BOOM!
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Hearthstone |OT2| Created by Unstable Portal
- Thread starter ZealousD
- Start date
- Status
BananasWithGuns
Member
Glad it's two different cards per class because I'm not a fan of Lava Shock. Only two cards have an Overload of 3 so why would I bother running it when it's essentially a 2 damage Moonfire most of the time?
Sain Drevia
Member
Hmm, two legendary cards in my last 4 free packs. Geddon and Malygos. Not quite sure how to feel. I primarily play Rogue, Mage, or Paladin and I can't see either of those being super useful (maybe Malygos for Spell Dmg Rogue but I hear that is hit or miss).
I would make Sylvanas, Ragnaros, Black Knight and Jaraxxus (if you are interested in playing Handlock).
Azzurri
Gold Member
Does Mal'ganis not fit in a handlock?
BananasWithGuns
Member
Sylvanas is a must craft in my opinion. Finds a place into a ton of decks.
After that it just depends what you play and what your preferences are. Jaraxxus is always good. Mal'Ganis is decent but is usually cleared as soon as he's played so it's tough to put any reliance on him.
Geddon finds some play in control Warrior but that's about it. I'd also hold on to Malygos for now since he's a dragon. Never know what might happen with that synergy.
After that it just depends what you play and what your preferences are. Jaraxxus is always good. Mal'Ganis is decent but is usually cleared as soon as he's played so it's tough to put any reliance on him.
Geddon finds some play in control Warrior but that's about it. I'd also hold on to Malygos for now since he's a dragon. Never know what might happen with that synergy.
It fits into Demonlock. I just don't think Malganis is that good, it's an easy BGH target.
Professor Lich
Member
I would say he does, but I would call him the very definition of slow. You want him to be the last thing you play after your opponent plays out all their removal. There's just more effective stuff out there.
AstroZombie
Banned
He can fit in a greedy Handlock deck but he's a staple in demolock.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Hmm, I'm not convinced that is actually a good deal since you're still going 2-1 against a 3 drop and still paying 7 mana to do so.
I mean, sure, the overload isn't ruining your next turn but the exchange is pretty bad regardless. And there are also black knights to worry about as well.
I'm not sure if earth elemental will be a good card, ever. Even Crusher was a very bad deck imo.
On the other hand, I feel like neptulon is much more worth the risk due to the value you get from the battlecry.
To clarify, the reason why he's staple in Demonlock is because you really really really want to get Malganis out via Voidcaller rather than actually playing him from hand. Malganis is otherwise too expensive and if you're able to play him from hand without dying or losing tempo from having it cheaply removed it probably means you had already won.
Princess Carl
Member
I shall definitely try to play in this one!
maybe next time I wont throw games.
Azzurri
Gold Member
That's what I was thinking, and from watching streams it's what people aim for especially in early to mid game.
hypersheep
Member
I believe once your units hit 1 hp they stop taking damage, so effects that activate from damage no longer apply. You could probably test it right now with frothing berserker.
I really need to test it out to know how useful it will be. The real power is in erasing the overcharge for the current and next turn at the same time, so I need to see how often you can make use of it in that regard.
Here's my writeup of the strategies and deck lists that I used for Fixed1979's latest NeoGAF Hearthstone tournament. The key strategy is based on this rule of the tourney:
Here are the deck lists that I set up for the tourney:
1. Freeze Mage to counter Mech Mage, Shaman, Priest and Zoo.
2. Mech Mage to counter Druid and Warrior, the bad matchups for Freeze Mage.
3. JustSaiyan's Demonlock which is generally all-around good, especially against Zoo and Mech Mage.
4. SilentStorm's Demonlock which is similar to JustSaiyan's but is better against Hunter and face aggro decks.
5. Handlock for Priest matchups because Priest has an advantage against the Demonlock decks.
6. Combo Druid as a fall-back and to counter Warrior. Harrison/Mind Control Tech/BGH are swapped out accordingly based on whatever the opponent has remaining which is also why I leave it as the last deck to be played.
I generally brought out Freeze Mage as my first deck because of how effective it is when players do not expect it and aren't teched to counter it. This also allows me to switch to Mech Mage if it wins in order to dodge any counters that the opponent makes for Freeze Mage. If the opponent has Warrior and/or Druid in their line-up then I start off with Demonlock instead as it is generally good against anything. Druid is left as the last hero used unless I know that the opponent only has a weak matchup class remaining against it like Warrior.
This rule allows you to use any deck you want for 3 heroes and you can switch them between each game. This means that heroes which have multiple deck archtypes have an advantage as you can switch up archtypes depending on the matchup. This is why I picked Mage, Warlock and Druid as these heroes have the widest varities in decks. I had originally picked Warrior instead of Druid but noticed that there were a lot of players bringing Shaman and not many Hunters or Rogues so I felt that Warrior was a poor choice as a fall-back hero.
Here are the deck lists that I set up for the tourney:
1. Freeze Mage to counter Mech Mage, Shaman, Priest and Zoo.
2. Mech Mage to counter Druid and Warrior, the bad matchups for Freeze Mage.
3. JustSaiyan's Demonlock which is generally all-around good, especially against Zoo and Mech Mage.
4. SilentStorm's Demonlock which is similar to JustSaiyan's but is better against Hunter and face aggro decks.
5. Handlock for Priest matchups because Priest has an advantage against the Demonlock decks.
6. Combo Druid as a fall-back and to counter Warrior. Harrison/Mind Control Tech/BGH are swapped out accordingly based on whatever the opponent has remaining which is also why I leave it as the last deck to be played.
I generally brought out Freeze Mage as my first deck because of how effective it is when players do not expect it and aren't teched to counter it. This also allows me to switch to Mech Mage if it wins in order to dodge any counters that the opponent makes for Freeze Mage. If the opponent has Warrior and/or Druid in their line-up then I start off with Demonlock instead as it is generally good against anything. Druid is left as the last hero used unless I know that the opponent only has a weak matchup class remaining against it like Warrior.
T
thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
Similar experence for me tonight. Only get 4 wins with a deck with 3 fireballs, 2 flamestrikes, 2 flamecannons, and 3 water elementals. Then I get 9 wins with a palidan deck that only has one blessing of kings and 2 consecrations, no weapons or avenges or legendaries at all.
People always seem to complain about OP arena decks with a bunch of really fancy cards, but I think a decent mana curve full of strong yet boring minions might be most important of all.
I've gotten lucky with three really good legendaries, but fucked up my mana curve and never even got to play any of them in Arena.
mana curve wins the game.
I suck at arena. never can get past 5 wins. keep playing it because at one point I hope to make some profit out of it, but so far i average on 3 wins.
toddhunter
Member
I've been trying out a Hunter spell damage deck. It doesn't work...but felt like it was worth a go.
The last three games I have been doing pretty well... until Dr Boom comes out. In all three games the boom bots hit face with other minions on the board.
IN ALL THREE GAMES, BOTH BOOM BOTS HIT FACE FOR 4 DAMAGE EACH.
T
thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
I found using HearthArena.com really helped me if you haven't tried something like that yet. I only used it for a few drafts, but even just doing that helped immensely in giving me the general idea of what cards are good and bad for arena.
i've been doing just as bad, if not worse with hearth arena. Thing with arena is that is just gives you the value of the cards, and doesn't really add mana curve into the equation until you get to the end of your draft.
KojiKnight
Member
Just went 9-1 (the last match was my last for the day) with the updated version of my deck.
Not a huge accomplishment when climbing ranks, but still felt good. Been a long time since I've had such a streak.
It really does pay to play a deck slightly out of norm for meta, if only because so many people play to the deck they think you have even if your plays don't match it at first (they assume you're playing some minor variant).
Decks this is good against: Mech mage, demon/zoo lock, mid (lesser) and face/aggro (more) hunter, and sitting at about 50/50 with handlock. It really seems to depend on how aggressive my start is and whether they use hellfire or not.
It doesn't seem to be great against ramp druid, but I don't have enough matches under my belt to be sure (though I'm fairly confident in it's weakness to it). I also only had 1 match against a mill rogue but that seemed to go pretty spectacularly in my favor so pretty confident there.
I only fought 1 control warrior and won... but I think it was more due to his incredibly bad start (no play the first 2 turns) than it was my deck... Pretty confident any mid to late game control decks are going to own this deck pretty hard, but since they are out of favor....
To be clear, this deck is NOT an aggro deck, it's actually an early game control deck. If you play it like aggro/to the face you're going to do very poorly. It's all about keeping minions on the field with divine shield, weapons, and having targets on your field to BoK.
Your opening hand ideally includes a shielded mini bot or chow and 1 argent protector. Chow on turn one into AP turn 2 pretty much guarantees you board control on the first 3 turns. Shielded mini bot is an okay substitute to chow, but it puts you one turn back unless you have coin (then it's perfectly on par).
If you get a knife juggler in your starting hand, it's usually best just to throw it back and save it for future turns when you can throw a ton of knives... unless you get both an AP and call to arms. "The dream" hand, but one you won't get often enough to want to rely on... and even if you do, it's pointless to have against a rogue and mage since they'll have it dead before you can divine shield him or get call out.
There is a point where you have to switch from early game control to mostly face or you're going to have issues dealing enough damage... I haven't really kept track of what turn that is, it's generally once your opponent starts dropping big minions. Never sacrifice 2-4 minions to kill a single big minion, even if they have taunt. It's better to sit it out and hope they get over confident and go for face and leave your minions up for a clear.
Do not feel bad using equality on your field to clear 1-2 big minions. Chances are your board is already going to be AoE bait, and if they haven't already used it to clear your board at one point, the difference between 2-3 HP and 1 likely won't matter.
Divine Favor is both the best and worst card draw in the game, that's why I only have 1 in there. If you have good control of the board and your opponent has been afraid to play cards they know will instantly die, it's great early game for 3-4 cards. Often times though it's only worth 1-2 cards mid to late game. By late game, Jeeves is the much better draw, even if your opponent is also pulling cards since you'll always get first 'go' at the card draw and generally the only opponents who'll need that draw when you need it will be aggro heavy (and thus fodder for this more control style deck). Most control will have plenty of cards regardless.
Really starting to love this deck. Most matches are quick, it's not a brainless "to the face", it's also a nice change of pace from my primary ramp decks I play since most matches don't end with "combo wombo or bust!" That said, there is no doubts that the deck is kind of aggro. There are no early game dead turns (sans super ultra terrible draws) and you're always making some play.
I love control decks, but most were just too slow in this current meta. I don't claim it to be revolutionary or that others haven't done something similar... but damn I also just feel good since this is one of the first decks I've really felt I 'built' without relying heavily on using a pre existing deck for a base and only taking a few (VERY helpful) comments here... /end wall of text.
(edit) On the topic of heartharena... It's a good tool for people who aren't willing to put thoughts into their decks or those that are just starting... Otherwise it's terrible. My best decks have been ones Heartharena would have told me were terrible. My last 11-3 was with a deck that had a VERY large amount of 3 drops (hunter, 3 animal companions, 4 unleash the hounds, 2 mind control techs) and almost no 2's (the ones I got offered were garbage) and only 3-4 cards over 6 mana.
I'd even somewhat advise against those new to the game using it... because it encourages a crutch. Their 'reasoning' for picking cards isn't always very helpful and without the help of a real person coaching these you're not encouraged to learn proper synergies and curve management yourself.
Not a huge accomplishment when climbing ranks, but still felt good. Been a long time since I've had such a streak.
It really does pay to play a deck slightly out of norm for meta, if only because so many people play to the deck they think you have even if your plays don't match it at first (they assume you're playing some minor variant).
Decks this is good against: Mech mage, demon/zoo lock, mid (lesser) and face/aggro (more) hunter, and sitting at about 50/50 with handlock. It really seems to depend on how aggressive my start is and whether they use hellfire or not.
It doesn't seem to be great against ramp druid, but I don't have enough matches under my belt to be sure (though I'm fairly confident in it's weakness to it). I also only had 1 match against a mill rogue but that seemed to go pretty spectacularly in my favor so pretty confident there.
I only fought 1 control warrior and won... but I think it was more due to his incredibly bad start (no play the first 2 turns) than it was my deck... Pretty confident any mid to late game control decks are going to own this deck pretty hard, but since they are out of favor....
To be clear, this deck is NOT an aggro deck, it's actually an early game control deck. If you play it like aggro/to the face you're going to do very poorly. It's all about keeping minions on the field with divine shield, weapons, and having targets on your field to BoK.
Your opening hand ideally includes a shielded mini bot or chow and 1 argent protector. Chow on turn one into AP turn 2 pretty much guarantees you board control on the first 3 turns. Shielded mini bot is an okay substitute to chow, but it puts you one turn back unless you have coin (then it's perfectly on par).
If you get a knife juggler in your starting hand, it's usually best just to throw it back and save it for future turns when you can throw a ton of knives... unless you get both an AP and call to arms. "The dream" hand, but one you won't get often enough to want to rely on... and even if you do, it's pointless to have against a rogue and mage since they'll have it dead before you can divine shield him or get call out.
There is a point where you have to switch from early game control to mostly face or you're going to have issues dealing enough damage... I haven't really kept track of what turn that is, it's generally once your opponent starts dropping big minions. Never sacrifice 2-4 minions to kill a single big minion, even if they have taunt. It's better to sit it out and hope they get over confident and go for face and leave your minions up for a clear.
Do not feel bad using equality on your field to clear 1-2 big minions. Chances are your board is already going to be AoE bait, and if they haven't already used it to clear your board at one point, the difference between 2-3 HP and 1 likely won't matter.
Divine Favor is both the best and worst card draw in the game, that's why I only have 1 in there. If you have good control of the board and your opponent has been afraid to play cards they know will instantly die, it's great early game for 3-4 cards. Often times though it's only worth 1-2 cards mid to late game. By late game, Jeeves is the much better draw, even if your opponent is also pulling cards since you'll always get first 'go' at the card draw and generally the only opponents who'll need that draw when you need it will be aggro heavy (and thus fodder for this more control style deck). Most control will have plenty of cards regardless.
Really starting to love this deck. Most matches are quick, it's not a brainless "to the face", it's also a nice change of pace from my primary ramp decks I play since most matches don't end with "combo wombo or bust!" That said, there is no doubts that the deck is kind of aggro. There are no early game dead turns (sans super ultra terrible draws) and you're always making some play.
I love control decks, but most were just too slow in this current meta. I don't claim it to be revolutionary or that others haven't done something similar... but damn I also just feel good since this is one of the first decks I've really felt I 'built' without relying heavily on using a pre existing deck for a base and only taking a few (VERY helpful) comments here... /end wall of text.
(edit) On the topic of heartharena... It's a good tool for people who aren't willing to put thoughts into their decks or those that are just starting... Otherwise it's terrible. My best decks have been ones Heartharena would have told me were terrible. My last 11-3 was with a deck that had a VERY large amount of 3 drops (hunter, 3 animal companions, 4 unleash the hounds, 2 mind control techs) and almost no 2's (the ones I got offered were garbage) and only 3-4 cards over 6 mana.
I'd even somewhat advise against those new to the game using it... because it encourages a crutch. Their 'reasoning' for picking cards isn't always very helpful and without the help of a real person coaching these you're not encouraged to learn proper synergies and curve management yourself.
I like it. What ladder rank have you been able to get to with this?
So I've been trying to jump back into HS after casually playing it off and on for the past year. At this point, I'm finding it incredibly difficult to beat almost anyone in casual play to get my dailies. It usually takes me about 30-40 minutes just to get a single win. Is this because the value added in newer cards is just so much greater?
I have almost all the Naxx wings unlocked but mostly basic cards otherwise. Should I start creating decks around those Naxx cards for the time being? I don't really want to drop money on a bunch of card packs but it almost seems required at this point to even play at all.
I have almost all the Naxx wings unlocked but mostly basic cards otherwise. Should I start creating decks around those Naxx cards for the time being? I don't really want to drop money on a bunch of card packs but it almost seems required at this point to even play at all.
RumblingRosco
Member
Now that the NeoGAF Hearthstone tournament has wrapped up, I thought some people would be interested in seeing the recordings of the finals (and the portion of the semifinals that I was a part of). So, I've linked them in another post in the tournament thread. My decklists are there too if anyone cares.
I didn't narrate for any of the matches, so just background music and sound effects. I'll say, I feel like the Finals were some pretty horrid representation of my HS abilities. Felt like nothing went my way and I was fucking up on top of that.
I didn't narrate for any of the matches, so just background music and sound effects. I'll say, I feel like the Finals were some pretty horrid representation of my HS abilities. Felt like nothing went my way and I was fucking up on top of that.
KojiKnight
Member
I stopped my win spree at rank 10 today. Plan on playing it more later, but my damnable children need their father to not play computer games all day <_<
Congrats ZZ
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
After returning wild pyro to my control paladin deck, I'm not sure why I ever thought it was worth removing. I think it was because of muster, but really that pyro + consecration combo is still really strong against aggro and everyone is running pilotted shredder so it takes out the first half rather cleaning as well.
I think I got caught up with how strong zombie chow is on turn 1-3, forgetting how strong pyro can be turn 3+.
--
Opponent gets a troggzor off sneed's shredder. What do I do? Equality clear? Use my vast board to trade with it? Use consecration + minions? Nope. I just went face for the rest of the game.
It was control paladin vs control warrior. He already used dr. boom, sylvanas, ragnaros, brawl... and I had 4x 3/3s + shredder. He basically tossed out all his strong cards hoping they would just win him the game, so normal for a control warrior to do.
I think I got caught up with how strong zombie chow is on turn 1-3, forgetting how strong pyro can be turn 3+.
--
Opponent gets a troggzor off sneed's shredder. What do I do? Equality clear? Use my vast board to trade with it? Use consecration + minions? Nope. I just went face for the rest of the game.
It was control paladin vs control warrior. He already used dr. boom, sylvanas, ragnaros, brawl... and I had 4x 3/3s + shredder. He basically tossed out all his strong cards hoping they would just win him the game, so normal for a control warrior to do.
Thanks for posting the video!
Here are the decklists I used if anyone is interested.
My Mech Rouge deck didn't change at all throughout the tournament because I felt it was a deck that is pretty streamlined and it is tough to change any one card.
I changed a few cards in this deck depending on what classes I was facing. Against Soka's line up I felt like some more anti-aggressive cards were needed so I added an extra Shadow Word Pain and Holy Nova (and removed a Mind Control and a Thoughtsteal). Sometimes I put in Harrison Jones if I was facing two weapon classes.
This deck changed a lot depending on match ups. Against Soka's line up I added in 2 Mind Control Techs, an extra Sludge Belcher and a Sunwalker. I removed a Big Game Hunter, a Shade of Naxxramas, a Spectral Knight and a Black Knight/Harrison Jones.
Before anyone asks I don't yet have Dr. Boom or it might have been in one or two of these decks heh.
Gully State
Member
I got an extra Harrison Jones in a pack. Should I dust him now? Or wait until later?
He doesn't seem like a card that will be changed. Probably a safe disenchant.
TetraxShards
Member
Hearthstone |OT6| In The Blackrock Candy Mountain
poppedcollar69
Member
would it be so bad if one eyed cheat was a neutral card?
He is a perfectly balanced card and blizzard has no reason to change him.
- Status