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Halo: Reach |OT3| This Thread is Not a Natural Formation

F

FourDoor

Member
Ramirez said:
Can we go ahead and call Forge World the biggest blunder ever? The framerate is simply laughable on FW a good portion of the time. I was playing that community playlist, and I think the map is Reverance or something, it's suspended over Blood Gulch. On more than one occasion the framerate dropped into what seemed like single digits, I wasn't scoping or anything, and it lasted for a good 5-10 seconds, it was completely unplayable. -_-
Click to expand...

I ran into this issue as well. Horrible framerate drops in the middle of the game in the community playlist. :(
 
B

Brolic Gaoler

formerly Alienshogun
FourDoor said:
I ran into this issue as well. Horrible framerate drops in the middle of the game in the community playlist. :(
Click to expand...

Yep, and there's texture glitching in a lot of them too.


FilthyLies said:
And it's a Plasma RIFLE, not a Repeater. The rifle is very weak in all aspects, though that obviously doesn't preclude people from picking up other weapons.
Click to expand...

Or simply using the Plasma pistol in its place, which in Reach is a beast.
 
F

FourDoor

Member
Alienshogun said:
Yep, and there's texture glitching in a lot of them too.
Click to expand...

That too. I tried to look past it but the flashing floors can get distracting at times. It was as if my spartan was playing some DDR! LOL :lol
 
M

Major Williams

Member
"Halo: Reach's engine is able to support up to 40 active AI characters and 20 vehicles with AI characters on screen at once, twice as many as in Halo 3."

:lol :lol :lol

Framerate issues in multiplayer confirmed. That's what... 12 players, max?
 
X

xxjuicesxx

Member
No cause guys I remember when I was in Reach preview thread and getting yelled at because I said "Halo Reach will have framerate issues because its graphics are way better than H3's on the SAME hardware"

You guys all like "NO CONSOLE GAMING HAS ALWAYS BEEN THIS WAY! THEY WILL CODE BETTER!"

While thats true in ways, you still can't recreate the wheel.

PS I was right. You were wrong. Deal with it.
 
M

MrBig

Member
xxjuicesxx said:
No cause guys I remember when I was in Reach preview thread and getting yelled at because I said "Halo Reach will have framerate issues because its graphics are way better than H3's on the SAME hardware"

You guys all like "NO CONSOLE GAMING HAS ALWAYS BEEN THIS WAY! THEY WILL CODE BETTER!"

While thats true in ways, you still can't recreate the wheel.

PS I was right. You were wrong. Deal with it.
Click to expand...
martydealwithit.gif
 
S

Squall ASF

Member
Alienshogun said:
Yep, they simply replaced it with Plasma rifle and plasma pistol, the plasma pistol is the way to go since you can OC/melee with it, or burst fire for the kill.
Click to expand...

HAHAHA they do realize the main problem with AL is: Stick someone-AL to survive explosion, Stick-AL, Stick-AL....I've never had an issue with people ALing my rifle in Multi, it's just that the match devolves into a stick/AL the explosion fest.
 
M

Major Williams

Member
xxjuicesxx said:
No cause guys I remember when I was in Reach preview thread and getting yelled at because I said "Halo Reach will have framerate issues because its graphics are way better than H3's on the SAME hardware"

You guys all like "NO CONSOLE GAMING HAS ALWAYS BEEN THIS WAY! THEY WILL CODE BETTER!"

While thats true in ways, you still can't recreate the wheel.

PS I was right. You were wrong. Deal with it.
Click to expand...
Bieber-Deal-with-it.gif
 
G

GhaleonEB

Member
Juices, you could generate frame rate issues in Halo 3 by over-loading an area with objects in Forge as well. I think your argument has merit, but taking some badly designed and balanced Forge maps as the foundation of it doesn't work. I'd point to the campaign more on that front. Most of the Reach maps are gorgeous and don't have frame rate issues. And I managed to build a freaking massive map out in the open of Forge World that doesn't have the same issues.
Squall ASF said:
HAHAHA they do realize the main problem with AL is: Stick someone-AL to survive explosion, Stick-AL, Stick-AL....I've never had an issue with people ALing my rifle in Multi, it's just that the match devolves into a stick/AL the explosion fest.
Click to expand...
They also cut the plasma grenades available at spawn from two to one, which in the game I played did cut down on what you describe.
 
S

Squall ASF

Member
GhaleonEB said:
Juices, you could generate frame rate issues in Halo 3 by over-loading an area with objects in Forge as well. I think your argument has merit, but taking some badly designed and balanced Forge maps as the foundation of it doesn't work. I'd point to the campaign more on that front. Most of the Reach maps are gorgeous and don't have frame rate issues. And I managed to build a freaking massive map out in the open of Forge World that doesn't have the same issues.

They also cut the plasma grenades available at spawn from two to one, which in the game I played did cut down on what you describe.
Click to expand...

I can see that helping some, though you can still pick up from corpses. That said, you could potentially pickup 2 from a body before so it still helps. I guess I'll find out the impact for myself tonight when I go for the assist challenge.
 
B

Booties

Banned
kylej said:
I'm amazed people thought Forge 1.1 would be any better than Halo 3s.

Far Cry 2 happened 2 years ago, y'all - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C8qa-naczjg

Guess that's the Bungie Lack of Resources™ again. At least all that time and manpower not spent on Forge went to good use, like building many great multiplayer maps.
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I love when you post this. Get on BK, it's time to get our ratings again.
 
M

Major Williams

Member
1283943361_peeping-tom.gif


Related to Reach: My dog bit my left thumb super bad 2 nights ago and I can't play for awhile. The full extent of my playing style is running forward and looking wherever I go. I can't even strafe!
 
B

bobs...onGaf

Member
Ramirez said:
Worst free DLC ever? :lol

I pooped on kids today pretty consistently, I think I get better the less I play the game, I know it keeps me from raging on it so hard...

Can we go ahead and call Forge World the biggest blunder ever? The framerate is simply laughable on FW a good portion of the time. I was playing that community playlist, and I think the map is Reverance or something, it's suspended over Blood Gulch. On more than one occasion the framerate dropped into what seemed like single digits, I wasn't scoping or anything, and it lasted for a good 5-10 seconds, it was completely unplayable. -_-
Click to expand...

After playing the Community Map playlist im tempted to say yes. I actually enjoy seeing new maps, but the quality of the maps is still sub par, and visually things get very boring very quick.

So yeah the fact that resources where taken away from making full on maps and where invested into Forge World in order to allow community maps to be a big thing sucks. We saw how poorly that turned out in Halo 3.

I do really love Forge World, and it is a fun playground to have available when forging, but at the expense of proper maps its just not worth it. If we could have had 5 different unique maps in its place I would have prefered the latter option.
 
F

FourDoor

Member
I think the initial hate here towards the community maps just highlights how incredibly hard it is to create a quality map for Halo.

Bungie had an entire MP team with design artists building their maps yet we can still pick it apart down to the pixel as to why we think it's bad.

For the community playlist, we have Forge World and forgers who think loading every map with a rocket launcher and places to jet pack up to and camp is a great idea.

Take note 343, our standards are set high for the next Halo! :lol
 
M

MrBig

Member
FourDoor said:
I think the initial hate here towards the community maps just highlights how incredibly hard it is to create a quality map for Halo.

Bungie had an entire MP team with design artists building their maps yet we can still pick it apart down to the pixel as to why we think it's bad.

For the community playlist, we have Forge World and forgers who think loading every map with a rocket launcher and places to jet pack up to and camp is a great idea.

Take note 343, our standards are set high for the next Halo! :lol
Click to expand...
Better maps were coming out of gaf alone in the first few weeks. I think they're just giving us the shit now to make the rest look better.
 
B

Brolic Gaoler

formerly Alienshogun
OMG bring on the multiteam BKs, OM NOM NOM.

These two kids on orange insisted I got pooped on. :lol

http://www.bungie.net/stats/reach/gamestats.aspx?gameid=412009934&player=AlienShogun

Some attached screens for lulz, and so they see it when they check their "pics of you." :lol

http://www.bungie.net/Stats/Reach/FileDetails.aspx?fid=12180454&player=AlienShogun

http://www.bungie.net/Stats/Reach/FileDetails.aspx?fid=12180456&player=AlienShogun


On a side note, I'm getting awesome with pistol, and wonder why I didn't love it before.
 
G

GhaleonEB

Member
MrBig said:
Better maps were coming out of gaf alone in the first few weeks. I think they're just giving us the shit now to make the rest look better.
Click to expand...
Probably - these aren't the contest winners, which I assume will be a cut (hopefully many cuts) above.

That said, I think Bungie has their work cut out from them finding great community maps. I did a few sessions of downloading maps with the tag "forgecacular" - as all such maps were required to be tagged - and the signal:noise ratio was very poor.

Which speaks to Four Door's comment. I made this post on b.net yesterday:

I haven't had a chance to play these yet. I look forward to them tonight.

But I think it's worth noting that making good maps is hard. Like, really, REALLY hard. Factors such as sight lines, spawn locations, base designs, landmark placement, weapon placement and balance and more are very hard to juggle, and require tons of testing to get right. And even after putting in tons of work, lots of people will hate the end result.

I put two months of work and testing into the map I submitted to the Forgetacular contest, and was very methodical about it. But even then my map was just okay. When I perused the maps tagged as being for the Forgetacular contest, I found a very poor signal:noise ratio - lots and lots of poorly designed or implimented ideas. I'm sure the designers put a lot of time and effort into them, but that's not guarantee of success.

Also note that the playlist is intended as a testing bed, and the best of the best will bubble upto general matchmaking. This is an approach I was hoping to see. And given that approach, there are going to be good maps and bad maps flow through. Vote accordingly.

I guess what I'm saying is - maybe you shouldn't point all the ire at Bungie, but at the community. Because making good maps is a crazy hard challenge, and they picked from what they had submitted.
Click to expand...

I was proud of the first version of Crossroads I tested on you poor guys. And I ended up making, literally, several hundred changes, many of them huge. Because that first version was kinda crappy. The difference between a good map and a crappy one is often pretty small, I think. The two maps I played in the Community Slayer hopper could both be turned into good maps with a couple more iterations and polish passes. But they didn't get there.

All that said, I'm surprised at how poor they were. I thought surely better ones would be in the first cut. But I'm hopeful we'll find some gems in the rough as we go forward.
 
B

Blueblur1

Member
I agree with pretty much everything you guys have been posting. I don't really care for Forge World and it's drab pallette. I much rather would have preferred 5 individual maps instead of FW. I have yet to be impressed by any Forged map in Halo 3 and Reach just because the tools are ridiculously limited and making an excellent map is a monumentous feat. For Halo 4, I hope there's an actual sophisticated map editor rather than an upgraded version of Forge. That and at least 12 mp maps at launch.

(I've got a ton of expectations for Halo 4 but that's a post for another day.)
 
neoism

neoism

Member
Multi-team <3 <3
just had some great games... damn that First strike daily..can't seem to get it. :/ o while I'm 10/16 for the Weekly though :D
 
neoism

neoism

Member
Striker said:
Yes, AL remains but they changed it to a Plasma Rifle. Better than a Needler which is still a viable mid-range weapon whereas the Plasma Rifle is close quarters.
Click to expand...
yeah it made it a little better in the games I played... I think I played like 10 or so the get 3 dailies, but most people just used invis, and just picked Al next then picked up the needler.:lol Al doesn't bother me all that much though. I use it when everyone else uses it.
 
S

squidhands

Member
hx5bx3.jpg


Elevation wins my vote for worst map I've played in a really long time. Like, early Foundry days long time. It's pretty much a jetpack only map, and the design is so poorly thought out I'm absolutely amazed that the Bungie testers thought that this map has actual competitive merit. Nothing but bridges and hallways, which is the death knell of any strafing that one might consider doing. The z-fighting is absolutely atrocious, there are random capture plates and flag stands that show up in a Slayer game, random ramps that dead end, and you can pretty much camp behind the teleporter frames and assassinate anyone stupid enough to use them. My favorite part of the map has to be the area that you spawn in on the bottom level and have only one way to higher ground; a lift that shoots you high enough to become an instant target for everyone on the other team, no matter where they are. I could go on, but I really don't want to sound like a total asshole.

I still haven't played all the maps yet (and I had to quit a game because everyone on my team bailed out right away), but if this isn't the worst of the bunch then I'm about to be really let down.
 
G

GhaleonEB

Member
I haven't played that map, but I'm guessing from the picture that getting to the top level is paramount, as you have coverage over the entire bottom level from it. The map from the same name I made in Halo 3 had a high side and a low side, but balanced them with distance and cover elements.

Have links to the maps been put up yet? I'd like to scope them out in Forge.
 
K

Kuroyume

Banned
Anyone get a bunch of XML Parsing errors when trying to view Bungie's site?

Btw, that map looks so fucking huge. I've only played Obsidian so far but when you consider Atom, Obsidian, and that map it seems like people are obsessed with gigantic maps.
 
H

Hypertrooper

Member
Kuroyume said:
Anyone get a bunch of XML Parsing errors when trying to view Bungie's site?

Btw, that map looks so fucking huge. I've only played Obsidian so far but when you consider Atom, Obsidian, and that map it seems like people are obsessed with gigantic maps.
Click to expand...
works fine for me. It's a bit slow but I have no real other problems with it.
 
B

Brolic Gaoler

formerly Alienshogun
Louis Wu said:
You DID get pooped on! Your team came in last, and you personally came in second-to-last, overall!

Oh, wait, you're laughing because you played slayer in an objective game?

Never mind, then.
Click to expand...


He's saying THEY pooped on me. They didn't, I completely dominated them.

I guess I should have been more clear what was going on.

Besides, multiteam isn't serious business, it's where you go to knock out challenges and let BKs pick bad game types, plus, look again, I'm counted as winning that match (top 50%).

squidhands said:
Elevation
Click to expand...

I actually liked that map, but the over abundance of power weapons is bad.
 
B

Brolic Gaoler

formerly Alienshogun
Devin Olsen said:
boy oh boy do I hate people like you in Multi Team... Especially when I get someone like you as a partner.

If all you plan on doing is slaying people, go play slayer.
Click to expand...

Multiteam is garbage anyway, with people picking shit multiplayer modes.

It's a BK fiesta, I only go in there for challenge farming, blame bungie.

P.S Multiteam is slayer, not my fault everyone else picks objective, again, blame bungie.

Kuroyume said:
May as well play it like that unless you want to die in 2 seconds from grenades.
Click to expand...


Kuroyume with the knowledge bomb!
 
Z

zumphry

Banned
Elevation looks like it was picked just because it looked cool (or the creator thinks it's cool looking and thus, a great map). I mean, it does look cool, but people should remember that the coolest looking thing isn't the best thing to play in.

As for maps with more than 3 or so levels, where the middle is the highest, they rarely work. Wizard and Derelict worked because there were only two levels, with a outside ring, or platforms. Midship worked because it was a mesh of the two.

Keep it simple, stupid.

/semi-rant that would be more suited in the (now dead?) Forge thread
 
G

GhaleonEB

Member
Alienshogun said:
He's saying THEY pooped on me. They didn't, I completely dominated them.
Click to expand...
You scored one point. You didn't just get pooped on, they shat straight into your mouth and made you swallow. :p

Pooping on guys usually means you win - like this.

And after the Rocket Race discussion earlier, it's pretty funny that I just had my first and second game on it just now. Scored first place both times - and the second time I didn't have a gunner. :lol

Got the Achievement on the second game by splatting some guy that wiped out right in front of me. Poor guy.

Awesome mode.
 
S

Sai-kun

Banned
Alienshogun said:
He's saying THEY pooped on me. They didn't, I completely dominated them.

I guess I should have been more clear what was going on.

Besides, multiteam isn't serious business, it's where you go to knock out challenges and let BKs pick bad game types, plus, look again, I'm counted as winning that match (top 50%).



I actually liked that map, but the over abundance of power weapons is bad.
Click to expand...

no dude, you got shit on, big time.
 
G

Grimm Fandango

Member
Well I got my Multiteam groove back. It felt pretty good not picking the Armor Lock in Elite Slayer. But so many people pick the Needler that it's hysterical. Plasma Rifle is like a death sentence.
 
B

Barrow Roll

Member
I don't think Shogun should be boasting so hard that he shat on these kids when he technically did lose the game but who actually enjoys playing KOTH in multi-team "properly"? I mean, play to win and all that but getting blown up from grenade spam in like 2-5 seconds of being in the hill just isn't fun at all. The hill movement is random so there isn't even any real strategy to it. And you're probably thinking that if it's so bad then don't play multi-team but fuck it, I like farming challenges easily in multi-team especially since most challenges just involve grinding something like kills or assists anyways.
 
G

GhaleonEB

Member
Odd bug just now. 30 seconds into a game of Multi Team, the screen freezes. Initially I think it's because of a networking/host issue, but it stays frozen. After a couple minutes, I have to hard-reboot the system because nothing is responsive.

Just now I went back to look at the film, curious where it stopped recording. And it's 32 seconds long. When I hit second 32, it's the same moment I was frozen at. Okay, that settled I try to back out...but can't. When reviewing the film, the system crashed again at the same moment as in the game. So I need to hard reboot again.

I seem have have recorded a repeatable system level crash bug.
 
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