Audiophile
Member
Konami outclassing Sony devs wasn't on my list of possibilities before this gen.
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Graphical Fidelity I Expect This Gen
- Thread starter ResetEraVetVIP
- Start date
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
lol yes. But im not surprised. Plenty of devs have outshone sony devs. Even bethesda last year who made ps2 looking games in the ps3 era, and ps3 looking games in the ps4 era, but somehow upped their games and produced some stunning looking interiors. the lighting and material quality in starfield is a step above most sony games. Id say on par with bluepoint's demon souls remake. Quite possibly still sonys best looking title to date in terms of asset and material quality.
Honestly, its been like this since cyberpunk came out. you'd think spiderman 2 would feature at least cyberpunk level of asset fidelity 3 years later, but nope. didnt even have rtgi. ratchet and hfw kept everyone from freaking out, but callisto in late 2022 and then star wars, avatar, alan wake, and most sports titles from freaking EA and 2k just proved how far behind sony studios are lagging this gen. we are now approaching 4 years and their best looking game is going to be a UE5 game made by a third party no-name studio making Lego Horizon. Astro bot looks like a ps3 ratchet game at best. it's like there was a mandate being passed down from the top to purposefully create the most average looking games.
everyone from AAA ubisoft studios to greedy EA sports devs to poorly managed MS devs to Japanese devs and even indie devs working with UE5 have outclassed sony studios this gen. I said this in another thread, but their focus on cross gen and gaas trash was eventually going to catch up with them. there are only so many studios and having half of them work on cross gen until 2022 and burden the other half with multiplayer gaas projects was always going to result with them being left behind by the rest of the industry.
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SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
I cant get over how good this game looks.
If Sony san diego had any shame, they would resign and just quit making video games. go flip burgers you talentless hacks.
If Sony san diego had any shame, they would resign and just quit making video games. go flip burgers you talentless hacks.
Konami making a game looking like that pisses me off so God damn much with that crappy ass futbol game they give us in eFootball. I seriously cannot believe this is Konami's work, I am having serious doubts believing that, lol.I cant get over how good this game looks.
If Sony san diego had any shame, they would resign and just quit making video games. go flip burgers you talentless hacks.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
lol watch this. More footage here. They simply put in a lot of work. All new mocap animations. New materials on every piece of baseball gear. Brand new stadium scans. It’s no accident. This is just what happens when devs apply themselves instead of jerking off wfh all day.
Motherfuckers, if only they had put in the same amount of effort in eFootball like they had with this game I would be the happiest guy alive. This is amazing stuff seriously.
Polygonal_Sprite
Member
Bring back classic Pro Evolution Soccer!
CamHostage
Member
Apparently Konami is making a baseball game using unreal engine 5 and it looks fucking insane. set to release on pc and ps5 only in september. meanwhile sony san diego is busy making ps4 and switch versions. The lighting, the materials, the level of detail in the stadiums all look fucking phenomenal. Even the animations look way better than the ones ive been playing in mlb the show which still have that stiff ps3 era feel to them.
Konami's Pro Spirits Baseball always looked nice, especially at night where their super-shiny helmet lighting really sparkled. (The last main game was 2019, for PS4 and Vita, then a 2020 version was released on Switch.)
Pro Yakyuu Spirits 2019, PS4
Pro Yakyuu Spirits Baseball 19 Review
www.operationsports.com
Lighting and shading is always carefully handled in their games, and it pays off in the night settings. Stadiums aren't usually very good, this one still has some of the problems of flatness and lo-fi techniques that they tend to use, but their players and attention to detail in pitcher/batter animation are always top-notch, going back to the PS2 version 20 years ago. And again, the helmets always shine up nice.
This being a brand new engine work, even with five years of work, it's probably going to have some of the new-egg issues that eFootball had when switching out of the stable and feature-rich PES line. (That's one of the reasons Sony San Diego wouldn't have just tossed everything and started from scratch, though I agree that something's quite behind with their PS5 work and they haven't had a wow-factor release since before PS4 even. They've made 4 PS5 releases and visuals have never been exciting in The Show this gen.) Hopefully they have afforded the time to avoid those pitfalls in this reinvention of the series' tech system. And you kind of have to play or watch a Pro Yakyuu to know what it's good and not good at graphically and presentation-wise, but the visuals released so far emphasize what the series has always been good at, with that clean and 'processed' aim at photorealism and mocapping which can lose some fluidity or personality if motions aren't captured (though how much "personality" is expressed in pro baseball is its own discussion.)
I'm not at all surprised that Konami did a great job with a new Pro Spirits Baseball game, having seen them pull off great sports graphics many times before. (I am a little surprised that the game exists though, as Konami wasn't showing signs of a comeback in the market and eFootball had all kinds of issues in following up on the PES legacy.) I do figure it'd be worth playing the game before declaring who rules and who drools in having the best sports game engine, but eh, this does look super nice so far.)
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GymWolf
Member
Same, i feel like i'm taking crazy pills.I guess I'm the only one not too impressed with the baseball game visuals. The new college football game looks way better to me
It looks decent with a realistic light/color scheme but that's it.
Like yeah the cutscenes with the zoom in look good but the actual gameplay look whatever, and the npcs cheering looks as last gen as it comes, we are still light years from looking like real people cheering.
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Represent.
Banned
I fucking love the focus on large enemy counts.
Really shaping up to be a GOTY candidate.
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Balducci30
Member
ideally we can get both swarms and more intelligent enemies - I could see the swarm thing getting old pretty fast but it still looks great. I’m optimistic
I guess efootball lowered my standards to sub-water in the Netherlands surface levels that anything Konami put a teeny tiny effort in makes it seem gigantic in comparison!I guess I'm the only one not too impressed with the baseball game visuals. The new college football game looks way better to me
It's amazing when dev pulls it off, but yes most of the time its just messy and not engaging.
GymWolf
Member
In days gone it was strategic, in here it just look like a mess, stay in the middle of the horde,mash attack and counter and repeat, so much fun...
Trilobit
Member
blastprocessor
The Amiga Brotherhood
Looks fantastic, finally some Sony competition.Apparently Konami is making a baseball game using unreal engine 5 and it looks fucking insane. set to release on pc and ps5 only in september. meanwhile sony san diego is busy making ps4 and switch versions. The lighting, the materials, the level of detail in the stadiums all look fucking phenomenal. Even the animations look way better than the ones ive been playing in mlb the show which still have that stiff ps3 era feel to them.
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ResetEraVetVIP
Member
Sony should just use UE5 if they don’t have engines comparable.
blastprocessor
The Amiga Brotherhood
Death Stranding 2 looks amazing. Let's wait and see what the other studios like ND, Sucker punch deliver with their updated engines.
Lethal01
Member
I think doing so would just to them possibly getting very slightly better results at the cost of having to fork over a huge sum of cash to Epic and possybly becoming dependant on their engine instead of being smart and focusing on improving their own engines while also making cash from their games
CamHostage
Member
It looks amazing with so much interactive stuff moving around and we don't get enough crazy stuff like this these days, so your point is all that needs to stand, but...
I mean, swarms is what this game is. It's a swarm-fighting game. As with their previous World War Z, they tune the gameplay to be based around fighting swarms. Too many games try to be "regular" and do combat or mechanics that every other game in the genre do, but we should have much more cases like this where the question is simply, "Do you like swarm games? No, then this game isn't for you. Yes, then this game has a great engine and is made by skilled developers and hopefully you will like it. " At these budgets, developers can't usually help but to make something down the middle, but it's a good thing for me when some people say that a game looks good but isn't for them.
For those who aren't into how this plays, don't worry, there'll probably be like a half-dozen more Warhammer games popping up in the next nine months, this series breeds like bunnies...
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Lethal01
Member
I like the idea of fighting swarms but want them to do more with the concept.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
I think the problem is that nearly all of sonys best studios have released ps5 games this gen, and they have disappointed. San Diego just released their 4th baseball game on PS5 and it still looks like a souped up ps3 game. they did update some faces but they still dont look as good as Madden of Fifa faces, but at least they look ps4 quality now.
Then you have ND who made a PS5 only game in TLOU1, but forgot to add anything next gen in it, doing a copy pasta of TLOU2. Callisto came out months later and completely outshined it despite still using UE4 tech and being cross gen.
SSM could've done the same thing. Create a truly outstanding next gen version like Callisto, but nope, they did a copy pasta on the ps5 increasing the resolution and fps and calling it a day. they had 8x more gpu power and wasted it on pixels and frames.
PD is running GT7 at 100 fps at native 4k. why? just cut that down and use the gpu for ingame ray tracing or other graphics effects. better rain, car models, lighting, anything.
GG, Bluepoint and to a lesser extent insomniac had done slightly better, but they have been outclassed since they last released their games, and they have no games on the horizon. i dont know if we should really wait until 2026-2028 to see what they have in store. we have to judge them based on what they've released and despite a decent start to the gen, they have lagged behind.
Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
Sony can kiss my ass this gen. Theres nothing this gen like Uncharted 4, The Order, God of War, Ghost of Tsushima (it may lack in genometric density but my goodness its still a beautiful game), Death Stranding, Last of Us 2. We dont even know when we're getting the first current gen exclusive from any of the same devs except for Death Stranding 2 which as a tentative release window.
Hopefully now everyone realizes just how unacceptable and phoned in Naughty Dogs LoU1 remake was, Gow Ragnarok, and to a slightly lesser degree Spiderman 2 and Sony will stop getting away with this bizarre lack of graphical upgrades this gen.
Hopefully now everyone realizes just how unacceptable and phoned in Naughty Dogs LoU1 remake was, Gow Ragnarok, and to a slightly lesser degree Spiderman 2 and Sony will stop getting away with this bizarre lack of graphical upgrades this gen.
Cr1ptkeeper
Member
And to think Metal Gear Solid 2 was running at 60 fps on PS2 and looked 2 gens ahead of MGS 1. I still remember seeing that reveal trailer for the first time, couldn't believe that was ingame.
Now we have AA(A) games on PS5 that can't hold a steady 60 fps at around 720p. And somehow jaggies are back in this generation, who would've thought...
Now we have AA(A) games on PS5 that can't hold a steady 60 fps at around 720p. And somehow jaggies are back in this generation, who would've thought...
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I think the recent reveals of next gen games like Fable, Doom, Assassin's Creed, Dragon Age etc show quite clearly that proper next gen iterations of other engines are every bit as impressive as Unreal 5. No reason Sony's technically excellent studios won't step up too.
It is what it is. They've obviously got stuff cooking, it's just taking longer than we'd like. The idea that they CAN'T just because they haven't yet just seems silly to me.
Audiophile
Member
I think we've had only one truly current-gen title from Sony's first parties which was Ratchet N' Clank and that was an early effort. Spidey 2 was current-gen only but was an asset swap and the only stuff that differentiates that is the traversal speeds; visually it's only gains were better lighting, some more RT & denser traffic/pedestrians. That's all nice but it's a few things being tacked on or dialled up, not a fundamental upgrade in the overall, perceptible visuals.
Sony really need to turn up when it comes to the second half of this gen. I hope to see major overhauls to all the engines for Ghost Of Tsushima 2, SSM+Bend+ND's next projects, Horizon 3, Spidey 3 and any other unannounced major titles. Given their resources, their pedigree and the fact they'll be completely untethered from PS4, I expect to be wowed. If they continue effectively releasing games that feel like scaled up PS4 engine titles, I'm gonna be so disappointed.
We're still in the PS4 gen as far as I'm concerned and PS5's functionality is 95% that of a PS4 Pro+. I don't think this gen really starts till GTAVI & Death Stranding 2 (and DS2 is the bare minimum I expect).
I wanna see them bring the beans for the last 3-4yrs of this gen.
Sony really need to turn up when it comes to the second half of this gen. I hope to see major overhauls to all the engines for Ghost Of Tsushima 2, SSM+Bend+ND's next projects, Horizon 3, Spidey 3 and any other unannounced major titles. Given their resources, their pedigree and the fact they'll be completely untethered from PS4, I expect to be wowed. If they continue effectively releasing games that feel like scaled up PS4 engine titles, I'm gonna be so disappointed.
We're still in the PS4 gen as far as I'm concerned and PS5's functionality is 95% that of a PS4 Pro+. I don't think this gen really starts till GTAVI & Death Stranding 2 (and DS2 is the bare minimum I expect).
I wanna see them bring the beans for the last 3-4yrs of this gen.
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Spidey 2 and Horizon FW were both essentially cross gen games, yeah, albeit extremely impressive ones. Burning Shores often looks properly next gen to me, although certainly not always. They're both miles better than TLOU Part 1, which really was low-effort.
Ratchet is still easily the best looking game I've played this gen, though. Kinda crazy.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
MGS2 was a massive leap but its a very closed off game. Think of it as a souped up PS1 game. MGS3 is when they went wide linear and it got a massive framerate cut. Several sections in the game dropped below 20 fps and stayed there. including boss fights and end of the game setpieces.
We had a lot of those games earlier this gen. Demon Souls Remake is essentially the same PS3 game only souped up with better graphics and it ran at a flawless 60 fps. So did Ratchet, Returnal, and most other cross gen games.
Now that devs are finally pushing the visuals, yes it's come at a cost. FSR is whats introducing jaggies when devs run resolutions at 720p trying to upscale to 4k, but thats just the cost of 60 fps on $399 consoles. I dont see jaggies on my PC and i doubt we will see jaggies on the PS5 pro. This one isnt on the devs, but the consumer who all of a sudden expects 60 fps in every game. No one trashed GTA3 for not having a 60 fps mode like MGS2 back then.
GymWolf
Member
Ratchet is like burning shores, sometimes it looks fully nextgen, some planets looks like they are part of another game, we had countless of pics in this very topic, i guess the highs of ratchet are higher so it feel more nextgen.
Crazy bitch 2 seems to be the only game that always look nextgen but to do that they had to turn it in a playable tech demo.
Even stuff like cyberpunk or aw2 have parts that look ultra meh.
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They fight without limbs when they need too.
I know people here hate Ubisoft, but they are one of the few that are making huge investments in new technology. Avatar FoP may have some problems with the gameplay approach, animations and AI, but it is a visual showcase of what is possible in the current generation. Star Wars Outlaws is going to be another one, and Assassin's Creed Shadows has shown a wide range of improvements that together reach a visual and simulation level impossible to achieve in the previous generation.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
I think the key here is that they started development on those games in 2017-2018. Avatar started dev in 2017 and from the beginning they wanted a next gen game. AC Shadows started dev in 2018. Again, next gen only title from the beginning. Meanwhile Sony shipped Horizon 1 in 2017 and decided to make a last gen game. So did SSM who shipped GOW in 2018. First party developers have an obligation to start a few years earlier than third party devs and sony went the complete opposite way.
Even fucking Bethesda always targeted next gen system and that game started dev well before 2018.
yes, they had Insomniac, Bluepoint and Housemarque work on next gen only titles but they are not your top tier studios. Insomniac dropped the ball with their focus on native 4k rendering with rt enabled and forgot to upgrade city building assets to next gen or even cyberpunk level of fidelity.
I was hoping to see Ghost of Tsushima 2, Sony Bend's next title and Bluepoint's new IP 4 years after they last shipped a game, but those games are clearly in development hell. back in the day we would get entire sequels in 2 years. nowadays, the same studios cant even get a trailer out in 4 years? something's gone horribly wrong over at sony.
P.S Even Death Stranding 2 has taken 6 years. KOjima was literally fired. Was jobless and had no studio, no engine, no money and yet managed to get all of that and make a brand new IP in just under 4 years. Then the sequel which looks fairly similar to the first game takes 6 years? Why? Norman Reedus said they didnt start making the game until mid 2021. Why? Kojima was contracted to make 2 death stranding games back in 2015. Why did they only begin in 2021 instead of immediately after shipping DS1 in 2019? we wouldve gotten ds2 in 2023 if sony had funded the dev immediately. Days Gone dev said the same thing about DG2. A lot of boneheaded decisions were made towards the end of that gen, and those are coming back to bite sony devs in the ass this gen.
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GymWolf
Member
The last showing of outlaws was downright hilarious and although on paper shadows has nextgen features, the overall presentation left most people pretty cold, it really doesn't look a generation ahead of valhalla unless you have the lowest standards, the characters and specially ncps are still not even close to the level of hfw, a 3 years old crossgen game...
Shadows should fucking destroy horizon dude...in all aspects, but alas...
And their animation work for both games seems to be stuck to 10 years ago, you watch footage of tsushima combat and footage of yasuke combat and it's night and day, and i'm far from a tsushima fanboy, quite the opposite.
I think avatar looks vastly better than both, but like you said, it's kinda of a shit game
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Nah it almost all looks great. I ignore that nonsense.
It's variable, but so are most good looking games. Even Uncharted 4, say, looked surprisingly rough in some areas, and practically CG in others.
GymWolf
Member
The fact that you ignore it doesn't make it less true but ok.
The game looks downright cg in the robot cantina but it looks on par or worse than hfw in the primitive planet where you drive the insect (or whatever the fuck was), and is not the only meh looking planet, we are not talking about a texture here and there but entire planets looking much worse than others.
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Super solid conclusion there, based on precisely fuck all raised to the power of fuck all.
Earlier this gen they said that they believe in generations, and that they are committed to continue making the games that have made the brand great. The thing is that seeing this 4 years we can say that they are more in line with the opposite direction.
Now first party teams are working to support 2 different platforms, Ps5 and PC, 3 if we take into account Ps4. But also some of them are working on multiple projects with a heavy focus on GaaS. We know how this approach works in the best Sony studio, Naugthy Dog, and i don't think I'll be the only one with issues.
The investment has to be distributed and they can't be focused on one hardware and one IP/game. So the results are that by trying to do too much at once they are underperfomance on the cadence of releases and the quality or technical complexity.
Playboi Carti
Member
If SSM and ND next titles don't trade blows with the best looking games this gen so far/GTA VI then the Sony studios in-house engines are completely cooked. Crazy how Demon's Souls continues to be the best looking Sony FP game this gen and it's a launch game, Bluepoint really cooked like a mf with that one.
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GymWolf
Member
The we believe in generation was some grade A bullshit.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
If you look at their GaaS vs Single Player investments, their single player investments actually went down from 2019 to 2023. It's no surprise that we are in a dry spell with virtually nothing on the horizon aside from astrobot. As games became more expensive, they cut down on spending. Thats probably why Death Stranding 2 wasnt greenlit right away and why Sony San Diego wasnt given more resources to make substantial improvements every year. Instead of they were forced to make Xbox and Switch versions.
Things are only going to get worse. Their investment in single player games would be roughly the same as it was in 2019 despite the fact that costs have risen substantially since. I think most sony studios only have money allocated for one game. My guess is we get 1-2 games max till the end of the gen. nothing special.
2025 - Death Stranding
2026 - GoT 2
2026 - Wolverine
2027 - ND new IP
2027 - SSM new IP
Cross gen PS6 games
2028 - Horizon 3
2028 - Bend's GaaS game
2028 - Bluepoint's new IP
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
where did you go?
Turk1993
GAFs #1 source for car graphic comparisons
Had lots of projects to do on my work and also have a girlfriend so had almost no time to post or game. but now everything is finished (work related) and im back chilling.
Portugeezer
Member
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
So you chose your girlfriend over graphics. you just lost all credibility in this thread.