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Giant Bomb #7 | Hey There, Small Business Owner!

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noobasuar

Banned
Fevaweva said:
Phil Fish back in public? Awesome. I hope there will be some info on Fez 2 soonish
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Naw he's to busy DJ'ing and taking copious amounts of acid.

If I have any complaints about the stream is that I would rather have less guests and have the segments run longer than the pathetically short time we got for each segment.

Just give me a 3 hour segment of Johnny, Dave, Phil and Jeff. Throw in Jaffe if you can find him.
 
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AngryMoth

Member
It seems like there's a lot of people in the industry who try to rationalise to themselves the merits of f2p because the money is just too good to say no.

But I don't believe it's a case of "we'll get there eventually". Making the business model part of the game fundamentally corrupts good design. Unless you go with the dota model (which I also don't think is ethically perfect) then you will always be compromising on creative integrity in favour of your DARPU or whatever.
 
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SteveWinwood

Member
AngryMoth said:
It seems like there's a lot of people in the industry who try to rationalise to themselves the merits of f2p because the money is just too good to say no.

I don't believe it's a case of "we'll get there eventually". Making the business model part of the game fundamentally corrupts good design decision. Unless you go with the dota model (which I also don't think is ethically perfect) then you will always be compromising on creative integrity in favour of your DARPU or whatever.
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Curious, what do you not like about the dota model?
 
F

Freedom = $1.05

Banned
SteveWinwood said:
Curious, what do you not like about the dota model?
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the DOTA model seems like the least offensive of them. I haven't played it but my understanding is that the base game is completely free and fully playable and that you can choose to pay for cosmetic items, right? So the playing field is even. That's pretty much the best possible model (as a player) for a F2P game.
 
M

Megasoum

Banned
AngryMoth said:
It seems like there's a lot of people in the industry who try to rationalise to themselves the merits of f2p because the money is just too good to say no.

But I don't believe it's a case of "we'll get there eventually". Making the business model part of the game fundamentally corrupts good design. Unless you go with the dota model (which I also don't think is ethically perfect) then you will always be compromising on creative integrity in favour of your DARPU or whatever.
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.
BjQSjU8IEAA-Roo.jpg:large
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N

NumberThree

Member
AngryMoth said:
It seems like there's a lot of people in the industry who try to rationalise to themselves the merits of f2p because the money is just too good to say no.

But I don't believe it's a case of "we'll get there eventually". Making the business model part of the game fundamentally corrupts good design. Unless you go with the dota model (which I also don't think is ethically perfect) then you will always be compromising on creative integrity in favour of your DARPU or whatever.
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So true. Also, I think it was Jeff who (a while back) brought up the point that in the end video games are in one way or another escapism, and having to think about money while playing games is pretty shitty.
 
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AngryMoth

Member
SteveWinwood said:
Curious, what do you not like about the dota model?
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Oh boy this could be controversial :p. I don't have a have big problem with it or anything, there are just some aspects to it I'm not so sure about. I guess it's because I'm the sort of person that will never pay for cosmetic stuff in games so it makes me a bit uncomfortable knowing that there are people spending so much money on it. I think people with certain personality types are likely to spend much more money than others. I dunno, I think was that story about how 50% of IAP revenue comes from 0.15% of users that got me thinking, obviously I don't think the situation is anywhere close to that bad with dota but it made me wonder how reliant they are on 'whales'.
 
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sixghost

Member
AngryMoth said:
Oh boy this could be controversial :p. I don't have a have big problem with it or anything, there are just some aspects to it I'm not so sure about. I guess it's because I'm the sort of person that will never pay for cosmetic stuff in games so it makes me a bit uncomfortable knowing that there are people spending so much money on it. I think people with certain personality types are likely to spend much more money than others. I dunno, I think was that story about how 50% of IAP revenue comes from 0.15% of users that got me thinking, obviously I don't think the situation is anywhere close to that bad with dota but it made me wonder how reliant they are on 'whales'.
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I'm sure there are people that would be classified as whales in DOTA, but the business model really isn't designed to take advantage of those people in the same way that most other F2P games are. So at the very least it's a more ethical model for F2P. The most questionable thing about DOTA is the chests, in my opinion. It's just a bit too much like gambling for me.
 
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Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
I missed the live show last night. Do they expect to have it up today?
 
C

Curious_George

Neo Member
Freedom = $1.05 said:
He had that one E3 where he talked about Sugar Ray Leonard and pizza. He's not that bad.
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I've always found him to be a good speaker with some interesting stories, but he's also very much a PR type guy. As someone who followed Warhammer online before and after release, I can't say I necessarily believe everything he's saying anymore even if I admit he's often very good at saying it.
 
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frostyxc

Member
AngryMoth said:
I guess it's because I'm the sort of person that will never pay for cosmetic stuff in games so it makes me a bit uncomfortable knowing that there are people spending so much money on it.
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What do you care about how other people spend their money? If someone wants to buy a rare dolphin for the sole purpose of having a very expensive bubblemaker, how does that affect you? Is that money coming out of your bank account to buy the Oil of Olay bubble sauce and pollock? Are your charge cards being maxed out to fill the bathtub with heated salt water? Are those stolen gold teeth being used to hire Tom Skerritt to MC the whole bizarre event YOURS?

I think not! So why should it bother you how someone else's money is spent? Just chill and spend your money how you want to spend it and don't you worry about what others spend on weird dolphin shows. Look, I'm not on trial here! Just step off!
 
E

Etnos

Banned
Is it me or Lang was wasted in yesterday cast? He was hilarious nevertheless!

I don´t like fighting games but I´m buying dive kick just to support that guy.
 
K

Kelas

The Beastie Boys are the first hip hop group in years to have something to say
Second Son looks really nice but Seattle looks and sounds like a ghost town.
 
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Archaix

Drunky McMurder
Etnos said:
Is it me or Lang was wasted in yesterday cast? He was hilarious nevertheless!

I don´t like fighting games but I´m buying dive kick just to support that guy.
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That's okay, Divekick isn't a real fighting game anyway. Just make sure you have the latest version of Flash installed.
 
styl3s

styl3s

Member
Kelas said:
Second Son looks really nice but Seattle looks and sounds like a ghost town.
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My only real complaints about the game.

Also, like i said in the infamous thread, i think Jeff is a little out of touch. He complains about the Delsin character as if the mentality is strictly 90s when in fact the anti-government and upper class movement and "sheeple" thing couldn't be more relevant with things like Wallstreet, NSA, Wikileaks etc.
 
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Serra

Member
Watching this Infamous QL, holy shit I want to punch this main character in the dick.

Quite an achievement to make a protagonist worse than the dude in Prototype 2.
 
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Danielsan

Member
Infamous looks incredible visually, but it also looks incredibly boring. I guess I can hold off on the PS4 until the end of the year.
 
I

inky

Member
sixghost said:
I'm sure there are people that would be classified as whales in DOTA, but the business model really isn't designed to take advantage of those people in the same way that most other F2P games are. So at the very least it's a more ethical model for F2P. The most questionable thing about DOTA is the chests, in my opinion. It's just a bit too much like gambling for me.
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Well, IT IS designed to take advantage of them and their desire for cool cosmetics in a very similar way (you even mention chests), it is only that it never makes it unfair for the rest of the people, including and especially those who don't participate in it, because purchase affect nothing within the game itself.

In that sense, it is perfect for everyone involved because it keeps a perfect baseline of content available at the same time and will always do. But make no mistake, it is definitely a system that entices people to spend copious amount of money on it, it is just that people see the openness of the request and are at not point fooled by it or manipulated by altering the game's core design, so it feels and ultimately IS more fair to the audience.
 
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sixghost

Member
inky said:
Well, IT IS designed to take advantage of them and their desire for cool cosmetics in a very similar way (you even mention chests), it is only that it never makes it unfair for the rest of the people, including and especially those who don't participate in it, because purchase affect nothing within the game itself.

In that sense, it is perfect for everyone involved because it keeps a perfect baseline of content available at the same time and will always do. But make no mistake, it is definitely a system that entices people to spend copious amount of money on it, it is just that people see the openness of the request and are at not point fooled by it or manipulated by altering the game's core design, so it feels and ultimately IS more fair to the audience.
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Yeah, that's basically the point I was trying to make, worded in a better way. The nice thing is that even if you really want to collect tons and tons of cosmetics, the items generally will sell for like 30% of their store cost on the steam marketplace not too long after an item is introduced. The only people that really dump tons of money into the game are people with zero patience, the crazies that are into super-rare gem effects, or the very limited number of extremely rare cosmetics.
 
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Deleted member 22576

Unconfirmed Member
I had to urban dictionary it, but SJW means Social Justice Warrior.
 
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