Support NeoGAF

[Audioboxer]

The website had more than 87,000 users and was used for the worldwide exchange of child pornography and to make appointments for the sexual abuse of children, prosecutors said.

God damnit that is fucked up. I hope the police can track down users of the site as well, but that is often a challenge.

"Among the child pornographic images and video files exchanged by the members of the platform were recordings of the most serious sexual abuse of children, including toddlers and depiction of sexual violence against children," it said.

That is even more fucked up.

The forces and people that have to do this kind of work must carry baggage. It doesn't matter how professional you can be. Even knowing you are doing great justice with your line of work, what you have to watch/listen to and witness will be stomach churning and utterly depressing/life-changing. What you've seen you truly cannot unsee even with all the psychological help imaginable to cope with it. That's before we even get to the victims, many often irreversibly changed for life. Not just physically. I may have to work with children/adults one day who've experienced abuse as youngsters (pretty much a guarantee tbh). Sadly it's more common than many want to think. If we're covering family members abusing and what not too, alongside obvious child-porn rings like this that aim to exploit to put content online. Your moral compass has to be well and truly broken to get involved with child porn. I say that as someone studying psychology and knowing fine well whatever arguments there are to be made about issues in the brain and mental illness. It's why I won't go as far to ever support the death penalty for crimes, even this horrendous, but ultimately, as a professional or not I'm not going to hold back giving my personal opinion on how morally reprehensible something like this is. What it does mean is I will be capable of working professionally within a field where I'm likely to come across victims needing help. I don't however think I'd be capable of doing the work the police/intelligence services do when it comes to looking at actual photos/videos. Talking about events is something I can handle, that (videos/pictures/audio), I seriously doubt it.

There's a lot of sick things in the world we live in and many victims. We always require the support networks and authorities to be well-funded to try and do all we can to clean up some of the dark, grim and tragic sides of humanity.

 

[Calamari41]

It may surprise you but online personaoften misalign to offline. Though given his past with drugs and assault maybe they'll be less inclined for leniency. He might get two years instead.

He was jacking it to child porn. I'm pretty sure his persona offline is actually worse than the one he subjected us to on here.

 

[TwEE-N-Toast]

Glad you linked an actual newsource unlike the alt-right sites other posters had been linking when referencing him.

Oh you.

 

[Disxo]

Absolutely disgusting, but police that check that stuff should be proud, hope they get plenty of mental help and/or find a way to automate the process.

 

[thelatestmodel]

I used to know a guy who was a detective for this kind of stuff.

I have no idea how he sleeps at night, he says you "kind of just have to laugh it off" and I guess that's one way of trying to stay sane. Easier said than done.

I can't believe the numbers on this thing, 87,000 members is scary.

 

[Emperor_Uriel]

Never been soft, just the government and local organisations pushing therapy and clinical treatment concerning it more than other countries.

It's important more countries and people start talking about this, because pedophiles get these tendencies during puberty and the goal of clinical treatment/therapy is to prevent pedophiles from acting on their urges and harming a child (whether themselves molesting or indirectly by consuming child pornography).

No one wants to talk about it and it's not solving anything, there are people that have never harmed a child but have these thoughts, due to the stigma they are too afraid to seek help and can lead to harm later on.

There needs to be more study concerning therapy/clinical treatment and raising awareness in this regard so that abuse can be prevented.

In Germany one such effort is called Prevention Project Dunkelfeld which is about clinical treatment and therapy and it's very successful in terms of how many people seek out their help and the positive effect it has on these people.

Some articles
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2015/oct/16/how-germany-treats-paedophiles-before-they-offend

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-33464970

As someone working in the mental health field, this is definitely a conversation worth having.

HOWEVER, the ultimate danger (as outlined in the OP) is when pedophilia mixes with sadism. These sorts of vicious, monstrous crimes are perpetrated by people who are simply beyond redemption.

The 87,000 members of this site are most likely not pitiable people who are suffering from pedophilia as a mental illness, but people who are truly reveling in it as a perverse secret.

 

[NoblesseOblige]

I have no idea how he sleeps at night, he says you "kind of just have to laugh it off" and I guess that's one way of trying to stay sane. Easier said than done.

Humor is a very common coping mechanism, especially the sardonic. Since I began working in a hospital I hear many doctors telling jokes involving some of the most gruesome anecdotes. I imagine police and crime scene investigators experience it as well. As well as those who have to parse through the most appalling of digital material.

 

[Audioboxer]

Absolutely disgusting, but police that check that stuff should be proud, hope they get plenty of mental help and/or find a way to automate the process.

I truly wonder if anyone can do that. I know many can become desensitised to gore/death, but for the majority, it's nigh impossible not to get impacted when it's children. Even around gore/death, such as tragic events that lead to children dying. Most well-rounded people have innate responses to want to protect children as they're at stages in their life where they are growing/developing and have their whole life to come. It's not that we view them as fragile as such (as that can be a negative connotation), but the protection we want to give is simply part of the nurturing process all forms of life usually exhibit. Heck as the stories go, even hardened criminals have their "nothing is to be done to children" stances. You can torture, kidnap, and dice up an adult, but if you go near a child they themselves are going to come after you. It's fucked up in one sense, but in another, there are genuine thought processes that go into why people who are still incredibly broken morally/mentally still somehow come to the conclusion "children are off-limits".

The long and the short is while desensitisation can occur, anything involving children is often much harder to ever tune out to. The people who work in these fields will have techniques and psychological aid, but as I said above what you see/hear, you cannot unsee. Although I don't doubt some minds turn to trying to block out content, which is actually not a healthy state to be in as it shows trauma in the brain/psyche. I'd state that is something many of these workers will be asked in mandated treatment ~ If they black out parts of their work or forget things? It can show an inability to handle the work.

I used to know a guy who was a detective for this kind of stuff.

I have no idea how he sleeps at night, he says you "kind of just have to laugh it off" and I guess that's one way of trying to stay sane. Easier said than done.

I can't believe the numbers on this thing, 87,000 members is scary.

Yes, humour is a coping mechanism. Hence people can make totally out of the blue jokes/asses of themselves when under stress/pressure. Obviously, multiply that by 1,000x when talking about something like this versus a job interview/social situation/public speaking or whatever. It's not laughing at what they do/see to be fucked up, it's trying to cope. Then again as I just said about blackouts, if someone is going to therapy and spending an uncomfortable amount of time joking about their line of work/what they see, that too might be cause for concern of an inability to handle things.

Most of the time when I hear about workers in these cases someone says there is a fair bit of rotation to try and shift around "the workload". Or exposure to things.

 

[NoblesseOblige]

I truly wonder if anyone can do that..

They're working on it.

http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/6957295/?reload=true
http://cental.fltr.ucl.ac.be/projects/icop/

 

[Audioboxer]

They're working on it.

http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/6957295/?reload=true

AI/computing work to automate things will be fantastic. Although, even then there will still require to be some sorts of human input/observation/evaluation. Glad to see that link, though.

I do have to say I misread what that poster typed until I re-read it again there. I thought they meant the workers "automate" their feelings/thoughts whilst going through things. In other words, shut off to some extent. Hence why I went on to share my feelings on anyone being able to do that.

 

[GameAddict411]

So they managed to hit about 100k members in about 6 months. Same amount of active members in Gaf and it's running for years now. It's very crazy, and sadly it won't be the last.

 

[Deleted member 325805]

Round them up and shoot the lot of them. Fuckers.

Would you have the same opinion if you were born with an attraction to kids? It's not like it's a choice, they have a mental illness, one that's vilified so they can't seek help like they could for almost any other mental illness. I imagine if they could openly discuss their problems without fear for their safety and freedom more of them would come forward and get the help they need before they ever hurt anyone.

And we have to remember there are many different types of paedophiles, I would guess the majority never actually harm a child in any way, but keep their desires in check with pictures (possibly not even nudes or real children). Obviously some do enjoy hurting kids and that's a completely different story, that goes beyond paedophilia. I wouldn't feel right putting someone in the same pile as a child rapist when they only look at cartoons or clothed photos. I'm of the opinion you can't help being a paedophile, but you can choose not to be a rapist.

 

[Tankard]

Holy shit at this and the Amir0x story, i had no idea, i even liked a lot of his posts (video game related stuff), i feel disgusted now.

Prison to all these people, please.

 

[Bay Maximus]

Good work by the police.

All 87k of the users should be locked up for a very long time imo. However, I feel terrible for the people that have these attractions. I don't know what could be done though. I'm not sure that therapy would work and I worry that child porn substitutes such as anime or 3D stuff would just feed their desires. Man, when I have kids my head is gonna be on a fucking swivel.

 

[Xe4]

Good. I hope they arrest the owners and track down those who used the site, too. I'm as sympathetic to someone who deals with (non-offending) pedophilia as any normal person can reasonably be (I get that it probably sucks). However, when you go out of your way to view videos of children being sexually abused, or worse sexually abuse them yourself, fuck you. You crossed a huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge fucking line, and can get fucked. Hope rehab in prison goes well, asshole.

So they managed to hit about 100k members in about 6 months. Same amount of active members in Gaf and it's running for years now. It's very crazy, and sadly it won't be the last.

There was someone who posted a while back about a bestiality website that had like 10x the number of members as GAF. While not as fucked as pedophilia (obviously), it's still pretty nuts. The internet is crazy sometimes.

 

[bman94]

87,000??? What the fuck is wrong with people????

 

[CREMSteve]

Fuck you if you're a member on a site like this.

I hope they round up all 87,000 of them and slit their goddamn throats.

Right after they kill the fuckers who made the videos themselves.

Fuck this makes me angry.

 

[Trace]

Some real disgusting people out there god fucking damn.

 

[Volimar]

There was someone who posted a while back about a bestiality website that had like 10x the number of members as GAF. While not as fucked as pedophilia (obviously), it's still pretty nuts. The internet is crazy sometimes.

It's not too long ago that some porn sites had bestiality sections. Pretty disgusting.

 

[MIMIC]

That is absolutely incredible that an "underground" child porn website would have that many members. I mean, how underground are you with that many people.

The "Elysium" platform, built as a forum, has existed since the end of 2016 and was only accessible via the so-called Darknet, Frankfurt public prosecutor's office and BKA Federal Police said in a statement.

Is this like that "Tor" program?

The website had more than 87,000 users and was used for the worldwide exchange of child pornography and to make appointments for the sexual abuse of children, prosecutors said.

Put them under the jail, please.

 

[NoblesseOblige]

There was someone who posted a while back about a bestiality website that had like 10x the number of members as GAF. While not as fucked as pedophilia (obviously), it's still pretty nuts. The internet is crazy sometimes.

GAF moderates its membership, whereas bestiality forum probably not so much.

Is this like that "Tor" program?

The Darknet just refers to places accessible outside of standard protocols. So yes, Tor is an example of it.

 

[Deleted member 325805]

GAF moderates its membership, whereas bestiality forum probably not so much.

They just need to woof twice for entry

 

[Always-honest]

Goddamn that is terrifying... This makes me so angry.
87.000 active users???!! imagine the real numbers on people who like this kind of stuff. We likely know people who want to see or do this.
It's absolutely sickening. I sincerely hope a lot of those 87.000 get their lives completely ruined.

 

[Xe4]

It's not too long ago that some porn sites had bestiality sections. Pretty disgusting.

Some of the more salacious sites probably still do have bestiality sections. It's just major ones that I think got rid of it.

GAF moderates its membership, whereas bestiality forum probably not so much.

True, lol. Still pretty crazy to me though.

 

[Royal_Phalanx]

Scary stuff. There probably are way more people looking for this sick shit than 87,000.

 

[Northeastmonk]

I believe we are afraid of losing our own integrity by saying we can rehabilitate sexual predators back into society. I was in nursing school for 1.5 years and their mental health clinical was at the Step 1 Sex Offender rehabilitation center. It's basically a school where sex offenders go after they've been admitted. There's people from their late teens to probably 50+. They all met in the morning and discussed their crimes in front of everyone and then they'd go on to talk about what they've learned from it all. Then the rest of the offenders would come up to the mic and confront them about what they said or ask questions.

We were told that these people are manipulative and dangerous. We had to hide our name tags and our license plates because they'll memorize your plates. The nurses said if we were angered by their crimes then it was best that we stayed home from the clinical.

Yeah, some of their stories made me mad and seeing them smile after saying what they did made it worse.

Helping them isn't for everyone and it's hard to say they're mentally ill when they choose to do what they do. But it's something we have to consider as human beings trying to improve our society. Nursing didn't work out for me, so I am not a person to say I'm helping.

 

[Kaako]

Busts like this gives us a glimpse of the widespread nature of this damn god damn epidemic. Utterly disgusting to know that people you have and do interact with can potentially be a member of some sick fucking site like this or even worse.

 

[TheLostBigBoss]

I believe we are afraid of losing our own integrity by saying we can rehabilitate sexual predators back into society. I was in nursing school for 1.5 years and their mental health clinical was at the Step 1 Sex Offender rehabilitation center. It's basically a school where sex offenders go after they've been admitted. There's people from their late teens to probably 50+. They all met in the morning and discussed their crimes in front of everyone and then they'd go on to talk about what they've learned from it all. Then the rest of the offenders would come up to the mic and confront them about what they said or ask questions.

We were told that these people are manipulative and dangerous. We had to hide our name tags and our license plates because they'll memorize your plates. The nurses said if we were angered by their crimes then it was best that we stayed home from the clinical.

Yeah, some of their stories made me mad and seeing them smile after saying what they did made it worse.

Helping them isn't for everyone and it's hard to say they're mentally ill when they choose to do what they do. But it's something we have to consider as human beings trying to improve our society. Nursing didn't work out for me, so I am not a person to say I'm helping.

Most of what people are talking about is having programs and initiatives to have people seek help before harming anyone.

Can't imagine what you said with the bolded though. But yea, there are people who are dangerous and manipulative, anyone who exhibits those behaviors (I don't know the sex offender level system) should be constantly monitored by the states, if not stay in prison.

 

[notworksafe]

Biggest what the fuck moment ever when I read about this. I hope he's able to get the help he desperately needs, but this being the US prison system, he'll end up in solitary for his own safety or committing suicide.

considering his worthless life spent as a domestic abusing, drug addicted, child porn loving thief who contributed nothing to the world other than some over the top and vitriolic posts on a gaming forum, here's hoping. but hey, he said he wanted to punch nazis...have at it bro. There's plenty in the PA prison system I'm sure.

 

[Anteater]

Wait what?! Amir0x?? Wow, I had no idea.

his threads were buried because all of the threads get locked including the one where evilore offer a statement, I mean I also don't even know that guy took donations from gaffers to spend them on drugs (i actually donated)

he's also no longer a member so i'm actually surprised all of his threads are locked and we don't get to discuss this.

 

[SecretMoblin]

hero police

including Detective Brian Webbe

 

[Acinixys]

I feel sick to my stomach. I could never work in such a division, being witness to such crimes. Ugh.

I can tolerate some horrible shit but I can only imagine how hard it must be to be a parent with young kids and to work on such a task force

 

[TheLostBigBoss]

his threads were buried because all of the threads get locked including the one where evilore offer a statement, I mean I also don't even know that guy took donations from gaffers to spend them on drugs (i actually donated)

he's also no longer a member so i'm actually surprised all of his threads are locked and we don't get to discuss this.

I imagine because there isn't anything to discuss other than "omg no way"

 

[Xe4]

his threads were buried because all of the threads get locked including the one where evilore offer a statement, I mean I also don't even know that guy took donations from gaffers to spend them on drugs (i actually donated)

he's also no longer a member so i'm actually surprised all of his threads are locked and we don't get to discuss this.

I think it's just policy to avoid gossiping about members, current or former. Makes sense to me. All the facts are there, publicly available to everyone, with a statement by the owner of the site no less. No sense in creating a 100 page thread on it.

The only difference is he was an ex mod long before I was a member, when GAF was waaaay different (seriously, reading threads from just 5 years ago is night and day). That, and people gave extra credence to his posts, for whatever reason. It's not like he wasn't an asshole before the latest revelation anyhow.

 

[Yoshi]

Fuck you if you're a member on a site like this.

I hope they round up all 87,000 of them and slit their goddamn throats.

Right after they kill the fuckers who made the videos themselves.

Fuck this makes me angry.

Holy moly. Good they caught them and shut the place down, but calling for killing 87.000 people? Death penalty is so archaic and I am very happy to live in a civilised country where it is not only forbidden, but which is part of a union that forbids this for all members (the EU, namely).

 

[moggio]

Holy moly. Good they caught them and shut the place down, but calling for killing 87.000 people? Death penalty is so archaic and I am very happy to live in a civilised country where it is not only forbidden, but which is part of a union that forbids this for all members (the EU, namely).

I mean, the state doesn't even murder paedophiles in the USA and they will murder children and the mentally handicapped.

 

[SporeCrawler]

Only half a year old and already that many members?
That tells me another such platform will sprout quickly.
Sickening.

well at least some people will get their due

Fuck you if you're a member on a site like this.

I hope they round up all 87,000 of them and slit their goddamn throats.

Right after they kill the fuckers who made the videos themselves.

Fuck this makes me angry.

lets be reasonable. thats duterte style. germany has no death penalty

 

[vulva]

I imagine because there isn't anything to discuss other than "omg no way"

Isn't that the same for almost all of these threads about awful people doing awful things, though?

 

[Apathy]

Glad they stopped those sickos, hope they catch more. I feel for not only the kids that have suffered but also the officers in the task force that have to see those images and videos to be able to stop these criminals.

 

[NoblesseOblige]

I imagine because there isn't anything to discuss other than "omg no way"

I dunno. Seems like it could be a valuable place for people to gloat and apparently wish he'll off himself.

 

[cpp_is_king]

I always wondered how people even find these sites? Given that it's the darknet, it's not indexed by google or any other means. How would you even know such a site exists to begin with?

I mean, I guess if you have to ask then you'll never know type of thing. Just always been curious about how these crazy ass dark-web sites get discovered.

 

[TheLostBigBoss]

Isn't that the same for almost all of these threads about awful people doing awful things, though?

yes, and those get closed down all the time because of the lack of discussion value and or relevance to events in the world.

 

[NoblesseOblige]

I always wondered how people even find these sites? Given that it's the darknet, it's not indexed by google or any other means. How would you even know such a site exists to begin with?

I mean, I guess if you have to ask then you'll never know type of thing. Just always been curious about how these crazy ass dark-web sites get discovered.

Word of mouth. Also 4chan was super into it for awhile.

 

[Ogodei]

Word of mouth. Also 4chan was super into it for awhile.

Aren't there also a bunch of these communities as Secret facebook groups and such? Essentially gateway groups that act as fronts for the really horiffic stuff.

 

[Pizza con salsiccia]

Wait what?! Amir0x?? Wow, I had no idea.

Yeah...

Isn't it like the second time that a neogaf mod or former mod got caught for that in like a year?

Opiate was demodded for that reason no? Only thing I remember is a photography blog he had with pictures of half naked kids.


Anyway, good to see that the authorities in Europe manage to shut down these places.
Must be terrible having to pose as one of them in order to get access to that kind of sick shit.

edit: come to think of it, I don't think opiate got arrested, just demodded here.

 

[Xe4]

yes, and those get closed down all the time because of the lack of discussion value and or relevance to events in the world.

Yeah, there was even a sticky thread by Evilore disallowing those kind of threads, unless they were politically or socially important in a wider sense.

 

[NoblesseOblige]

Aren't there also a bunch of these communities as Secret facebook groups and such? Essentially gateway groups that act as fronts for the really horiffic stuff.

I dunno I've never done the facebooks. I just remember visiting 4chan and seeing at least a dozen threads with pictures of onions and being super confused because I thought it was about the satirical newspaper. But nope, turns out it's an anonymity network for peddling kiddie porn, weapons, drugs, and more.

Opiate was demodded for that reason no? Only thing I remember is a photography blog he had with pictures of half naked kids.

Fairly certain he got demodded for threatening to ban a molestation victim.

 

[psychowave]

Would you have the same opinion if you were born with an attraction to kids? It's not like it's a choice, they have a mental illness, one that's vilified so they can't seek help like they could for almost any other mental illness. I imagine if they could openly discuss their problems without fear for their safety and freedom more of them would come forward and get the help they need before they ever hurt anyone.

And we have to remember there are many different types of paedophiles, I would guess the majority never actually harm a child in any way, but keep their desires in check with pictures (possibly not even nudes or real children). Obviously some do enjoy hurting kids and that's a completely different story, that goes beyond paedophilia. I wouldn't feel right putting someone in the same pile as a child rapist when they only look at cartoons or clothed photos. I'm of the opinion you can't help being a paedophile, but you can choose not to be a rapist.

By looking at child porn, they create a market for that kind of content and encourage spreading it. Pedophiles who are aware of their problem, try to seek help, and stay the fuck away from children deserve my sympathy, but these sick fucks who go and look at child porn and even justify it barely count as human to me.

 

[Kingpin Rogers]

Has enough time passed to where it's acceptable for me to make a joke about Amir0x probably being a member of that site?

 

[Audioboxer]

And we have to remember there are many different types of paedophiles, I would guess the majority never actually harm a child in any way, but keep their desires in check with pictures (possibly not even nudes or real children). Obviously some do enjoy hurting kids and that's a completely different story, that goes beyond paedophilia. I wouldn't feel right putting someone in the same pile as a child rapist when they only look at cartoons or clothed photos. I'm of the opinion you can't help being a paedophile, but you can choose not to be a rapist.

The law might sentence differently for severity of the crime (length of sentence), but this is a misguided comment. No one should "normalise" paedophilia in any way. That is why people are hostile to the "open discussions" you are asking for. Going to seek help because of thoughts you're having is one thing, but not accepting the severity of said thoughts is not a path you want to go down under "cartoons/clothed children". Even a psychologist would tell you that. Normalisation is not the answer/acceptable behaviour, it's incredibly damaging and fuels the cycles of paedophiles. If you want to argue about rehabilitating paedophiles then you will have to accept part of that rehabilitation is the explicit stating of what is wrong/illegal and the attempt to completely and utterly nuke any sort of normalisation in the mind of the person. So no, no room is given to "but what happens if its just kids in clothing I sexualise? It's not real nudes!". That is unacceptable behaviour and these kinds of attempts to skirt the law to "aid" the paedophile are not acceptable. Absolutely no form of rehabilitation is going to play ball with these concepts, let alone actively encourage someone to just seek out clothed children instead. Or even cartoons. If someone is sexualizing children then there will be an effort to remove/restrict them from any sort of content that depicts children sexually, yes, even cartoons or animated content.

It may seem like I'm going in strong here, but if there's one thing that infuriates many it's apathy and/or normalisation of paedophilia that occasionally goes on. If any paedophiles read forms of "normalisation" across the internet all that does is reinforce in their minds oh, it's okay if I suppress my urges by downloading CP because "people online say I'm not really hurting anyone". Or, "there are different types of paedophilia, so I'm one of the better paedophiles". None of this is helpful, and in fact, it's potentially dangerous. Amir0x appeared to give that statement when arrested and charged, that he "just did what he did to suppress urges". Apparently going for "I'm one of the better paedophiles" argument. That cannot be accepted or normalised when the core issue with paedophiles is the sexualisation of children. You might get a shorter sentence depending on what you've done, but you're still going on a sex offenders list and you like any other paedophile still have the same core problem, sexualising children. To try and tackle that zero tolerance can be given to any sort of sexualisation of children, however they are depicted.