 30 paid for days or part of the Heavensward Collectors Edition.
VanillaCakeIsBurning
Member
Reading random threads someone mentioned they could do Samurai with an Ala Mhigan twist or something.
Like if this guy is
an actual Samurai (as in he uses Samurai animations like the previous bosses use animations from other classes) then that's a pretty cool take on the idea.
Although the triple scabbard is probably a boss only thing. Seems too cool to let players get a hold of it.
Like if this guy is
an actual Samurai (as in he uses Samurai animations like the previous bosses use animations from other classes) then that's a pretty cool take on the idea.
Although the triple scabbard is probably a boss only thing. Seems too cool to let players get a hold of it.
VanillaCakeIsBurning
Member
Yeah, his mechanics during his fight might involve him switching to different swords/modes.
I would like to see them add an Extreme fight with human opponents for once. All of them IIRC are against large primals.
There's something about fighting human opponents that's different and I think it would be a neat idea for them to do that.
Oh they definitely could add a blunt weapon class, but for me it's more like "what are they most likely to do"?, because asking "what could they do" means pulling for the wellspring of potential FF jobs that have been around over the years and analyzing them to death. Sure, there could be another job like AST that was totally out of left field with just enough presence in a previous game to build something entirely different open (Olan in FFT who joins you for all of one battle but that's not something that anyone's going to actually guess, so meh.
Like I said, I won't leave anything off the table, cause if they add stuff like AST and are adding stuff like RDM, they could put in just about anything, But going by that, I also can't rule out the very real possibility of SAM being a tank. They have been putting emphasis on getting people to want to tank with propping up WAR like they have and making the fairly popular DRK into a tank, and there's no reason they can't do the same thing with SAM. They could make it a DPS, but they actually want people playing the tank job; mind you: they can make SAM look cool, but can they make *insert obscure job here* popular enough to even try out for a playbase resistant to tanking?
It's exciting that this is your first MMO. My tips from a longtime MMO player and this game vs the merits/demerits of other games:
SMN and MNK are both good choices. AST, SCH, MCH, and WAR also have a heavy emphasis on min/maxing or class specific mechanics to learn (kind of like an extra minigame on top of what you are already doing) that I have personally played.
SMN and SCH both have pets to look after and maximize in addition to SMN support options like battle Rez/Eye4Eye/Virus, and SCH has pretty valuable DPS options as a healer and can contribute quite a bit when a lot of healing isn't needed.
AST gets a lot of options during combat with their card system on who to buff and when on the fly. Boosting the correct person or landing the correct buff combo at the right time is an insane boost to your party (+10% party damage for ~40 seconds, or ~20% damage reduction on a tank for 60+ seconds, for example).
Don't want to ramble on but at this point pretty much all the classes have personal mechanics like that, so I wouldn't brush off any of them before giving them a try and finding out what clicks with you.
As for race, seriously, just pick who looks the most aesthetically pleasing to you. The stat differences are so minor that no one is going to notice, and since a true min/maxer in this game would have multiple jobs of different roles available, that would be diminished to the point where you'd be race changing based on whatever class you decided to "main" for *insert cutting edge content here* You will even get a Fantasia for playing for a bit so if you change your mind you can reselect for free (the first time).
As for a samurai tank, I would like it to have some type of active parry move.
Kind of like the hypothetical Dragoon's rage meter, where in that moment you can just MGR parry all damage away, And you see bosses arms fly back like " shit his defense is too strong "
Edit: So how it would work right is instead of usual defense buffs, though you do get those by having other tanks. You get parry's Its timing based and the sooner you activate the parry to the hit of the thing you are tying to parry the less damage you take and in some cases none. These parry moves would have timers like shadow skin and shit for DRK. And then you get a buff move that makes the whole parry window for all the stuff you can use for a while in the realm of low damage or invincibility.
Maurader is cool
I say go for dark knight tho, because its just guts. Its just guts.
Kind of like the hypothetical Dragoon's rage meter, where in that moment you can just MGR parry all damage away, And you see bosses arms fly back like " shit his defense is too strong "
Edit: So how it would work right is instead of usual defense buffs, though you do get those by having other tanks. You get parry's Its timing based and the sooner you activate the parry to the hit of the thing you are tying to parry the less damage you take and in some cases none. These parry moves would have timers like shadow skin and shit for DRK. And then you get a buff move that makes the whole parry window for all the stuff you can use for a while in the realm of low damage or invincibility.
Maurader is cool
I say go for dark knight tho, because its just guts. Its just guts.
VanillaCakeIsBurning
Member
Maybe a beast master that uses a large club? I had the idea of a pet that has skills that could build aggro for you like Ninjas can by using Shadewalker.
It could be their way of ranged pulling, like if there are two enemies you could send the pet after one while you go after the other with the end result being both enemies moving towards you after the pet hits the second target with some aggro moves. It could have a leap enmity generating move since moving slow like Titan-egi would be ineffective.
Of course that's just one possible idea, one that there aren't any particular hints for.
I can't really think of a job that uses clubs or blunt weapons (other than White Mage but that's not the sort of club a tank would use).
BossDarkseid
Member
I like the idea of Dark Knight but doesn't it only come in Ishgard? I'm levelling up again with a friend on a different server/realm so I'd have to level all through the MSQ to that point.
A Sentient Keyboard
Member
Is there any reason to buy xiv on the official site vs the steam store?
Thanks for your advice! I think I'll start out as an arcanist and move onto summoner if I like it. I made a good looking midlander in the benchmark character creator I want to use, and I guess I'll just have to live with their low starting mind if I pick up a healer job.
Thanks for your advice! I think I'll start out as an arcanist and move onto summoner if I like it. I made a good looking midlander in the benchmark character creator I want to use, and I guess I'll just have to live with their low starting mind if I pick up a healer job.
hosannainexcelsis
Member
I picked up DRK recently, mainly because I've heard plenty of praise for the job questline's story, but I failed to even beat the first job quest solo duty. Maybe I'm just not good enough for tanking classes.
Yeah, you gotta get to ishgard to get it
Nah its because it doesn't explain to you what the moves do, and it starts you off with 30 levels of moves you aren't familiar with in a fucted up order on your dash. Trust me, I would give it a try after looking at what the moves do. The class isn't that hard.
JoeyJungle
Banned
What's the difference between Character and Character Name in the recruitment form?
How full is the FC right now? I play a few times a week but I'm still doing 2.x content, I've wanted to join for a while but don't want to take a spot from someone who could participate more.
Quote
Member
Wherever you purchase is where you have to purchase in the future. So if you get the Steam version now, all expansions will have to be bought through Steam. Which I believe excludes any deals you might get at Amazon or if you're interested in physical Collectors Editions.
I think the consensus would be to buy through the official site (or Amazon ect) for more options, or buy through Steam if you care about playtime on your profile.
Personally, I bought through the site and activated my account through it and buy expansion packs there or third-party BUT I also bought the Steam version later just to use as a launcher and track play time (this could stop working next expansion, who knows). This does not work the other way however.
More details here - https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comments/33gh06/buy_on_steam_or_squareenix/
VanillaCakeIsBurning
Member
The problem with starting out with the Heavensward classes is they throw 30 levels worth of abilities at you from the start. It will take a bit of time to properly organize your crossbars and to learn what everything does.
SPeaking of that, will the new classes be like Heavensward where you have to get to the first town before you can get them?
If so they'll probably start at a higher level than 30, maybe 40 or 50? In that case you'll have to learn how to play them with a lot on your plate as well.
If they start them off at level 1 and allow anyone who has the expansion to select them then I'm not sure how that would go over since if you want to go through the expansion with a new job then that means you won't be playing any of the new content for quite a while.
EDIT: There's something wrong when I have the third highest number of posts in a thread.
Stone Ocean
Member
Steam version can use the Steam wallet to pay for stuff and depending of what currency you use this means cheaper subscription and Mogstation items.
not sure what the difference is. the fc is not full so you can join even if you play a few times a week
hosannainexcelsis
Member
Yeah, I appreciate that they want to take away some of the early level grind for players who are already experienced at the game, but it is rather disorienting when they throw a bunch of stuff at you all at once and tell you to figure it out for yourself. I mean, they talked a little about the Darkside stuff, but they haven't even given me that ability yet.
Hopefully Stormblood will figure out a good balance for its new classes. I don't expect the game itself to lay out optimal rotations and such, but it would be nice to have a little more tutorials available for new abilities rather than having to search for Internet guide to figure out how to best use them.
Yes, the Steam version comes with too many drawbacks.
The non steam version (SE site, GMG, Amazon, etc....) tends to go on sale more frequently than the Steam version, expansions will have discounts at launch (Amazon Prime savings, Best Buy Gamers Club, usual GMG launch discount, etc...), and you have the option of purchasing physical collectors edition of the base game and expansions.
The only perk the Steam version has is that you can pay for your sub using the Steam wallet. Everything else is a drawback cause once you've registered the Steam version you're locked into purchasing expansions from Steam and since the game rarely goes on sale in Steam and they offer no expansion discounts at launch you'll most likely have to pay full price for them. You also won't be able to register physical collectors editions of the game cause they dont come with Steam codes and the steam repository for the game hasn't been updated since launch so you'll still be reliant on the game launcher to download the game.
WonderCheese
Banned
I'm planning on starting soon. I'd like to pick a well populated server, so any advice on which server to try for for someone located in California?
Yes, I'm aware that I may need to create my character during off-hours.
Yes, I'm aware that I may need to create my character during off-hours.
A lot of people failed that one. Early HW I remember there being a lot of people asking for a Protect so they can do it.
VanillaCakeIsBurning
Member
Yeah Darkside is your damage stance that steadily drains your mana. You will get it after beating that job quest.
You could try out the training hall/Hall of the Novice. Never done it myself but apparently it's useful for new players and might have some stuff to help you learn how to tank if you're going to try Dark Knight.
SolVanderlyn
Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
Leveling a WAR now, this is really helpful, thanks
IonicSnake
Banned
I really hope Samurai is a dps if they release it, we need a swordbased dps role, tank already have Paladin and Dark Knight.
NCR Redslayer
NeoGAF's Vegeta
I want samurai to be a tank.
I just want more people to play tank so I can have shorter queue times.
VanillaCakeIsBurning
Member
If Samurai does end up being a tank then that's probably Red Mage.
I wonder if they want to keep tanks unified in terms of the damage type they deal since slashing so far is their damage type so Warrior's and Ninja's benefit any tank combo.
SolVanderlyn
Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
Ninja should have been blink tank like it was in XI. Yes, I know it was unintentionally used that way, but that is irrelevant, lol
On SAM I'm kinda in the "well we already have 2 sword tanks and 0 sword dps" camp, though Ninja does fill the slash dps role. Speaking of tanks, I recently picked WAR back up, and while I enjoy how it plays on the overworld, actually using it in the intended group context is another matter. Like I know the basics of what to do (tomahawk - run through - overpower x2 or 3 - cycle through 1-2-3, face enemies away from party, red square = good), but every dungeon seems to have at least one trash pull that devolves into an aoe cleavesterfuck or one critter peels off to go after the overgeared trigger happy bow/mage and I feel bad for the poor monk caught in the middle. Some healers tell me they don't mind because 'healing just the tank is boring', but it makes me feel like I'm not doing my job properly. I've ended up much more comfortable against bosses than large pulls, 'cause at least then enmity is less of a concern and I can experiment with deliverance mode.
On the other hand, I know what it's like from the dps perspective since as a SMN I do sometimes get bit too strong on the aoe and giving tanks a hard time.
Also I have a feeling I don't use berserk, holmgang, and equilibrium as much as I should.
On the other hand, I know what it's like from the dps perspective since as a SMN I do sometimes get bit too strong on the aoe and giving tanks a hard time.
Also I have a feeling I don't use berserk, holmgang, and equilibrium as much as I should.
VanillaCakeIsBurning
Member
AOE is awesome on WAR.
What I normally do is round up a couple groups then throw out a couple Overpowers to get aggro lead, then I switch to Deliverance and get Maim buff up then pop Berserk/Infuriate/Bloodbath/Internal Release/Decimate and go to town with the Overpower spam till everything is dead.
Use Equilibrium to get some TP back as well. You can also pop Vengeance for the 30% damage taken reduction and the 50 potency attack on anything that hits you.
I wouldn't bother using Unchained at all for large pulls since you'll live in Deliverance and you can use it for Decimate instead.
Abstrusity
Member
VanillaCakeIsBurning
Member
This was a thing in Tera online. Warrior functioned as a dodge tank and it was awesome. Probably the most fun tank class I've played in a game. You could also fill in the DPS position if you had another Warrior or Lancer who were a shield/block type tank.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
I wish the Halloween body piece for this year had a no-cape variant...
Try the Riviera Doublet from Gold Saucer, the Vampire Vest is based on its model (color scheme is different though).
Been thinking how Red Mage is going to fit in.
Red Mages in FF have always been a jack of all trades class but unable to access the high end skills of either a Black Mage or a White Mage.
In FFXI it found its role as more of a support class. This obviously does not fit within the light party structure of FFXIV, and I feel that making this class hard-locked to either a dps or a healer takes away from what the class is suppose to be. But then if you leave it open to be able to do both roles it either makes black and white mage redundant, or red mage redundant as it can't do both roles as well.
I can see two ways of would ideally like to see them fit it in:
1. Expand light classes to 5 members making this addition slot for support classes. I do not expect this to happen but would be pretty cool if they did this. Also rebrand Bard as a support job and maybe rework Ninja to fit this role as well. I've always liked support classes in mmos which is something that has really disappeared from the genre. I do not expect them to do this.
2. What I thinks more likely is that red Mage will have something similar to Cleric Stance that lets them switch from being a full dps to a full healer job. And that the you will be able to queue for either dps or healer slots in parties.
Red Mages in FF have always been a jack of all trades class but unable to access the high end skills of either a Black Mage or a White Mage.
In FFXI it found its role as more of a support class. This obviously does not fit within the light party structure of FFXIV, and I feel that making this class hard-locked to either a dps or a healer takes away from what the class is suppose to be. But then if you leave it open to be able to do both roles it either makes black and white mage redundant, or red mage redundant as it can't do both roles as well.
I can see two ways of would ideally like to see them fit it in:
1. Expand light classes to 5 members making this addition slot for support classes. I do not expect this to happen but would be pretty cool if they did this. Also rebrand Bard as a support job and maybe rework Ninja to fit this role as well. I've always liked support classes in mmos which is something that has really disappeared from the genre. I do not expect them to do this.
2. What I thinks more likely is that red Mage will have something similar to Cleric Stance that lets them switch from being a full dps to a full healer job. And that the you will be able to queue for either dps or healer slots in parties.
http://img2.finalfantasyxiv.com/accimg2/c4/f0/c4f08131c6eb31be1cb426b2f734cb744bb5dd1a.jpg
quality cash shop designs for the fans
quality cash shop designs for the fans
SliceSabre
Banned
Why do they fucking love robes so fucking much holy shit.
Red mage will never be a half-and-half hybrid in this game. It's too shallow to support a class design like that. If it's a half a healer, people will just take better healers, if it's a half-DPS, people will just take a better DPS, healers already can output a considerable amount of damage, though if you make RDM a healer then then what's the difference? And most "honest healers" won't DPS on it anyway.
XIV is not XI.
XIV is not XI.
Abstrusity
Member
Well, we'll have to see what they plan on the battle adjustments. If they go deep enough, we MIGHT open it up for hybrids like that.
Paladin might have enough Mind to heal themselves while tanking, in addition to having access to Cure 2(without the bonuses WHM gets), RDM might get some hybridization going on. Remember, the funding for 4.0 is TWICE that of 3.0.
Stone Ocean
Member
And the budget is all going into making Verminion an eSport
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