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[Draugoth]

Fast forward to now, as IGN notes, Judge Jacqueline Scott Corley stated that the Switch was a true competitor to the other systems whether the FTC wanted to admit it or not. They even noted that the Xbox Series S was priced lower to compete with the Switch. Plus, numerous high-end and popular titles are on Switch as well as the other systems.

Even though much of the focus was on Sony and obviously Xbox, Nintendo was dragged into the fight in day two of the trial, with the FTC arguing that the Switch is “very different” than the current-gen Xbox and PlayStation consoles. As today’s ruling put it, the FTC “insists the Nintendo Switch’s pricing, performance, and content make it an improper substitute at least for purposes of its preliminary injunction motion.”

Xbox head Phil Spencer, however, said in court that it was “incorrect” to say that Nintendo “isn’t a competitor,” and Judge Jacqueline Scott Corley agrees with him. While acknowledging that the Series X and PlayStation 5 are both a couple of hundred dollars more expensive than the Switch, the ruling caveats that “Xbox set the price of its entry-level Series S to compete with the Switch.” It points to quotes from Xbox CFO Tim Stuart, who said in the trial that the company considered the Switch when setting the price of the Series S.

"The FTC... [doesn't] consider the extent to which the Switch’s differentiated features... are factors the customer balances.

“And, there are functionality differences between the Switch and the PlayStation and Xbox consoles – the Switch is portable, and it has its own screen and less powerful hardware,” the ruling continues. “However, neither the FTC nor its expert consider the extent to which the Switch’s differentiated features including its price, portability, and battery are factors the customer balances when deciding which console to purchase.”

The court also acknowledges that there are obvious "content differences" between the Switch and PlayStation, but adds that many of the most popular PlayStation and Xbox games are also available on the Switch, citing Fortnite, Minecraft, Rocket League, Lego Star Wars, Fall Guys, and the FIFA, MLB the Show, and NBA 2K franchises.

 

[killatopak]

Series S fucked them up again.

 

[Three]

Fortnite, rocket league, fall guys are free to play games. I can see people downloading those to play portable. 50% of PS owners have a Switch.

Fifa, MLB and NBA are sport license releases but I doubt they get much sales on switch and it shows in the "legacy" game support. They should have looked at sales differences between the platforms to see "factors the customer balances when deciding which console to purchase". They would see that the percentage is considerably lower for the, I guess now, "market leader" Switch. Somebody who is planning to buy Fifa or MLB isn't really debating between a Switch or PS/Xbox. Xbox vs PS sure, and the sales difference on Switch would show that.

Minecraft and Lego Star Wars do play to the Switches audience. Diablo and CoD don't really, Diablo 3 tried and Diablo 4 went for PS/Xbox again.

 

[Thirty7ven]

Fortnite, mobile, Minecraft, mobile. Fall Guys?

FIFA isn’t even the same game.

Such a joke.

 

[Solidus_T]

Well, MS can rest assured that when they struggle against Nintendo, they can just buy them, and Corley will be glad to approve of their purchase of a company smaller than ABK

/s

 

[tryDEATH]

Pretending like the Judge wouldn't consider Nintendo a direct rival was nothing more than wishful thinking from some people on here. You can play the biggest console games on the Switch from Fortnite to the likes of Apex, Roblox, Minecraft, Rocket League, Among Us, Fall Guys, and countless more that are on all three platforms competing for sales. The game being free and of a visual style that some might not like doesn't mean that Nintendo isn't directly competing with Sony and MS for gamers in those titles.

 

[Kilau]

Cool cool, do we get her top 10 games of all time list too?

Maybe she can settle SNES vs Genesis.

 

[RoboFu]

Lol why wouldn’t it be?

 

[SlicedBread3]

So does this mean the "Sony have a monopoly" arguments can be put to rest?

 

[Lasha]

Nintendo was always a competitor. The myopic "high end console market" segment was contrived to try and block the merger. Nintendo competes for the same dollars as everybody else.

 

[Rusty Shackelford]

Everyone questions the existence of the Series S.
Series S helps MS case against the FTC.

Everyone now is looking at MS like...

 

[adamsapple]

Everyone questions the existing the Series S.
Series S helps MS case against the FTC.

Everyone now is looking at MS like...

Phil played the long game.

 

[Three]

So does this mean the "Sony have a monopoly" arguments can be put to rest?

No, they're "market leader" of a market they're not leading. Ignore that the CEO bonuses exclude Nintendo and only use PS vs xbox marketshare too, that's just for fun.

 

[Trunx81]

Cool cool, do we get her top 10 games of all time list too?

Maybe she can settle SNES vs Genesis.

30 or 60 fps first, please. It’s urgent.

 

[Three]

Nintendo was always a competitor. The myopic "high end console market" segment was contrived to try and block the merger. Nintendo competes for the same dollars as everybody else.

So does mobile then?

 

[Bernkastel]

Portable Series S when?

 

[Crispy Gamer]

I thought the tag "high end" console market was used to exclude Switch and show Sony had a huge % of the market and therefore it was ok for the deal to pass? Guess I haven't been following the case close enough

 

[Hero of Spielberg]

I thought the tag "high end" console market was used to exclude Switch and show Sony had a huge % of the market and therefore it was ok for the deal to pass? Guess I haven't been following the case close enough

It had a few uses along the way

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

yes and no. do i need to explain this with apples?

 

[Pasta la Vista]

So wait, are you saying that all companies that are trying to get my time and money in my limited lifespan are competitors to xbox?

 

[Warablo]

But people were telling me a car isn't a car.

 

[Lasha]

I thought the tag "high end" console market was used to exclude Switch and show Sony had a huge % of the market and therefore it was ok for the deal to pass? Guess I haven't been following the case close enough

I think the term originally came from a regulator to justify concerns about the deal. Microsoft can already make market share argument by virtue of its third place position.

 

[quest]

I thought the tag "high end" console market was used to exclude Switch and show Sony had a huge % of the market and therefore it was ok for the deal to pass? Guess I haven't been following the case close enough

No it was to dismiss Microsoft bringing COD to the switch. If Microsoft never said they would do that the high performance market argument wouldn't exist.

 

[Solidus_T]

So does this mean the "Sony have a monopoly" arguments can be put to rest?

It'll be deployed when convenient. Someone just used it in the megathread.

 

[Closer]

I imagine Kerotan going ape shit trying to explain to this judge how Switch doesn't compete because it is not a traditional home console same as he went against Nautilus.

 

[Vognerful]

Nintendo was always a competitor. The myopic "high end console market" segment was contrived to try and block the merger. Nintendo competes for the same dollars as everybody else.

there were some guys who really pretended that the money you keep aside for console gaming is like 2 separate budgets: 1 for Sony/xbox and 1 for Nintendo.

Closer

I imagine Kerotan Kerotan going ape shit trying to explain to this judge how Switch doesn't compete because it is not a traditional home console same as he went against Nautilus.

Shades of Nintendo switch vs PS4/PS2 sales threads and "switch is not a home console so you can't compare sales" arguments

 

[Lasha]

there were some guys who really pretended that the money you keep aside for console gaming is like 2 separate budgets: 1 for Sony/xbox and 1 for Nintendo.

Hardcore console gamers have been like that since the PSWii/Wii60 days. That segment can't fathom somebody walking into a shop and only buying Nintendo stuff.

 

[BadBurger]

I can't imagine that the Switch steals many sales from Xbox or PlayStation, and vice versa, beyond a negligible amount. But sure, it is technically a console and it and its software isn't exactly cheap.

 

[MrTroubleMaker]

Everyone questions the existence of the Series S.
Series S helps MS case against the FTC.

Everyone now is looking at MS like...

Three-dimensional chess

 

[Lupin25]

It’s true, even though MS has mostly targeted Sony as a direct competitor.

They’ve completed neglected Nintendo in discussions, yet Nintendo is the OG of exclusivity! Lol. In fact, they actually make MS look worse, because they didn’t need the Switch to be the most powerful console to achieve highest selling platform of last-gen.

But either way, in this case it still paints MS in a “good” light and in a better position knowing the judge acknowledges even more competition and less even market share.

As long as Nintendo is in the console space (hybrid or not) they’re still taking potential customers away from Xbox. Where else would people turn to for a secondary/primary console outside of Sony?
(Would be a steam deck my case, but still)

 

[Robb]

 

[ZehDon]

Everyone questions the existence of the Series S.
Series S helps MS case against the FTC.

Everyone now is looking at MS like...

If the Series S really existed as a means to alter regulatory comparisons to enable large scale industry acquisitions, Phil is out there playing 9D chess while the rest of us are eating checkers.

 

[ZoukGalaxy]

Only Microsoft and Cumbaya Phil *tried* to pretend otherwise.

 

[ByWatterson]

Culturally, Switch is a separate market, but historically and legally, Nintendo is of course competing for the same hours, eyes, and dollars as the other two.

I don't consider Nintendo a "direct" cultural competitor, but for anti-trust purposes? Yeah, of course it's in the same space.

 

[GigaBowser]

MS and used Nintendos to get the deals through and Nintendos used MS to get COD

Microsoft signs binding Call of Duty deal with Nintendo ahead of EU Activision hearing

Amidst increasing regulatory pushback against the deal.

www.theverge.com

 

[Last Hearth]

The judge is of course, correct. If you disagree, they you should agree that ToTK doesn’t belong on the same sales chart as games like Diablo IV and SpiderMan 2, and doesn’t belong in the same GOTY conversation as Starfield or SpiderMan

 

[In Cold Blood]

Of course it's a competitor.
Nintendo, Sony, MS and PC are all competing for the gamers time.
There's only so many gamers, and so many hours they can play, and those companies are competing against each other for those hours.

 

[Wingnut]

Of course it is.

 

[Hudo]

Series S fucked them up again.

Actually, it helped in this case because the ruling was (partially) justified that Nintendo is also a competitor (to the Series S, as per Microsoft's own admission) and therefore some of the FTC's reasoning does not apply; they tried to make Sony to only competitor to have more "solid" ground to argue that titles like CoD and online stuff are so important that it would be anti-competitive behavior to giving Microsoft control over that.

 

[Tommi84]

How much MS paid in bribes to have this?

 

[Torrent of Pork]

Wait, did some of you people here actually buy the FTC line of horseshit that Nintendo isn't a competitor in the console space?

 

[crackajack]

Of course it is competing for time of gamers, but with that logic the Disney empire, comics, getting wasted etc. i.e. everything and anything is also competition.

Practically no one is deciding between getting a Switch or one of the high end consoles, or XSS, or a PC. It's all gaming, definitely, but an entire different deal with very different reasons why you get one.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Why wouldn't it be.

They are known as the big three.

 

[Fess]

I’ve been playing Zelda TOTK since it released. Not FF16, not Diablo 4, not Street Figher 6. Only TOTK. And as a family we added two new Switch consoles to cope with more family members wanting to play it.

Of course it’s a competitor, to everyone.

And I mean if it weren’t, then it would mean that Nintendo would have a segment of the hobby all by themselves, so where is the monopoly trials?

 

[intheinbetween]

 

[SupremeHoodie]

Only Microsoft and Cumbaya Phil *tried* to pretend otherwise.

Microsoft wanted this…it helped them with their deal.

 

[Team Andromeda]

So Nintendo no longer make consoles?

 

[Negotiator101]

Fortnite, mobile, Minecraft, mobile. Fall Guys?

FIFA isn’t even the same game.

Such a joke.

You're taking this pretty hard aren't you mate

 

[01011001]

Fortnite, mobile, Minecraft, mobile. Fall Guys?

FIFA isn’t even the same game.

Such a joke.

Fortnite and Minecraft are some of the biggest games and they are fully cross compatible with the other consoles. we are talking cross play and full cross progression.

Doom is on there, Witcher 3, Apex... all feature complete, Apex also has crossplay... oh Overwatch 2, Crossplay and cross progression

 

[Moses85]