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Hannibal S3 |OT| Man Destroys God. Hannibal Eats Man. Hannibal Inherits The Earth.

So glad to be back to watching this. Episode was mesmerizing and beautiful. So much eyecandy that I was practically drooling. Dying to see how Will and the others are doing, but it was interesting to see a Hannibal-specific episode.

Only thing I didn't like was the large ad that came up at the bottom of the screen (some late night talk show) 3/4 way through after there being none before. Took me out for a moment but so minor that I can't complain too much.
 

wenis

Registered for GAF on September 11, 2001.
Bedelia running down the stairs during Hannibal's lecture would be grand.

And an excellent "bailout" .gif for next week's E3 festivities.

staircasedisjv.gif


with font

bailout9gria.gif
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
Even when bailing out she is just so dignified and refined.
 

water_wendi

Water is not wet!
So after the display at the end im guessing we get full blown (Hannibal book spoilers)
Il Mostro mode from Hannibal
.
 
OK just watched again now that I'm way more awake and damn was that good. Dinner scene was fantastic. Gillian Anderson is killing it with the way she shows she is scared shitless. Every small smile Hannibal gives is unsettling because you know nothing is being thunk / coming.

Ps: it's unreal how fine gillian Anderson is
 

Corpekata

Banned
Think a gif would be even better if you edited in the she's in the audience, Hannibal looks at her, then away, then seat is empty too.
 

Mariolee

Member
Rewatching again with a quiet room. Man, this is about a billion times better. The sound design is fucking incredible.
 
took longer than I realized. I didn't want to ruin so much of the imagery by either cutting it too short or reducing the coloring profile to nothing that it comes out splotchy. 10mb will have to do
So brilliant. Thank you! One of my favorite shots of the whole series thus far.
 

Dan

No longer boycotting the Wolfenstein franchise
Some delicious moments in that premiere. Vincenzo Natali is bringing the beautiful creep factor just like last year. He directed the next two episodes, too.

It may have been deliberate (?), but "aesthetical" is not a word. "Aesthetic" is what she should have said. A trivial detail, I guess, but it stood out.

I'm glad this show is back.
I don't believe that's in error. The term aesthetical has definitely been used in certain philosophical and academic discussions. I believe a lot of this has its roots in a series of letters the German philosopher Friedrich Schiller wrote in the late 18th century.
 

jett

D-Member
It's amazing that this show exists.

Seems they've gone full television arthouse now, they give no fucks about appealing to the mainstream.
 

Monocle

Member
I feel like that's the kind of episode that you could only create because the ratings are so low and the show has already been pushing so many boundaries and alienating enough people after two seasons of increasingly intense violence and increasingly abstract filmmaking that the only folks left are those willing to take the show entirely on its own terms. So while it felt slight in some ways - mostly the self-imposed myopia of taking place entirely in this new setting of Europe - it was also easily the most exquisitely shot and constructed episode of the entire series thus far. The cheeky, winking references to art and aesthetics - and even giallo, with that synthy Goblin-esque score accompanying Bedelia throughout Florence - served to underline the fact that this show is operating on a level of both ambition and execution pretty far above most anything else on television, network or otherwise.

The running comment in season 3 reviews was that the show was "bold," and yes, it takes a huge amount of boldness to not only defy, but straight-up ignore convention in concentrating entirely on one set of characters (Hannibal, Bedelia, Gideon) to the complete exclusion of everyone else - most of whom are far more easily sympathized with than three of the show's coldest and most impenetrable people. But I also feel like there's a surety of vision here that is perhaps more like a film or a miniseries or a novel, because we trust that the show absolutely knows what it is doing and where it is going and right at this moment this is the narrative line it wants to follow, and nought else.

It is a bit too disconnected from the whole right now for me to say that I really loved it, in spite of the great character work, pacing, and craft displayed throughout, but because of that boldness and vision I feel like this will play out far better on video or streaming after the fact wherein the show's design will be more readily apparent. On its own, it's an outstanding episode of television; the structure of the episode sort of reminded me of "Unfinished Business," an episode of Battlestar Galactica that similarly skipped here and there in time and featured a similar focus on building character and creating a particular mood (in Hannibal: a creeping dread more heightened than usual) than addressing goings on in the plot. The interweaving of various timelines, often without an obvious marker to indicate what era we're in until the dialogue and scenery subtly reveals it, was as superb here as it was there.

For an episode of Hannibal and as a fan of the show, well- I wanted to know what happened to Will, Jack, Alana, Chilton, Margot, Mason, Bella, and that makes this episode less than fully satisfying even when I can appreciate it and its aims on an intellectual level. I like that the show has fully embraced the symbolism of Hannibal as Satan - seductive, clever, and observant, but fundamentally evil, and interested largely in poking and prodding at humanity in whatever ways he pleases divorced of any moral grounding or core. It's more than a bit on-the-nose to have him literally interposed with imagery of the devil, and called so in flashback, but from the perspectives of Bedelia and even Gideon that's exactly what he is. The ways in which the show explored her complicated push-pull relationship with Hannibal, and the ways in which she is both captivated and captured by him, are as fascinating as ever, though the highlight of various interactions for me might have been the way that Gideon continually tried to get under Hannibal's skin as the latter had so literally done to the former. It's a fascinating turn that has given him a lot of depth.

That focus on the two characters who have been most privy to seeing Hannibal without his person suit - save for, arguably, Will himself - was an interesting and smart way to segue into a season that represents a huge shift in the direction of the show. Now we're all, like Gideon and Bedelia, privy to seeing Hannibal as he is, something the show (and the character) have been very selective in portraying thus far. It's a huge part of why he has been so likeable and charming a character in spite of the monster he clearly is lurking so close to the surface; if season 2 was about slowly stripping away that facade, season 3 is about gazing into the abyss that we're left with.
I don't have anything to add, but I appreciate this post. Well stated.
 

Mumei

Member
I don't have anything to add, but I appreciate this post. Well stated.

I agree. Splendid post. I'm really looking forward to being able to marathon the whole season after it finishes, so I can see the first episode from that perspective.
 

Einchy

semen stains the mountaintops
When are the Abel scenes happening? The last relevant scene I remember with Abel from the post seasons was when Will shot him in the head.

I should probably watch a re-cap of season 1 and 2...
 
When are the Abel scenes happening? The last relevant scene I remember with Abel from the post seasons was when Will shot him in the head.

I should probably watch a re-cap of season 1 and 2...

You didn't watch Season 2? He was a pretty big part of it...

They're happening after his back was broken and before Hannibal kills him and frames Frederick as the Ripper.
 

Einchy

semen stains the mountaintops
You didn't watch Season 2? He was a pretty big part of it...

They're happening after his back was broken and before Hannibal kills him and frames Frederick as the Ripper.

I did but apparently I've forgotten most if it.

I remember Hannibal framing Frederick as the Ripper but not the details of how he did it.
 

Mariolee

Member
Finished the rewatch. Yeah, that was a fantastic episode of Hannibal. Still confused about Bedelia going to those weird shops? Is it to just get Hannibal's weird ingredients or is it to establish a daily routine so that people start noticing if she's gone?
 
Finished the rewatch. Yeah, that was a fantastic episode of Hannibal. Still confused about Bedelia going to those weird shops? Is it to just get Hannibal's weird ingredients or is it to establish a daily routine so that people start noticing if she's gone?

I thinks he keeps sitting in front of the train station security cameras during her outings cause she knows Will and Jack are still hunting and eventually they'll see her in the security footage.
 

Mariolee

Member
I thinks he keeps sitting in front of the train station security cameras during her outings cause she knows Will and Jack are still hunting and eventually they'll see her in the security footage.

That is definitely why, but I'm still confused as to why she was buying all that weird animal stuff. I don't remember that being part of the recipe to make Bedelia tastier for Hannibal to perhaps one day eat.

Edit: Also, was Bedelia somehow the one to contact Anthony? Is that part of her participation? Sorry guys, I'm a dumb dumb :(
 

Gaz_RB

Member
Thanks! I knew he did it to Fell, but I wasn't sure if he was just hopping around doing it to more people.


Seems like it would be hard to impersonate someone so noted in the age of the Internet.
 
Thanks! I knew he did it to Fell, but I wasn't sure if he was just hopping around doing it to more people.


Seems like it would be hard to impersonate someone so noted in the age of the Internet.

Did people (in Italy, maybe?) not know who Dr. Fell was before Hannibal took his identity?

I'm just assuming this is part of the heightened reality of the show.

Like Gaz said, it'd be extraordinarily difficult to steal someone's identity like this in the age of the internet. Maybe when Harris wrote the books, it was far easier. This seems more like an ode to the 'Talented Mister Ripley' novel which takes place in the 50s and the protagonist murders a man and steals his identity.

It could simply be that Hannibal searched for someone of some renown that simply didn't have much of a digital footprint, and that's why he chose Doctor Fell, and luckily enough... he was a professor of Italian poetry.

But yeah, it seems to be just one of those things they did cause it was cool, not cause it made legit sense (like an 80 year old geriatric making a totem pole of dead bodies or a psycho string dude playing a dead dude's throat in the middle of an auditorium without anyone noticing).
 

ivysaur12

Banned
I feel like that's the kind of episode that you could only create because the ratings are so low and the show has already been pushing so many boundaries and alienating enough people after two seasons of increasingly intense violence and increasingly abstract filmmaking that the only folks left are those willing to take the show entirely on its own terms. So while it felt slight in some ways - mostly the self-imposed myopia of taking place entirely in this new setting of Europe - it was also easily the most exquisitely shot and constructed episode of the entire series thus far. The cheeky, winking references to art and aesthetics - and even giallo, with that synthy Goblin-esque score accompanying Bedelia throughout Florence - served to underline the fact that this show is operating on a level of both ambition and execution pretty far above most anything else on television, network or otherwise.

The running comment in season 3 reviews was that the show was "bold," and yes, it takes a huge amount of boldness to not only defy, but straight-up ignore convention in concentrating entirely on one set of characters (Hannibal, Bedelia, Gideon) to the complete exclusion of everyone else - most of whom are far more easily sympathized with than three of the show's coldest and most impenetrable people. But I also feel like there's a surety of vision here that is perhaps more like a film or a miniseries or a novel, because we trust that the show absolutely knows what it is doing and where it is going and right at this moment this is the narrative line it wants to follow, and nought else.

It is a bit too disconnected from the whole right now for me to say that I really loved it, in spite of the great character work, pacing, and craft displayed throughout, but because of that boldness and vision I feel like this will play out far better on video or streaming after the fact wherein the show's design will be more readily apparent. On its own, it's an outstanding episode of television; the structure of the episode sort of reminded me of "Unfinished Business," an episode of Battlestar Galactica that similarly skipped here and there in time and featured a similar focus on building character and creating a particular mood (in Hannibal: a creeping dread more heightened than usual) than addressing goings on in the plot. The interweaving of various timelines, often without an obvious marker to indicate what era we're in until the dialogue and scenery subtly reveals it, was as superb here as it was there.

For an episode of Hannibal and as a fan of the show, well- I wanted to know what happened to Will, Jack, Alana, Chilton, Margot, Mason, Bella, and that makes this episode less than fully satisfying even when I can appreciate it and its aims on an intellectual level. I like that the show has fully embraced the symbolism of Hannibal as Satan - seductive, clever, and observant, but fundamentally evil, and interested largely in poking and prodding at humanity in whatever ways he pleases divorced of any moral grounding or core. It's more than a bit on-the-nose to have him literally interposed with imagery of the devil, and called so in flashback, but from the perspectives of Bedelia and even Gideon that's exactly what he is. The ways in which the show explored her complicated push-pull relationship with Hannibal, and the ways in which she is both captivated and captured by him, are as fascinating as ever, though the highlight of various interactions for me might have been the way that Gideon continually tried to get under Hannibal's skin as the latter had so literally done to the former. It's a fascinating turn that has given him a lot of depth.

That focus on the two characters who have been most privy to seeing Hannibal without his person suit - save for, arguably, Will himself - was an interesting and smart way to segue into a season that represents a huge shift in the direction of the show. Now we're all, like Gideon and Bedelia, privy to seeing Hannibal as he is, something the show (and the character) have been very selective in portraying thus far. It's a huge part of why he has been so likeable and charming a character in spite of the monster he clearly is lurking so close to the surface; if season 2 was about slowly stripping away that facade, season 3 is about gazing into the abyss that we're left with.

The aspect of the episode that struck me the most was the revelation of Hannibal's own POV. We've sort of guestimated it: He's a cannibal. He's using Will. etc. etc. But up until now, I've never felt like I truly get where Hannibal is coming from. Is he actually Satan?

And he is. I mean, he's not actually Satan, but his line "Cannibalism is when you're equals" is everything about why Hannibal does what he does. Almost no one is equal to Hannibal. Hannibal is not human. We are not worthy of Hannibal. That's where the idea of "eat the rude" comes from -- we have no right to be rude to Hannibal, or attempt to slight him, because we are bugs. We are things. We deserve to die.
 
I'm just assuming this is part of the heightened reality of the show.

Like Gaz said, it'd be extraordinarily difficult to steal someone's identity like this in the age of the internet. Maybe when Harris wrote the books, it was far easier. This seems more like an ode to the 'Talented Mister Ripley' novel which takes place in the 50s and the protagonist murders a man and steals his identity.

It could simply be that Hannibal searched for someone of some renown that simply didn't have much of a digital footprint, and that's why he chose Doctor Fell, and luckily enough... he was a professor of Italian poetry.

But yeah, it seems to be just one of those things they did cause it was cool, not cause it made legit sense (like an 80 year old geriatric making a totem pole of dead bodies or a psycho string dude playing a dead dude's throat in the middle of an auditorium without anyone noticing).

Yep yep, I kind of figured it was just something [else] that requires the audience to suspend their disbelief.
 
I'm sure it's already been theorized, but since it was a former patient of his...either Hannibal used ZQ's character to get closer to Bedelia for a curiiosity already present we don't know about...or she somehow "broke" Hannibal's psychological spell over ZQ and became a plaything because of the interest.
 

abrack08

Member
I did but apparently I've forgotten most if it.

I remember Hannibal framing Frederick as the Ripper but not the details of how he did it.

In season 1, Will shoots Gideon outside of Alana's house. They both slump into the ground, and we don't see Gideon again for a while. It's unclear if he's alive or dead at this point.

In Season 2, Will convinces Chilton to transfer Gideon back to his hospital so that he can corroborate Will's story about Hannibal being the Ripper. Gideon pretends like he doesn't know what they're talking about in front of Jack, then on his way back to his cell he mocks the nurse he killed in Season 1 which angers the guards and they beat the crap out of him. While he's confined to a hospital bed, Hannibal breaks in, kills a guard or two, plants some evidence to exonerate Will from being the copycat, and kidnaps Gideon. We later saw Hannibal feeding Gideon his own arm, then Gideon doesn't appear again until he shows up dead in Chilton's basement, missing most of his limbs.

So these flashback scenes are between when we saw Hannibal first feed him his arm and when Chilton was framed as the ripper.
 

Moff

Member
his line "Cannibalism is when you're equals" is everything about why Hannibal does what he does. Almost no one is equal to Hannibal. Hannibal is not human. We are not worthy of Hannibal.

yes that was my favourite line of the episode.
well a day later I have come to accept that hannibal abandonend is ethics. I think it's probably better for the show in the long run than him being exactly the same all the time.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
And he is. I mean, he's not actually Satan, but his line "Cannibalism is when you're equals" is everything about why Hannibal does what he does. Almost no one is equal to Hannibal. Hannibal is not human. We are not worthy of Hannibal. That's where the idea of "eat the rude" comes from -- we have no right to be rude to Hannibal, or attempt to slight him, because we are bugs. We are things. We deserve to die.

Except Will. Hanny <3s Will.
 

TripOpt55

Member
Really good episode. I look forward to seeing how some of these scenes fit in as we watch more of the season. I loved the bathtub scene where Gillian is falling. She was really awesome in this episode. Happy to see her taking on a larger role this season. Mads was great too of course.
 
I don't believe that's in error. The term aesthetical has definitely been used in certain philosophical and academic discussions. I believe a lot of this has its roots in a series of letters the German philosopher Friedrich Schiller wrote in the late 18th century.

Ah, I stand corrected then. Thanks.
 

And_Boy

Member
As a medical student and as I have finished my aesthetics course yesterday, I admit this show, especially this episode, is magnifique.
 

Alpende

Member
I liked the episode. Some shots were amazing, like the one with Bedelia walking in front of the white building. I think it was a good starting point for season 3, can't wait for next week.
 
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