XesqueVara
Member
Trailer is better too, The dialogue of today's trailer is... just cringe.
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Graphical Fidelity I Expect This Gen
- Thread starter ResetEraVetVIP
- Start date
Trailer is better too, The dialogue of today's trailer is... just cringe.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
in the blogpost they said that they are using the ssd to achieve fast speeds. so this is ps5 only.
which means the lack of a graphics upgrade is likely due to them chasing native 4k like morons instead of pushing graphics fidelity like we had wanted them do.
Dont say i didnt warn you guys about this. native 4k on a 10 tflops machine means their rendering budget is likely just 2.5 tflops at 1080p whereas the PS4 game was targeting 1080p on a 1.8 tflops gpu. you were never going to get a generational leap with devs targeting 60 fps or native 4k.
what a waste of everyone's time this game turned out to be.
SolidQ
Member
should be max 1440p target for this gen. Even 4090 struggle in some games hit stable 60 fps in 4k
This looking miles more impressive then Spiderman thts only on ps5. Spiderman 2 looks like a ps3 cartoon gameAC Mirage looks last gen as fuck but this shot really shows just how underwhelming Spiderman 2 looks.
The only problem is that AC mirage is a last gen game.
Hawking Radiation
Member
Yep before this gen even started I was saying 1440p should be the targetted resolution for everything.
This looks like Cod black ops 2 graphicsI just watched the 4K trailer and now im even more disappointed. I think i just expected too much from Insomniac after there solid cross gen SM:MM and R&C. I mean just look at this, i hope this shit is still unfinished because it looks average for a PS5 only Sony exclusive
Hawking Radiation
Member
icerock
Member
This gen has been so weird to gauge from a technical perspective, because the progression hasn't been linear. Normally, as years go the graphics improve but this gen has thrown a huge curveball whereby I am forced to think that the development cost has gotten too big for devs to chase those fancy little details.
Ratchet which released in 2021 remains the best technical showcase on new gen, and weirdly enough it's a cross-gen game in Horizon: Forbidden West which comes close. Ratchet with it's smaller scope, and Horizon being developed with PS4 as baseline would perhaps explain as to why gains have been modest for actual PS5 exclusives, which I think has to do with production costs and scope of these games.
Coming to Spider-Man 2, the game is not as polished as their previous vertical slices but I think the lighting used (specifically the time of day) is making visuals look a lot worse than they actually are, nothing is popping out and everything looks flat due to dullish hue of yellow/orange daylight. I'd suspect with change in time, the visuals would look a lot better. If you have Spider-Man you can check it out for yourself, during sunset time, the game doesn't look as good.
Having said that, there is a downgrade compared to the reveal trailer. I don't exactly know what is causing this but at this point I think it is a dev choice rather than any hardware limitation.
Alan Wake 2 looks stunning but once again I think scope and budget is playing a bigger factor than pure dev prowess. Also, we should temper our expectations for future Sony games from their first-party. The gains might not be as big as we might expect, and I suspect a lot folks will find themselves disappointed because expectations are particularly high for Santa Monica and Naughty Dog at this point.
Ratchet which released in 2021 remains the best technical showcase on new gen, and weirdly enough it's a cross-gen game in Horizon: Forbidden West which comes close. Ratchet with it's smaller scope, and Horizon being developed with PS4 as baseline would perhaps explain as to why gains have been modest for actual PS5 exclusives, which I think has to do with production costs and scope of these games.
Coming to Spider-Man 2, the game is not as polished as their previous vertical slices but I think the lighting used (specifically the time of day) is making visuals look a lot worse than they actually are, nothing is popping out and everything looks flat due to dullish hue of yellow/orange daylight. I'd suspect with change in time, the visuals would look a lot better. If you have Spider-Man you can check it out for yourself, during sunset time, the game doesn't look as good.
Having said that, there is a downgrade compared to the reveal trailer. I don't exactly know what is causing this but at this point I think it is a dev choice rather than any hardware limitation.
Alan Wake 2 looks stunning but once again I think scope and budget is playing a bigger factor than pure dev prowess. Also, we should temper our expectations for future Sony games from their first-party. The gains might not be as big as we might expect, and I suspect a lot folks will find themselves disappointed because expectations are particularly high for Santa Monica and Naughty Dog at this point.
ResetEraVetVIP
Member
This. Looks awesome visually too.
icerock
Member
Community Director at Insomniac is saying what I alluded in my previous post. I think time of day is making lighting and overall visuals look a lot worse than they actually are. Do you all remember puddle-gate? It caused huge uproar online whereby the difference in visuals was down to time of day.
I do expect to see night sequence next time after all the chatter they must be reading online.
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ResetEraVetVIP
Member
It does.
Lethal01
Member
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LiquidJensen
Banned
After this PlayStation showcase I’ve officially given up on matrix graphics this Gen 
ChiefDada
Member
I don't think so because MM evening TOD was my second favorite TOD behind afternoon. Remember they used evening TOD as the intro for the game and I think most here would say it was excellent looking.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Matrix looks next Gen under any lighting condition. This is insomniac being their lazy b tier self. Telling people to relax after hyping up the graphics for two years lol
Maybe be honest and don’t put out a bullshot trailer next time or hire better developers. Matrix was done by 80 people in 8 months. These guys took 5 years to make dlc. Pretty sure Matrix was done by Hollywood artists. This clearly shows that its a talent and ambition issue. Insomniac has neither.
VeganElduderino
Member
After this PlayStation showcase I’ve officially given up on matrix graphics this Gen
Represent.
Represent(ative) of bad opinions
It shouldn’t even exist until a PS5 PRO exists.
These games are looking like shit thanks to framerate warriors.
Yes I’m coining that term
rofif
Can’t Git Gud
People are stubborn fools who just discovered 60fps and think they are cool kids. No matter they played 30fps for past 20 years. Suddenly everything is unplayable. The hypocrisy
Jinzo Prime
Member
I'm hoping it's still in the oven or using an old build or something. Don't want to jump to conclusions just yet. However, the eyes and skin need some serious work.They achieved this nearly 3 years ago...
So how did we get back to here? They no longer believe in subsurface scattering I guess. And did they suddenly forget their eye rendering techniques?
Sorry for spam posting about the same stuff but I'm still in shock.
Go_Ly_Dow
Member
Towards the tail end of the generation, you'll get a sprinkle of big budget games that'll really impress, but apart from that we're seeing the graphical ceiling hit given what budgets will allow. Alan Wake 2 visually impressive, but then again that's a very on the rails, linear and likely 5-10 hour game, so not impressive when factoring that in.
A good thing we've found a ceiling for most studios, as no doubt if they pursued higher graphics these games would take much longer to ship, increasing the chances of both risk and failure.
A good thing we've found a ceiling for most studios, as no doubt if they pursued higher graphics these games would take much longer to ship, increasing the chances of both risk and failure.
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GymWolf
Member
Yeah, hunter dude looks very meh graphically, the moment i saw his model i knew the trailer would have been very underwhelming.They achieved this nearly 3 years ago...
So how did we get back to here? They no longer believe in subsurface scattering I guess. And did they suddenly forget their eye rendering techniques?
Sorry for spam posting about the same stuff but I'm still in shock.
Let's hope this is from a pre-alpha but i don't have much hope...
GymWolf
Member
We need to reach movie quality before talking about that, this thing looks almost worse than morales, come the fuck on...
Success
Gold Member
Excellent point.
I am pissed that we're essentially getting another high-end PS4 game.
My decision to join the Xbox Defense League is looking better each day.
SolidQ
Member
Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
And last gen we had Quantum
We are fucked. The push for 60fps has ruined gaming. We have all of you frame nerds to thank. Utterly stunned.
But this game was shown at 30 fps and all they have to so is scale back visuals to get 60 performance mode. If you want today's demos graphics you gotta play 30. If you want 60 they'll look even worse lol. I think some of you guys are getting a bit extreme with this "it's 60 fps ruining graphics". On one hand your right 60 fps does limit graphics but on the other hand why are today's devs so incompetent that they can't make amazing visuals at 30 and scale them down to include the two modes? 60 fps is important. People want that fluidity and low input lag to stay.
Have you guys noticed that whenever a game has a 30 and 60 mode that the fidelity mode looks better but is only a matter of a few settings being different? If devs were competent and spent time on each mode we could have best of both worlds. They usually focus on only one and the other is an afterthought. It's something didn't expect this gen and had to accept earlier on as disappointing.
I think that circles back to the lack of ambition stemming from production costs and studios realizing they don't need to put so much effort.
Could it be resolution in the case of Spidey 2 as the culprit? Makes no sense not to use 1440p upscaled to 4k. As Slimy pointed out, its such a waste to target native 4k/30.
Do they really target native 4k though Slimy? What about all that stuff about their temporal upscaling being so good... I mightve read a while ago that Spiderman 1 WAS 1440p then used temporal upscaling to 4k. There have been conflicting reports.
GymWolf
Member
Spidey 2 still looks decent and it's nowhere near redfall level of shittines.That show how gamedev downgraded today
10GB+ vs 64mb+
I'm mad but not unresonable.
Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
Confirmed that Miles Morales gameplay trailer looks better than Spiderman 2 trailer
How is that possible being cross gen to next gen?
How is that possible being cross gen to next gen?
The devs have become delusional...they have so many yesmen and fanboys drooling iver whatever they shipout that they have forgotten their own pedigree and standards. Take a look at the Insomniac senior dev in the spiderman thread..dude legit giving out one-liners confidently giving out one liners like "watch it on a 4k display and youll know" , "lots of impressive stuff under the hood etc". Meanwhile anyone who questions the games visuals gets dog piled on, if anyone thinks this game is not nextgen they are delusional bla blla. Hell people are even saying fuck the push for fidelity games are too tough to make nowadays" give me good gameplay, and 60fps and Im happy......legit wtf happened to expectations did everyone from the ps3 gen die out?
I have zero doubts digital foundry will barely point out any negatives or downplay them to hell and back while bigging up the minute differences as a justification of progess ending with a buzzword like "a visual toure de force" for the ps5 and everyone will be back saying I told you this game was a technical beast eat crow etc.
I have zero doubts digital foundry will barely point out any negatives or downplay them to hell and back while bigging up the minute differences as a justification of progess ending with a buzzword like "a visual toure de force" for the ps5 and everyone will be back saying I told you this game was a technical beast eat crow etc.
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I just woke up and I am still depressed. I thought I’d wake up forgetting all about it but nope, it is still bothering me to the core.
If you wanna know why the hell are we still getting subpar crap just look at the comments below the Spiderman 2 trailer on YouTube that was uploaded by Sony after the showcase. You would think it is the best thing since sliced bread, The Matrix demo looks like a lego game next to it. No wonder game devs have become lazy and they just phone it in nowadays.
Edit:
SlimySnake
I was just on the other thread the one dedicated to the showcase and I am appalled by some people’s reaction towards you dude. I could drop a couple dudes’ names but I dont want to. These very guys are THE problem. Let them enjoy mid crap!
If you wanna know why the hell are we still getting subpar crap just look at the comments below the Spiderman 2 trailer on YouTube that was uploaded by Sony after the showcase. You would think it is the best thing since sliced bread, The Matrix demo looks like a lego game next to it. No wonder game devs have become lazy and they just phone it in nowadays.
Edit:
SlimySnake
I was just on the other thread the one dedicated to the showcase and I am appalled by some people’s reaction towards you dude. I could drop a couple dudes’ names but I dont want to. These very guys are THE problem. Let them enjoy mid crap!
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KXVXII9X
Member
The amount of people who continue to use the word "entitled" or belittle people who are disappointed can go fly a kite.
So far this gen, I have barely seen anything "next gen" worthy. I was planning on buying a current gen console at some point but nothing has enticed me enough other than Final Fantasy XVI. I have a PC and Switch so most of my bases are covered.
I'm just embarrassed at how creatively bankrupt the industry is right now. I remember when devs were trying to one up another and came out with new mechanics and tech that wowed. Now it looks like we have games that look worse than late last gen games but require a 4090 card to run. It is insanity.
I will keep saying this, but it is sad when a game from 2017 mobile software is blowing next gen games away purely on a gameplay standpoint. Zelda TotK's physics alone is more impressive than these games that focus everything on graphics, but are static as can be. They still don't look great.
The industry has to come out with remakes, hop on a trend, or copy games like Splatoon because they can no longer afford to take risks or criticism. Not to sound like this person, but art is being pushed out for maximum profit. They are seriously having characters preaching about how greedy the rich are while being the perfect example of it. I'm as liberal as can be and I'm tired of the fake virtue signaling. It is insulting.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
I am used to it. I have been on forums since E3 2000 when MGS2 changed the gaming world, and I have had everyone say everything there is to say about a person to me. What gives me hope is that these morons are just a tiny fraction of the users who feel compelled to lash out at other users. I have almost 60k likes on this board. Hell, im pretty sure i got 1k likes just yesterday. Almost everyone agrees with us that this was a trash conference and an underwhelming showcase for Spiderman 2.Edit:
The best thing about this forum is that the mods dont ban critical discussion like they do on era. The front page of gaf is full of people voicing their disapproval of Jimbo, Spiderman, Sony first party, state of the industry and the conference in general. That's something. Some users are trying to get the discussion banned, but I hope the mods dont bite. GAF is literally the only sane place left on the internet. On youtube, this thing has 6 million views and comments are overwhelmingly positive.
And yes, woke up depressed too. Everything I had feared has come true. They called me chicken little and in the end, time proved me right. The industry is fucked. There is literally nothing to look forward to. I have been on the verge of just dropping this hobby I started 33 years ago when I was 5 playing my cousin's Atari, and I think this conference might have done it. Dozens of gaas trash. fortnite clones. 1 SP game. zero focus on pushing visuals, physics, gameplay, anything. same QTE driven gameplay that we all hated in 2005. This hurts because I truly believed in Sonys mission statement these last 2 decades as I watched Sega crumble, Microsoft chase casuals and Nintendo go handheld only. It's time I moved on and left the industry behind. The industry has clearly left the hardcore gamer behind.
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SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
I legit laughed at the virtue signaling in a GAAS game. Like dude, you are targeting the 1% of gamers who are going to spend billions on your game and you are complaining about rich people??
And yeah, the industry is clearly creatively bankrupt. When Bungie unveils their next big IP and it looks like 10 other games shown at the same conference, you know there is nothing orignal left. Everyone is upset over reliance on CG while I am thinking about Suicide Squad's gameplay reveal and how everyone hated them showing people shooting at weakpoints watching numbers pop up. That's what all these GaaS games are about. No one is going to show that after SS was forced to delay the game for a year over showing what is essentially 99% of the gameplay. So they showed CG trash instead hoping to avoid the backlash altogether. at least for now.
KXVXII9X
Member
Very high. I'm pretty pleased with them.How do we score the models in aw2?
Top 3 but not quite the best of the best?
H . R . 2
Member
the models are great but what I am worried about is facial and gameplay animations [they didn't show much of the other characters' animations, especially in-geme] hopefully, they will be more on par with QB's than Control'sHow do we score the models in aw2?
Top 3 but not quite the best of the best?
this and enemy variety are currently my only concerns
A gameplay reveal later this year can put these concerns to rest
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Represent.
Represent(ative) of bad opinions
Some Quotes from Era regarding SpiderMan 2 visuals.
All yes men with lower standards than me. Granted, there are even more comments saying it looks underwhelming. But Devs will flock to the positive comments to reassure themselves everything is fine. And the negative comments are seen as "harassment".
All yes men with lower standards than me. Granted, there are even more comments saying it looks underwhelming. But Devs will flock to the positive comments to reassure themselves everything is fine. And the negative comments are seen as "harassment".
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GymWolf
Member
Grildon Tundy
Member
What's not realistic about this? No camera guy in the reflection?
I don't know what I'm missing
H . R . 2
Member
I meant a proper gameplay reveal
apparently coming soon
on a side note:
I see what you did there MS!
even MS got word that the showcase was not received well and decided to captialise on it
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ChiefDada
Member
The texture is just plain weird. I don't think it was their intention to make it look so rubbery. I think this is also why the specular highlights on the suit look like low-res crap. It looks very cheap. Compare that to his OG suit from the 2020 reveal where it was evident that the texture quality and shading had improved substantially. It was awesome looking (when you ignore the obnoxious pectoral muscles). Yeah I know Venom had a similar quality in the reveal but I chalked it up to work in progress.
GymWolf
Member
It kinda looks low res, like the texture is smeared in something, i can't quite explain.
They try to replicate organic matter but it looks pretty meh to me compared to the other costumes materials.
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sankt-Antonio
Banned
They really need to tone down the motion blur.
ChiefDada
Member
Go figure. I loved it.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Madserb2023
Member
Spider Man 2 looked about as good as I expected it to be. They increased the size of the world by adding new boroughs and as result has roughly the same overall level of detail as the previous game. Has very much a whif of Halo infinite about it. I don't know what people expect. If you want a big leap in visuals over the previous games then 1440p 30 would probably be too high. 1080p 30/40 would be probably the max it could be. Graphics technology has matured. You can see it in CGI. Takes an ever increasing amount of power and time to get the same leaps in fidelity. Consoles won't be any different.