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Fitness |OT7| #Swelfies, Trap Lords, and Quadzilla

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C

Coriolanus

Banned
muntersaur said:
You could easily do SS by following the exercises and rep scheme but not add weight. Whose fault is it - the program or the person following the program?
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Id go so far as to argue that if a person did that, they wouldnt be doing SS.

Either way, the point is tangential to a key aspect youve glossed over: here the high rep program is provided by a trainer that also checks up on you, and to whom you have to report. At which point whose fault is it, the common person's, for following the instructions given by a supposed authority, or the trainer's?

Scarecrow said:
My heart going to explode if I eat too many eggs?
Click to expand...

Been on 12-14 eggs a day 5 days a week since january first. HDL, VLDL and Trigs are fine. Cholesterol nearing 400 tho. Lost near 40 pounds already so whatever.
 
S

Szu

Member
Scarecrow said:
My heart going to explode if I eat too many eggs?
Click to expand...

Well, your stomach might explode before your heart.

3-Cool-Hand-Luke-quotes.gif
 
B

BumRush

Member
Coriolanus said:
Been on 12-14 eggs a day 5 days a week since january first. HDL, VLDL and Trigs are fine. Cholesterol nearing 400 tho. Lost near 40 pounds already so whatever.
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You're trying to LOSE weight and you're eating 14 eggs a day? I mean they're great for you but isn't this excessive? Is that all you eat?
 
O

ohhthegore

Member
Sadetar said:
I am so extremely ridiculously happy at the moment! ^_^

I met the orthopedic doctor today. He said that the herniated disk healed nicely back then and that my spine and disks are totally fine at the moment. I have only piriformis syndrome and according to the doc, it should be fine after couple of months! I have been so damn relieved today because of these news. Sure I still have the nerve pain, but since it is muscle related normal ibuprofein will work and now I know how to be able to heal it as well. Most likely I can also go back to deadlifts before June/July. I honestly couldn't have even dreamed to have this good information. Have anyone in here had it before?

Also had awesome work out after that since I was so excited. :D

Now I should start to be able to sleep again and also my motivation is back where it should be. Yay. :)


People really think so?

...and say it out loud!?

Wow.
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great to hear

Fox318 said:
Even those can be a little extreme

Y2mb6EQ.jpg


MY BATMAN SHIRT SUPPORTS THE TROOPS LOOK AT MY GUNS

ScM1dd7.jpg


MY SUPS IS MURCA

MY IRON MAN SHIRT ISN'T ENOUGH MY FUCKING PANTS AND COCK ARE METAL

0s3cMyi.jpg
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LOL those pants, will probably make your legs and ass look great but I don't think I could ever be comfortable in those
 
F

Faiz

Member
muntersaur said:
We are not actually disagreeing on anything. I just don't think that anybody should say that Ice Cream Fitness or SS are good programs because they follow linear progression and bodybuilding.com routines are rubbish because they do not. This is a lie as these bodybuilding.com routines have exactly the same form of progression (linear progression is literally the most basic form of progression there is and nothing special at all).

Show me a routine which literally wants you to use the same weights and and rep scheme and never change a thing. There is no such thing and is therefore pointless in assessing the quality of a program.
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I think you've misunderstood Noema's post.

The idea isn't that there are "routines" which want you to only use the same weights and reps over and over. The idea is that a "routine" without "programming" simply doesn't address how and when to make those changes at all. And that is profoundly detrimental for a lot of prospective trainees.

ICF and SS are not good because they use linear progression specifically, it's because they define a progression to use. The image in question doesn't address the programming of the exercises and presented without the context of how you are intended to program the lifts.

Yes, linear progression is the simplest of all, but again, without being told how much weight to add, and to do it every workout, most beginners are going to add weight "when they feel like it". And right there, they've already lost.


muntersaur said:
You could easily do SS by following the exercises and rep scheme but not add weight. Whose fault is it - the program or the person following the program?
Click to expand...

If you aren't adding weight as described in the program then you aren't doing the program. This isn't a matter of fault. I don't understand the purpose of the question here.
 
A

andycapps

Member
Faiz said:
If you aren't adding weight as described in the program then you aren't doing the program. This isn't a matter of fault. I don't understand the purpose of the question here.
Click to expand...

And I think this is the main difference between SS or any of the other plans mentioned in the OP. If you remove the linear progression aspect from SS or the other plans, then they're just a set of exercises with no defined plan of the user to advance. Which is what the BB plans mostly are.

SS=exercises plus linear progression. SS minus linear progress is just a combination of exercises and is no longer SS.
 
D

Dark Phoenix

Member
andycapps said:
And I think this is the main difference between SS or any of the other plans mentioned in the OP. If you remove the linear progression aspect from SS or the other plans, then they're just a set of exercises with no defined plan of the user to advance. Which is what the BB plans mostly are.

SS=exercises plus linear progression. SS minus linear progress is just a combination of exercises and is no longer SS.
Click to expand...

I guess I did SS wrong then, I just followed the exercise list in the OP but didn't remember reading anything about strict linear progression at certain times. I did add weights when I felt I needed to but didn't get anywhere, wasted year of lifting then.
 
P

Psychotext

Member
On the subject of progression in general, how do you guys decide when you've "achieved" the weight? I'm loathe to add weight until I'm convinced that I've done the move with perfect form and it didn't feel like I'd ruptured a spleen getting it done. Others I know count pretty much any vague flailing at the form and seem quite happy to progress as fast as they can to the next weight.

I'm guessing that the proper way of doing it is somewhere in between. Just wondering what the general consensus is on it. (Funnily enough, I see this is mentioned in what I just pasted below)

Related, how do you guys handle progression on accessory lifts? On some of the lighter weights I've found that even moving up the minimum amounts I have (smallest increment I can do per dumbell is 1kg for instance) proves to be too much to handle effectively next time around. So what I've taken to doing is increasing the reps, then moving on to higher weight at lower reps.

Dark Phoenix said:
I guess I did SS wrong then, I just followed the exercise list in the OP but didn't remember reading anything about strict linear progression at certain times.
Click to expand...

Yeah, sadly you did.

How much weight should I add from workout to workout?

For young males that weigh between 150-200 lbs., deadlifts can move up 15-20 lbs. per workout, squats 10-15 lbs., with continued steady progress for 3-4 weeks before slowing down to half that rate. Bench presses, presses, and cleans can move up 5-10 lbs. per workout, with progress on these exercises slowing down to 2.5-5 lbs. per workout after only 2-3 weeks. Young women make progress on the squat and the deadlift at about the same rate, adjusted for bodyweight, but much slower on the press, the bench press, cleans, and assistance exercises.

– Mark Rippetoe, Practical Programming, Pg. 122

1: If you get all 3 sets of 5 with proper technique, then move the weight up as described above.

2: If you get all 3 sets of 5 with proper technique, but bar speed was exceedingly slow on the last few reps (i.e. you busted a nut trying to complete your reps), then you may end up stalling if you add the full amount. Err on the side of "lower". i.e. don't add 20 lbs to the deadlift, add 15. Don't add 10 lbs to the press, add 5 (or even 2.5), etc. and proceed cautiously. Cautiously means adding less weight rather than more. There is no consequence for adding too little weight, but adding too much could stall progress for weeks.

3: If you get the first 2 sets of 5 with proper technique, but you only get 4 reps on the 3rd, then determine if it was a "recovery deficit" (4 hours sleep last night/skipped meals, etc) or a "technique deficit" (body wasn't tight during presses, leaned forward too much in squat, etc). If the strength or technique deficit was an anomaly and/or is easily correctable, then you can probably add the normal amount of weight as described above. If the weight just felt dog heavy, then add only a bit more, or even keep the weight the same for the next workout. Better to get your 5/5/5 next workout then get a 5/5/3 or a 5/4/4 with a heavier weight.

4: If you get at least 12 or 13 of the reps total (i.e. 5/4/4 or 5/4/3 or 4/4/4) then keep the weight the same for the next workout.

If you get something strange like 5/5/2 or 5/3/4 on your 3 sets, then you probably just need to be more mindful of rest periods. Best to use 3-5 minutes between pressing, cleaning and rowing work sets and up to 7 for squats and deadlifts if necessary. For now, use a little too much rest rather than too little rest.

If you can't get at least the first set of 5, or if you are missing 2 or more reps each on the 2nd and 3rd sets, then you are using too much weight, assuming you recently started training.

If you had been making progress, but then all of sudden, you have 3 workouts in a row where you can't add weight to the bar for an exercise and get your 5/5/5, then see the sections on "stalling."
Click to expand...
 
D

DUFFMCWALIN

Member
Psychotext said:
Related, how do you guys handle progression on accessory lifts? On some of the lighter weights I've found that even moving up the minimum amounts I have (smallest increment I can do per dumbell is 1kg for instance) proves to be too much to handle effectively next time around. So what I've taken to doing is increasing the reps, then moving on to higher weight at lower reps.
Click to expand...

I really only move up accessory workouts every month or two if they feel good. Depends on the lift though.
 
A

andycapps

Member
Dark Phoenix said:
I guess I did SS wrong then, I just followed the exercise list in the OP but didn't remember reading anything about strict linear progression at certain times. I did add weights when I felt I needed to but didn't get anywhere, wasted year of lifting then.
Click to expand...

Wasted year maybe not, but sub-optimal results, yes.

Psychotext said:
Related, how do you guys handle progression on accessory lifts? On some of the lighter weights I've found that even moving up the minimum amounts I have (smallest increment I can do per dumbell is 1kg for instance) proves to be too much to handle effectively next time around. So what I've taken to doing is increasing the reps, then moving on to higher weight at lower reps.
Click to expand...

That's exactly what I do. I'm no expert though, so not sure if that's correct. I've always felt like I do my accessory lifts after my primary's (obviously) and try to do one more rep than last week. When I get a couple reps higher than what I'm trying to hit, I raise the weight 5 pounds and go back to my original reps.
 
R

RumblingRosco

Member
Hey all. I've been mostly lurking, but I'm glad to see you're all keeping on. My routine is going well. Slow, gradual progress but most importantly I'm enjoying my time in the gym quite a bit.

I wanted to add, the dietary guidelines for Americans are being updated this year and initial reports are suggesting that people worry a lot less about how much cholesterol they're consuming and worry more about limiting added sugars (soda, juice, etc. being the main offenders). Google "2015 dietary guidelines for Americans" for more info.

Basically, eggs are now going to be acknowledged as being a lot healthier than the government had given them credit for.
 
I

ILoveBish

Member
Accessories I go up in weight once a month, and only if I feel like it's gotten easy enough. All my accessories are done with 10/8/6/4 reps, ramping up in weight with each set.
 
D

Dark Phoenix

Member
Psychotext said:
On the subject of progression in general, how do you guys decide when you've "achieved" the weight? I'm loathe to add weight until I'm convinced that I've done the move with perfect form and it didn't feel like I'd ruptured a spleen getting it done. Others I know count pretty much any vague flailing at the form and seem quite happy to progress as fast as they can to the next weight.

I'm guessing that the proper way of doing it is somewhere in between. Just wondering what the general consensus is on it. (Funnily enough, I see this is mentioned in what I just pasted below)

Related, how do you guys handle progression on accessory lifts? On some of the lighter weights I've found that even moving up the minimum amounts I have (smallest increment I can do per dumbell is 1kg for instance) proves to be too much to handle effectively next time around. So what I've taken to doing is increasing the reps, then moving on to higher weight at lower reps.



Yeah, sadly you did.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the quote on that, because of the lack of real progression I switched it up and now I'm on 5/3/1. Thankfully I did see how to progress in that program and I'm following it to the letter. I hope to see some nice progression compared to last year.
 
F

Faiz

Member
Psychotext said:
On the subject of progression in general, how do you guys decide when you've "achieved" the weight? I'm loathe to add weight until I'm convinced that I've done the move with perfect form and it didn't feel like I'd ruptured a spleen getting it done. Others I know count pretty much any vague flailing at the form and seem quite happy to progress as fast as they can to the next weight.

I'm guessing that the proper way of doing it is somewhere in between. Just wondering what the general consensus is on it. (Funnily enough, I see this is mentioned in what I just pasted below)

Related, how do you guys handle progression on accessory lifts? On some of the lighter weights I've found that even moving up the minimum amounts I have (smallest increment I can do per dumbell is 1kg for instance) proves to be too much to handle effectively next time around. So what I've taken to doing is increasing the reps, then moving on to higher weight at lower reps.
Click to expand...

I'm kinda somewhere in between. If I slip a little on technique and it goes up, I'll take it, but if it comes to a wild break in form I just stop right there and don't even bother trying to finish the lift much less think about adding weight next time. I'm too old and have too many injuries to aggravate to create new ones.
 
B

Bubbavelli

Banned
Hey fitgaf I was planning on getting back in the gym and doing starting strength. Im not new to a weightroom or working out since I played football in highschool and had a gym membership a couple years ago. After taking a long hiatus, Im planning on getting back into it as a way to be productive with my college free time since I dont have a job right now. I have a quick question about the the days. I plan to be going m/w/f but some weeks i go back home on friday. Would it be sufficient to knock out my workout on Thursday night instead since I wont be doing it on friday?
 
C

Coriolanus

Banned
BumRush said:
You're trying to LOSE weight and you're eating 14 eggs a day? I mean they're great for you but isn't this excessive? Is that all you eat?
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Not trying. Succeeding.

And yes.

On weekends i go all the way to 2000kcal a day. Only trace carbs.

This is in no way healthy longterm, obv.
 
P

Psychotext

Member
Cheers for all the answers on the progression. Very handy.

Good to know that if I'm doing it completely wrong then I'm in good company. :D

Unrelated, put 15kg (33lb) plates on instead of 7.5kg plates on when I was doing my OHP warmup today (tired maths failure). Picked it up and couldn't work out for the life of me why I was feeling so weak!
 
B

Bowser

Member
Coriolanus said:
Not trying. Succeeding.

And yes.

On weekends i go all the way to 2000kcal a day. Only trace carbs.

This is in no way healthy longterm, obv.
Click to expand...

Wait, are you saying on weekends you only eat 2 dozen eggs and nothing else all day?

That's kind of insane, but if it works for you...
 
C

Coriolanus

Banned
Bowser said:
Wait, are you saying on weekends you only eat 2 dozen eggs and nothing else all day?

That's kind of insane, but if it works for you...
Click to expand...

on weekdays it's 12 eggs nowadays. If i add, say, a slice of cheese (because there's a limit to how many ways you can cook just eggs), i usually subtract an egg.
on weekends i eat any kind of meat, but no carbs, and try to stay under the 2000kcal limit.

Started this with 14 eggs and a bit of meat a day on january once i'd gotten back from a trip feeling bloated as fuck, and been cutting ever since.

Would probably be hell if not for all the fat ingested, and yes, there is most certainly a degree of lean mass lost when you go to such extremes.

Plus, like i said, this sure as fuck aint healthy longterm.

1.83cm, currently probably under 80kg now. been more than a week since the last weight in.
 
C

Cooter

Lacks the power of instantaneous movement
Coriolanus said:
on weekdays it's 12 eggs nowadays. If i add, say, a slice of cheese (because there's a limit to how many ways you can cook just eggs), i usually subtract an egg.
on weekends i eat any kind of meat, but no carbs, and try to stay under the 2000kcal limit.

Started this with 14 eggs and a bit of meat a day on january once i'd gotten back from a trip feeling bloated as fuck, and been cutting ever since.

Would probably be hell if not for all the fat ingested, and yes, there is most certainly a degree of lean mass lost when you go to such extremes.

Plus, like i said, this sure as fuck aint healthy longterm.

1.83cm, currently probably under 80kg now. been more than a week since the last weight in.
Click to expand...
Am I missing where all your fiber is coming from?
 
A

andycapps

Member
Coriolanus said:
on weekdays it's 12 eggs nowadays. If i add, say, a slice of cheese (because there's a limit to how many ways you can cook just eggs), i usually subtract an egg.
on weekends i eat any kind of meat, but no carbs, and try to stay under the 2000kcal limit.

Started this with 14 eggs and a bit of meat a day on january once i'd gotten back from a trip feeling bloated as fuck, and been cutting ever since.

Would probably be hell if not for all the fat ingested, and yes, there is most certainly a degree of lean mass lost when you go to such extremes.

Plus, like i said, this sure as fuck aint healthy longterm.

1.83cm, currently probably under 80kg now. been more than a week since the last weight in.
Click to expand...

This sounds like an awful diet. No vitamin C, no carbs, no fiber. I mean, I love eggs and think they're great, but you need things in your diet other than a carton of eggs a day.
 
C

Cooter

Lacks the power of instantaneous movement
Coriolanus said:
Haven't really eaten fiber in more than a year. Bloodwork was fine (and cholesterol way lower) before all the egg craze. As was the ECG.

Poop just fine. Once to twice a week, tiny amounts, but fine.
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That sounds miserable personally but if it's working for you keep it going. Can't argue with results and you know it's not a long-term fix. Good luck.
 
C

Coriolanus

Banned
andycapps said:
This sounds like an awful diet. No vitamin C, no carbs, no fiber. I mean, I love eggs and think they're great, but you need things in your diet other than a carton of eggs a day.
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Vitamin C is loaded during the weekends with my choices of meat. Carbs are one per egg, more than enough. Don't need fiber. Take potassium pills, and magnesium is the only thing that might run low. Been rolling keto for more than a year.

Plus, like i'm saying for the third time, this aint healthy longterm.

I just like shortcuts. And this is one hell of a shortcut.

Well, to be fair, the lack of fiber most likely impacts my total cholesterol.
 
A

andycapps

Member
Coriolanus said:
Vitamin C is loaded during the weekends with my choices of meat. Carbs are one per egg, more than enough. Don't need fiber. Take potassium pills, and magnesium is the only thing that might run low. Been rolling keto for more than a year.

Plus, like i'm saying for the third time, this aint healthy longterm.

I just like shortcuts. And this is one hell of a shortcut.

Well, to be fair, the lack of fiber most likely impacts my total cholesterol.
Click to expand...

What kind of meat do you eat on weekends? Yeah I really wouldn't do this diet much longer.
 
C

Coriolanus

Banned
andycapps said:
What kind of meat do you eat on weekends? Yeah I really wouldn't do this diet much longer.
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For C? salmon and about 100g of raw broccoli. Then complete the rest with beef or whatever. Really just preserving my sanity at that point.

Should be able to quit this thing in about 2-4 weeks. End of march, at the latest.
 
L

Lupercal

Banned
Gotten back into training after 5-6 months hiatus. Man, exercises that used to be my warmup now leave me struggling. Any tips on helping me speed up the road to recovery?
 
F

Fox318

Member
No matter how many times I do Barbell rows it never feels right. It either feels like my back isn't low enough or straight enough for my own liking.
 
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