Support NeoGAF

[Snuggles]

Man, it's been interesting reading all the butthurt comments after last night. Don't get me wrong, the fucked up ending made me sick, but to ragequit the show because the 'good guys' lost again is kinda silly. It's been posted already, but that classic Ramsay quote has never been more true.

Good and Evil are just empty, man made concepts. We want to believe that the power of good will always overcome evil, and that there's this magical, karmic power which always enforces that in the end, but that's just wishful thinking. We create fairy tales so we can fantasize about this being true, but in reality there are no 'good guys' or 'bad guys', there are just the strong and the weak. There are those who are willing to do whatever it takes to survive, and those that are steamrolled in the process. It's just the cold, hard truth of nature.

That's what makes Game of Thrones so compelling. It's not just another silly fairytale, it actually reflects the brutal shittiness of our own world. Nine times out of ten, the Tywin Lannisters of the world will destroy the Robb Starks. It can be hard to stomach sometimes, but I wouldn't want it any other way.

 

[Spineker]

Episode titles are fair game for discussion.

Awesome.

I have a theory about a couple of things. Strictly theories. I am not a book reader.

Spoiler

I think the battle at the Wall serves no other purpose other than to take the Nights Watch off the table. Jon's story cannot continue if he is stuck at the Wall to serve his oath. If the Nights Watch is gone, there is no oath left to serve. Where he will go after he leaves, who knows, but it will probably involve Ygritte in some fashion.

As for "The Children", this one is a tough one to gauge, but I have a suspicion it involves Tyrion. IF he is to escape Kings Landing with his head still attached, it will have to involve some sort of elaborate plan to get him out. Usually involving a "hiding in plain sight" scenario.

I mean absolutely zero disrespect to dwarves by saying this, but when you look at them, what do they most resemble?

 

[Bisnic]

Episode 9 preview speculation

Spoiler

Seeing as how the preview focused on the Castle Black battle, and this is Episode 9... expect Jon Snow, Sam and Ygritte to die. Or maybe the White Walkers will join the fun and kill everyone for the lols.

 

[Leunam]

both of them died, so why it doesn't count as a draw? i don't think that the mountain is going to survive that direct stab to the chest, i am guessing that jamie is going to break free his brother and both them are going to be fugitives. at least i hope so.

The end goal was to execute Tyrion. If they need to fudge the ruling on some technicality to get that result they will certainly try.

In other words, no draw probably.

 

[stufte]

Man, it's been interesting reading all the butthurt comments after last night. Don't get me wrong, the fucked up ending made me sick, but to ragequit the show because the 'good guys' lost again is kinda silly.

Good and Evil are just empty, man made concepts. We want to believe that the power of good will always overcome evil, and that there's this magical, karmic power which always enforces that in the end, but that's just wishful thinking. We create fairy tales so we can fantasize about this being true, but in reality there are no 'good guys' or 'bad guys', there are just the strong and the weak. There are those who are willing to do whatever it takes to survive, and those that are steamrolled in the process. It's just the cold, hard truth of nature.

That's what makes Game of Thrones so compelling. It's not just another silly fairytale, it actually reflects the brutal shittiness of our own world. Nine times out of ten, the Tywin Lannisters of the world will destroy the Robb Starks. It can be hard to stomach sometimes, but I wouldn't want it any other way.

This right here. Last nights episode was CRAZY, but if you want safe and comforting, there are 1000 different shows you can watch instead. I love how GoT pulls no punches and everyone is fair game.

 

[nilbog21]

Well, that last scene was absolutely fucking crazy. Way more shocking and heart dropping than the Red wedding. Holy shit... what a terrible feeling. This show is one crazy ass ride

that being said, I think Tyrion will be just fine, unless he is beheaded on the spot =]

 

[GameAddict411]

The end goal was to execute Tyrion. If they need to fudge the ruling on some technicality to get that result they will certainly try.

In other words, no draw probably.

so we're going to see the death of the best character in the series? it was horrible to see the starks die last season, but if this happens it's just too much.

 

[kame-sennin]

So why was the confession so important for Oberyn? He knew who killed his sister, Tywin knew. And the rest of King's Landing's people probably could have guessed.
It's not like the Mountain was some noble knight, who never resorted to violence. In the previous episode we see him slaughtering prisoners just for practice. It must be common knowledge, that he is a sick, twisted and extremely violent person.

So why does Oberyn insists on a stupid confession? Were the circumstances of his sister's death unclear for the general public?

1) Rumor doesn't hold the same weight as a confession.

2) He wanted the Mountain to implicate Tywin in the murders. He pointed to him several times when asking, "who gave you the order?".

 

[Deified Data]

Episode 9 preview speculation

Spoiler

Seeing as how the preview focused on the Castle Black battle, and this is Episode 9... expect Jon Snow, Sam and Ygritte to die. Or maybe the White Walkers will join the fun and kill everyone for the lols.

Jon Snow has plot armor out the ass. Ygritte and Sam is a possibility. I'm 99.999% sure that the current Lord Commander is going to die.

 

[Complistic]

Where do you guys think stannis is going to turn up at? He's headed somewhere with a lot of men, a witch, and just guessing, but his daughter for sacrifice.

 

[Captain Europe]

That ending was brutal! I cringed even.

I'm sad now =(

Bring on the next episode!

 

[Spineker]

Where do you guys think stannis is going to turn up at? He's headed somewhere with a lot of men, a witch, and just guessing, but his daughter for sacrifice.

I'm thinking this might be the end of Melisandre and her mother. I can't see Stannis letting his daughter burn.

 

[Violet_0]

both of them died, so why it doesn't count as a draw? i don't think that the mountain is going to survive that direct stab to the chest, i am guessing that jamie is going to break free his brother and both them are going to be fugitives. at least i hope so.

it's not like he has anything important to do in King's Landing (guarding his son, perhaps, but they haven't even spoken once with each other in the show iirc) so this would be the best-case scenario. We need another duo traveling across Westeros for season 5 anyway

 

[Leunam]

so we're going to see the death of the best character in the series? it was horrible to see the starks die last season, but if this happens it's just too much.

I'm not going to speculate on that, I don't really know what to expect. I imagine someone is going to argue for a draw but Tywin or Cersei won't let it fly.

 

[Vyse The Legend]

Jon Snow has plot armor out the ass. Ygritte and Sam is a possibility. I'm 99.999% sure that the current Lord Commander is going to die.

No one has plot armor. That's the point.

Also, I loved Oberyn, but his death was pretty obvious and deserved. That aspect of it didnt really affect me like Robb's.

What's had me fucked up since yesterday is the visual. I've seen some fucked up shit in my life, both in fiction and real life, but I feel a bit traumatized by the whole thing. So disturbing.

 

[rando14]

Jon Snow has plot armor out the ass. Ygritte and Sam is a possibility. I'm 99.999% sure that the current Lord Commander is going to die.

Plot armor? In my game of thrones?

 

[Turin]

I'm just going to watch this over and over again until that ep. 8 scene is out of my head.

 

[Spineker]

I'm just going to watch this over and over again until that ep. 8 scene is out of my head.

Most awesome death of the season.

 

[Vyse The Legend]

I'm just going to watch this over and over again until that ep. 8 scene is out of my head.

That was a cartoon death by comparison. Nothing compares to Oberyn's death, and honestly, I cannot fathom how anyone can die in a worse way. I think it's literally impossible.

 

[Violet_0]

Plot armor? In my game of thrones?

Jon, Tyrion, Bran, Daenerys, the Stark girls

 

[Nerokis]

The more I sit on it, the worse the ending seems. The Mountain's confession is almost as chilling as Oberyn's death. That's what he did to Oberyn's sister? Really? And those are the final words Oberyn heard as he was brutally killed?

Jesus Christ. Honestly, the Red Wedding was probably more initially shaking, but I think the overall brutality of this moment will probably have a more lingering effect.

 

[Denton]

HOLY FUCKING SHIT.

So unbelievably intense. I knew shoe was gonna drop. I expected Oberyn to lose. But fuck. They gave me hope.

And then they smashed it with a force of thousand mjolnirs. So brutal, so well done. And fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu poor Tyrion and Jaime, the horror in their eyes..

I was just lying on my couch, staring at the credits with tears and disbelief in my brain.

Also, Arya at the gate.
I started laughing loudly right when they told them Lysa is dead. When Arya joined, I was hysterical, tears in eyes and all that.

Best show ever, right alongside Sopranos, Buffy, Firefly.

 

[Leunam]

Yeah shame about Oberyn, but the guy was just Too Cool. Hell, even Jaime got a hand cut off and Jaqen H'ghar is an ugly goblin monster under his disguise.

 

[Hot Coldman]

Gwendoline Christie just joined Star Wars... oh god Brienne's going to die isn't she

 

[ASIS]

What do you guys mean by cheap deaths?

 

[Enco]

Fukin Oberyn.

What dumbass. He was so cool. Had to throw it away...

 

[RustyNails]

What was so funny about the news of Lysa's death?

 

[kinoki]

That was a cartoon death by comparison. Nothing compares to Oberyn's death, and honestly, I cannot fathom how anyone can die in a worse way. I think it's literally impossible.

I'll agree. I'm still pretty shaken and it's been 15 minutes since I saw the episode. I was doing the "Please Oberyn, kill him. Kill him, kill him, please." over and over to the screen. I pretty much knew he'd still bite it in the scene I was just hoping he didn't have to... :S

 

[Spineker]

What was so funny about the news of Lysa's death?

Yet another person the Hound sought to ransom Arya to was dead mere days before his arrival.

 

[Enco]

Plot armor? In my game of thrones?

Yes.

Bran is no way going to die any time soon. Neither is Dany or Arya. Sansa is unlikely and Jon probably won't die soon either.

 

[Jibbed]

What was so funny about the news of Lysa's death?

That The Hound's journey has been utterly pointless?
That Arya's (almost) entire extended family is being murdered just before she gets to them?

 

[Ichi_]

So why was the confession so important for Oberyn? He knew who killed his sister, Tywin knew. And the rest of King's Landing's people probably could have guessed.
It's not like the Mountain was some noble knight, who never resorted to violence. In the previous episode we see him slaughtering prisoners just for practice. It must be common knowledge, that he is a sick, twisted and extremely violent person.

So why does Oberyn insists on a stupid confession? Were the circumstances of his sister's death unclear for the general public?

I think he wanted a confession that it was Tywin that ordered it, so that when he was done with the mountain Tywin could be next on his to-kill list.

 

[GameAddict411]

What was so funny about the news of Lysa's death?

the irony of the hound's terrible luck.

 

[ASIS]

Yes.

Bran is no way going to die any time soon. Neither is Dany or Arya. Sansa is unlikely and Jon probably won't die soon either.

Those are probably the only 4 who have plot armor. Because their deaths wouldn't have any meaning right now. But I bet you they won't be safe for long. As soon as they enter the political world their lives will be in danger.
Actually scratch that, Jon doesn't have plot armor. That doesnt mean he must die.

 

[Tawpgun]

 

[Turin]

That was a cartoon death by comparison. Nothing compares to Oberyn's death, and honestly, I cannot fathom how anyone can die in a worse way. I think it's literally impossible.

Eh. Just looking for a replacement image in my memory. At least something bad and demoralizing happened to a bad guy.

Spoiler

But yeah, it's at least one of the top 5 worst possible ways to die. Getting your head slowly sawn off would suck as well.

 

[Liquidsnake]

I always thought we would see Jaqen H'ghar again, that Arya would meet up with him. I thought he would train her to be an assassin. I guess that is not going to happen. Maybe she learned what ever she could from him

 

[kame-sennin]

That's what makes Game of Thrones so compelling. It's not just another silly fairytale, it actually reflects the brutal shittiness of our own world. Nine times out of ten, the Tywin Lannisters of the world will destroy the Robb Starks. It can be hard to stomach sometimes, but I wouldn't want it any other way.

No they don't. Nine times out of ten, the young, brilliant strategist defeats the older, complacent, overconfident warlord. Alexander did it. Octavian did it. Napoleon did it. None of those guys were angels, but neither was Rob Stark. He loved the power he had over people in sentencing them to death, "this man only watched, hang him last so he can watch the others die". People's irritation with the show is not about good guys and bad guys. Nor is it about accepting reality. The problem is that the show actively rejects reality and plausibility in the name of shock value. Oberyn was vastly superior as a fighter. He had already won the fight. He stabbed the Mountain in the chest. Having Gregor leap out of his grave to crush Oberyn's skull is horror movie level schlock. It's not good writing and it's not realistic. Shitty people don't come out on top when the odds are overwhelmingly stacked against them. WWII didn't end with Hitler skullfucking Eisenhower.

 

[ASIS]

Eh. Just looking for a replacement image in my memory. At least something bad and demoralizing happened to a bad guy.

Spoiler

But yeah, it's at least one of the top 5 worst possible ways to die. Getting your head slowly sawn off would suck as well.

Biologically speaking, is Obyren's death possible?

 

[Van Owen]

That was a cartoon death by comparison. Nothing compares to Oberyn's death, and honestly, I cannot fathom how anyone can die in a worse way. I think it's literally impossible.

Yeah, it was pretty bad to see him go from swagger to scared and screaming with no teeth.

Everyone is a badass until a giant is gouging your eyes and slowly crushing your head in.

 

[Liquidsnake]

the irony of the hound's terrible luck.

Yeah, I think Araya could give a F*ck about her aunt, it was just the hounds bad luck that really made her laugh.

 

[Spineker]

Biologically speaking, is Obyren's death possible?

Absolutely. If the Mountain had enough upper body strength.

 

[Vashetti]

What was so funny about the news of Lysa's death?

The Hound and Arya had gone through so much shit that it was it was all for nought.

 

[jonnyp]

Man, it's been interesting reading all the butthurt comments after last night. Don't get me wrong, the fucked up ending made me sick, but to ragequit the show because the 'good guys' lost again is kinda silly. It's been posted already, but that classic Ramsay quote has never been more true.

Good and Evil are just empty, man made concepts. We want to believe that the power of good will always overcome evil, and that there's this magical, karmic power which always enforces that in the end, but that's just wishful thinking. We create fairy tales so we can fantasize about this being true, but in reality there are no 'good guys' or 'bad guys', there are just the strong and the weak. There are those who are willing to do whatever it takes to survive, and those that are steamrolled in the process. It's just the cold, hard truth of nature.

That's what makes Game of Thrones so compelling. It's not just another silly fairytale, it actually reflects the brutal shittiness of our own world. Nine times out of ten, the Tywin Lannisters of the world will destroy the Robb Starks. It can be hard to stomach sometimes, but I wouldn't want it any other way.

Although I agree with what you're saying, it was the sloppy, clichéd and silly way he died that I found to be worthy of criticism with this particular death of a cool character. They could've done that a lot better.

 

[Archer]

Biologically speaking, is Obyren's death possible?

That's a massive amount of pounds per square inch to crush the skull like that.

Eyeballs, yes. Skull gibbage with bare hands, doubtlful.

 

[Ninja Scooter]

That's a massive amount of pounds per square inch to crush the skull like that.

Eyeballs, yes. Skull gibbage with bare hands, doubtlful.

The way the Mountain could knock all of his teeth out with one punch, off his back, I think they set him up to have some sort of super human strength.

 

[Hot Coldman]

The way the Mountain could knock all of his teeth out with one punch, off his back, I think they set him up to have some sort of super human strength.

They totally have giants in this show. Just saying.

 

[GameAddict411]

Biologically speaking, is Obyren's death possible?

yes, easily. the guy is 7 foot tall, and has muscles the size of tires.

 

[MutFox]

That scene between Jaime and Tyrion felt poorly/awkwardly acted...

 

[Hoya Destroyer]

I love Grey Worm. He getting good character development.

I dont care much for him but hopefully he'll develop a romance with Missandei and we'll get some quality nude scenes

so Grey Worm has no penis right

Yeah, he implied that but Im still not sure. Why was he physically attracted to M, if he was missing his stones and stem? I also question what kind of elite warriors those "unsullied" would be, if their testosterone supply was cut off at a young age.