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[ZealousD]

Isn't the Imp Gang Boss just a reworked Imp Master? And nobody runs that in constructed. I guess it having 2 attack and being a demon makes it slightly better.

2 attack makes a world of difference. Having 2 attack is more than twice as good as having 1 attack. You can't really make trades with 1 attack. And with Imp Master you only get good value in a "win more" scenario where you are already ahead. Imagine using this as an answer to a 3/2. You'll get a favorable trade plus two imps. This is also a pretty good answer to shielded minibot or a 2/3. You'll probably get 2 imps guaranteed. Or maybe you kill the mad scientist and use the imp to trigger the freezing trap.

Another way to think about it is compared to Harvest Golem. Imagine if Harvest Golem was a 2/4 with a deathrattle to spit out a 1/1 OR two 1/1's. That's pretty good. I think this makes a lot of sense in zoo because it's super sticky that way too. They're going to have to try and kill your imp gang boss first before doing any AoEs, kind of like the awkwardness with haunted creeper, but here it's even worse for your opponent since it has 4 hp.

 

[Danj]

You have to consider the board state (your minions and your opponent's minions, weapons, and life totals). Sometimes it's better to clear their minions than to hit their hero.

Really, watch this video series. Especially the "Board Contorl Video #1."

Thanks. I've checked out the board control video, it's quite helpful.

Here's a question, if the only card you have is a minion with a useful battlecry, should you play it anyway and waste the battlecry, or wait for a better opportunity?

 

[mxgt]

Liking the Flamewaker. Could be fun flamestriking a board with some 5 health minions.

 

[gutshot]

2 attack makes a world of difference. Having 2 attack is more than twice as good as having 1 attack. You can't really make trades with 1 attack. And with Imp Master you only get good value in a "win more" scenario where you are already ahead. Imagine using this as an answer to a 3/2. You'll get a favorable trade plus two imps. This is also a pretty good answer to shielded minibot or a 2/3. You'll probably get 2 imps guaranteed. Or maybe you kill the mad scientist and use the imp to trigger the freezing trap.

Another way to think about it is compared to Harvest Golem. Imagine if Harvest Golem was a 2/4 with a deathrattle to spit out a 1/1 OR two 1/1's. That's pretty good. I think this makes a lot of sense in zoo because it's super sticky that way too. They're going to have to try and kill your imp gang boss first before doing any AoEs, kind of like the awkwardness with haunted creeper, but here it's even worse for your opponent since it has 4 hp.

Yeah, you make some good points. And it combos pretty well with Knife Juggler while Imp Master doesn't.

I kinda want to make an Imp deck now. Flame Imp, Blood Imp, Imp Master, Imp-plosion, Imp Gang Boss. Could token Lock become a thing?

 

[ViviOggi]

Thanks. I've checked out the board control video, it's quite helpful.

Here's a question, if the only card you have is a minion with a useful battlecry, should you play it anyway and waste the battlecry, or wait for a better opportunity?

Like everything except Dr. Boom it depends on the situation. How much swing potential does the battlecry have, what's the board state -> would your minion trade favorably with the opponents', how many cards is your opponent holding etc.? For example you'd likely drop a Dark Iron Dwarf or Shattered Sun Cleric if you're desperate since you don't have anything to buff in the first place, but if you're both in topdick mode you'd certainly hold onto something like a Bomb Lobber to potentially take out their next drop.

 

[embalm]

Thanks. I've checked out the board control video, it's quite helpful.

Here's a question, if the only card you have is a minion with a useful battlecry, should you play it anyway and waste the battlecry, or wait for a better opportunity?

It depends. Usually it's better to have something on the board or to try to clear the board than to do nothing.
If it's a card with a battlecry that you know is going to go off and maybe swing the game in your favor then hold on to it and wait for a better play, a good example of this is Kezen Mystic when a Mad Scientist is on the board, waiting a turn to kill the Scientist before playing the Mystic is probably the right play.
If you have an acidic ooze and want to destroy an opponents weapon and you're playing against Paladin, it's probably a good idea to play it if you don't have any other options.

 

[ViviOggi]

lmao at Frodan & Monk getting muted mid-sentence to play some shitty ass country song but you still see them continue talking for half a minute

 

[embalm]

I think this card will find a home in the Tempo mage that's been off and on for awhile. It's lacking 3 drops and as long as you get a single spell off this card is as valuable as Spider Tank. It has more potential in the late game where it can combo with spells and become more annoying than just about any other 3 drop.
I don't think this will see play in mech mage or freeze/echo mage. It is mid-range/tempo and will shut down aggro hard at times.

Straight up arena card. I think it will be played in some fringe Beast decks, but it will be a great pick in Arena. I think it's similar to Floating Watcher in that it's just not good enough for constructed, but in arena it will run away with games at times.

Awesome card. I bet it shows up in zoo and demonlocks. I love me some demon lock and that deck has very few mid-game minions, turn 3 especially feels so empty, so this guy gets props as a demon and a 3 drop. On top of that he creates tokens, which is incredibly powerful in warlock, a single token can be buffed for great trades or add in shadow flame for board clear, I love warlock tokens. He also tag teams with Mistress of Pain as the best demons to buff with Demonfire/heart, both which have awesome affects on damage and great stat allotment for buffs. Just a straight up value card.

 

[ZealousD]

Just figured out the best situation for Imp Gang Boss is actually Haunted Creeper! You could get so many imps, they'll have to run their spiders into your imps to stop you from getting too much value.

 

[G.ZZZ]

Mech mage is a good home for the new mage card, especially if you play mech yeti. Lots of spare parts , frosbolts +fireballs, maybe that 1 flamestrike/polimorph.

 

[Danj]

it's better to have something on the board or to try to clear the board

I've been trying to do this but I still get my ass kicked while the enemy is unharmed. Are you guys sure I'm not supposed to attack the opposing face instead of getting rid of his minions?

EDIT: and again

 

[Zemm]

I've never seen such a terrible player get carried by a deck as much as this - http://www.twitch.tv/alinity

Sooo many bad plays then gets some crazy part rng. Stumbles into lethal when they don't even know they have it, just awful. Wish I could play my decks on the US servers.

 

[ZealousD]

I've been trying to do this but I still get my ass kicked while the enemy is unharmed. Are you guys sure I'm not supposed to attack the opposing face instead of getting rid of his minions?

Watch all of Trump Teachings if you haven't already. Link in the OP.

Also, tbh, your hand is full of bad cards.

 

[Danj]

Watch all of Trump Teachings if you haven't already. Link in the OP.

Also, tbh, your hand is full of bad cards.

No this is what I'm saying, I watched the Board Control thing which is about Mage which is what I'm playing, and it seems to be saying to concentrate on getting rid of enemy minions and making sure you have minions on the board, but it doesn't work, I get my ass kicked.

 

[Nirolak]

I've been trying to do this but I still get my ass kicked while the enemy is unharmed. Are you guys sure I'm not supposed to attack the opposing face instead of getting rid of his minions?



EDIT: and again

I would suggest checking your deck composition a bit. Each "Trump Teachings" video ends with a good starter deck using basic cards for the classes.

It's going to be hard to trade efficiently with things like Salty Dog or the 1/4 flier. Cogmaster also isn't a great choice unless you have a ton of mechs.

One of the later videos also goes over when it's a good time to go for the face versus when it isn't.

At least watch Video 5 (favorable trading).

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

No this is what I'm saying, I watched the Board Control thing which is about Mage which is what I'm playing, and it seems to be saying to concentrate on getting rid of enemy minions and making sure you have minions on the board, but it doesn't work, I get my ass kicked.

It looks like your deck needs to be retuned. Post a screenshot. A better deck will help you hold board better. That 1/4 with windfury isn't helping, for example.

 

[Fixed1979]

No this is what I'm saying, I watched the Board Control thing which is about Mage which is what I'm playing, and it seems to be saying to concentrate on getting rid of enemy minions and making sure you have minions on the board, but it doesn't work, I get my ass kicked.

Copy the deck he used as well...there's a few changes you can make to it as you go along, but some of your card choices may really be hampering your ability to keep up with your opponents play.

 

[ZealousD]

No this is what I'm saying, I watched the Board Control thing which is about Mage which is what I'm playing, and it seems to be saying to concentrate on getting rid of enemy minions and making sure you have minions on the board, but it doesn't work, I get my ass kicked.

It works fine. You are probably making other mistakes. Like I said, I see some bad cards in your hand. You should post your deck, and people will give suggestions.

 

[G.ZZZ]

No this is what I'm saying, I watched the Board Control thing which is about Mage which is what I'm playing, and it seems to be saying to concentrate on getting rid of enemy minions and making sure you have minions on the board, but it doesn't work, I get my ass kicked.

You are using horrible cards which will always trade badly with opponent's ones. No strategy would work with some of those cards.

Look up some good basic decks. A lot of basic cards are very good, but things like Salty Dog? Cogmaster without any mech? Lord of the Arena? Those are unusable even in Arena.

 

[Nirolak]

Also in this screenshot your board at least is not in a horrendous position.

You would want to use Frostbolt on the Senjin, hit it with your hero power, and run the 1/4 into it. Then you trade the Force Tank with the War Golem and the board is just left with their 2/2 and your 1/1.

Some better cards could definitely fix this.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

I think it would actually be better to frost bolt the war golem, kill senjin with the tank, kill the 2/2 with 1 hit from the windfury, 1 hero power ping, and hope to draw something like another burn card or flamestrike.

 

[KePoW]

I think it would actually be better to frost bolt the war golem, kill senjin with the tank, kill the 2/2 with 1 hit from the windfury, 1 hero power ping, and hope to draw something like another burn card or flamestrike.

Was just about to say this, I think this is the better play. You'll be left with both of your minions

 

[Nirolak]

That's a good point. For some reason I was forgetting that Frostbolt actually freezes so they don't need to worry about the 7/6 insta killing them next turn.

 

[KePoW]

That's a good point. For some reason I was forgetting that Frostbolt actually freezes so they don't need to worry about the 7/6 insta killing them.

broski u should play Mage most of the time!

 

[IceMarker]

Re-posting this one more time for the new page...

I made a Hearthstone Archetype Generator that spits out a new deck idea every time you load the page! I've updated it several times since yesterday, mostly just new type words.

 

[clav]

Really need Defender of Argus.

Would stop a lot of these rush decks.

 

[Nirolak]

It's more that I almost never run into a scenario where either I or another mage actually just freezes a minion with frostbolt instead of killing it off.

Usually they're gone way before that's relevant on early game units or used in some face combo with ice spear so that aspect slipped my mind.

 

[Nirolak]

On a similar note doing some Hearthstone puzzles in general might help you.

There seems to be a dedicated site here: http://www.hsdeck.com/forum/puzzles/

 

[Rapstah]

Re-posting this one more time for the new page...

I made a Hearthstone Archetype Generator that spits out a new deck idea every time you load the page! I've updated it several times since yesterday, mostly just new type words.

Here's a suggestion for a future feature: add "you must run this card" and have it be a neutral card or a class card somehow connected to the archetype, or not connected to the archetype at all. Maybe it's more fun if it's not connected to the archetype in the slightest. Beast Mage: you must run 2 * Mana Wraith.

And if you want the suggestions to actually work, prevent "demon" from appearing in front of anything except Warlock. The only Demon card other classes have access to is Imp Master, which isn't even a demon. (Right?)

 

[RumblingRosco]

Re-posting this one more time for the new page...

I made a Hearthstone Archetype Generator that spits out a new deck idea every time you load the page! I've updated it several times since yesterday, mostly just new type words.

I'm getting a new video card soon and plan to record some HS. I think I'll use this to generate a horrible deck idea to record. Thanks.

 

[IceMarker]

Here's a suggestion for a future feature: add "you must run this card" and have it be a neutral card or a class card somehow connected to the archetype, or not connected to the archetype at all. Maybe it's more fun if it's not connected to the archetype in the slightest. Beast Mage: you must run 2 * Mana Wraith.

And if you want the suggestions to actually work, prevent "demon" from appearing in front of anything except Warlock. The only Demon card other classes have access to is Imp Master, which isn't even a demon. (Right?)

Neat idea, I'll toy with it over the weekend. Oh, don't forget Illidan is available to all classes as a Demon as well! Blizzard really needs to add more neutral demons, Sacrificial Pact might actually be run!

I'm getting a new video card soon and plan to record some HS. I think I'll use this to generate a horrible deck idea to record. Thanks.

You're welcome, I was hoping this would come in handy for some video creators/streamers.

 

[RumblingRosco]

You're welcome, I was hoping this would come in handy for some video creators/streamers.

Also, I got "Dragon Rogue" as one... I might need to wait for Blackrock for that one lol.

 

[ViviOggi]

I feel like we've been over this before but it might have been another poster, so re: taunts. You might feel like throwing in taunt minions helps you survive but the reality is that most taunts plain suck. In Hearthstone a good offense is your best defense, a minion with good stat distribution for its cost acts as a taunt in of itself by threatening your opponent's board/life.

For example the Lord of the Arena you've got in your hand there is a godawful card as he dies to a plethora of combinations worth way less mana than the 6 it took you to play it. Two 1/2-drops, a buffed 2-drop, a 1-drop + a low tier removal spell, a 4-drop plus hero power, you name it - they'll nullify your entire previous turn and strengthening their own board at the same time (i.e. gain "tempo"). Now for the same cost you could get a 6/7 Boulderfist Ogre which demands an answer just as much, but its higher health forces considerably more resources out of your opponent. The same concept applies to Salty Dog: 7 attack on turn 5 is meaningless when your opponent can use a cheap spell or a shitty leftover minion + hero power to get through its pathetic 4 health.

The only neutral taunts worth playing in constructed are Sen'Jin and Sludge Belcher as they usually eat up multiple minions or a spell worth an entire turn when played on curve. Against aggressive decks which don't run many answers to minions these have the potential to put you ahead. A Lord of the Arena always throws you behind.

 

[Fixed1979]

I feel like we've been over this before but it might have been another poster, so re: taunts. You might feel like throwing in taunt minions helps you survive but the reality is that most taunts plain suck. In Hearthstone a good offense is your best defense, a minion with good stat distribution for its cost acts as a taunt in of itself by threatening your opponent's board/life.

For example the Lord of the Arena you've got in your hand there is a godawful card as he dies to a plethora of combinations worth way less mana than the 6 it took you to play it. Two 1/2-drops, a buffed 2-drop, a 1-drop + a low tier removal spell, a 4-drop plus hero power, you name it - they'll nullify your entire previous turn and strengthening their own board at the same time (i.e. gain "tempo"). Now for the same cost you could get a 6/7 Boulderfist Ogre which demands an answer just as much, but its higher health forces considerably more resources out of your opponent. The same concept applies to Salty Dog: 7 attack on turn 5 is meaningless when your opponent can use a cheap spell or a shitty leftover minion + hero power to get through its pathetic 4 health.

The only neutral taunts worth playing in constructed are Sen'Jin and Sludge Belcher as they usually eat up multiple minions or a spell worth an entire turn when played on curve. Against aggressive decks which don't run many answers to minions these have the potential to put you ahead. A Lord of the Arena always throws you behind.

I was looking for something to argue here but this is pretty much spot on. Depending on the current meta and your deck archetype there might be a couple others to consider but you need a good reason to run any taunt besides the two mentioned. Even against faster decks you're better off with defender of argus or sunfury protector than one of the unmentioned taunt minions.

 

[dralla]

Also in this screenshot your board at least is not in a horrendous position.

You would want to use Frostbolt on the Senjin, hit it with your hero power, and run the 1/4 into it. Then you trade the Force Tank with the War Golem and the board is just left with their 2/2 and your 1/1.

Some better cards could definitely fix this.

Or, Tank into the taunt. Hero power the 2/2, run the 1/4 into the now 2/1. Freeze the 7/6. You'd be in 2 v 1 situation and he'd be frozen.If you get lucky, the card you draw out next turn could take out the golem without having to sacrifice the tank.

 

[Cat Party]

Re: taunts, don't forget the trusty annoy o tron.

 

[Nirolak]

I feel like we've been over this before but it might have been another poster, so re: taunts. You might feel like throwing in taunt minions helps you survive but the reality is that most taunts plain suck. In Hearthstone a good offense is your best defense, a minion with good stat distribution for its cost acts as a taunt in of itself by threatening your opponent's board/life.

For example the Lord of the Arena you've got in your hand there is a godawful card as he dies to a plethora of combinations worth way less mana than the 6 it took you to play it. Two 1/2-drops, a buffed 2-drop, a 1-drop + a low tier removal spell, a 4-drop plus hero power, you name it - they'll nullify your entire previous turn and strengthening their own board at the same time (i.e. gain "tempo"). Now for the same cost you could get a 6/7 Boulderfist Ogre which demands an answer just as much, but its higher health forces considerably more resources out of your opponent. The same concept applies to Salty Dog: 7 attack on turn 5 is meaningless when your opponent can use a cheap spell or a shitty leftover minion + hero power to get through its pathetic 4 health.

The only neutral taunts worth playing in constructed are Sen'Jin and Sludge Belcher as they usually eat up multiple minions or a spell worth an entire turn when played on curve. Against aggressive decks which don't run many answers to minions these have the potential to put you ahead. A Lord of the Arena always throws you behind.

Back in the early days Trump didn't run *any* taunts for just this reason, though he started to realize that having a couple of the really good ones were useful for the above reason.

Similarly having something like a Defender of Argus which grants a strong amount of stats and also taunt status is a great way to add taunts to your deck without sacrificing good stats, since the two minions getting buffed can be units with good stats instead.

 

[KePoW]

Back in the early days Trump didn't run *any* taunts for just this reason, though he started to realize that having a couple of the really good ones were useful for the above reason.

Similarly having something like a Defender of Argus which grants a strong amount of stats and also taunt status is a great way to add taunts to your deck without sacrificing good stats, since the two minions getting buffed can be units with good stats instead.

where is ur avatar from??

 

[Nirolak]

where is ur avatar from??

Overwatch: http://us.battle.net/overwatch/en/heroes/reinhardt/

 

[mr_boo]

Re: taunts, don't forget the trusty annoy o tron.

Also, the Arcane Nullifier X-21 has some application as well.

 

[CoolOff]

And Ancient of War. Or don't we count class ones?

Sunwalker.

 

[KePoW]

Overwatch: http://us.battle.net/overwatch/en/heroes/reinhardt/

wow kool, I like the dark colored helmet

 

[mr_boo]

And Ancient of War. Or don't we count class ones?

Sunwalker.

I think we're only talking about neutral taunts. Good call on Sunwalker...I've always thought of her as Annoy-o-tron's mom ... lol.

 

[Kapow]

I just won 3 games in a row on ladder rank 9 with the starter mage deck lol.

Its funny cause no one expects it

Edit: Got wrecked by a weird Warlock deck

 

[ViviOggi]

Yeah, I said neutral and was mainly thinking universal, as in you can reasonably throw Taz'Dingo and particularly Belcher into any midrange/control list. Sunwalker is indeed decent while Annoyotron and Nullifier are more specific choices, but evidently have their place. If you really want to taunt up Druid is the only choice since he has two additional overbudgeted taunts and can get them out ahead of curve to boot.

------------------------------------

These Kibler dragon games lmao

 

[thepotatoman]

I've been trying to do this but I still get my ass kicked while the enemy is unharmed. Are you guys sure I'm not supposed to attack the opposing face instead of getting rid of his minions?

I want to add that you should try not to take all this criticism about your cards as forcing you buy ton of good cards before you can win.

Arcane Missiles
Frostbolt
Arcane Intellect
Fireball
Polymorph
Water Elemental
Flamestrike

Acidic Swamp Ooze
Bloodfen Raptor
Novice Engineer
Kobold Geomancer
Razorfen Hunter
Shattered Sun Cleric
Chillwind Yeti
Gnomish Inventor
Sen'jin Shieldmasta
Gurubashi Berserker
Archmage
Boulderfist Ogre
Stormwind Champion


All those are pretty decent basic cards every player has and is worth considering over some of the cards you have right now. That Force-Tank max shown is the only non-basic card shown that's worth keeping I'd say.

If you're willing to craft some commons I'd also recommend:
Mana Wyrm
Sorcerer's Apprentice
Snowchugger
Harvest Golem
Spider Tank

 

[slayn]

I think this card will find a home in the Tempo mage that's been off and on for awhile. It's lacking 3 drops and as long as you get a single spell off this card is as valuable as Spider Tank. It has more potential in the late game where it can combo with spells and become more annoying than just about any other 3 drop.
I don't think this will see play in mech mage or freeze/echo mage. It is mid-range/tempo and will shut down aggro hard at times.


Straight up arena card. I think it will be played in some fringe Beast decks, but it will be a great pick in Arena. I think it's similar to Floating Watcher in that it's just not good enough for constructed, but in arena it will run away with games at times.


Awesome card. I bet it shows up in zoo and demonlocks. I love me some demon lock and that deck has very few mid-game minions, turn 3 especially feels so empty, so this guy gets props as a demon and a 3 drop. On top of that he creates tokens, which is incredibly powerful in warlock, a single token can be buffed for great trades or add in shadow flame for board clear, I love warlock tokens. He also tag teams with Mistress of Pain as the best demons to buff with Demonfire/heart, both which have awesome affects on damage and great stat allotment for buffs. Just a straight up value card.

I'm kind of luke warm on all 3. The mage card is kind of cool but I think it is difficult to fit non-mech creatures in mech mage even if it does have spare parts. Plus you usually want those spare parts to become fireballs, not arcane missiles. It will make for some good videos of crazy late game spells going off though.

Core Rager also doesn't look amazing. I feel like any situation where you would want to play this thing you would be better off with fel reaver. Core Rager technically can come out a turn earlier but even the faciest of face hunters will have a hard time consistently dumping their hand by turn 4. Not to mention unless you play hunter's mark or can coin a blind draw 1 drop, you actually have to fully dump your hand on turn 3 and then blind draw into Core Rager. The more I think about this card the more I think it sucks.

edit: eh, my opinion of imp gang boss is increasing a little as I stew on it more. If we assume that it will tend to be killed in a single hit, then its still 3/5 of value for 3 mana. So I see it being powerful in arena. But it still doesn't 'feel' strong in current constructed warlock decks. Warlock decks aren't really about cards with good value. Warlock decks are about cheating the rules of the game in different ways and this card doesn't help cheat. Zoo doesn't really want it because it is slow. Demon lock doesn't want too many demons in it because you need your void callers to be pulling down your 9 mana demons. And handlock doesn't want it because it just doesn't really do anything to promote the handlock game plan.

 

[KePoW]

I just won 3 games in a row on ladder rank 9 with the starter mage deck lol.

Its funny cause no one expects it

Edit: Got wrecked by a weird Warlock deck

where is ur name from??

 

[CoolOff]

Just built Mech Mage in Arena.

Clockwork Gnome
Mechwarper
2x Snowchugger
Harvest Golem
Spider Tank
Tinkertown Technician
Piloted Shredder
2x Blastmage

Oh, and three Fireballs and three Polymorphs. Disgusting.

 

[KePoW]

Just built Mech Mage in Arena.

Clockwork Gnome
Mechwarper
2x Snowchugger
Harvest Golem
Spider Tank
Tinkertown Technician
Piloted Shredder
2x Blastmage

Oh, and three Fireballs and three Polymorphs. Disgusting.

lol you should stream that