ItAintEasyBeinCheesy
it's 4th of July in my asshole
Nah, the filmed the quicklook during UPF.
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Giant Bomb #7 | Hey There, Small Business Owner!
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Nah, the filmed the quicklook during UPF.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Oh I know, but I thought they would have cut it out.
Still, half of UPF is definitely missing.
patjburns89
Member
Totally agree. And besides the game is egregious enough to where you really only need to see it in action to truly see what is so pathetic about it. His arguments were terrible. People weren't mad it was a mobile game (well, maybe some were, but I doubt it). People were mad because it had some of the worst monetization hooks I've ever seen, things
was fine for me. I was able to watch the whole thing.
"But it's not as bad as clash of clans! and in 5 years mobile games will be art anyway so"
ReignofSparrows
Member
Watched the GDC videos in full. Brad Muir is still a delight, and Rami Ismail proved to be erudite and guided the discussion nicely.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Weird. It's still totally borked for me.
ReignofSparrows
Member
Same here.
Well, someone in the video comments came up with a solution. I changed the quality to 'high' and now its length is at 1:55.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Huh, if I go to the download version it works.
MrTroubleMaker
Member
yeah, I'v dl'd the HD version 1:55:58 and its all there. Something must be messed up with one of the stream versions.
they played it on upf
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
I dunno, towerfall doesn't look that great.
Fattony12000
Member
Hah, I made my own copy of UPF when I recorded the chat. Analogue pirating, yo. It's also the only way you'll see a 1080p video from Giant Bomb dot com.
#shots
#fired
#shots
#fired
For all the hype surrounding it seeing it played for an extended period I wasn't convinced either. Guess I would agree with the GB crew that there is beauty in the simplicity of Samurai Gun.
Crawl looked really cool though.
Backfoggen
Banned
Boringest game choices for UPF in a while tbh.
One Foul Note
Member
Towerfall actually plays infinity better then it looks, especially considering the game isn't especially initiative early on. I wasn't 100% sold on it from early trailers but after a few hours of solo and multiplayer I consider it far superior to Nidhogg and equal in quality to Samurai Gunn.
Playing it with a friend is great. That's the problem with judging a game like Towerfall from a video
Broder Salsa
Banned
That EA guy in the dungeon keeper shirt at GDC is fucking painful to listen to. Embarrassing really, it's just corporate bullshit.
Yeah, came out as a douche in that segue. I just wish GB would spit some of those truth bombs at him, but ALAS, they have some politeness to maintain.
Broder Salsa
Banned
Yeah... the way they shit on it on the bombcast, I wish they would have counter argued him instead of just having him do his little pathetic speech for 15 minutes.
But but but it's not as bad as clash of titans...
and you probably only dislike it cause your friends do...
and because you don't like EA...
The "only half as aggressive as clash of clans" line made me laugh. You cannot set a lower bar for yourself.
Rami and Jeff spelt it out for him too: if you want to roll in the dirt and try to rake in that F2P whale money, do it, but just don't involve a beloved IP. If you do, you're just asking for negative attention from press and consumers that would have never cared otherwise.
Giantbomb isn't there for hard hitting journalism. They're also friendly and pretty neutral towards so they can have them as guests. They aren't there with a bunch of developers to call them out for stuff even though I'm sure Jeff felt the same way as everyone else.
It's like that time Leigh Alexander was on and Ryan acted all polite then "accidentally" tweeted a pic showing a chat screen of his saying what a fucking nut she is. They know. They just can't always say it live on camera.
He was saying this within the context of his assumption that an IAP balance will be found in the future, and that people need to be a little more patient until then. Everyone agreed that nobody has figured out how to do it right and how difficult it is, and the fact that these games make billions of dollars only complicates things by bringing in people who know nothing about video games to make decisions on video games.
It's going to take time essentially. I thought he added a really interesting perspective. He's making different types of games for a different type of audience. I don't really know how much you can hold it against him because they're are a lot of people out there enjoying and spending money on his game.
SteveWinwood
Member
why does it take time
its already been figured out
hats
its already been figured out
hats
Part 04.
Paul had to know what was coming, though, he even wore a Dungeon Keeper jacket! And I think he said it all with the "more people downloaded this Dungeon Keeper, than ever bought the original games." That just explains why it exists. But you could be more honest about it.
They put Paul on the same segment as Rami, that was their job. They knew this conversation would happen, they are often smart about things like this.
Who is then?
Giantbomb are perfectly positioned to get some real answers out of people.
Also is Brad Muir ever not a complete delight?
Some members are more interested than others. Patrick definitely pulls his weight for the site's journalism, as does Alex occasionally with guns of Navarro. But the rest of the guys seem more content in their 'funny/stupid stuff' bubble than commenting on what's going on in the industry outside podcast discussion (which is fine). Hell, Jeff's tumblr is a better source for his editorial opinions on issues than the site itself, outside the increasingly rare jar time.
I've always found the clear split between GB's 'hard-hitting journalism' interests and the rest of its content kind of jarring more than complimentary to each other, even more so now with Patrick gone. Makes me wish they'd have him on the bombcast to deliver news segments more often; I like when the others are able to talk at greater length and depth off of the more informed insights he can sometimes bring.
There was that one time he was really down in the dumps and extremely sad:
God, it's hard to see him so depressed.
vitaminwateryum
corporate swill
Please take that picture down...seeing him so sad is heartbreaking.There was that one time he was really down in the dumps and extremely sad:
God, it's hard to see him so depressed.
yeah i thought this was an interesting point.
my main problem was that he wasted 10 minutes spinning a rhetorical web of annoying nonsense about what a terrible victim he was of mean-spirited reviews, scepticsm of ea and mega corps and stuck in the mud dungeon keeper fans/pc gaming snobs out to get him, instead of focusing on the issues.
ab.aeterno
Member
Anyone expecting the crew to start viciously arguing with Paul have somehow managed to not pay any attention for the entire duration of their consumption of Giant Bomb media. Like, the bombcrew are fucking people, guys, just like their guests. Which means being polite in social situations where you disagree or have strong feelings about something. Just because Jeff didn't start screaming at Paul doesn't mean he agrees with him, or thinks Dungeon Keeper's ok, or whatever. It just means he's not going to be a dick to someone. Whatever thoughts he have about Paul or what he said, he's not going to air them in front of an audience. That'd be pretty gross.
Shit, the way that segment was talked up here, I expected some hardcore meltdown, but it was just Paul expressing his thoughts on the infanacy of mobile games, and sharing his experience to having a universally shit-upon game.
The people calling for the crew to have drawn verbal blood are fucking nuts.
Nobody wants them to draw verbal blood.
But it might be nice to expect them to actually voice their opinions.
Not in a nasty way, but there is nothing wrong with a lively debate.
ab.aeterno
Member
They did, or voiced what they felt like voicing. Like, I'm not even sure what the issue here is. They said what they felt like saying in the context of the conversation. So, what, is the issue that they didn't say what you wanted them to say? Because that's the impression I get from reading people in this thread: that people feel so strongly about this game or business model, or whatever, and are upset that the bombcrew didn't say things they think they should have said. Which, when you stop and think about that for a second, seems absurd.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
I dunno, is what they said on the Bombcast impolite? If their opinion was worth putting out into the public via their podcast, which Burnett presumably heard, why couldn't they also bring it up with the man in person? Maybe they don't know him well enough to be able to shit all over him Dave Lang style?
But, like most of what Paul said, it's an intellectually dishonest arguement. F2P balance is not nebulous, nor do we need it to become an art-form before it's better understood. Plenty of games have stuck a balance and gone on to make a lot of money. Dungeon Keeper Mobile didn't even bother to make an attempt which is why his only comparison was the lowest of the low.
Which is exactly why I mentioned Jeff and Rami pointing out the problem with using the Dungeon Keeper name. To that audience, it adds nothing to the product and just generates ire in a community that wasn't going to play your game to begin with.
As someone else mentioned above, Jeff and Patrick are smart. They know who to pair to let that debate form naturally without being aggressive hosts. So if a developer walks away upset, he'll probably be upset at another guest, rather than GB itself. It's already so difficult to book people for their brand of candid discussions, you don't want to make it harder by developing a bad rep.
CambriaRising
Member
Pretty much.
ab.aeterno
Member
It's not solely about polite or impolite, but social context as well. On a livestream for an after-hours party at a developer conference, with a developer for the title next to you, is yes, probably an impolite time to say "Dungeon Keeper is a shitty game with a terrible business model that's the grossest thing ever." What would that accomplish, except give people in this thread the thing they're looking for? It would be terribly awkward for everyone else present. As it was, people like Rami(?) from Vlambeer made their opinion heard without being an asshole about it.
Ugh, like the assumptions people make sometimes about the relationships between people based on such a tiny percentage of visible interactions blows my mind.
Comparing this to the Dave Lang stuff seems really misplaced, because the dynamic seems totally different and done for laughs. Who knows, really, that's just my read and assumption of it, but they're probably not actively bullying Lang you guys, sorry to spoiler that.
I don't think the 2-4 player verses mode is that great.
BUT the 2 player co-op in quest mode? Hands down, best co-op game I've played in a long, long time. Easily in my top five best co-op games ever.
Brad Muir is a lovely lovely man.
Finally watching the last part of the GDC live show. Good lord.
edit: Puzzle & Dragons made 100 million a month. I was into it deep for about a month but never put money into it. That's fucking insane.
edit: Max needs to shut up and let the drunk men speak.
edit: Why is Max being such a DICK! Hahahahahha Ed Boon's face during all of this is priceless. The zoom ins on Lang's face ma gaaaaaaawd.
Finally watching the last part of the GDC live show. Good lord.
edit: Puzzle & Dragons made 100 million a month. I was into it deep for about a month but never put money into it. That's fucking insane.
edit: Max needs to shut up and let the drunk men speak.
edit: Why is Max being such a DICK! Hahahahahha Ed Boon's face during all of this is priceless. The zoom ins on Lang's face ma gaaaaaaawd.
Not as much money as Clash of Clans (or Candy Crush Saga or even Puzzle & Dragons), though. I'm not sure that anyone has figured out how to make that sort of cash on non-exploitative games. Can you expect a publically-traded company to go after 'good enough' ROI? If you were a shareholder, and not a gamer, would you be okay with that?
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