I'm still wagering it won't be a day-one release, but I expect it'll be play anywhere when it comes out, yeah.
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Halo 5: Guardians |OT5| Is HaloGAF irrelevant now?
- Thread starter sir_dany12
- Start date
I think it will be day and date.
It's going to be weird for PC people though since they are still missing Halo 3, ODST, Reach, Halo 4 and Halo 5 Campaign
Why not?
Samurai G0SU
Member
They didnt do anything crazy deep like HTT, they were in charge of the tv commercials. from what i remember.
Cause I can still see Microsoft being tentative about putting both feet in the pool when it comes to Halo.
I just hope we get true cross-platform options. I don't care about matching with keyboard users if I'm going into social lists and customs. Put in a toggle for people to turn off if that's too abhorrent for them. HW2's Balkanized player base is exactly what Halo doesn't need.
Oh yeah!!! Those commercials were pretty damn good too.
I hope it will be Day & date. I think it will. That would be best for the franchise.
I'd even do crossplay it for all playlists but give players the ability to opt in/out.
Fata1moose
Banned
I guarantee you if 343 went for nostalgia and had a classic art style, no sprint, they'd sell a lot more copies. Look at the excitement BF1 and CoD generated by going back to their roots.
Well Old is New is in. So if they are still chasing trends....But yeah I think those studios realized that some of that older stuff never became "outdated"
I don't think Halo 6 will flop though if it comes to PC and if they work out their Win10/Steam stuff (which we might see soon on how KI is going to handle that)
Fata1moose
Banned
I don't think it'll flop, but it won't do nearly as well if they don't find a happy medium between old and new.
I think a new classic Halo would pretty much be H2A. It was the PERFECT new classic but was super short lived because of the MCC bugs and that is a damn crime imo
If there's one trend I'm for chasing it's the "when Massive changes alienate your audience, be true to your core" trend.
Assuming things are outdated or fixing what isn't broken is a recipe for disaster.
ATOMICJORGE
Member
By the way yesterday Halo Combat Evolved was the #3 most watched game on Twitch during SGDQ 2017 with 162k viewers
Samurai G0SU
Member
What if CORTANA took away their LIGHT!
(tech of newer armor abilities)
Well be playing back to our roots with no ability to thrust, slide, hover or clamber! just walk, jump, strafe and crouch.
@Jorge: You don't need to post the same message in both Halo and Halo 5 topics (I know it's to be sure everyone see this, but still), only one will be good, and the more appropriate in this case would be the Halo community thread, not the Halo 5 one. 
It actually splits the discussion rather than focus on something. Don't worry that anyone interested in Halo around there are looking to both topics.
It actually splits the discussion rather than focus on something. Don't worry that anyone interested in Halo around there are looking to both topics.
Fatmanp
Member
I think this guy deserves a hell of a lot more subscribers than he has. He puts so much thought into his vids and his latest is no different. He basically breaks down the difference between how the originally trilogy innovated its gameplay vs the current trilogy.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yz9GA6oTWTY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yz9GA6oTWTY
Yeah this dude shares my line of thinking. They should innovate within the core formula that actually resonated with a massive audience rather than seeking a new formula altogether.
Fata1moose
Banned
I like Favyn, I don't always agree with his opinions (liking Halo 3 MP :lol), but he always presents his arguments in a logical way. He changed my perspective on a few things. If I recall Favyn and Actman were both invited to 343i post Halo 5 to talk about Halo moving forward.
Gnome Scat
Member
Great video, I agree with him completely. When it comes to the actual implementation of that game design philosophy I may have some alternative suggestions, but overall I think 343i (or another studio) should try making a Halo game with this line of thinking. I'd buy it in a heartbeat and I'm sure a lot of other former and current fans would, too.
Mind sourcing this for me? Guess that news went over my head and I'd like to look into it.
He was just invited to visit the studio (actually the museum and the public space) alongside HiddenXperia and ActMan, but it wasn't to talk about moving Halo forward (even if they sure gave their opinion about the state of Halo).
Actually, I just want to see the Sprint go (and everything tied to the sprint), but Clamber, Thrust, ground pound and hovering/stabilizers are okay additions regarding having a mix of classic and new Halo, according the maps don't need to be designed around those abilities being used to move around.
And sure, additions to the sandbox would be great, but influencing on the gameplay and make the controls (the feedback and action) change because of the environment? That's not what I think Halo needs and should do.
Gnome Scat
Member
Yeah that was the one thing I had disagreements with him about. I would love to see zero gravity, teleporters, conveyer belts, etc. return to map design as a way of making environmental based adjustments to map movement, but I don't think it should extend to the controls like he suggested. Now obviously there would also be static maps, but I do miss the dynamic ones of the OT days.
Now I haven't thought to longly or deeply about this, but one way Halo could possibly innovate in the ways he discussed could be the implementation something like Spartan Chassises, where you could step into an upgraded suit that can modify movement. So while base gameplay and movement would be restricted to traditional Halo abilities, chassises could modify that. I'm not sure how extensive these modifiers could be, but one, for example, could be a thruster-based chassis, which would give the player movement and abilities similar to Halo 5. Now they could be more scaled back than that or maybe there could only be one chassis available, working as a gameplay modifier for specific maps, modes, or levels, and exist as an extension of player agency in the same way that vehicles provide players with that. It would not be present in arena, but maybe it could be found on bigger maps/modes or possibly exist as an alternative playlist mode. It could also make a fun addition to some campaign levels.
Once again, haven't thought about this too much, but it's a possibility that could both preserve the desire for classic Halo gameplay, but also scratch that itch for a faster, more mobile experience. And since it's not built into the core, it can be taken away. Personally, I would be fine with more simple interactive additions to the sandbox on top of classic gameplay features, but I could live with that as a feature if it works.
Fata1moose
Banned
I love ground pound and thruster. Stabilization and clamber I don't give two shits about. Smart scope, sprint, spartan charge and slide need to go.
Ozzy Onya A2Z
Member
Can't say I follow the hype on this video to the extent others do, lots of words/time to say what could be delivered within 5mins IMO. If you want to create these sorts of videos I'd recommend you first need to define the audience and perhaps gametype for each video segment. Literally the entire first 10 minutes go out the window in this video when you consider MLG vs default or BTB H3.
The H5 sandbox 343 have these days can happily cross many audiences and gametypes, something Bungie didn't reach such great player responses for IMO. This is the reason 343 went after base gameplay instead of interactions from H4 to H5 and moving away from Bungie's trilogy style changes.
You know what the community should spend more time doing? Actually creating new ideas for 343 to review and delve into within Halo. The spark can come in any form from base mechanics to cool interactions all the way down to a weapon or map design with a new gametype. Why limit creativity? It would be nice if the PC side of H6 brought Forge/scripting/modding to the forefront. Let fans develop and design elements that go wild on PC but get a developer's touch and vetting/QA processes before releasing to Xbox game versions. Community driven content is the big time and will aid 343 across many skills, executions and ideas.
I agree with the video point that overall Bungie map design and interactions are better than 343 thus far. It's always been the cornerstone to moving forward, that's not to say I dislike 343 wholesale, far from it. Nailing simple and effective map designs with quality gametypes in stable consistent gameplay is the way forward. Fuck innovation as a 100% must have, give me something I can play 1000 times over and still find unique interactions then I'm happy. It doesn't bother me if that's old or new. Bungie said as much in a ViDoc years ago. Go back to simple high quality maps.
If the video creator doesn't think Bungie designed the H3 maps and iterations around equipment he's batshit crazy. I like what he has to say near the end of the video about CE/H2 map elements affecting gameplay, more slick ice, more grav boots limiting jumping in areas etc. That's good stuff but just falls under the banner of good map design and interactivity. Halo 5 had elements of map scripting and interactivity that would be aces in multiplayer e.g. forerunner maps that move, teleport and are predictable to alter paths and sightlines, again replayability and skill go hand in hand here.
I can also agree with simplifying the buttons by losing one or two spartan abilities. However when you compare current eSports to "default Halo" in H5 vs back in the day with MLG/H3 the base gameplay has come along lightyears in front, as has the sandbox and netcode for the most part. It's the map designs and gametypes that need work moving forward. WZ/FF is awesome and plenty to build on from there but the disparate playlists/audiences need to be accommodated for and curated over periods of time. I don't accept the video's premise that the current sandbox and interactions haven't raised the bar across all gametypes and audiences though. Separate playlists, developer maps and mild setting changes are also cornerstone to attracting differing audiences and guiding developers/designers from the get go.
That's my two cents on the video anyhow.
I have nothing against slide since you can design cool elements around it, but Thruster + crouch to slide? I find this be a mapping control that can feel really unnatural. :/
And yeah, that's the thing I find quite ridiculous about Halo youtubers (and other), they litteraly take 20 minutes to talk about something that could be said in less than 5... But you've got to play the Youtube game I guess... I miss long read articles sometimes.
Remove spartan charge+sprint and keep clamber for casuals but design maps around crouch/spring jumping
Not sure if possible but improve they way forge maps look (high quality textures etc) so players can create maps that look like dev maps
Bring back h3 physics and by that i mean if rockets/nades hit close to a warthog i want to see some flips. Halo 5 physics lacks that impact it feels like all vehicles are tanks
Not sure if possible but improve they way forge maps look (high quality textures etc) so players can create maps that look like dev maps
Bring back h3 physics and by that i mean if rockets/nades hit close to a warthog i want to see some flips. Halo 5 physics lacks that impact it feels like all vehicles are tanks
Samurai G0SU
Member
I think if Spartan charge didn't have such a big auto aim and distance, it would be more tolerable. But we seen those gifs of where he turns mid air in mid Spartan charge to get a slay.
We'll see what changes are made with 6.
We'll see what changes are made with 6.
jizzlobber
Member
I think those gifs are the result of latency or something, I find most of the time I hit nothing but air unless i'm on the money.
I like the Spartan charge and ground pound, good fun.
I like the Spartan charge and ground pound, good fun.
Ozzy Onya A2Z
Member
Beyond simple mechanics, sandbox or settings I want to see player choice given the utmost priority and respect with H6. IMO it's the key change Halo needs to stop player drop off post launch. Further it's the one change 343/Bungie have never implemented (beyond custom games browser recently with H5).
Specifically I mean a low number of playlists built with player/party choices via toggles or sliders to really balance matchmaking vs a near singular player/party selection of map and gametype. I've posted about matchmaking toggles many times and I still wholeheartedly feel giving more player/party control over choices of what to play directly minimises quitters, speeds up dynamic voting and maximises closer game outcomes naturally. Everything Halo developers have been aiming to achieve with so many other systems, fixes, changes, designs etc.
It's a damned shame MCC/H5 didn't do this type of matchmaking system. All this developer work, maps, gametypes, metrics, community armchair design etc are all skewed by design in the current and historic matchmaking systems. A player choice driven matchmaking system is likely to deliver return players more often than current systems while ensure far more accurate metrics about what players actually want to play rather than shoehorning into a developer driven system for skewed data.
Why? We get to mostly play what we choose to. Now imagine that in Halo for the first time. Given all the resources, game releases, changes and feedback over the decades it's high time this was implemented more so than anything I've seen in YT videos or casts etc.
Specifically I mean a low number of playlists built with player/party choices via toggles or sliders to really balance matchmaking vs a near singular player/party selection of map and gametype. I've posted about matchmaking toggles many times and I still wholeheartedly feel giving more player/party control over choices of what to play directly minimises quitters, speeds up dynamic voting and maximises closer game outcomes naturally. Everything Halo developers have been aiming to achieve with so many other systems, fixes, changes, designs etc.
It's a damned shame MCC/H5 didn't do this type of matchmaking system. All this developer work, maps, gametypes, metrics, community armchair design etc are all skewed by design in the current and historic matchmaking systems. A player choice driven matchmaking system is likely to deliver return players more often than current systems while ensure far more accurate metrics about what players actually want to play rather than shoehorning into a developer driven system for skewed data.
Why? We get to mostly play what we choose to. Now imagine that in Halo for the first time. Given all the resources, game releases, changes and feedback over the decades it's high time this was implemented more so than anything I've seen in YT videos or casts etc.
FUNKNOWN iXi
Member
You give a bad name to greek gods and dinosaurs.
Fata1moose
Banned
We have a discord don't we? There's no link in the OP.
Just poppin' in to mirror this sentiment. They need tweaks, and some probably don't belong in a competitive environment, but I'd be kinda disappointed if they just went back to the classic setup.
FUNKNOWN iXi
Member
Halo 2 got a sequel -> Halo 3
Halo Reach got a sequel -> Halo 4
Halo 5 deserves its sequel.
Halo Reach got a sequel -> Halo 4
Halo 5 deserves its sequel.
RIP CE
2
GringoSuave89
Banned
Do we?
SmartWaffles
Member
Bad game gets bad sequel, pretty fair to me.
Fata1moose
Banned
If we don't I can make one. Would be nice for the community when we have nothing of substance to say--Hahaha that's already the case. I mean the FUNKNOWN guy's shit posts am I right!?
<3
I'm not sure I follow here... How does the H5's sandbox have more reach than any of the previous halos. I'm just thinking of all the things created (by the devs and the community) and all the niche audiences served back in the H3 and Reach era that are missing now, so I don't see how changing the chore mechanics bolstered that quality.
Interesting concept for sure. I definately believe in letting the community get a bit more say in what ships Helps all parties.
I don't think that's what he's saying. Because equipment were all pickups and not base abilities, the "damage" done by designing around them is limited to the specific map rather than the entire game. Furthermore, they/players could easily remove them from maps where they didn't work, and replace them with items that worked better.
I'm not sure I follow you here. Care to elaborate on the idea that the current sandbox "raised the bar" across all audiences and gametypes?
I agree, Juan, Halo 5 is not an easy game to play and way too convoluted. Halo should be easy to play, hard to master.
BizzyBum
Member
I feel like the argument of what spartan abilities to keep and discard is something we discuss like once every two weeks. lol
To me it's pretty simple if 343 wants to appease most fans. Keep nothing. Back to basics with Halo 6 in where it plays like the original trilogy. That's literally all they have to do. Hire some new people to design their maps is a bonus.
To me it's pretty simple if 343 wants to appease most fans. Keep nothing. Back to basics with Halo 6 in where it plays like the original trilogy. That's literally all they have to do. Hire some new people to design their maps is a bonus.
It would be nice if they went back to basics and designed excellent maps while adding new stuff as said in that video above aren't base mechanics but additions in the sandbox. Perhaps it would make their job a bit easier and people would come back to a comfortable pair of nostalgia shoes, isn't that the hot thing these days. I don't think it would be old hat, just great to play something that is simple, yet hard to master so everyone can enjoy like when you played splitscreen and system link with your buddies and some weren't good but still having a good time. Fun and simplicity, both in mechanics and art style.
Fata1moose
Banned
You're right, we do talk about the sandbox and abilities a lot, but we're in the doldrums between Halo 5 and 6, best to talk about it now instead of later when it's too late to change. Granted it's probably already too late, but we've been talking about this at nauseam for a while. I think ground pound and thruster could be retained and people could be happy on both sides of the fence. At the very least thruster should return, it's easy to account for when it's not strung together with sprint, sliding, stabilization, etc... Thruster is smart innovation, despite what Favyn may say. It's very much in the spirit of Halo's strafing and 1 on 1 encounters. The biggest offender is sprint, cut that and up the base movement and you can return to classic map design while maintaining a fast (albeit slightly reduced) pace.
FUNKNOWN iXi
Member
💪💩👍
I truly believe most existing fans could be more than satisfied with just Sprint being moved. And I think it would result in a much better game overall. I'd like to see some others go, but I recognize that they don't have nearly the negative impact that sprint has.
Hire a new art director as well. Absolutely hate the art direction in 5. I want my natural beauty back.
The thing is, I don't really know what the Halo formula really is since every Halo game was different from each others. While Destiny 2 is being criticize by some people for being Destiny 1.5, at least they don't change the formula and the core audience know they will got a very similar game with new foundation.
Regarding Halo, I honestly don't know which one I would take as a basis.
Personally, I would maybe choose Halo 4 after it was patched and get rid of armor abilities.
While I still think it's a cool idea, I'm strongly against having something like that in a Halo game, at least for the matchmaking part. Reach social profile & MM already showed that toggle and filters are cool at launch but get useless after a few weeks. And this was only for players, so having this for maps & gametypes would be awful...
Titanfall (1 & 2) tried something very similar, and it failed.
Custom Game Browser is here for this and I hope it will be improved for the next Halo game.
Yeah, you got it, that should be the mantra for Halo: easy to play, hard to master.
Halo Wars 2 is such a perfect mix between old & new art style. But Halo 2 Anniversary is still, to me, the best iteration from a art standpoint.
Regarding Halo, I honestly don't know which one I would take as a basis.
Personally, I would maybe choose Halo 4 after it was patched and get rid of armor abilities.
While I still think it's a cool idea, I'm strongly against having something like that in a Halo game, at least for the matchmaking part. Reach social profile & MM already showed that toggle and filters are cool at launch but get useless after a few weeks. And this was only for players, so having this for maps & gametypes would be awful...
Titanfall (1 & 2) tried something very similar, and it failed.
Custom Game Browser is here for this and I hope it will be improved for the next Halo game.
Yeah, you got it, that should be the mantra for Halo: easy to play, hard to master.
Halo Wars 2 is such a perfect mix between old & new art style. But Halo 2 Anniversary is still, to me, the best iteration from a art standpoint.